07-16-2013 01:38 AM
32 12
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  1. EchoRedux's Avatar
    I know you've seen it. People on here complain about it. Reviewers, users, lovers, haters, all seem to agree that Windows Phone needs 1080p screens and quad core processors. In short, some specs mean a heck of a lot more than others. Processors are rarely the bottleneck and my Focus S super amoled+ Screen with less than 220 ppi looks better than the screen on the Sammy GS 4. I feel like I'm in the minority when I make my demands, but here they are:

    I demand more RAM
    I demand faster read/write speeds from the storage
    I demand a larger battery


    More RAM brings more capabilities to the phone. More processing power (dual core to quad core) doesn't. If the rumors are true and the EOS/1020 comes with 2 GB of RAM, I'd say that is easily the biggest step forward for Windows Phone. Far bigger deal than a 41mp camera, a quad core processor, or a full HD screen. Honestly, I don't know anything "Droid Does" that couldn't be done on a Windows Phone with 2 gigs of RAM.

    tl;dr version: RAM matters more than processing speed and screen resolution at this point.
    a5cent and zeronoise like this.
    07-09-2013 12:01 AM
  2. nube_android's Avatar
    I think most people don't care about RAM. Only the writers do and techies like me. Personally I think live tiles an awesome ux and a high end camera will be more than enough to sell people.
    07-09-2013 12:06 AM
  3. nube_android's Avatar
    2GB of ram and a quad core CPU will likely come in the HTC One WP 8.1 version
    07-09-2013 12:07 AM
  4. EchoRedux's Avatar
    I think that's a problem though. People care too much about things that aren't needed at this time like quad core. An underpowered processor still runs processes, too little RAM and you can't run the process at all.
    07-09-2013 12:09 AM
  5. z33dev33l's Avatar
    Ram is sadly important... Nova almost melts my 920
    Rem97 likes this.
    07-09-2013 12:24 AM
  6. FinancialP's Avatar
    Ram isn't the issue. Although I agree more would be better.

    Badly coded apps and games are the issue.

    However everyone can't be coding bad apps and games that require 1gb of ram. Complex situation.
    07-09-2013 12:52 AM
  7. nube_android's Avatar
    I still don't understand why an iPhone 4S with 512MB of ram can run most every game on the app store and Microsoft and nokias Lumia phones with 512MB of ram cannot.
    07-09-2013 01:10 AM
  8. tissotti's Avatar
    I still don't understand why an iPhone 4S with 512MB of ram can run most every game on the app store and Microsoft and nokias Lumia phones with 512MB of ram cannot.
    Like said above, devs not optimazing the software. Same as console vs PC's, even as you can get better results on PC.
    Not a developer so I don't know if much of the blame could be directed to WP tools or similar. WP is still better at this than Android, probably because MS seems to have limited WP8 to 2 SoC's so far.
    07-09-2013 06:02 AM
  9. SnailUK's Avatar
    I still don't understand why an iPhone 4S with 512MB of ram can run most every game on the app store and Microsoft and nokias Lumia phones with 512MB of ram cannot.
    Its simple. iPhones were on sale for years with 512mb ram. Developers were used to writing apps for 512mb, and there are tens of millions of 512mb devices out there.

    WP8 came along, and most developers just do lazy ports to WP8, because of the much smaller market. Its no different to early Android, which was forever suffering a similar fate.

    That's why 2GB of ram scares me. Great for the top devices, but lazy developers will just start targetting the higher spec units, and all the existing phones will start to suffer :(
    07-09-2013 07:37 AM
  10. vlad0's Avatar
    The most important thing is that it can handle 41Mpix camera with a SoC that doesn't support it.. that is where the real engineering magic happens.
    07-09-2013 10:09 AM
  11. MAERSK's Avatar
    The most important thing is that it can handle 41Mpix camera with a SoC that doesn't support it.. that is where the real engineering magic happens.
    So you're betting on it not being the S800? If this were true then it truly is magical or really clever :)
    07-09-2013 10:38 AM
  12. EchoRedux's Avatar
    Remember, the iPhone uses PowerVR chipsets as it's GPU. Just about every same generation Adreno is underpowered in comparison. I'm sure this is why RAM limitations play a bigger factor in Windows Phones than in iOS, even though iPhone 5 has more RAM than it's predecessors.
    07-09-2013 11:21 AM
  13. TechAbstract's Avatar
    Remember, the iPhone uses PowerVR chipsets as it's GPU. Just about every same generation Adreno is underpowered in comparison. I'm sure this is why RAM limitations play a bigger factor in Windows Phones than in iOS, even though iPhone 5 has more RAM than it's predecessors.
    That can't be right. The iPhone 4 has a weak PowerVR SGX 535 GPU compares to Adreno 305/225 on WP8. Only iPhone 4S and iPhone 5 have powerful GPUs.
    07-09-2013 09:58 PM
  14. a5cent's Avatar
    I feel like I'm in the minority when I make my demands, but here they are:

    I demand more RAM
    I demand faster read/write speeds from the storage
    I demand a larger battery
    The only demand I'm not instantly on board with is the one for more RAM. Not because it's a bad idea, but because that alone isn't enough. As it is now, you can add as much RAM to a WP device as you want, without it making the slightest difference. Why? Because WP puts caps on how much RAM apps have at their disposal. These are described here. Basically, if you want that extra RAM to actually have an affect, then you need to change a lot of other OS level functions along with it.

    Additionally, it would be far more beneficial to raise the low-end from 512 MB to 1 GB, than it would be to raise the high-end from 1 GB to 2 GB. Why? Because all apps specifically written for WP are targeted to run well on 512 MB devices. There is practically no benefit to be had from running such apps on devices with more RAM. Raising the low-end however, that changes what WP developers actually target, which is much more likely to make a noticeable difference.

    Just to be clear. I'm definitely not saying more RAM is a bad idea. I'm just trying to add some background knowledge and show that there is more to it than just calling for more RAM. Basically, I'd want to know more about everything affected before putting my vote behind it.

    Finally, if forced to choose, I'd much rather get lower latency RAM and higher bandwidth RAM, before getting more RAM. Particularly because the RAM in our smartphones also serves as shared video memory, for which it is painfully slow.

    Completely agree with your other two points, so I'll join your minority group.

    That's why 2GB of ram scares me. Great for the top devices, but lazy developers will just start targeting the higher spec units, and all the existing phones will start to suffer :(
    IMHO we really need to differentiate between ports on the one hand, and apps that are built from the ground up for WP, on the other.

    Games that are ported from Android or iOS aren't targeted at any specific hardware configuration. They are just converted as quickly as possible and whatever amount of RAM they end up using defines the minimal requirements. If developers are required to put in a lot of work to reduce the memory footprint, then it's usually not worth the cost, in which case those ports end up running only on 1 GB devices.

    That is completely different from software built specifically for WP. The 1GHz / 512 MB models represent the vast majority of all WP devices on the market. Because developers want access to the largest possible user base, practically all WP apps are specifically targeted at these lower-end devices. So, at least for apps that were specifically written for WP, you need not fear the lazy-developer/2GB scenario you described.
    07-10-2013 12:43 AM
  15. vlad0's Avatar
    So you're betting on it not being the S800? If this were true then it truly is magical or really clever :)
    No, that would be too easy :) I am betting on a custom made GPU inside the camera module, just like what they have on the Symbian device.
    07-10-2013 07:50 AM
  16. Bizarro_Prime's Avatar
    2GB of ram and a quad core CPU will likely come in the HTC One WP 8.1 version
    Or maybe the HTC 8.One ? (see what I did there)
    Rem97 likes this.
    07-10-2013 09:57 AM
  17. Pavel Gotze's Avatar
    Is there any real application, excluding games, where person can care if there is 1 GB or 2 GB of RAM in his device?
    07-10-2013 10:09 AM
  18. a5cent's Avatar
    Is there any real application, excluding games, where person can care if there is 1 GB or 2 GB of RAM in his device?
    Allegedly, the Lumia EOS will come with 2 GB of memory. Considering that a single image from this device's camera could be up to 100 MB large (obviously before applying jpeg compression), handling such images sounds like it might be a sensible application for that much RAM.
    Last edited by a5cent; 07-10-2013 at 11:31 AM. Reason: Spelling
    07-10-2013 10:50 AM
  19. vlad0's Avatar
    Allegedly, the Lumia EOS will come with 2 GB of memory. Considering that a single image from this device's camera could be up to 100 MB large (obviously before applying jpeg compression), that would seem like a sensible application for that extra GB of RAM.
    No need.. the Symbian version does it on really slow 512 RAM
    theefman likes this.
    07-10-2013 11:14 AM
  20. z33dev33l's Avatar
    No need.. the Symbian version does it on really slow 512 RAM
    Didn't that one have a secondary processor strictly for the camera though? I may be wrong.
    07-10-2013 11:32 AM
  21. a5cent's Avatar
    No need.. the Symbian version does it on really slow 512 RAM
    In that case I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place, because there is no other reason for the EOS to get bumped up to 2 GB at this time.

    For all I know, the 2 GB limit could just be a false rumour, but if it isn't, then the camera has something to do with it.

    P.S. The image processor on the 808 certainly has its own generous helping of dedicated memory. Only when it was done would it transfer the results to those 512 MB of system RAM.
    07-10-2013 11:55 AM
  22. EchoRedux's Avatar
    I think this is supposed to be a new Flagship device until 8.1 so they are putting enough RAM to match the high end Androids. Heck, even Blackberry has 2 GB devices. If anything, it looks a lot better on the spec sheet.
    07-10-2013 12:00 PM
  23. vlad0's Avatar
    Didn't that one have a secondary processor strictly for the camera though? I may be wrong.
    You are right, but I am not sure how the extra GPU helps the RAM..



    P.S. The image processor on the 808 certainly has its own generous helping of dedicated memory. Only when it was done would it transfer the results to those 512 MB of system RAM.
    Unless the 1020 has the Snap 800, and that alone is enough for the oversampling and the mpix count.. I think they might have done the same thing again and have that extra custom GPU built into the camera module.
    07-10-2013 12:18 PM
  24. EchoRedux's Avatar
    Not worthy of it's own thread, but I found it interesting that Gorilla Glass 3 is being used. I think the 925 and 928 screens are Gorilla Glass 2 making me believe this is the first Windows Phone with Corning's current most advanced glass.
    07-10-2013 05:17 PM
  25. MAERSK's Avatar
    Not worthy of it's own thread, but I found it interesting that Gorilla Glass 3 is being used. I think the 925 and 928 screens are Gorilla Glass 2 making me believe this is the first Windows Phone with Corning's current most advanced glass.
    I think they had to since this is using the 2.5 D display. IIRC N9/L800's were a bit fragile b/c of it but looked so much better. Might also explain it being a bit larger than a L920?. Anyways, so in LOVE with these camera specs. Thank you Nokia! <3 Truly made my day :)
    07-10-2013 05:37 PM
32 12

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