Replacing my MacBook Pro and IPad Air "thoughts and Advise"

[chattoe]

The surface 3 is not an option, if I'm upgrading my hardware I want the latest for that amount of money. It's works out I'd save ?150 if I bought the equivalent in the pro 3 options.

Can any one tell me that have had hands on with the pro 4 what the type cover is like? Especially compared to a MacBook Pro keyboard and track pad if possible

 

[Keith Wallace]

Things may do NOTHING for you, but for others (like OP) they could be the best thing since sliced bread.

For me, buying old hardware is a silly choice. If you're buying a Surface, buy the latest. Lots of things are better. Longer battery. Fast CPU options. Better graphics. Smaller. Lighter. Better pens. The list goes on.

The new Surface Pro isn't smaller. It's BARELY lighter (14 grams). The graphics and CPU improvements are likely negligible for the vast majority of users. You aren't going to perceive the improved browser and Office load times. The battery life isn't necessarily better (we'll see how testing goes), and if it's better, it's because of the added size (more battery space), in part. The new pen SHOULD work on the SP3, if you want the added precision, and they made a Windows Hello-functional keyboard for the SP3, with a fingerprint reader.

The whole point of my first post is that you said the SP4 is "likely the best," but that's not really fair. It's the most-powerful, but when you consider added cost, it's likely a lot less-improved.

 

[cgavula]

Getting past the platform ****** hype, the Surface Pro 3 and 4 are generally good choices and work well in most cases, although there are some lapability concerns that other people have already mentioned and the general state of tablet apps is better in the Apple ecosystem than the Windows ecosystem.

That said, I generally have found Windows 10 to be less stable on my SP3 than Windows 8.1 was and some apps don't work correctly (I'm talking about you - Magic Puzzle) so I ended up rolling it back to Windows 8.1.

If you use Kindle Reader on your iPad, you will be disappointed with it on the Surface. The Windows version isn't very good and still makes use of ClearType so it looks wretched if you turn the tablet into Portrait mode compared to an iPad (and the home button placement makes using the device in portrait mode for reading a little challenging at times.)

Lastly, if you like/use the long-press extended keystrokes to type extended or foreign characters on your Mac or iPad, Windows doesn't really implement that at all, although there is limited support for it in the soft keyboard, but it's not nearly as extensive as what's on the Mac.

Having the pen is great of taking notes, but some folks have had reliability problems under Windows 10 using One Note, so approach that with caution and save frequently.

You can make up for some of the app deficit using regular desktop apps and web apps, but it isn't perfect and there are actually a few things (including things I just mentioned) that are different/better on your current setup. Also note - if you are invested in iTunes, the Windows version is NOT as good and performs sluggishly even on good Windows PCs. This is Apple's fault for writing a poorly optimized Windows app, but if you use iTunes, it's something to keep in mind.

You asked about the type cover and the track pad - the type cover flexes too much for me. I've taken to using a BT keyboard with it instead. Also makes it easier to lap - I put the Surface on a tv tray and put the BT keyboard in my lap. If you are used to trackpads, you will definitely not like Windows trackpads. They simply aren't as good. I've never had a Windows laptop trackpad that I liked, including the SP3. Most people I know will use a Mac laptop as is, but most Windows users insist on having a mouse. Why? The trackpads are usually touchy and sensitive, no matter how you adjust the settings. I'd love it if someone licensed the Apple trackpad to put in a high-end Windows laptop - now that would be something!

All that said, I'd be inclined to wait for the wider range of SP4 and SB reviews to come out, and I might even wait for the actual release of the iPad Pro to get all the reviews on these new products and get a chance to try them out to see what is the best fit for you. The SPs are really good devices, but they aren't perfect - nothing is - and they have a few unique challenges as I've mentioned (and others have mentioned) here.

Bottom line for me? The SP did NOT eliminate my need for the iPad or make me get rid of my Macbook, because of it's poor ereader support, poor tablet apps, and limited extended keyboard support, but I do use it a lot for Windows-specific apps and there are a few things that do run better on it so I ended up with an even wider mix of devices rather than being able to eliminate devices!

Good luck with your decision!

 

[chattoe]

So, after reading back on this thread I decided yesterday to go ahead and order the pro 4. According to the terms and conditions I have 90 days to return it for a full refund. So I have nothing to loose by giving it a go.

I pick it up in a few hours (a bit excited )

 

[Steve Adams]

The Apple community is very special in nature - many users would not go back to Windows once they have used the Mac, because they think Apple is the best.

You and I are some of the exceptions. Had been using iPad from its 1st gen to iPad mini2/iPad Air + MacbookAir + iMac, until Surface Pro came out in 2012.

Have sold all my Apple devices to my friends at very cheap prices. I feel very good now.

Yeah, whats up with apple supposedly keeping it's value. I had a 27" cinema monitor connected to an upgraged mini, MacBook pro, ipad 2 iphones and lost my shirt on all of it.

 

[Steve Adams]

So, after reading back on this thread I decided yesterday to go ahead and order the pro 4. According to the terms and conditions I have 90 days to return it for a full refund. So I have nothing to loose by giving it a go.

I pick it up in a few hours (a bit excited )

You will never look back. Where the SP4 is a real computer designed like a tablet apps are not "needed". The whole system is awesome. Get a dock, monitor and whatnot at home, you have an "everything" device. I am sitting at my desk typing this message using my 23" hp ips monitor connected to my surface 3 dock. Its as if I have a home computer!

 

[dkediger]

All of my execs at work have done, or are in line for, replacing their MBAs and iPads with SP3/4s, docking stations, and ultra wide monitors. It only took getting one of them to "just try this" to get the ball rolling. One tried to use a Henge dock for his MBA, but quickly gave that up as it was a most decidedly un-Apple like experience.

They like the Surface Pros so much, they have all (iPhone users) asked about Windows phones. But alas, we're stuck with Verizon (ATT has no indoor signal) so it's one step forward, one step back with Microsoft.

 

[RichBrown68]

You know, I'm trying to think of the last time I saw a person using a laptop computer on his or her lap while sitting straight up. Honestly, I can't envision it in my eye. Everyone who uses one on their lap is either lying sitting up in bed or their in a chair with their legs up on a footstool or the coffee table or something. If I'm sitting straight up--then no, I can't balance the SP4 very well on my lap. But then I would never--EVER--sit like that while on the computer anyway. If I use it in my lap, my feet are almost always up on the table.... and then, there is zero problem with balancing it on my lap.

 

[smanmit2]

I ust switched from MacBook Air. While surface pro 4 is great form factor it still requires refinement. Windows 10 is buggy especially after experiencing OS X and battery life is terrible when compared to 13 in air. Pen and display are plus for pro. Considering your usage, is I would wait till things settled down especially battery life.

 

[boltman2013]

You know, I'm trying to think of the last time I saw a person using a laptop computer on his or her lap while sitting straight up. Honestly, I can't envision it in my eye. Everyone who uses one on their lap is either lying sitting up in bed or their in a chair with their legs up on a footstool or the coffee table or something. If I'm sitting straight up--then no, I can't balance the SP4 very well on my lap. But then I would never--EVER--sit like that while on the computer anyway. If I use it in my lap, my feet are almost always up on the table.... and then, there is zero problem with balancing it on my lap.

It has to do with thigh length ...me its great lab-ability my wife not so much

 

[chattoe]

It has to do with thigh length ...me its great lab-ability my wife not so much

I normally use a cushion with the laptop sitting on that to bring the computer level up.

I tried it with the pro 4 last night and it's spot on

 

[WildKarrde]

I honestly wish they would have kept the surfaces at the 10.1 size profile, as I feel 12 is just a bit too big. That said, I've switched from the SP2 to the SP4... and I think I'm gonna go ahead and keep it. The size is a bit annoying on some of the small desks at my college, but other than that it is nice to have a bit better visibility. The digitizer pen is absolutely fantastic, I use it every day, and it has spoiled me against any device that doesn't have it. Not only is it good for drawing, taking notes, CAD work, etc... it makes a great mouse too! I really enjoy playing games like Diablo III, StarCraft II, Automation, and others with the stylus.

I really don't think they'll regret going with the SP4 to replace your Mac stuff. Mac had the corner on the mobile device market for so long, but Microsoft really knocked it out of the park with their Surface Pro line.

If Apple had released an OSX tablet, I probably would have gotten one, but, (shock and awe) Microsoft beat them to the punch! It had been so long since Microsoft was actually the ones innovating, so it's great to see them on the ball now! I'm quite surprised Apply still hasn't released an OSX tablet, with the popularity of Win 8/10 tablets... but then again, I'd still stick with Microsoft anyway at this point.

 

[chattoe]

The way I feel with the pro 4 at the moment is it's a great replacement for the MacBook Pro but so far not so much for the iPad.

To be able to pick the iPad up and do something really quick and put it down is one of its pro's for me with it being light and battery life really great on it another. So far the pro 4 isn't matching that feeling with my iPad. So now I'm starting think should I just use the pro4 to replace the Mac or send the pro 4 back and just grab a dell XPS 13 to replace the Mac and still keep my iPad

 

[boltman2013]

The way I feel with the pro 4 at the moment is it's a great replacement for the MacBook Pro but so far not so much for the iPad.

To be able to pick the iPad up and do something really quick and put it down is one of its pro's for me with it being light and battery life really great on it another. So far the pro 4 isn't matching that feeling with my iPad. So now I'm starting think should I just use the pro4 to replace the Mac or send the pro 4 back and just grab a dell XPS 13 to replace the Mac and still keep my iPad

My ipadAir 99.995% of the time sits in my bag unused. I have used the SP4 in tablet mode so far as much as I ever have used my iPad Air. Face it ipad is a consumption device limited to Apple eco.

 

[WildKarrde]

^^ But to some people, the Apple eco system is all they need. Personally, the reason I never bought an iPad was because it couldn't do anything my iPhone doesn't, but not everyone is a power user.

Because of my needs, there is no alternative to the Surface Pro lineup, but that's just me.

 

[WillysJeepMan]

Hi, so I'm looking at replacing my iPad and MacBook Air for a surface pro 4.

I generally use my iPad for social networking, surfing the web and checking email. The MacBook is used for office tasks, photo editing and converting my ripped blue ray disks to be put on my nas drive. I also do a few other bits and bobs on the Mac too.

The iPad is what I use mostly though and it pretty much glued to me when at home.

I've been watching videos and reading reviews on both the pro 4 and mostly pro 3 (as the pro 4 isn't out just yet) so I've been doing my research.

The general size as a tablet has me a little worried with the surface but I'm sure I'd get used to carrying it around as a tablet.

The touch cover keyboard is also of concern as I use the Mac on my lap mostly and I'm concerned that the keyboard would be rocking all over the place while typing on my lap.

Generally I thing it makes sense to merge 2 devices into one and what with what MS have been doing I think it's finally time to move back to the Windows family, I have an Xbox and am also looking at ditching my iPhone for a lumia too but first on the list would be the laptop/tablet that needs sorting first.

Any users out there that have done what I'm thinking of doing or general thoughts or mini reviews would be generally appreciated.

Thanks

Disclaimer: Everyone's experiences are different. What we use on our devices, How we use them, why we use them, all factor in to one's final conclusion.

I have the need to use a variety of devices: Windows, OSX, iOS, Android, Windows Mobile, Chrome OS... and I have a stack of 'em.

My go-to tablet of choice is the iPad. Terrific battery life, performance, instant-on, rich and mature apps. I just recently purchased an Air 2 (Staples has been having killer deals on them).

My go-to netbook of choice is the 11" Macbook Air. Slightly larger than the iPad but a full OSX computer. (I have an iMac and Windows system in my home office)

My goal was to consolidate down to 1 mobile device that would replace both my tablet and notebook. Because of the variety of OS/hardware that I use, most of the software that I use is cross-platform (so OSX vs Windows is not a determining issue). MS Office, LibreOffice, etc.

I started out with a Surface RT and Surface 2. Loved the quality, capabilities, and performance (Surface 2). Office ran great on them. The downside was the poor experience in using them as a tablet. A lack of quality and quantity of touch-optimized Modern UI apps. (There's more to apps than simply app-ified frontends to websites)

I ended up trading them in, only to buy another Surface 2 a few months ago. For my purposes it is far more "pro" than the iPad Pro.... by a seriously wide margin.

I then bought an Acer Aspire Switch 11... this is essentially a poor-man's Surface Pro 3 (1/2 the price of a full SP3 setup) complete with multiple USB ports, full Windows, active digitizer, actual keyboard.

As a notebook... terrific. As a digital notepad... fantastic. As a tablet... fail. Again, it came down to the chronic lack of apps. Since it runs full Windows I decided to do what others do and attempt to use desktop apps in touch mode. That is not a pleasant experience. It is handy to have in a pinch but in no way would I want that to be the day-to-day tablet experience.

If your tablet needs are minimal... as in, "those needs can be satisified by a $50 Android tablet", then the Surface can satisfy those needs.

If most of your usage will be as a notebook with only very occasional tablet use, then the Surface would work.

TL;DR: I have attempted that, a few times with different devices. The same result: the Windows alternatives fall short.

 

[chattoe]

Disclaimer: Everyone's experiences are different. What we use on our devices, How we use them, why we use them, all factor in to one's final conclusion.

I have the need to use a variety of devices: Windows, OSX, iOS, Android, Windows Mobile, Chrome OS... and I have a stack of 'em.

My go-to tablet of choice is the iPad. Terrific battery life, performance, instant-on, rich and mature apps. I just recently purchased an Air 2 (Staples has been having killer deals on them).

My go-to netbook of choice is the 11" Macbook Air. Slightly larger than the iPad but a full OSX computer. (I have an iMac and Windows system in my home office)

My goal was to consolidate down to 1 mobile device that would replace both my tablet and notebook. Because of the variety of OS/hardware that I use, most of the software that I use is cross-platform (so OSX vs Windows is not a determining issue). MS Office, LibreOffice, etc.

I started out with a Surface RT and Surface 2. Loved the quality, capabilities, and performance (Surface 2). Office ran great on them. The downside was the poor experience in using them as a tablet. A lack of quality and quantity of touch-optimized Modern UI apps. (There's more to apps than simply app-ified frontends to websites)

I ended up trading them in, only to buy another Surface 2 a few months ago. For my purposes it is far more "pro" than the iPad Pro.... by a seriously wide margin.

I then bought an Acer Aspire Switch 11... this is essentially a poor-man's Surface Pro 3 (1/2 the price of a full SP3 setup) complete with multiple USB ports, full Windows, active digitizer, actual keyboard.

As a notebook... terrific. As a digital notepad... fantastic. As a tablet... fail. Again, it came down to the chronic lack of apps. Since it runs full Windows I decided to do what others do and attempt to use desktop apps in touch mode. That is not a pleasant experience. It is handy to have in a pinch but in no way would I want that to be the day-to-day tablet experience.

If your tablet needs are minimal... as in, "those needs can be satisified by a $50 Android tablet", then the Surface can satisfy those needs.

If most of your usage will be as a notebook with only very occasional tablet use, then the Surface would work.

TL;DR: I have attempted that, a few times with different devices. The same result: the Windows alternatives fall short.

This is exactly how I feel. I am a heavy tablet user but I still need a laptop for other tasks. I feel while the surface makes a great laptop it falls very short when using it as a tablet.

 

[sflxn]

I'm an Apple user, and a Linux user, and an iOS and Android user. I used to develop for the Microsoft platform. I don't think I have any strong bias. However, the pros of Apple computers is their power management, Retina support, and open source dev tools and libraries. Of the three main desktop OSes, I find OS X's power management to be the only one that actually works well. You can close the lid on a your laptop, come back in 2 weeks, open the lid, and there's still plenty of juice left, and there's no wake from hibernate. It's wake from sleep.

Retina support on OS X is still far ahead of Windows and Linux. Since Apple formally supported Retina 5 years ago, and the standard resolution hasn't changed, it's been easier for app writers to support Retina. This isn't the case on Windows and Linux. Even apps like Java UIs that runs well on OS X retina are unusable on the other OSes.

One reason OS X has gain popularity is the open source support. Open source usually means Linux, and Macs provide a Linux environment with a plethora of tools and apps.

Today, I do not own any personal Macs. I have a work MBP and have a Dell precision laptop with Ubuntu as my personal machine. I'm currently on a Linux binge because I'm just looking for a different user experience. For the OP, I would make this recommendation. SP4 is great hardware, but base your decision on your specific usage. Is power management important? If it is, then SP4 might not be the ideal platform. If you want a tablet experience, I can tell you that it's not optimized for that. A tablet experience and a desktop experience is quite different. If you're using FB app on your tablet, don't expect the same experience. You'll end up using a web browser on Windows to connect to FB. The same goes for media consumption. That's fine, but it's also a lot slower than custom written tablet apps. I had the SP4 for about 3 weeks, and it was the power management that eventually forced me to return it. It's best not to get enamored with any one specific hardware device, esp one that's new. I chose the one that fits my usage, regardless of OS and hardware. Since I use desktop OSes for software development and photoshop, I don't really care about what else it can do. I use real tablets for real tablet experience. I've learned my lesson with trying to combine both. They just don't mix... yet. Maybe one day there will be more consumption apps for Windows or devtools and photoshop for iPad, but as it stands today, they're separate worlds.

 

[sflxn]

I'll add one more thing, if I were to go out and buy a Windows device today, I'd still buy a laptop. Windows is still a desktop OS and works better in that mode. If you really want Windows but don't care about the stylus, go get yourself an Dell XPS or Precision laptop. I can't see any other reason to pickup the SP4 for any other use other than to use the stylus.

 

[chattoe]

I'll add one more thing, if I were to go out and buy a Windows device today, I'd still buy a laptop. Windows is still a desktop OS and works better in that mode. If you really want Windows but don't care about the stylus, go get yourself an Dell XPS or Precision laptop. I can't see any other reason to pickup the SP4 for any other use other than to use the stylus.

Hi thank you very much for your input, I read your first post and was going to ask what you recommend for a Windows laptop then realised you answered that in your second post lol.

I think you are correct the tablet and desktop world aren't ready to be merged and this was my main reason for getting the Sp4 to consolidate my laptop and tablet into one device, clearly this isn't working for me.

So that leaves 2 options either stay with my MacBook and possibly upgrade to the latest MacBook Pro or move to Windows and get myself an Xps.

Either way I'm keeping my iPad and will continue to keep my tablet and desktops separate.