possible surface pro 2 trade in program?

[andrantos]

Actually, I think it could be argued that this is a new product, because of the increase in size. I think there would be some people who won't be interested in this because they think it's too large.

I kind of agree. I was theorycrafting to myself that when broadwell launches, instead of a refresh for this "SP3", we may see a refresh of the original sized model (a true SP3 so to speak).

 

[WillysJeepMan]

Actually, I think it could be argued that this is a new product, because of the increase in size. I think there would be some people who won't be interested in this because they think it's too large. I didn't say "too bad, so sad, ...", you're putting words in my mouth.

In reviewing your post and what others said, I incorrectly and unfairly attributed that attitude to your post. I apologize. You are correct, you did not express that attitude....others did, but you did not.

I just don't think a company owes me anything except a product that works as sold. And, truly, no company has the loyalty that Apple has (for a variety of reasons). They are unique in that respect. And, personally (although currently I'm into Windows Phones and Surface tablets), I will never feel loyalty to a corporation. I'm loyal to me and that means always keeping my options open when any company develops a product that meets my needs. Anything else seems like a foolish use of my finances.

I agree. It is possible for a company to develop customer loyalty that is NOT based on emotional tribalism. When a company provides a product that meets my needs, protects my investment (by maintaining the product's viability, sustainability, and value) then I give them the first shot when I'm looking to upgrade.

 

[Cleavitt76]

kicking loyal/trusting customers in the teeth... It's the Microsoft way.

This is happening with all tablets and mobile devices. It's not just a Microsoft thing. It's a rapidly developing market so this is bound to happen.

Apple has done this with most of the iPad releases being less than a year after the previous release and even discontinuing some models within several months of announcing them. My mom bought a Kindle Fire (which she had constant problems with) and she was pissed when the Kindle Fire HDX was released several months after. Mostly she was pissed because the issues were fixed in the HDX and she was stuck with her problematic Fire. Android tablets come and go so fast I can't even keep track of them.

People had the same issues with PCs and laptops up until just the last 5 years or so. This is just how it is with emerging technology. As long as your current device still works and is supported there is no reason to get upset about it other than gear lust.

 

[WillysJeepMan]

This is happening with all tablets and mobile devices. It's not just a Microsoft thing. It's a rapidly developing market so this is bound to happen.

Apple has done this with most of the iPad releases being less than a year after the previous release and even discontinuing some models within several months of announcing them.

In the most technical of senses, you are correct. But realistically, you are not correct.

1st generation: April 3, 2010
2nd generation:March 11, 2011 (3 weeks shy of a year after 1st gen)
3rd generation:: March 16, 2012 (1 year after 2nd gen)
4th generation: November 2, 2012 (8 months, Apple caught a lot of grief for this)
Air: November 1, 2013 (1 year after 4th gen)

Only the 4th gen came out less than a year (3 weeks between 1st/2nd is not significant)

My mom bought a Kindle Fire (which she had constant problems with) and she was pissed when the Kindle Fire HDX was released several months after. Mostly she was pissed because the issues were fixed in the HDX and she was stuck with her problematic Fire. Android tablets come and go so fast I can't even keep track of them.

People had the same issues with PCs and laptops up until just the last 5 years or so. This is just how it is with emerging technology. As long as your current device still works and is supported there is no reason to get upset about it other than gear lust.

There is a difference between when a person purchases a device shortly before the next generation is announced and the announce dates between generations. What I've been talking about is the company's timing of announcing generations.

Kindle Fire - 1st generation: November 15, 2011
Kindle Fire HD - 1st generation: September 14, 2012 (10 months after KF)
Kindle Fire HDX - 1st generation: September 25, 2013 (1 year after KF HD 1st gen)
Kindle Fire HD - 2nd generation: October 2, 2013 (13 months after 1st gen)


Surface Pro 2 : October 22, 2013 (this doesn't factor in the low inventory available in the 2 months or so afterwards)
Surface Pro 3: May 20th, 2014 (7 months after 2nd gen)

Both Apple and Amazon have a pretty steady release cycle. The exception was Apple releasing the iPad4 8 months after they released the iPad3... and they caught a lot of flack over it... including threats of a class-action lawsuit. Given that many here believe that the press and customers are overly friendly to Apple, that criticism is quite remarkable.

So here is Microsoft announcing the SP3 7 months after SP2 and "all is good, that's the way technology goes". mmm, ok.

I'm not saying that I am upset. I have a Surface 2 and no plans to get an SP3 (until the app gap is closed). What I AM saying is that if people are upset at the short time between generations, it is understandable because contrary to what you said, it is NOT the norm.

 

[nmercy]

MS has a real problem with marketing because we would not be having this conversation if MS had branded the Surface Pro 3 as Surface Pro or Surface Pro 2 "synonym for bigger". We would instead be praising them for creating a Macbook Air killer even if they never made another Surface Pro 2. Instead a lot of people are upset because they see this as meant to replace their Surface Pro 2 (which it is since you have to go out of your way to find it on the MS store), feel threatened and betrayed by it even though 80% of the Surface Pro 3 is the same as the Surface Pro 2.

I mean didn't they have a secret refresh to the Surface Pro 2 in January or February where they changed the CPU in it and only a very few people complained.

If they had labeled it the Surface Pro 2 "big" a year from now they could have refreshed it, called it Surface Pro 3 (eliminating the Pro 2 form factor), no one would have really complained.

 

[Cleavitt76]

...
So here is Microsoft announcing the SP3 7 months after SP2 and "all is good, that's the way technology goes". mmm, ok.

I'm not saying that I am upset. I have a Surface 2 and no plans to get an SP3 (until the app gap is closed). What I AM saying is that if people are upset at the short time between generations, it is understandable because contrary to what you said, it is NOT the norm.

Well it's 8+ months to be more accurate. The SP3 has been announced, but it won't be "released" for another month and the i3/i7 versions may be up to two months later. I'm not saying that the short time between Surface releases is ideal, but if the "norm" is 12 months and that is acceptable then I don't think it's fair to say that 8 months is "kicking customers in the teeth." It's the hyperbole that that I'm questioning.

As a former owner of a SP1 and a current owner of a SP2, I too would like to see the release schedule spread out a bit and more predictable. However, I'm willing to give MS some slack in this case because the Surface Pro is such a unique and ground breaking product. It's also being developed at a time when the required hardware for such a form factor is only now becoming a possibility. For example, Intel's Haswell was still in development when the original SP was released. Microsoft is the only company out there that has put in enough R&D investment to create this form factor and get it "right". I don't fault them for developing it over a few iterations. It's not like my SP2 is any less of a device than it was before the SP3 was announced.

At some point down the road Apple and others will probably have products similar to the Surface Pro. When they do I wouldn't be surprised if the first version is near SP3 specs right from the start. However, it won't be because MS likes to "kick their customers in the teeth" and Apple is always awesome to it's customers ("all of you are holding your phones wrong" -Steve Jobs re iPhone 4 antennae flaw). It will be because MS has already done the R&D, pioneered a new form factor, and figured out what works and what doesn't. Their competitors will have the luxury of copying, reverse engineering, and creating products long after the required hardware exists. All of that is fine, but I'm ok with MS moving quickly with SP releases since it is a cutting edge product. I'm just happy to be able to use such a cutting edge product and the Surface Pro 1/2 have been game changers for me.

 

[WillysJeepMan]

Well it's 8+ months to be more accurate. The SP3 has been announced, but it won't be "released" for another month and the i3/i7 versions may be up to two months later. I'm not saying that the short time between Surface releases is ideal, but if the "norm" is 12 months and that is acceptable then I don't think it's fair to say that 8 months is "kicking customers in the teeth." It's the hyperbole that that I'm questioning.

Sounds like one can infer that you believe that Apple was treated unfairly over the 8 month gap between the iPad 3 and 4.

We simply disagree. I'll leave it at that.

 

[rdubmu]

If you bought the device and you needed it at that time, wouldn't it still be useful.

My Surface Pro 1 is still just as great as the day I bought it. I don't upgrade my computers every year, about ever 4 years.

If somebody felt cheated between the iPad 3 and 4 there wasn't much of a difference except for the lightning cable. The iPad 3 and 4 run the same games, apps about the same size. (Yes I bought an iPad 3).

The iPad 4 was a minor update.

The surface pro 3 is not a minor update but it is also a device that could be considered in a different class. 12 inches vs the 10.6 on the sp2.

Because the Surface Pro 3 came out doesn't mean your Surface Pro 2 is any worse. If it is such a big deal sell it on Craigslist and buy the SP3


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[anon(5383410)]

In most cases the "you go in knowing it'll be outdated in 6 months" rule would apply and people shouldn't complain but this is different in my opinion.

If you JUST BOUGHT (a month or two ago) an SP2 it's perfectly reasonable to want the option to trade yours in. It's not a new concept and has been done before plenty of times.

For those that bought theirs earlier I think their gripe is with the release/update management and I don''t think t's fair to call them wanting an upgrade option unjustified entitlement. They simply shouldn't have released it so soon. I'd even take it as far as arguing that SP2 should've never happened. I'm sure they were already toying with this form factor (whether conceptually or working with a real prototype) while developing the SP2. Since the S2 and original form factors are nearly identical and they planned on releasing what eventually became SP3 this soon, they could've just as easily held off on an intermediary product release and had SP2=SP3.

The fact that they didn't comes off as either a money grab or poor release cycle management, possibly both. That's what rubs me the wrong way.

 

[mozman68]

The difference in size and aspect ratio alone make them two completely different devices.

Based on the number of SP2 commercials still running, I think they consider the SP3 as an add to the entire line and that some may still want the SP2.

I don't think they ever said the SP3 was introduced to replace the SP2...did they?

 

[anon(5383410)]

The difference in size and aspect ratio alone make them two completely different devices.

Based on the number of SP2 commercials still running, I think they consider the SP3 as an add to the entire line and that some may still want the SP2.

I don't think they ever said the SP3 was introduced to replace the SP2...did they?

If they were both launched at the same time, which would you have bought?

 

[WillysJeepMan]

If you bought the device and you needed it at that time, wouldn't it still be useful.

My Surface Pro 1 is still just as great as the day I bought it. I don't upgrade my computers every year, about ever 4 years.

If somebody felt cheated between the iPad 3 and 4 there wasn't much of a difference except for the lightning cable. The iPad 3 and 4 run the same games, apps about the same size. (Yes I bought an iPad 3).

The iPad 4 was a minor update.

The surface pro 3 is not a minor update but it is also a device that could be considered in a different class. 12 inches vs the 10.6 on the sp2.

No, the iPad 4 wasn't a minor update.

iPad 3: 0.3MP front-facing camera
iPad 4: 1.2MP front-facing camera

iPad 3: A5X processor
iPad 4: A6X processor (DOUBLE the speed of the A5X)

iPad 3: 30-pin connector
iPad 4: Lightning connector

iPad 3: single band WiFi
iPad 4: dual band/dual stream WiFi

iPad 3: 11 hours battery life
iPad 4: 12+ hours battery life

iPad 3: 4G limited international connectivity
iPad 4: 4G LTE international connectivity

It sounds like you don't think it is helpful to consumers to have a regular release cycle of products so that they can make an informed decision. I find that odd.

 

[Mike Coates1]

off topic, how do I make a new post on website

 

[mozman68]

If they were both launched at the same time, which would you have bought?

If I was looking for more of a tablet that is good for reading and watching movies...and I can happen to do work on, the SP2.

If work was more of my focus and tablet functions were secondary, the SP3

 

[anon(5383410)]

If I was looking for more of a tablet that is good for reading and watching movies...and I can happen to do work on, the SP2.

If work was more of my focus and tablet functions were secondary, the SP3

See this is what I mean. If you were looking for a tablet that's "good for reading and watching moves" you'd get a Surface RT. The other category wuld be productivity and the SP2 and SP3 overlap in this regard. If it boiled down to paying $200 extra for an i7 256 gb sp3 over a 256gb SP2 you can't honestly say you'd choose the sp2. More power, better power management, beefed up hardware and a bigger screen for $200 more bucks?

 

[mozman68]

See this is what I mean. If you were looking for a tablet that's "good for reading and watching moves" you'd get a Surface RT. The other category wuld be productivity and the SP2 and SP3 overlap in this regard. If it boiled down to paying $200 extra for an i7 256 gb sp3 over a 256gb SP2 you can't honestly say you'd choose the sp2. More power, better power management, beefed up hardware and a bigger screen for $200 more bucks?

I think cost becomes less of an issue and the size of the screen is more of an issue.

No different than the pricing of iPads.

 

[Oneofthesedays]

Honestly I'm a little upset Microsoft is not offering existing SP2 owners a way to easily upgrade to SP3.

They need to take a page out of Apple's book and offer trade in programs that help lock in loyal users. Am hoping someone at Microsoft is paying attention here.

 

[BobLobIaw]

Honestly I'm a little upset Microsoft is not offering existing SP2 owners a way to easily upgrade to SP3.

They need to take a page out of Apple's book and offer trade in programs that help lock in loyal users. Am hoping someone at Microsoft is paying attention here.

I don't disagree that Microsoft should consider having a trade-in program, but if they did, it would undoubtedly still be more cost-effective for you to sell your SP2. Trade-in programs are great for those that don't like to deal with used equipment, but like with used car trade-ins it's never a good deal for the consumer.

 

[Danjp]

There's always been a trade in program, its called eBay.

 

[nmercy]

The difference in size and aspect ratio alone make them two completely different devices.

Based on the number of SP2 commercials still running, I think they consider the SP3 as an add to the entire line and that some may still want the SP2.

I don't think they ever said the SP3 was introduced to replace the SP2...did they?

They never came out and said directly SP3 was a replacement for the SP2, but their actions seem to be speaking louder than words at the moment. If you go to the Microsoft Store they've replaced SP2 with SP3 on the Surface page, you have to search for the Surface Pro 2 using the search box, and once you find it, currently only the 512 and 128 are in stock... most likely the page is just around for inventory clearance.