04-26-2016 04:35 PM
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  1. smanmit2's Avatar
    Primary use: Excel, powerpoint, outlook, programming, and browsing.
    Situation: Have been using macbook air - love it but few applications are not supported so decided to switch to windows. Bought surface pro 4 on release - was highly disappointed with battery life - never got more than 4 hours after all the settings suggested on forum. See my post - surface pro 4 terrible battery life do you agree?. I returned it and back to air.

    Question: Considering all the recent updates - is surface pro 4 finally bug free and has 7 hours of battery life (considering my use)? In macbook air, I typically get 10 hours of battery life. Would appreciate if you can help with following:

    1. Buy SP4 as now it is fully baked and has at least 6 hours of battery life
    2. Hold on purchasing SP4
    3. Install windows 10 on macbook air

    Would appreciate if you can help and share your experience and suggestions.
    04-17-2016 12:39 PM
  2. Great Bear's Avatar
    The Surface's battery is definitely much better than it was when the tablet was. I used to lose about fifty percent of the battery when the tablet wasn't plugged in at night; now I lose one or two percent at the most. I haven't yet experienced a time when my Surface ran all the way down to the end of its battery, but when I was using the tablet heavily with the maximum brightness setting, it lost about thirty percent in the two to three hours that it was turned on.

    Still, if your MacBook Air still works well, then I would recommend simply installing Windows 10 on there. I've never done it myself, but I haven't heard any stories of the MacBook becoming unusable after changing its operating system. It's also removable, which means that you could revert back to Mac OS if you have any problems.

    Still, if you want a touchscreen, or think that you might use a tablet, then the Surface is probable a better option. You might also like to have two computers available, which would again mean getting the Surface. Personally, I'm very happy with my Surface Pro Four, but it's really decided by personal preference.
    04-17-2016 01:39 PM
  3. smanmit2's Avatar
    Great. Thank you. So would you so, you would get 6 hours of battery life on 50% of brightness?
    04-17-2016 04:17 PM
  4. eastbayrae's Avatar
    You won't get 6 hours out of SP4 and no all the serious bugs are not worked out. As for installing Win10 on an MBA, just don't, it will run horribly slow. Get a regular MacBook or MacBook Pro.
    04-17-2016 08:06 PM
  5. smanmit2's Avatar
    You won't get 6 hours out of SP4 and no all the serious bugs are not worked out. As for installing Win10 on an MBA, just don't, it will run horribly slow. Get a regular MacBook or MacBook Pro.
    Are you sure Macbook? Because it is less powerful than air.
    v535 likes this.
    04-17-2016 10:01 PM
  6. explosive0's Avatar
    Just recently went back to my MacBook Pro after giving the Surface line another try. Your use case may be different, but for me, I just couldn't deal with the issues anymore. I probably spent more time transferring data to replacement devices that had the exact same issue than I spent actually being productive on one.
    04-19-2016 01:40 AM
  7. TechFreak1's Avatar
    Which model of the Surface Pro 4 did you get?

    As that highly depends how much battery life you will get out of your device.

    Just recently went back to my MacBook Pro after giving the Surface line another try. Your use case may be different, but for me, I just couldn't deal with the issues anymore. I probably spent more time transferring data to replacement devices that had the exact same issue than I spent actually being productive on one.
    What issue?

    Please elaborate as your post is rather vague
    04-19-2016 07:24 AM
  8. Axeelant's Avatar
    The SP4 i5, 8GB model i'm using is working just fine with all the updates and everything we got by now. It can eat any macs for dinner, and is perfectly reliable. The only thing you can't do with it is lock it with a power button and unlock it immidiately back on. U have to wait 10 - 15s, that's it. Battery life i'm getting with light usage is around 6h, 50% brightness. Also, W10 is awesome, after redstone it will be a killer!
    Matt Manahan likes this.
    04-19-2016 09:19 AM
  9. v535's Avatar
    The SP4 i5, 8GB model i'm using is working just fine with all the updates and everything we got by now. It can eat any macs for dinner, and is perfectly reliable. The only thing you can't do with it is lock it with a power button and unlock it immidiately back on. U have to wait 10 - 15s, that's it. Battery life i'm getting with light usage is around 6h, 50% brightness. Also, W10 is awesome, after redstone it will be a killer!
    You could compile native .net images thereby reducing much of the background tasks and also uplift some battery life.
    You need to compile x32 and x64 binaries separately.
    For x32:

    1. Open elevated prompt
    2. Navigate to this path: C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319
    3. Type ngen eqi /nologo /silent

    Similarly follow the same steps as followed but use a different path: C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework64\v4.0.30319
    Also did you try removing old updates using Disk cleanup and Dism?
    Hope this helps.
    04-19-2016 10:23 AM
  10. explosive0's Avatar
    Which model of the Surface Pro 4 did you get?

    As that highly depends how much battery life you will get out of your device.



    What issue?

    Please elaborate as your post is rather vague
    I think I made a post about this a while back, but here...I'll list a few
    • Battery life is nowhere close to what is advertised in real-wordl usage. A few spreadsheets and browser tabs/windows, the fan comes on and out goes decent battery life
    • Failing to wake up from sleep requiring a hard reboot. Even with the hibernate workaround (which I shouldn't have to put up with for the price of a premium device), my device fails to wakeup randomly, still requiring a hard reboot
    • Windows Hello having a mind of its own and working when it wants to
    • Type Cover disconnecting randomly - sometimes detaching and reattaching it fixes the issue, other times a restart is required
    • Random BSODs.

    Honestly, the list could go on. And this isn't a "you got a lemon" issue, I've tried multiple devices.
    04-19-2016 10:32 AM
  11. Axeelant's Avatar
    You could compile native .net images thereby reducing much of the background tasks and also uplift some battery life.
    You need to compile x32 and x64 binaries separately.
    For x32:

    1. Open elevated prompt
    2. Navigate to this path: C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319
    3. Type ngen eqi /nologo /silent

    Similarly follow the same steps as followed but use a different path: C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework64\v4.0.30319
    Also did you try removing old updates using Disk cleanup and Dism?
    Hope this helps.
    Can you just briefly explain what the first thing does? I have no clue...
    And yes, i use Ccleaner often, cleaning lots of crap stored on my Surface. I also set the CPU max processor state to 95%, so now the fen rarely kicks in when performing easy tasks...

    I think I made a post about this a while back, but here...I'll list a few
    • Battery life is nowhere close to what is advertised in real-wordl usage. A few spreadsheets and browser tabs/windows, the fan comes on and out goes decent battery life
    • Failing to wake up from sleep requiring a hard reboot. Even with the hibernate workaround (which I shouldn't have to put up with for the price of a premium device), my device fails to wakeup randomly, still requiring a hard reboot
    • Windows Hello having a mind of its own and working when it wants to
    • Type Cover disconnecting randomly - sometimes detaching and reattaching it fixes the issue, other times a restart is required
    • Random BSODs.

    Honestly, the list could go on. And this isn't a "you got a lemon" issue, I've tried multiple devices.
    Just my opinion
    1. Battery life is never the same as advertised by any company.
    2. Wake works as expected, since latest power managment updates
    3. Windows Hello works as it should, only on direct sunlight (especially outside), it rarely recognised me.
    4. Type cover has never disconnected since I own my SP4 (from January).
    04-19-2016 12:24 PM
  12. explosive0's Avatar
    Can you just briefly explain what the first thing does? I have no clue...
    And yes, i use Ccleaner often, cleaning lots of crap stored on my Surface. I also set the CPU max processor state to 95%, so now the fen rarely kicks in when performing easy tasks...



    Just my opinion
    1. Battery life is never the same as advertised by any company.
    2. Wake works as expected, since latest power managment updates
    3. Windows Hello works as it should, only on direct sunlight (especially outside), it rarely recognised me.
    4. Type cover has never disconnected since I own my SP4 (from January).
    http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/s...forum/surfpro4
    My issues are not an isolated occurrence. I'm glad yours is working as intended.
    04-19-2016 12:46 PM
  13. TechFreak1's Avatar
    I think I made a post about this a while back, but here...I'll list a few
    • Battery life is nowhere close to what is advertised in real-wordl usage. A few spreadsheets and browser tabs/windows, the fan comes on and out goes decent battery life
    • Failing to wake up from sleep requiring a hard reboot. Even with the hibernate workaround (which I shouldn't have to put up with for the price of a premium device), my device fails to wakeup randomly, still requiring a hard reboot
    • Windows Hello having a mind of its own and working when it wants to
    • Type Cover disconnecting randomly - sometimes detaching and reattaching it fixes the issue, other times a restart is required
    • Random BSODs.

    Honestly, the list could go on. And this isn't a "you got a lemon" issue, I've tried multiple devices.
    First of all, read the small print for all devices and you will see that there is a note saying something along the lines of your experience / battery life may vary. As a rule of thumb if a device has advertised 8 hrs battery life - deduct 3 to 2 hours and that will give you theoretically real world usage what the advertised battery life is based on. Anything intensive of course will decrease that; furthermore reducing the brightness of the screen will also help conserve battery life.

    2) That is a skylake issue and not just isolated to the Surface pro 4

    3) Understandable, it is still unfortunately in beta.. so bugs are still going to be apparent especially with the WaaS model with W10.

    4) I see, sounds like driver issues

    5) Check your GPU drivers, I have had no end of issues with intel igpu drivers (recent).

    As these (bar the battery life) are driver / software related issues it will/may span multiple devices sadly.
    04-19-2016 01:21 PM
  14. explosive0's Avatar
    First of all, read the small print for all devices and you will see that there is a note saying something along the lines of your experience / battery life may vary. As a rule of thumb if a device has advertised 8 hrs battery life - deduct 3 to 2 hours and that will give you theoretically real world usage what the advertised battery life is based on. Anything intensive of course will decrease that; furthermore reducing the brightness of the screen will also help conserve battery life.

    2) That is a skylake issue and not just isolated to the Surface pro 4

    3) Understandable, it is still unfortunately in beta.. so bugs are still going to be apparent especially with the WaaS model with W10.

    4) I see, sounds like driver issues

    5) Check your GPU drivers, I have had no end of issues with intel igpu drivers (recent).

    As these (bar the battery life) are driver / software related issues it will/may span multiple devices sadly.
    I honestly don't go in expecting the battery life advertised. My rule of thumb is give or take 20% reduction. When MS advertises 8 hours and I get 4 from typical usage, that's abysmal. When I use my MacBook, for example, I get close to (if not more) than what was advertised.

    Again, just stating my opinions and not trying to talk down MS; heck, I even work 100% on MS technology and want to see them succeed.
    04-19-2016 03:03 PM
  15. Steve Adams's Avatar
    Primary use: Excel, powerpoint, outlook, programming, and browsing.
    Situation: Have been using macbook air - love it but few applications are not supported so decided to switch to windows. Bought surface pro 4 on release - was highly disappointed with battery life - never got more than 4 hours after all the settings suggested on forum. See my post - surface pro 4 terrible battery life do you agree?. I returned it and back to air.

    Question: Considering all the recent updates - is surface pro 4 finally bug free and has 7 hours of battery life (considering my use)? In macbook air, I typically get 10 hours of battery life. Would appreciate if you can help with following:

    1. Buy SP4 as now it is fully baked and has at least 6 hours of battery life
    2. Hold on purchasing SP4
    3. Install windows 10 on macbook air

    Would appreciate if you can help and share your experience and suggestions.
    Were you using edge as the browser? if so, switch to IE11. I found that my battery life jumped massive amounts on all my devices running on 10. My 2 notebooks, and 2 surfaces were using edge first.....it was horrible.
    04-19-2016 03:45 PM
  16. TechFreak1's Avatar
    I honestly don't go in expecting the battery life advertised. My rule of thumb is give or take 20% reduction. When MS advertises 8 hours and I get 4 from typical usage, that's abysmal. When I use my MacBook, for example, I get close to (if not more) than what was advertised.

    Again, just stating my opinions and not trying to talk down MS; heck, I even work 100% on MS technology and want to see them succeed.
    Well like I said it depends what model you are using and it what's running in the background.

    For instance when my hp probook 4730s wasn't tethered to AC, I was able to stretch the battery to 10 hours by reducing the brightness, placing system files were seek times were lower on the hdd, under clocking and under volting. So yes, it depends what you are doing on the device - modern laptops and 2 in 1's don't suffer from battery fatigue the moment they leave the factory (unlike older cells).
    04-19-2016 06:23 PM
  17. ttsoldier's Avatar
    The SP4 i5, 8GB model i'm using is working just fine with all the updates and everything we got by now. It can eat any macs for dinner, and is perfectly reliable. The only thing you can't do with it is lock it with a power button and unlock it immidiately back on. U have to wait 10 - 15s, that's it. Battery life i'm getting with light usage is around 6h, 50% brightness. Also, W10 is awesome, after redstone it will be a killer!
    What do you mean you can't lock and unlock it with power button immediately? I do it with mine...

    Press power button. It locks. Press power button again. unlocks..Immediately
    04-19-2016 09:22 PM
  18. explosive0's Avatar
    What do you mean you can't lock and unlock it with power button immediately? I do it with mine...

    Press power button. It locks. Press power button again. unlocks..Immediately
    Press power button and it locks, but probably wouldn't wake up when you try to wake it up because of the known wake-up bug. The only workaround is to enable hibernation, which adds 10-15 seconds to the wake up process. No?
    04-19-2016 10:28 PM
  19. ttsoldier's Avatar
    Press power button and it locks, but probably wouldn't wake up when you try to wake it up because of the known wake-up bug. The only workaround is to enable hibernation, which adds 10-15 seconds to the wake up process. No?
    I have hibernation enabled.

    When I press the power button the screen simply locks. Just as it does when you press the power button on your Lumia.

    When I press the power button again, the screen unlocks. Just as it does when you unlock your lumia.

    There is no wake up process. Pressing the power button locks the device. Not puts it to sleep.

    In power settings I have "When I press the power button" configured to " Turn off the display"
    04-19-2016 10:44 PM
  20. explosive0's Avatar
    I have hibernation enabled.

    When I press the power button the screen simply locks. Just as it does when you press the power button on your Lumia.

    When I press the power button again, the screen unlocks. Just as it does when you unlock your lumia.

    There is no wake up process. Pressing the power button locks the device. Not puts it to sleep.

    In power settings I have "When I press the power button" configured to " Turn off the display"
    Lol. No it does not turn on instantly. Hibernation actually saves the state of your computer to memory before turning off, and once the power button is pressed, it has to load the system state from memory. So yeah, that's not instant on.
    04-20-2016 12:19 AM
  21. Axeelant's Avatar
    What do you mean you can't lock and unlock it with power button immediately? I do it with mine...

    Press power button. It locks. Press power button again. unlocks..Immediately
    Seems this is because your power button is only set to turn off the screen, mine is still set to Hybernate.
    Lol. No it does not turn on instantly. Hibernation actually saves the state of your computer to memory before turning off, and once the power button is pressed, it has to load the system state from memory. So yeah, that's not instant on.
    Exacly. Maybe after today's updates i can set it to sleep again? That should be better right?
    04-20-2016 07:03 AM
  22. cwds420's Avatar
    I've had a Surface Pro 4 for about a week now for much the same reason as you - as a practical alternative to my (heavy) Macbook Pro or (bad screen) Macbook Air. Up until yesterday I was pretty much set on taking it back - would reboot after sleep, not wake up with external display attached, lots of display driver reboots, and whatnot. The enormous package of updates delivered yesterday (Apr 19) appears to have solved all of these problems, at least for my use cases. Might actually get adventurous and try the Microsoft/Dell Dock again - previously it would lock up the machine in fascinating and seemingly random ways. If these driver updates fixed most or all of the issues; I'll certainly be keeping it as it's a very nice physical machine with a fantastic screen, great type cover; much nicer to use than anything Apple has came out with lately. Most of the issues appear to be Intel Skylake related; a Dell XPS13 I had for a bit had many of the same problems, as I would expect anything else released with this chipset. You would think that the most likely one to fix these issues in a timely fashion would be the Microsoft Devices - the way Dell had you update things was convoluted and backwards, cira 2000 or earlier; at least the Surface updates the Bios/Firmware with Windows Update.

    So if Intel/MS have finally figured out how to write drivers for this chipset, I'd say it's a fantastic machine that should serve you far better than anything Apple currently has on offer. I don't see any signs Apple will innovate whatsoever in the coming years - they are just rehashing quite old and tired designs into slightly different packages. If anyone ever decides to write any software for the UWP platform (Enpass is about the only good example I found from the programs I use) the whole universal platform idea has a lot of promise; there is no way you'd ever see something similar come out of Apple or Android land, they are too large and entrenched. In the meantime the Win32 programs work well enough, if a bit clunky in places.
    04-20-2016 09:54 AM
  23. TechFreak1's Avatar
    Lol. No it does not turn on instantly. Hibernation actually saves the state of your computer to memory before turning off, and once the power button is pressed, it has to load the system state from memory. So yeah, that's not instant on.
    When you say memory, you mean hard drive not RAM right?
    04-20-2016 03:15 PM
  24. ttsoldier's Avatar
    Lol. No it does not turn on instantly. Hibernation actually saves the state of your computer to memory before turning off, and once the power button is pressed, it has to load the system state from memory. So yeah, that's not instant on.
    Because my surface is not set to hibernate when I press the power button... I said that.. It's in the last line of the post I sent...
    04-20-2016 06:07 PM
  25. explosive0's Avatar
    Because my surface is not set to hibernate when I press the power button... I said that.. It's in the last line of the post I sent...
    Then your response was invalid, because the conversation we were having was regarding instant on/off being absolutely since release, and the SP4 randomly won't wake up unless you performed a hard reboot by holding the power button down for so long. Hibernation does not offer instant on, as it takes a few seconds to load the saved state. Thanks for playing though. 2/10.
    04-20-2016 11:57 PM
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