05-30-2014 11:55 AM
27 12
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  1. misterpunn's Avatar
    I have a Lumia 1020 and while I always thought the camera was good, I didn't quite understand why everyone praised it as much as they did, since my photos often came-out slightly blurry and the lossless zoom wasn't quite what I expected it to be. However, I just chalked it up to figuring that I had unrealistic expectations, so I never really looked much into it.

    This weekend, I compared my 1020 to my dad's 1020, and my dad's 1020 absolutely out-performed mine. To keep everything fair, I kept both phones on full auto settings and I took pictures from the exact same angle and distance. His pictures from a distance looked about the same as mine, but when you zoom in, his pictures stayed crisp and mine had a lot of static in comparison.

    Does anyone have any suggestions of what I should do? I called the Microsoft Store and they said that because I'm on the Developer Preview with 8.1 I should wait for the actual 8.1 release. This is the same store that also gave me this 1020 after I was experiencing the storage issue on my 920 so I don't want to press them too hard and seem ungrateful. Is Nokia or taking it to an AT&T Store an option? Should I hard reset (not preferred but not the worst thing?)

    I appreciate any thoughts!

    Pictures for reference:
    Mine: pt-coke-bottle1.jpg
    Dad's: dads-coke-bottle1.jpg

    Mine: pt-coke-bottle2.jpg
    Dad's: dad-coke-bottle-2.jpg
    Last edited by misterpunn; 05-28-2014 at 11:42 AM. Reason: Picture rearrangement
    Beijendorf likes this.
    05-28-2014 09:16 AM
  2. Beijendorf's Avatar
    Obviously start out by reverting to the same software version your dad has on his 1020 to see if it's a hardware or software error.
    If it's a hardware error they need to fix it or give you a new phone. If it's a software error you can rest easy and just hold out until the official 8.1 release.

    Edit: I should also point out that your dads picture seem to be a lot blurrier and with a different white balance, so it may just be different auto settings. You could also try setting the manual mode to the same instead of having it on auto to see if it makes a difference.
    jojoe42, misterpunn and xandros9 like this.
    05-28-2014 09:22 AM
  3. Dietrich Cleijne's Avatar
    Are you using RAW?
    05-28-2014 09:22 AM
  4. Gen Pop 1's Avatar
    Maybe it is one of the prescriptions? Might want to crop your photo if any of that is personal to you
    misterpunn likes this.
    05-28-2014 09:29 AM
  5. erda0's Avatar
    8.1 version should improve your picture quality...
    05-28-2014 09:46 AM
  6. misterpunn's Avatar
    I e-mailed the pictures directly from both of our phones to my e-mail address (meaning no uploading to the computer first.) The capture mode on both phones is set to "JPEG (5MP + 34MP.) I don't have much experience with the RAW photos, but perhaps the fact that I e-mailed them directly from the phones answers your question.
    05-28-2014 09:47 AM
  7. misterpunn's Avatar
    That's what I thought, but the Music on 8.1 got much worse, so that's why the Windows Store guy offered that suggestion (sadly we know each other by name because I've been there so often and he was frank with me.)

    Like I said, I had always thought my pictures weren't as good as I thought they should be (even before 8.1,) though, which leads me to believe it might be my camera.
    05-28-2014 09:55 AM
  8. Beijendorf's Avatar
    E-mailing a picture once shouldn't do anything for it's quality. You'd have to re-save a JPEG hundreds of times before you get a noticeable difference like this. If you want to rule everything out, set the exact manual settings on both phones and snap a picture under the same conditions. Don't leave anything in auto.

    They could have altered the imaging algorithms in 8.1, I haven't got a clue. WP 8.1 is still under development, so don't assume it's "better". If the manual-settings solution does nothing, your next natural step is to revert to WP 8.0 and trying the manual-settings test again. If the camera is still off, notify customer support with the new information. They're always thankful when you've tried trouble-shooting and ruling out the most obvious errors first.
    05-28-2014 09:58 AM
  9. xconomicron's Avatar
    FYI, same thing happened to me.

    If you go digging around, you might find that it could be a sensor issue. I know some batches of 1020's had a bad sensor in them. -something you might want to check out...
    Beijendorf likes this.
    05-28-2014 10:18 AM
  10. buxz777's Avatar
    to me it looks like different auto settings , have you checked the picture exif data too see what the camera was doing? your camera looks like it used a higher iso and slower shutter speed , your dads look like it used a lower iso and fast shutter speed

    I can make my 1020 do exactly the same thing by changing the settings , I often do to get a better xenon shot with more detail as the auto settings can be a bit hit and miss with the 1020 , the auto xenon settings tend to use shutter speeds of like 1/30 second and a iso of like 400 or higher to give a more natraul looking shot at the expense of clarity and detail , I personally like to use iso 100 and a faster shutter speed to make the shot as clean as I can ...... this results in pictures that look much more 808 like with less orange/yellow being absorbed from surrounding light sources

    so basically check/upload the exif data from both pics here and we can see what has happened , either that or use both phones in manual and change the settings to the same on both ;-)
    05-28-2014 10:20 AM
  11. sban85's Avatar
    idk if its just me, but your dad's phone seems to have flash on...or at least focus light effects on when compared to yours
    05-28-2014 11:12 AM
  12. misterpunn's Avatar
    I truly appreciate all of the replies!

    Some of these questions are over my head, such as buxz777's question about the exif data (could you tell me how to do that?)

    I haven't altered the auto settings since I've gotten my phone and neither has my dad. I figured my dad's still had the notorious yellowed look because he is still on 8.0 and I'm on 8.1 with all the camera app updates. I doubt my dad even knows how to do app updates. I also uninstalled Nokia Camera and reinstalled it before I took the pictures.

    I literally took both pictures exactly the same way using the physical camera button, and pressing that button at the same speed. Flash, focus and all other settings were kept fully on auto. If there was a flash on one and not on the other, that was the camera's decision.

    I'll look into downgrading back to 8.0 so I can do a comparison. I also should have thought about setting identical manual settings and tested it that way...maybe I'll be able to try that this weekend.
    05-28-2014 11:54 AM
  13. buxz777's Avatar
    if you open the pic on the phone , open in nokia camera , then pess the 3 dots , then press show picture details , it should show you the iso , the shutter speed , file size etc

    if these aren't the same on each device then the even though both phones were in auto , there might have been a slight difference in light that made each 1020 choose different settings ;-)

    it could also be a faulty phone but if these settings are different then it could also be that ;-)
    05-28-2014 12:56 PM
  14. anon(8555314)'s Avatar
    Any time you are comparing any two things, you need to change just one variable at a time. In this case the variable you are changing is the camera taking the picture. So you need to make sure that no other variables are changing. Make sure that you are using the same version of the same software, with all of the manual settings the same, location the same, ideally using a tripod so that the cameras are held the same, the lighting needs to be the same, and so on and so forth. If you haven't set up the comparo this way, then you aren't in any position to make a judgement, and it would be silly to go back to 8.0 on the theory that 8.1 did something bad to your camera, or to conclude that your camera doesn't work as well as other 1020s.
    05-28-2014 01:08 PM
  15. MarqBland's Avatar
    I'm not trying to be an ***, but did you check to see if there was plastic covering the lens to your camera?
    xandros9 and jojoe42 like this.
    05-28-2014 01:51 PM
  16. misterpunn's Avatar
    It's funny, buxz777, I tried doing the iso at 100 and the shutter speed at a fast rate... anything with the shutter rate faster than 1/50 doesn't even take an actual picture; it's just a black "picture" that was taken. Anything with a rate slower than 1/15 is yellow or "blown-out" to the point that it is indecipherable.

    I obviously am a total novice when it comes to photography. However, I would just think that taking a quick picture (when I don't have time to tinker with the settings, like at a sporting event) wouldn't produce such drastically different results. Even when messing-around with the settings, I can't replicate the lossless zoom of my dad's phone on plain auto.

    Hopefully it doesn't sounds like I'm whining...I'm just surprised there is such a huge difference.
    05-28-2014 02:10 PM
  17. misterpunn's Avatar
    Haha yes, MarqBland...I always take those stickers/films off right after I get a new phone.
    05-28-2014 02:10 PM
  18. buxz777's Avatar
    It's funny, buxz777, I tried doing the iso at 100 and the shutter speed at a fast rate... anything with the shutter rate faster than 1/50 doesn't even take an actual picture; it's just a black "picture" that was taken. Anything with a rate slower than 1/15 is yellow or "blown-out" to the point that it is indecipherable.

    .
    sorry I thought your shots were xenon flash based ;-) being indoors in auto mode etc ;-) with xenon flash you can have the shutter speed much faster because of the fast bright flash ;-)

    also I am not telling you to change settings all the time , I am saying that the difference in these pictures could be caused by the auto camera settings being different , that a slight difference in angle of shot , difference in light to the sensor might make the 1020 choose a higher iso and faster shutter speed and grain might creep into the picture

    this is why I told you to check the shot data so you can be sure that both phones done the same thing , as you have seen by playing with settings a slight change can give you a black picture or a normal picture lol ;-)

    if both phones didn't do the same thing then its not a fair assessment to say that your phone sensor or optics are broken ;-) this is why another user told you to do the same shot but go into settings and make the settings exactly the same on each camera and to use a fixed tripod

    the main thing we need to know before anyone says your 1020 is broken is are the cameras doing the same thing ...... so check the data and let us know

    here is an online one that might work EXIF Data Viewer or Exif Data Viewer Free Download

    i haven't used either program but both claim to take the exif data from the photo ;-)
    misterpunn likes this.
    05-28-2014 02:26 PM
  19. misterpunn's Avatar
    I'll have to try doing some more shots this weekend so I can do the comparison...I deleted the photos on my dad's phone immediately after I e-mailed them, so I don't have access to that data anymore.
    05-28-2014 03:18 PM
  20. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    Here's my two cents worth. Not a professional photographer or a phone expert but I can possibly help.

    First thing to keep in mind is that WP8.1 DP is just an OS upgrade. The firmware has not been updated so the camera isn't as optimized as it should be. So that's problem number one.

    You also stated that the pics haven't been that great from the get go so that's issue number two.

    When we're dealing with smartphone cameras, especially the 1020 it's a combination of software and hardware. Either or both can cause issues. I'd say majority of the time it's software related when it comes to smartphones. But as someone has pointed out there is some 1020s with sensor issues.

    So this is up to you but my suggestion is to see if it's a software issue. Easiest way to check that is with a hard rest. This will usually clear away any bugs in the software. Not entirely sure why there are bugs but as long as there's some way of getting around it.

    Lastly you can use Nokia Software Updater to install a new firmware on the phone and see if that fixes things. A simple search will usually find this.

    Be sure to backup your phone prior to the hard reset or using the NSU.

    If none of these produce a good outcome I'd suggest you send it in for repairs because then you've determined you have a hardware issue and no amount of software tweaks will fix that.
    misterpunn likes this.
    05-29-2014 04:02 AM
  21. jojoe42's Avatar
    I'll have to try doing some more shots this weekend so I can do the comparison...I deleted the photos on my dad's phone immediately after I e-mailed them, so I don't have access to that data anymore.
    Yeah I would probably do what most other people have said and a) try to take two photos with THE SAME manual settings and then b) revert back to stable 8.0 software and see if it makes a difference.
    05-29-2014 04:03 AM
  22. Bahamen's Avatar
    Actually, the EXIF data is available in both embedded images. Your dad's image is taken with a much lower ISO, therefore the image will look cleaner with less noise. The downside is that the image will be darker and appear under-exposed. This is quite apparent when you look at the distant walls where your image is much brighter.

    HOWEVER, his image is brighter at the Coke bottle because flash was fired from his camera, while it wasn't on yours. I can't be 100% certain about this, but there is a very bright light reflecting off the Coke bottle in his image which I'm guessing came from the flash. Another clue is that in your picture the label on the other side of the Coke bottle can be seen, while on his image you can only see the white insides.

    Having said that, I generally prefer to avoid using flash if possible. Introducing artificial light source can make the image look less realistic. The downside is that higher ISO will be used and the image will be noisier. If you can hold your camera steady, you can use manual setting to force a lower ISO to be used.

    Dad's EXIF:
    Shutter speed: 1/30
    ISO: 100

    Your EXIF:
    Shutter: 1/26
    ISO: 400
    buxz777 and misterpunn like this.
    05-29-2014 10:28 AM
  23. tomzi8571's Avatar
    On my 1020 I often take a closeup,eg in sunlight, place the focus point on eg a leaf of a tree and take the photo. After I zoom in on the photo its obvious that the focus point is not where I placed it. That's kinda frustrating...
    05-29-2014 04:57 PM
  24. buxz777's Avatar
    Actually, the EXIF data is available in both embedded images. Your dad's image is taken with a much lower ISO, therefore the image will look cleaner with less noise. The downside is that the image will be darker and appear under-exposed. This is quite apparent when you look at the distant walls where your image is much brighter.

    HOWEVER, his image is brighter at the Coke bottle because flash was fired from his camera, while it wasn't on yours. I can't be 100% certain about this, but there is a very bright light reflecting off the Coke bottle in his image which I'm guessing came from the flash. Another clue is that in your picture the label on the other side of the Coke bottle can be seen, while on his image you can only see the white insides.

    Having said that, I generally prefer to avoid using flash if possible. Introducing artificial light source can make the image look less realistic. The downside is that higher ISO will be used and the image will be noisier. If you can hold your camera steady, you can use manual setting to force a lower ISO to be used.

    Dad's EXIF:
    Shutter speed: 1/30
    ISO: 100

    Your EXIF:
    Shutter: 1/26
    ISO: 400
    exactly as I thought ;-) thanks for confirming ;-)
    05-30-2014 05:05 AM
  25. buxz777's Avatar
    On my 1020 I often take a closeup,eg in sunlight, place the focus point on eg a leaf of a tree and take the photo. After I zoom in on the photo its obvious that the focus point is not where I placed it. That's kinda frustrating...
    make sure you are 15cm from the subject or the 1020 will focus on just behind the subject or around the subject that is 15cm away ;-) I know what you mean though it can be a little annoying when you think you have the bee or something in focus and then boom when you look back the bee isn't in focus meaning when you zoom in its more blurred etc :-/ but when it is in focus ...... wow ;-)
    05-30-2014 07:24 AM
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