09-21-2012 12:17 PM
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  1. Luminatic's Avatar
    I agree a little, but mostly disagree the thread starter.

    Reason why I disagree - Immediate release date is not important to the average, non-tech-site reading customer

    Who are the people that want to buy a certain new phone asap? It's the ones who had no intention of buying anything else anyway.

    The majority of people are, though, not fanboys. They might have their preferences, but they won't preorder and they won't even dream of queuing up for anything. They will lhave the preferences, they walk into the provider shop once their contract is up or their old phone has crashed, and they will choose from what is there, not giving a sh*t when those existing devices were launched. The onces without much interest in technology might choose what their friends have, some other ones will listen to the salesperson and some others will choose according to their evaluation. I mean come on, if I buy a phone now, does it really, really matter if it is brand-spanking new or three months old?


    Reason why I agree a little:
    The presentation itself could have been done better by people who are better at presenting. A good speaker might not fool me (I tend to listen to content and to what's not said and not the way it is being presented because at the end of the day, a good presentation doesn't make the product better), but I believe are different in that matter.

    All IMHO, of course ;)
    Last edited by Luminatic; 09-14-2012 at 06:59 AM.
    09-14-2012 04:18 AM
  2. N8ter's Avatar
    The iPhone5 announcement was a disaster.

    This is NOT how you do it Nokia.
    iPhone 5 Pre-order Sells Out 20X Faster Than 4 And 4S, Further Highlighting Apple’s Dominance | TechCrunch

    Pre-Orders sold out in 60 minutes.

    That's exactly how you do it.
    experiment 626 likes this.
    09-14-2012 07:11 AM
  3. N8ter's Avatar
    Boo. Release dates and price points don't do crap for people like me that are locked into contract. If someone opted to hold off on upgrading for this particular device, guess what? It wouldn't matter: their mind is set on that device. As long as they saw it in action and see that it is coming, they are happy. If I was waiting to upgrade to the lumia and had my mind set on that device, this announcement would not deter me because it has a release date
    That's not true. Any time someone hold off there is always the chance that you can get the jump on competition and steal that sale, if your device/platform/ecosystem grabs their attention. It can happen.

    One of the reasons why the iPhone 5 announcement was a yawn fest is because it was probably the worst kept secret in the tech industry ever. Pretty much everything about it was leaked and it was even KIRF'd in China before its announcement so everyone knew pretty much exactly how it looked. Apple had already had an iOS 6 announcement before, so the device did seem a bit "oh, that's all" yesterday.

    The Samsung GS3 device was kept a bit more under wraps leading up to release, by comparison (they manufacture most of their own components, so that is easier for them).

    However, Apple is very good at announcing their products and getting them on the shelves fast. That does matter. It means people who get excited about it will be able to get it with very little time for competitors to pull them away.

    That's a mistake RIM made with the Blackberry Playbook (announced early and didn't release for MONTHS). People do lose interest nad "settle" often. It's not as simple as "mind set, sorry." Maybe to you (a WP enthusiast), but not to the average consumer.
    09-14-2012 07:16 AM
  4. Luminatic's Avatar


    While this is true, I believe this would also have happened if the iPHone preoderes and sales start had happened at a later date, so I don't see a connection there. Apple still has a strong, loyal following and quite a few people want it asap no matter if they have hold and tried it yet, hence the sell out.
    09-14-2012 09:37 AM
  5. Kredrian's Avatar
    I think this whole: "the presentation was trash because Nokia didn't release price and availability information" is ridiculous. The whole sentiment got seeded by finance analysts who were making up (ehem... I mean looking for) a rational explanation as to why Nokia's stock fell 16% on the day of the product launch. These analysts clearly stated why they thought the announcement was a complete and utter disaster. Obviously, it was due to the fact that by the end of Nokia's announcement a billion dollars in stock value had evaporated. For them, that is the only thing that counts. I'm sure their explanation is complete nonsense, but it isn't the worst attempt at an explanation I've heard, because even as someone who believes in Nokia, Microsoft and WP, you need to know which U.S. carriers will be selling them, by when, and at what price point in order to gauge earning potential. As an investor, you must know these things.

    Anyway, various news sites picked up on this and spread it through the internet, which is how it eventually ended up on our beloved tech websites. Of course these "journalists" (and most of their readers) couldn't care less about stock prices, but hey, if everyone was agreeing that the announcement was a disaster due to the lack of release and pricing information, then there must be something to it, right? Yes people, that is how we get news these days... :(

    Long story short: if you're not an investor, price and availability announcements aren't the main issues. What we should be judging are the products.

    Just to be clear, I also think the presentation was trash, but for the stylistic reasons others here already mentioned.

    Fins... I like you guys, really, but you shouldn't be allowed to make presentations! Americans are so much better than Europeans at that sort of thing. Next time, get our friends on the other side of the pond to do it (I'm European, so I'm allowed to say that).
    lol, maybe they could hire a motivational speaker to do their presentations. That way, you would be getting the dirt on the new phone, and feeling good about yourself at the same time. Actually, the more I think about it, the more I like the sound of that.
    a5cent likes this.
    09-14-2012 08:09 PM
  6. Reflexx's Avatar
    I could just imagine Anthony Robbins pitching Nokia, and a Personal Power app. LoL

    Or Kobe Bryant including the Lumia into the "Kobe System." "You're welcome."
    a5cent likes this.
    09-15-2012 01:29 AM
  7. Reflexx's Avatar
    This event isn't what sold them all those phones. It was their brand and reputation.

    The event could have said that there would be no changes other than a bigger screen, and you'd still see it sell out.

    So no, this is not how you do it. Only a company with Apple's already existing clout and fan base could get away with it.

    09-15-2012 01:32 AM
  8. cinek's Avatar
    honestly, I think nokia has done the right thing. If they released the phone, hardly anyone would buy it as everyone would be waiting for apple to come up with the next "big" thing, which didn't happen so this works in nokias favor
    09-15-2012 07:35 AM
  9. experiment 626's Avatar
    I complete agree in terms of announcement and boom release date, pricing, carriers ete... 100% agree. huge flaw nokia has going on right now is that we know the device but no clue when, how much or if they are going to be moronic and have exclusive providers.
    I believe this is what the OP was getting at.Hardware-wise the 920 looked great,at least equal to the iPhone 5 and flagship Android devices. On a side note: I think the iPhone 5 upgraded well. Had Apple not released the 4S last year and gave the 5 all of it's features plus this years' upgrades on the bigger screen critics would be glowing over this phone.
    09-15-2012 09:55 AM
  10. btgusto's Avatar
    Why is that how it's done?

    Especially when the final build of WP8 may not have passed all QA tests yet.

    Imagine Nokia announcing a release date, then having to delay it because there was a bug found in WP8 QA that had to be fixed before release. THAT would be worse.
    then don't announce a phone and have a big even without final software. I agree with the overall premise of the post. We ALL would appreciate a price and release date closer to the announce date of the 920/820.
    09-15-2012 04:23 PM
  11. alpinestars1z's Avatar
    then don't announce a phone and have a big even without final software. I agree with the overall premise of the post. We ALL would appreciate a price and release date closer to the announce date of the 920/820.
    I wonder though how many people would have bought the iPhone 5 if the Lumia 920 wasn't announced first? There are people out there who heard about the Lumia 920, then waited for the Apple announcement, then went meh, iPhone 5 isn't that great I'll wait or the 920.
    09-15-2012 05:16 PM
  12. crystal_planet's Avatar
    The Lumia 920 was announced first but by the time the Lumia 920 comes out, the Iphone will be a million seller.
    You should get an iPhone 5. It's a great device.
    09-15-2012 11:14 PM
  13. scottcraft's Avatar
    The Lumia 920 was announced first but by the time the Lumia 920 comes out, the Iphone will be a million seller.
    The Samsung Galaxy Note 2 and Ativ S were announced before the iPhone, so why hold Nokia to a different standard. Also Motorola and Verizon announced some new androids the day of the Nokia event. I don't see people on the android forums complaining about these phones not being released before the iPhone.
    09-15-2012 11:20 PM
  14. 1jaxstate1's Avatar
    Funny, people are saying that everyone from all over the place said they are getting a Nokia 920 because the iP5 was meh. Sales numbers when it's released should be in the millions the first day right?
    09-16-2012 08:44 AM
  15. socialcarpet's Avatar
    The iPhone5 announcement was a disaster.

    This is NOT how you do it Nokia.
    The iPhone5 sold out of PRE-ORDERS one hour after it went on sale.

    Even though I've never had an iPhone and I prefer Windows phone, Apple clearly is doing a lot more right than Nokia is and has been for a while.
    09-16-2012 10:17 AM
  16. Reflexx's Avatar
    To look at what Apple and Nokia did right, you can't just look at Apple's sales numbers. While this last upgrade wasn't very good, they still have a ton of mind share from years of doing things right.

    NOBODY ELSE could have the exact presentation that Apple did and have anywhere close to similar success. If Nokia had Apple's exact presentation, it would have been total bomb.

    So no, Apple didn't do much right this time around, despite the pre-order sales. Everyone knows that they were going to sell out regardless, so it's not a worthy argument.

    If Apple continues to have product launch presentations like this last one, they will slowly lose dominance.
    theefman and cckgz4 like this.
    09-16-2012 10:48 AM
  17. 1jaxstate1's Avatar
    The claim of Apple mobile fall is like the Linux people saying Windows will eventually lose ground.

    Yet Windows is still the leading mobile OS and will continue to be for a very very long time.
    Villain likes this.
    09-16-2012 11:04 AM
  18. mmacleodbrown's Avatar
    So no, Apple didn't do much right this time around, despite the pre-order sales. Everyone knows that they were going to sell out regardless, so it's not a worthy argument.
    I think a key driver of sales is that there were a lot of people on contract that didn't feel the 4S was a big enough upgrade from the 4

    If Apple continues to have product launch presentations like this last one, they will slowly lose dominance.
    If Apple continues to have products like the iphone5 launch they will slowly lose dominance. Other manufacturers are raising their game now, and apple will need to match them or lose market share
    Apple changed the way we view a mobile device, now they need to keep up..
    09-16-2012 11:06 AM
  19. Reflexx's Avatar
    I will say this. I don't think the iPhone6 will have as lame a launch.

    If iPhone5 orders 3 months from now show a significant decrease from where the 4S was at 3 months out, then Apple will reinvest in innovation. Well, maybe. Maybe there really was some magic and direction lost with the death of Jobs.

    Also, some Apple fans were also huge Steve Jobs fans. Without hobs, some of their long term loyalty may be damaged.
    Old_Cus likes this.
    09-16-2012 11:34 AM
  20. jfa1's Avatar
    All the posts above goes to show fan boys are d*cks any where you go on the internet. I was stupid to think this forum would be different. If you read my OP again, you will see that it was about the iPhone 5 launch dates, prices and countries and nothing more. I didn't say anything about the iPhone 5's features or lack thereof or how it competes with the Lumia 920.

    Why are you guys so insecure? My next phone will be a Lumia 920. Too bad I will be part of another iSheep or Fandroid community with just a different name. I honestly thought the WP faternity was going to be different and above petty attacks. I was mistaken.
    It would be nice Nokia or anyone else could do that with Windows Phone 8! It would have been nice if WP8 was ready or if they had waited until October 28 to announce any devices along with the WP8 os Unfortunately MS and MS alonme controls that and unless MS was able to get the os ready as Apple was and then announce the devices made by in this case three different oems with different procustions schedules etcthen it would not have been coordinated in short what you want is physically impossible un;less MS either buys Samsung Nokia and HTC and has the phones built uand sold under their own name just like Apple. Thats a pipe dream at this time and wont ever happen. Maybe MS would buy Nokia and kiss off HTC and Samung and follow the Apple model. Dont hold you breath!
    theefman likes this.
    09-16-2012 07:02 PM
  21. alvarezjpr's Avatar
    All the posts above goes to show fan boys are d*cks any where you go on the internet. I was stupid to think this forum would be different. If you read my OP again, you will see that it was about the iPhone 5 launch dates, prices and countries and nothing more. I didn't say anything about the iPhone 5's features or lack thereof or how it competes with the Lumia 920.

    Why are you guys so insecure? My next phone will be a Lumia 920. Too bad I will be part of another iSheep or Fandroid community with just a different name. I honestly thought the WP faternity was going to be different and above petty attacks. I was mistaken.
    saintforlife, I know it's frustrating when people don't get it, even though it seems quite clear what your message is. Anyway, I agree that Nokia could have done much better. They should have waited for wp8 to be ready, do all of their testing with the phone and then make an announcement with release date and pricing. Nokia needed to release the 920 in all 4 major carriers in the US and not just AT&T (from what I've read so far). This phone needs to be available to as many customers as possible if they want to make a bigger comeback in the US. I remember when Nokia and Motorola were kings (my first phone was a Nokia back in the late 90's). I would love to see Nokia once again at the top. I think they are great innovators in the cell phone arena.
    09-16-2012 10:07 PM
  22. cinek's Avatar
    is the some sort of a release pattern with WP os's? I really want to wait for the 920 but the whole no information situation is starting to ....... me off - as far as we know it can come out in december
    09-18-2012 11:08 AM
  23. Ebaneeezor's Avatar
    is the some sort of a release pattern with WP os's? I really want to wait for the 920 but the whole no information situation is starting to ....... me off - as far as we know it can come out in december
    pisses me off to, but i still say its better to be a little patient and get what I want, rather then rush for the sake of something new that I really do not want. Everytime I have sacrificed in the name of impatience I have always regretted it - we will hear something really soon wp8 just went gold, so its right around the corner.
    09-18-2012 12:18 PM
  24. Old_Cus's Avatar
    saintforlife, I know it's frustrating when people don't get it, even though it seems quite clear what your message is. Anyway, I agree that Nokia could have done much better. They should have waited for wp8 to be ready, do all of their testing with the phone and then make an announcement with release date and pricing. Nokia needed to release the 920 in all 4 major carriers in the US and not just AT&T (from what I've read so far). This phone needs to be available to as many customers as possible if they want to make a bigger comeback in the US. I remember when Nokia and Motorola were kings (my first phone was a Nokia back in the late 90's). I would love to see Nokia once again at the top. I think they are great innovators in the cell phone arena.
    Actually alot of us do get it. It would have been nice if WP8 was ready for release when Microsoft and Nokia made their announcement the way Apple did. As stated in earlier posts, the Lumia 920 is in just about every conversation concerning the new iphone and that wouldn't have happened had the 920 not been announced. While the new iphone is grabbing the headlines (as we all knew it would) there is still a buzz about the 920. Where I will agree with you 100% is that this phone should be offered on all carriers; atleast Verizon in addition to AT&T....just make sure that this time the salespeople push WP8 instead of steering customers from it.


    I'm asking all my friends and co-workers.........Have you tried a windows phone?
    theefman likes this.
    09-18-2012 01:23 PM
  25. cinek's Avatar
    I think it would be much better if we at least got the month - right now we don't know when it's coming out at all, for all we know it can be december - if they would at least say october or november that'd be much better imo
    09-19-2012 03:26 AM
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