09-13-2014 05:06 PM
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  1. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    I just want to know that what is the cost of manufacturing a Lumia 530 for Microsoft mobile (not nokia). Bcoz a half GB ram and quad core, fixed focus camera, must not be costing them a premium, and if they lower the price further, they WILL have a significant amount of benefit from it.
    It could gain significant amount of ground by cutting down it's profit margin.
    08-30-2014 08:51 PM
  2. DJCBS's Avatar
    I don't know the exact numbers but phones like the 530 don't turn a profit for Microsoft nor to anyone. That's why Apple refuses to go to the low end market. Even though each unit doesn't cost that much, they produce a bunch of them. The higher quality the materials, the more each unit costs. And no, you don't get a discount for batch ordering.
    Only high end phones actually pay for themselves, unfortunately those aren't the ones that sell the most, specially when economics are bad.
    That's why it's utterly entitled to demand phones with 1GB of RAM, camera button, flash etc and then want them to cost only 100€.
    a5cent likes this.
    08-30-2014 09:26 PM
  3. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    2GB ram, quad core android phone available for just ₹12000 as in India, that is 200 dollars. Android doesn't cost licensing fees and so do does wp. Then why can't nokia churn out high quality phones for low prices
    08-30-2014 09:35 PM
  4. DJCBS's Avatar
    Because no OEM is a charity. Those phones are being sold at a loss. Only companies with big pockets can do that with the sole purpose of attracting a user base. Also, don't forget there's an ocean of difference between one of those cheap phones produced in India and China by local OEMs and those phones produced by reputable OEMs like LG, Sony etc.

    Nokia is no longer in the phone business and even if they were or when they get back, they wouldn't produce a phone like that for so little. It's simply economical madness for them. Because they would be almost paying you to use the phone. For the consumers, sure, that's great. For the OEMs it's a terrible deal.
    08-30-2014 09:39 PM
  5. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    Loyalty pays. And heart within Indians are still loyal to Nokia. It's just the lack of budget phones that's making them bereft of nokia. And Samsung and micromax have successfully tapped that market. Nokia still has the largest service center chain in India. For us Indians nokia is 3310, 1100, 1600 and other tough phones and would definitely like to buy one. Please release some more value,for money budget phones in India. Please
    08-30-2014 10:21 PM
  6. DJCBS's Avatar
    Well, Nokia isn't releasing anything else at least until 2016. Microsoft has the 530 coming which is a budget phone and I'm sure it will hit India eventually. However, Microsoft is NOT Nokia and you shouldn't expect the same level of quality (I can tell you from personal experience that the customer support is horrible since Microsoft took over).

    They will give you cheap phones, however they won't have 2GB of RAM nor anything close. They'll have 512MB of RAM etc because that's the cheapest and the only way they can sell phones at a loss without bankruptcy. I know it sucks to not have Nokia around and I know it sucks that not every company can or is willing to do what Oppo does with the One+One or Google with the Moto G. But unfortunately Microsoft isn't that willing to lose a lot more money on a devices unit that, had this CEO been in charge a year ago, would have never been bought.
    08-30-2014 10:49 PM
  7. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    Wish nokia was never sold...
    08-30-2014 11:13 PM
  8. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    Earlier the cheapest wp 520 was selling in India for ₹10000, or 125 dollars approx. Price has dropped to ₹7500, a 25%drop. Nokia &msft must be have been having large profits. You are wrong.
    09-06-2014 05:40 AM
  9. DJCBS's Avatar
    Earlier the cheapest wp 520 was selling in India for ₹10000, or 125 dollars approx. Price has dropped to ₹7500, a 25%drop. Nokia &msft must be have been having large profits. You are wrong.

    No, I am not wrong. The thing is, the 520 was discontinued in favour of the 530. Therefore, Microsoft Mobile has to get rid of the stock they have. Otherwise they'll have warehouses filled with unsold phones.

    Because people are not willing (and rightly so) to pay the same price for a new phone than for an old one, OEMs always drop the prices of the old devices when they need to get rid of stock.

    That's why the 520 got its price dropped and will probably even drop more. It has nothing to do with profits, it has to do with making the money they can out of the stock they still have instead of being left with phones in store that they already spent the money on but didn't sell.

    It's economics.
    xandros9 and a5cent like this.
    09-06-2014 05:00 PM
  10. spaulagain's Avatar
    No, I am not wrong. The thing is, the 520 was discontinued in favour of the 530. Therefore, Microsoft Mobile has to get rid of the stock they have. Otherwise they'll have warehouses filled with unsold phones.

    Because people are not willing (and rightly so) to pay the same price for a new phone than for an old one, OEMs always drop the prices of the old devices when they need to get rid of stock.

    That's why the 520 got its price dropped and will probably even drop more. It has nothing to do with profits, it has to do with making the money they can out of the stock they still have instead of being left with phones in store that they already spent the money on but didn't sell.

    It's economics.
    Ya, exactly. It's better to make $20/phone off those remaining devices than to make $0/phone for them. When you have old stock, it's usually hard to sell because there are newer comparable models. So to get them to move off the shelves, you have to sell super cheap. Even if that technically means you sell each of those devices at a loss.

    Retail stores will do that sometimes as well. It's a common method to move old stock.
    09-06-2014 05:09 PM
  11. spaulagain's Avatar
    Wish nokia was never sold...
    Why?
    09-06-2014 05:11 PM
  12. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    Why?
    Because, Microsoft is removing all the nokia branding. I feel like nokia is being doomed. I think so...
    09-06-2014 10:05 PM
  13. AV2RY's Avatar
    Why?
    I think if it was not sold, Nokia would be in much better (financial) position now since they would have to pay MS for each devise they make. Remember all devices less than 9" are free now.
    09-06-2014 10:16 PM
  14. psoham777's Avatar
    I think if it was not sold, Nokia would be in much better (financial) position now since they would have to pay MS for each devise they make. Remember all devices less than 9" are free now.
    Nope that's not the case. Nokia was running into huge losses as it kept on losing its market share. Even initially when wp came, people were hesitant to but it. & now, after MS bought Nokia, its running in profit, so much that it could re open its own new company & make profits out of it. Still I don't like MS removing Nokia's brand name off the phones
    xandros9 likes this.
    09-06-2014 10:41 PM
  15. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    Little can we do about it.
    09-06-2014 11:40 PM
  16. DJCBS's Avatar
    Nope that's not the case. Nokia was running into huge losses as it kept on losing its market share. Even initially when wp came, people were hesitant to but it. & now, after MS bought Nokia, its running in profit, so much that it could re open its own new company & make profits out of it. Still I don't like MS removing Nokia's brand name off the phones
    Nokia was losing money increasingly ever since Eflop took over and they just got worse the moment he went with WP instead of Android. From there on, the path would always be down. Which was Eflops plan. Now that the exclusivity deal with Microsoft was ending, Nokia was prepared to counter-rule Eflop and move to Android. So Microsoft attacked pre-emptively to avoid Nokia ditching Windows Phone.

    Now Nokia has no phone division but they also are not losing money on Windows Phone since they completely abandoned the platform with the exception of HERE maps. All of Nokia's efforts are now directed to Android. When will we see Nokia return with an Android phone, we don't know. But they can't do it before 2016 anyway...however, they're not prevented to launch smartwatches, smartbands, cameras or other kinds of consumer products before 2016. And you'll see those sooner than you expect. Except they WON'T be aimed at Windows Phone.
    09-07-2014 10:28 AM
  17. jpal12's Avatar
    Maybe $55 for all the components and manufacturing. They still profit from the 530.
    09-07-2014 10:52 AM
  18. xandros9's Avatar
    Maybe $55 for all the components and manufacturing. They still profit from the 530.
    I still feel that might be conservative, but I don't know. Kinda wish there was a iSuppli cost teardown.
    But also, remember that the cost of developing the phone among others outside the price of materials also factors in
    09-07-2014 10:57 AM
  19. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    Nokia was losing money increasingly ever since Eflop took over and they just got worse the moment he went with WP instead of Android. From there on, the path would always be down. Which was Eflops plan. Now that the exclusivity deal with Microsoft was ending, Nokia was prepared to counter-rule Eflop and move to Android. So Microsoft attacked pre-emptively to avoid Nokia ditching Windows Phone.

    Now Nokia has no phone division but they also are not losing money on Windows Phone since they completely abandoned the platform with the exception of HERE maps. All of Nokia's efforts are now directed to Android. When will we see Nokia return with an Android phone, we don't know. But they can't do it before 2016 anyway...however, they're not prevented to launch smartwatches, smartbands, cameras or other kinds of consumer products before 2016. And you'll see those sooner than you expect. Except they WON'T be aimed at Windows Phone.
    Sorry, I couldn't get your 2016 nokia thing. Can you explain it b bit. Sounds interesting.
    09-07-2014 12:58 PM
  20. DJCBS's Avatar
    Sorry, I couldn't get your 2016 nokia thing. Can you explain it b bit. Sounds interesting.
    Simple: Nokia still exists. They're still a company. The only thing that was sold to Microsoft was their devices and services business. Think of it like this: you had 4 houses. You sold one of them. That's what Nokia did. They sold to Microsoft one of their houses. They didn't sell the entire company.

    In that contract by which Microsoft bought Nokia's phone division, Nokia is restricted to release phones themselves or lend their name to other OEMs to do it for them, until 2016. That means that until December 2015, Nokia can NOT release phones.
    However, starting 1st of January 2016, Nokia can again sell their own phones running the OS they so wish (Android,WP, iOS, Sailfish, Ubunto, WebOS, MeeGo, whatever they want).

    The phones that have been announced since 25th of April (Lumia 530, 730, 735, 830) were NOT released by Nokia. They were already released by Microsoft Mobile which means, altough they have the "Nokia" logo on them, they are NOT Nokia phones.

    Come 1st January 2016, Nokia can return to the phone business if they so wish. Since Nokia owns all the patents needed to produce the phones, they just need a new "phone division" to do it. Which can be easily done through the acquisition of Jolla, for example.

    I think 2015 will be a good year to see exactly where Nokia is aiming to go. After all, nothing in the deal prevents Nokia from, for example, presenting a phone in September or October 2015 to go on sale on 1st of January 2016. We'll have to wait and see what happens.
    Meanwhile Nokia is working on other stuff for Android which we will see way before that.
    09-07-2014 02:17 PM
  21. psoham777's Avatar
    Nokia was losing money increasingly ever since Eflop took over and they just got worse the moment he went with WP instead of Android. From there on, the path would always be down. Which was Eflops plan. Now that the exclusivity deal with Microsoft was ending, Nokia was prepared to counter-rule Eflop and move to Android. So Microsoft attacked pre-emptively to avoid Nokia ditching Windows Phone.

    Now Nokia has no phone division but they also are not losing money on Windows Phone since they completely abandoned the platform with the exception of HERE maps. All of Nokia's efforts are now directed to Android. When will we see Nokia return with an Android phone, we don't know. But they can't do it before 2016 anyway...however, they're not prevented to launch smartwatches, smartbands, cameras or other kinds of consumer products before 2016. And you'll see those sooner than you expect. Except they WON'T be aimed at Windows Phone.
    See, I know many people consider its all due to Stephen Elop, because he took some wrong decisions, like when Meego was introduced(as Nokia CEO, he didn't allow it to spread), so many phones which had Meego, eventually went on with Symbian updates(even when meego was a hell lot better). Also when Nokia came up with wp, it was still running into loses. I know that he came from MS to Nokia, but why plan his own company to go in loses, because that could destroy reputation of both MS as well as Nokia(if wp went into loses). Whatever it is Nokia is in profit now & at least wp isn't that bad, just that it needs more time to evolve in a market dominated by Android
    09-07-2014 10:30 PM
  22. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Ya, exactly. It's better to make $20/phone off those remaining devices than to make $0/phone for them. When you have old stock, it's usually hard to sell because there are newer comparable models. So to get them to move off the shelves, you have to sell super cheap. Even if that technically means you sell each of those devices at a loss.

    Retail stores will do that sometimes as well. It's a common method to move old stock.

    To a certain point. The GS3 is a very old (in tech circles) device that is still selling well. BB is still selling Curves in emerging markets as well. Tooling and development costs for those devices has been paid for many times over so I'm sure there's some profits being made.
    09-07-2014 11:05 PM
  23. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    Simple: Nokia still exists. They're still a company. The only thing that was sold to Microsoft was their devices and services business. Think of it like this: you had 4 houses. You sold one of them. That's what Nokia did. They sold to Microsoft one of their houses. They didn't sell the entire company.

    In that contract by which Microsoft bought Nokia's phone division, Nokia is restricted to release phones themselves or lend their name to other OEMs to do it for them, until 2016. That means that until December 2015, Nokia can NOT release phones.
    However, starting 1st of January 2016, Nokia can again sell their own phones running the OS they so wish (Android,WP, iOS, Sailfish, Ubunto, WebOS, MeeGo, whatever they want).

    The phones that have been announced since 25th of April (Lumia 530, 730, 735, 830) were NOT released by Nokia. They were already released by Microsoft Mobile which means, altough they have the "Nokia" logo on them, they are NOT Nokia phones.

    Come 1st January 2016, Nokia can return to the phone business if they so wish. Since Nokia owns all the patents needed to produce the phones, they just need a new "phone division" to do it. Which can be easily done through the acquisition of Jolla, for example.

    I think 2015 will be a good year to see exactly where Nokia is aiming to go. After all, nothing in the deal prevents Nokia from, for example, presenting a phone in September or October 2015 to go on sale on 1st of January 2016. We'll have to wait and see what happens.
    Meanwhile Nokia is working on other stuff for Android which we will see way before that.
    It's live giving your house on rent. Got it DJCBS.
    09-08-2014 07:33 AM
  24. ChinuKabi's Avatar
    What was the problem if Nokia continued selling the Symbian is phones. They had a good marketplace for it too.
    09-08-2014 07:34 AM
  25. psoham777's Avatar
    What was the problem if Nokia continued selling the Symbian is phones. They had a good marketplace for it too.
    No, due to Android, Symbian was losing its place, hence they needed to come up with something, lets say WP in this case. Symbian always used to lag, the apps would crash, your phone would hang etc, Symbian had many problems, hence not only Nokia but also other companies running Symbian eventually turned to Android or some other OS
    09-08-2014 08:52 AM
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