08-28-2013 04:25 PM
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  1. JamesC1119's Avatar
    I'm an iPhone 5 owner and I'm jumping ship to WP for this. While I'm far from a pro photographer, with two kids under two years old there's never enough time to grab the DSLR to get the best pictures. I've been waiting for this for a while. I held out on the 920 hoping this would be coming soon. $299 is not an issue for me if the camera exceeds what I can get in other smartphones with an OS that is half way decent. From what I've seen of WP I'm pretty excited, I'm sure I'll have a few app withdraws, primarily Instagram, but overall I'm ready to jump ship and pre-order this bad boy. Looking forward to the 16/26th respectively.
    07-11-2013 04:59 PM
  2. Musicman247's Avatar
    Elop himself said that there would be a bigger push for this phone than for the 920, but it wouldn't be anything compared to the push for the phones at the end of the year and beyond.

    Keep calm and be patient.
    07-11-2013 05:01 PM
  3. a5cent's Avatar
    It's the same price as the 32 GB iP5 on AT&T, which a very large portion of the American public was able to afford. Compared to the overpriced iP5, where you're paying primarily for the Apple logo, this purchase actually gets you ground-breaking hardware. Whether people will do the same for the L1020 is just a question of how it is sold in stores:

    Sales staff:

    "You want a smartphone with a good camera? Well, take a look at this. It's the Lumia 1020. The camera in this baby is in a league of its own! Amazingly, the camera is actually better than any of the point-and-shoot cameras some people still use. It even rivals some of the larger and more expensive camera models. However, just take a moment to appreciate how it's still "smartphone sized" and not "camera sized"! That means everyone can comfortably take this with them wherever they go. For people who want their photographs to look professional, rather than just good, but don't want to carry a dedicated camera around with them, this is a game changer. It's effectively two devices in one. It's a camera, and it's a reliable and easy to use smartphone. If you're also one of those people that appreciate great image quality, possibly even contemplated purchasing a real point-and-shoot in the next two years, then getting this device can save you hundreds of dollars. It's a smart deal, because you're getting us (AT&T) to subsidize your camera purchase along with your smartphone purchase. Would that interest you?"

    The GS4 and iPhone can get away with $249, $299, whatever, because they've earned that reputation.
    Yes, and as ridiculous as it sounds, that reputation is earned, first and foremost, by launching a higher priced device! What is and what isn't too expensive is a matter of consumer perception and frame of reference. Factually, the iP5 was and still is the most overpriced consumer electronics product ever produced. Their margins far exceed their competition's. The L1020 is factually the much better deal. After all, we're not really paying for the plastic and silicon that went into building it, but rather the costs associated with optics and materials research. No other company invests that amount of research dollars, and Nokia deserves a return on that investment. That goes beyond what most consumers are aware of, but considering that, it is a fair price. At least for now. If Nokia can't communicate that, then they must learn or fail. Better to start learning now.
    Last edited by a5cent; 07-11-2013 at 05:57 PM. Reason: Spelling
    07-11-2013 05:14 PM
  4. John20212's Avatar
    we're not just paying for the plastic and silicon that went into manufacturing the L1020, but also all the optics and materials research that went into it. No other smartphone OEM goes to such lengths to improve smartphone technology. Everyone else is happy with purchasing off the shelf components or buying up innovative startups when they appear. That's more than most consumers realize, but considering that this is a fair price. At least for now. If Nokia can't communicate that, then they must learn or fail. Better to start learning now.
    Good point, the problem is Nokia did not really communicate the price justification of $300 + 2y contract. I really hope they learn fast, as you suggested, because it would be a shame to see them fail. And without further explanation of the $300 price point they probably will fail.
    07-11-2013 05:32 PM
  5. ninjaap's Avatar
    Just like how I refuse to pay $500 for the xbox one, I refuse to pay $300 for the 1020. But I will still get these devices. I will wait a year or two for the One to drop in price and I will wait a month or two for 1020 to hit Amazon and undercut ATT.
    techiedude007 and gsquared like this.
    07-11-2013 05:43 PM
  6. chezm's Avatar
    I gotta say I sort of agree here, $300 on contract is pretty crazy and I also have doubts this will sway people to get it over an iPhone. Its unfortunate, I know a lot of people who would upgrade to this type of phone for the picture quality...but not at that price.
    Kebero likes this.
    07-11-2013 05:48 PM
  7. tractionx's Avatar
    Just like how I refuse to pay $500 for the xbox one, I refuse to pay $300 for the 1020. But I will still get these devices. I will wait a year or two for the One to drop in price and I will wait a month or two for 1020 to hit Amazon and undercut ATT.
    That's certainly an ... interesting ... way to look at economics. Say you wait a year for each to drop by $120... If the value of an Xbox 1 and a 1020 are so low to you that the use of them for a year isn't worth $120, how is the value high enough to ever be worth buying? You're saying the use of them isn't worth $10/month for all that extra use in 2013, but in 2014, it'd be worth that? What changed during that time?

    If you're poor enough that $100 makes a difference, perhaps a phone that is going to cost you almost $3k on contract is a bad decision to make? I mean, $100 is a few percent ...
    theefman likes this.
    07-11-2013 05:49 PM
  8. a5cent's Avatar
    Good point, the problem is Nokia did not really communicate the price justification of $300 + 2y contract. I really hope they learn fast, as you suggested, because it would be a shame to see them fail. And without further explanation of the $300 price point they probably will fail.
    Ouch, I see you quoted me before I made my last edit

    Anyway, to your point. I have a hunch it might not be a good idea to justify anything at a launch event. You need to convey confidence in your products. I suspect justifications are best left to retail sales staff. Either way, it's evident that Nokia has their work cut out for them.
    07-11-2013 05:55 PM
  9. ninjaap's Avatar
    That's certainly an ... interesting ... way to look at economics. Say you wait a year for each to drop by $120... If the value of an Xbox 1 and a 1020 are so low to you that the use of them for a year isn't worth $120, how is the value high enough to ever be worth buying? You're saying the use of them isn't worth $10/month for all that extra use in 2013, but in 2014, it'd be worth that? What changed during that time?

    If you're poor enough that $100 makes a difference, perhaps a phone that is going to cost you almost $3k on contract is a bad decision to make? I mean, $100 is a few percent ...
    You're making it to be more complicated than it really is.

    Amazon has a history of undercutting ATT prices within a month or two of release. I will not be waiting a year for the 1020, it will only be a couple months.

    Each version of xbox has a lifespan of about what - 7 yrs? So waiting a year or two for a Xbox One price drop (which historically has) is nothing especially if I still have my 360.

    Does calling me poor make you feel superior somehow?
    Laura Knotek and Dazzi like this.
    07-11-2013 05:56 PM
  10. gsquared's Avatar
    I gotta say I sort of agree here, $300 on contract is pretty crazy and I also have doubts this will sway people to get it over an iPhone. Its unfortunate, I know a lot of people who would upgrade to this type of phone for the picture quality...but not at that price.
    Your not taking into account that $299 is chump-change for most folks. I spend more than that on booze and women every month.
    07-11-2013 05:58 PM
  11. a5cent's Avatar
    Your not taking into account that $299 is chump-change for most folks. I spend more than that on booze and women every month.
    I'm relieved to hear that. I know a lot of people are having a tough time in the U.S. but I was starting to wonder whether any Americans still earn money.
    07-11-2013 06:05 PM
  12. John20212's Avatar
    Your not taking into account that $299 is chump-change for most folks. I spend more than that on booze and women every month.
    Well, for some, every cent makes a difference. That does not neccessarily mean that they are poor, it just means that they are more careful and wise with their finances.
    chezm and Dazzi like this.
    07-11-2013 06:09 PM
  13. chezm's Avatar
    Your not taking into account that $299 is chump-change for most folks. I spend more than that on booze and women every month.
    All because people CAN afford it ddoesn't means they will spend it...i am one of those people and so are most of my peers. I can spend $$$ each month of entertainment but I try to consider a need vs want. With that said, $300 on a contract for 2 years is a lot of cash...and when the general consumer puts a $150 iphone5 vs a $300 WP8 phone which likely none of their friends own....what do you think they'll choose? Its not that the phone isn't worth the cost, but its the competitive factor im talking about.
    Dazzi likes this.
    07-11-2013 06:20 PM
  14. Maserati Storm's Avatar
    I totally I agree with this. I was watching the live stream and during the Q&A one lady asked what makes this better than the i5 and the galaxy 4, Elop talked about the camera and just the windows phone experience thats been out for the past few months! If Nokia had their own is with this phone or even tweaked wp8 to another feature in there it would of been easier to sell (maybe). I'm a Nokia fan before windows and after seeing this transition Nokia is a caged bird, best thing they can do is make good phones/camera phones. Microsoft needs to throw money at marketing to get this sorted.
    chezm and Dazzi like this.
    07-11-2013 06:20 PM
  15. tgp's Avatar
    But does the 1020 have much of anything over other phones besides the camera? I know that most of us here like WP better, but we still admit that it falls behind the competition in features & capabilities. I personally couldn't care less about camera quality, as long as it's acceptable. I don't see most consumers paying more & making the jump simply for a better camera. I see the 1020 as a device for a niche market.
    07-11-2013 06:33 PM
  16. LMZR's Avatar
    Was that Elop doing the presentation?

    This phone is not gonna be for everyone, If you're coming from the iPhone 4. I'm sure you won't want to fork out $299 dollars for a Lumia 1020, but let's say you've come from the Lumia 920 and you are a good photographer, yes you would get the 1020.
    07-11-2013 06:41 PM
  17. Giddora's Avatar
    I'm upgrading from the 920 to the 1020 simply for the camera. I like the 920, and if it get's even better... Why not?
    theefman likes this.
    07-11-2013 06:52 PM
  18. boo516's Avatar
    I went in today to trade in my old samsung focus and they said that they have a promotion that if you trade in smartphones for an upgrade you can get $100-$200 off a new phone. My focus would get $100 but a 920 or 820 would get $200 off. I don't know if that sweetens the deal for you guys but it does for me.
    07-11-2013 07:03 PM
  19. MerlinJnr's Avatar
    Was that Elop doing the presentation?

    This phone is not gonna be for everyone, If you're coming from the iPhone 4. I'm sure you won't want to fork out $299 dollars for a Lumia 1020, but let's say you've come from the Lumia 920 and you are a good photographer, yes you would get the 1020.
    a good photographer? What's a good photographer? You mean someone who aspires to take better camera phone images. Think I'll spend the dollars on a 40mm macro lens and ring flash for my D7000.
    07-11-2013 07:13 PM
  20. ninjaap's Avatar
    I went in today to trade in my old samsung focus and they said that they have a promotion that if you trade in smartphones for an upgrade you can get $100-$200 off a new phone. My focus would get $100 but a 920 or 820 would get $200 off. I don't know if that sweetens the deal for you guys but it does for me.
    Hell yeah it does! How do we take advantage of this trade in? When does it start? Can we do it online or does it have to be in store?
    07-11-2013 07:33 PM
  21. hyedefinition's Avatar
    Copy paste from my other post:

    And yes that $700 price is ridiculous. Why so you ask? Because I just bought (and returned) an 808 Pureview for $400. The Lumia 1020 actually has an even SMALLER sensor than the 808, 1/1.5" instead of 1/1.2". The Lumia 920, which released last year, had an MSRP of $450. It should cost even LESS now to make for Nokia. You combine the current cost of the dated budget-like 920 and the cost of a SMALLER 808 sensor, it in no way equals a whopping $700. You also have to subtract the cost of the 920's camera since its not used, the wireless charging which there are none, and the lower price of the budget internals. You seriously can't expect whatever little R&D was done to fuse the two to be worth an extra $200-300. The $700 is just grossly overpriced. I wouldn't mind as much if it had a snapdragon 800 in it and a 5" 1080p display (ARM processors are CHEAP if you actually look at the bill of materials, and the extra cost from 4.5" to 5" 1080p isn't that much since its such a commodity), and even then, it would be overpriced. Not to mention its an ALL-PLASTIC phone. Polycarbonate is a fancy word for plastic.
    You're wrong in so many places. I really doubt you have used Nokia phones, the polycarbonate feels more sturdy than the all-metal phones out there.

    How do you expect Nokia to release 1080p and quad-cores when the software for WP doesn't support it yet. Have patience, that will come later on this year. The 1020 hardware will STILL compete with smartphones - especially the camera aspect - for at least the next 1.5 years. For that alone, I'd be willing to fork in $700. Knowing that, like the 808 before it, the camera will hold the crown for a long time.
    07-11-2013 07:37 PM
  22. falconeight's Avatar
    I would pay full price with contract for that phone. I have kids and live to take pictures of them and my family. I will have this thing no matter what it costs.
    07-11-2013 09:22 PM
  23. adrock107's Avatar
    I come at it from this angle... Let's not forget that the iPhone is selling at 199 for a 16GB model. If you opt for the 32GB option (which the 920 and 1020 come with already) then the price jumps to... 299, same as the 1020. I'll admit it's a hard sell against anyone who paid 99 or less on-contract for their Lumia 920, but if you compare it to directly to the competing iPhone or GS4 (32GB @ 249), it's not priced too terribly. There are those that will argue that it's a skinnier 920 without Qi charging and a giant camera sensor slapped onto it; it's not a 920 successor, and it's not like the competition don't celebrate evolution like a slimmer body as "revolutionary innovation" anyway.
    Dazzi and Mach_E like this.
    07-11-2013 09:30 PM
  24. LewLew23's Avatar
    Hell yeah it does! How do we take advantage of this trade in? When does it start? Can we do it online or does it have to be in store?
    You can do it online or in store, but if you do it in store, it's instant. Online I believe you wait about 2 weeks and then they send you a card in the mail.
    07-11-2013 09:34 PM
  25. TonyDedrick's Avatar
    That's certainly an ... interesting ... way to look at economics. Say you wait a year for each to drop by $120... If the value of an Xbox 1 and a 1020 are so low to you that the use of them for a year isn't worth $120, how is the value high enough to ever be worth buying? You're saying the use of them isn't worth $10/month for all that extra use in 2013, but in 2014, it'd be worth that? What changed during that time?

    If you're poor enough that $100 makes a difference, perhaps a phone that is going to cost you almost $3k on contract is a bad decision to make? I mean, $100 is a few percent ...
    I would have never purchased a Kinect at 149.99. Even after demoing and enjoying Dance Central and watching my sister in law and her family use it for video chat, it still was not worth $149.99, IMO. However, I found it used a year later on Amazon for $40. It was a no brainer purchase at that point
    07-11-2013 09:37 PM
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