11-05-2012 05:21 AM
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  1. a5cent's Avatar
    For your question about the marketplace, it surpassed 5,000 apps the other day, not a huge amount, but it'll grow quickly. I doubt WP7 apps will work on Windows RT, but nothing official has been said about it.
    but the RT may be too limited, since x86 apps wont work on it I believe, how about phone apps? will the RT have access to the 100k apps on WP8? or less than 100 apps available.
    Correct, you won't be able to install x86 apps on WRT (Windows RT), much less run them.

    It is official however, that WP apps won't run unaltered on WRT. Microsoft is of the opinion, that developers must put in the extra effort to optimize their apps for the differing amounts of screen real estate on tablets and phones anyway, so 100% compatibility isn't extremely important.

    yet still wondering if I would get the surface, I am not sure is the best decision, I am concern with Utility since not many apps will work on it.
    I am really concerned with the surface RT version, because I dont know how many apps will work on it on release, <snipped>
    I think you are focusing far to narrowly on the number of apps.

    Even if Microsoft had 2 million WRT apps in their store, you may still find that the one app you need isn't available. The opposite is also possible, since WP too has a number of apps you won't get anywhere else.

    That "app numbers-metric" is pushed by Apple, as it is one they can win on... of course the media buys into it, even though half of those 700'000 apps are used by no one. Ultimately, the number of apps is irrelevant. The only relevant metric is whether or not the system supports the apps YOU need. From what you've stated, iMovie is the only unknown. All of your other requirements will not be a problem. If video editing on the tablet is really important to you, then I would wait.

    Anyway, for most people, the inclusion of "free" Microsoft Office in Windows RT will be the ultimate "utility" app.
    10-18-2012 12:47 PM
  2. Sniper1087's Avatar
    Correct, you won't be able to install x86 apps on WRT (Windows RT), much less run them.

    It is official however, that WP apps won't run unaltered on WRT. Microsoft is of the opinion, that developers must put in the extra effort to optimize their apps for the differing amounts of screen real estate on tablets and phones anyway, so 100% compatibility isn't extremely important.





    I think you are focusing far to narrowly on the number of apps.

    Even if Microsoft had 2 million WRT apps in their store, you may still find that the one app you need isn't available. The opposite is also possible, since WP too has a number of apps you won't get anywhere else.

    That "app numbers-metric" is pushed by Apple, as it is one they can win on... of course the media buys into it, even though half of those 700'000 apps are used by no one. Ultimately, the number of apps is irrelevant. The only relevant metric is whether or not the system supports the apps YOU need. From what you've stated, iMovie is the only unknown. All of your other requirements will not be a problem. If video editing on the tablet is really important to you, then I would wait.

    Anyway, for most people, the inclusion of "free" Microsoft Office in Windows RT will be the ultimate "utility" app.
    o No dont get me wrong I get your point office integrated is a big thing,I do agree with the apps, though I would like to have all the apps I use available you know what I mean, 700,000 apps on the Ipad and you use half that means half of 700,000 apps are worth getting and Windows 8 apps have less than 100,000 meaning you even less apps to choose from, without the choice of some apps, like banking apps the only one I saw was BOA not chase, but not the point the current apps on WP8 work for me and if Bluestacks work you can bring 500k apps from android makes it even better when it releases on the RT that is.
    Last edited by sniper1087; 10-18-2012 at 03:27 PM.
    10-18-2012 03:14 PM
  3. a5cent's Avatar
    o No dont get me wrong I get your point office integrated is a big thing,I do agree with the apps, though I would like to have all the apps I use available you know what I mean, 700,000 apps on the Ipad and you use half that means half of 700,000 apps are worth getting and Windows 8 apps have less than 100,000 meaning you even less apps to choose from, without the choice of some apps, like banking apps the only one I saw was BOA not chase, but not the point the current apps on WP8 work for me and if Bluestacks work you can bring 500k apps from android makes it even better when it releases on the RT that is.
    I'm going to restate my argument about the number of apps, as I feel I haven't gotten through to you yet. Say you are looking for a thing-a-ma-jig app. You have 700'000 apps to choose from. That number is simply useless, so you go to the "thing-a-ma-jig" category and get a list of 100 apps. So now what? Are you really going to download and evaluate each of those 100 apps? Isn't that highly unlikely? Instead, you will ask friends what they use or consult the internet to get a quick rundown on what is currently considered good. You will then start your evaluation based on that selection of apps.

    For WP you might get 20 instead of 100 apps in that "thing-a-ma-jig" category, but that top-ten list will still have ten picks.

    If those top-ten apps were picked from 100 or 20 apps really doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is that the apps on both of those lists are comparable in terms of features and quality.

    Don't get me wrong, WP has yet a long way to go, as many apps don't yet match their iOS equivalents at this time. However, that isn't because WP has too few apps!

    On the other hand, if a platform has 100'000 apps to choose from, and that number doesn't include a single useful app of the kind you are looking for (video editing), then the problem isn't the number of apps, but something completely different. Either the market isn't large enough to make the development of such an app a financially worthwhile endeavor, or the platform has limitations that don't allow video editing.

    In both cases, the number of apps is irrelevant.

    Personally, I wish MS would introduce a system to eject deadweight apps from the marketplace. Unfortunately, there is no chance of this happening as the number of apps (no matter how useless most of them may be) has been turned into a selling point.

    Finally, JP morgan chase does have a banking app available for WP, which is sure to come to WRT as well. :)
    10-18-2012 04:32 PM
  4. Sniper1087's Avatar
    I'm going to restate my argument about the number of apps, as I feel I haven't gotten through to you yet. Say you are looking for a thing-a-ma-jig app. You have 700'000 apps to choose from. That number is simply useless, so you go to the "thing-a-ma-jig" category and get a list of 100 apps. So now what? Are you really going to download and evaluate each of those 100 apps? Isn't that highly unlikely? Instead, you will ask friends what they use or consult the internet to get a quick rundown on what is currently considered good. You will then start your evaluation based on that selection of apps.

    For WP you might get 20 instead of 100 apps in that "thing-a-ma-jig" category, but that top-ten list will still have ten picks.

    If those top-ten apps were picked from 100 or 20 apps really doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is that the apps on both of those lists are comparable in terms of features and quality.

    Don't get me wrong, WP has yet a long way to go, as many apps don't yet match their iOS equivalents at this time. However, that isn't because WP has too few apps!

    On the other hand, if a platform has 100'000 apps to choose from, and that number doesn't include a single useful app of the kind you are looking for (video editing), then the problem isn't the number of apps, but something completely different. Either the market isn't large enough to make the development of such an app a financially worthwhile endeavor, or the platform has limitations that don't allow video editing.

    In both cases, the number of apps is irrelevant.

    Personally, I wish MS would introduce a system to eject deadweight apps from the marketplace. Unfortunately, there is no chance of this happening as the number of apps (no matter how useless most of them may be) has been turned into a selling point.

    Finally, JP morgan chase does have a banking app available for WP, which is sure to come to WRT as well. :)
    ok there you go thats what I wanted to point out yes number doesnt matter, I was just pointing out since the number is bigger there is a higher chance of you finding an app for your needs, now dont get me wrong it also means that you could find a bunch of useless apps, but with more apps available there are more options to look at. I wish they had a system to remove all the crap apps that dont even work, and well the only way for them to get more apps is to become mainstream, with Windows 8 they might be, with their new Tablet/PC Line up of all the OEMS, they might become big in both PC and mobile
    10-18-2012 05:13 PM
  5. erasure25's Avatar
    ok there you go thats what I wanted to point out yes number doesnt matter, I was just pointing out since the number is bigger there is a higher chance of you finding an app for your needs, now dont get me wrong it also means that you could find a bunch of useless apps, but with more apps available there are more options to look at. I wish they had a system to remove all the crap apps that dont even work, and well the only way for them to get more apps is to become mainstream, with Windows 8 they might be, with their new Tablet/PC Line up of all the OEMS, they might become big in both PC and mobile
    I know what you mean, but for me, there is one big app that iOS does not have: Office 2013. For lots of business people, this will be great!
    10-18-2012 06:43 PM
  6. Sniper1087's Avatar
    I know what you mean, but for me, there is one big app that iOS does not have: Office 2013. For lots of business people, this will be great!
    Now office 2013 will be included in surface, but what about other windows 8 PCs /tablets.

    Also back to the topic I have a lot of music but since zune is no longer there what app can i use to upload my music, which was supposed to be xbox music, which no matter what i cannot see the download option for my pc
    10-18-2012 08:03 PM
  7. a5cent's Avatar
    Now office 2013 will be included in surface, but what about other windows 8 PCs /tablets.

    Also back to the topic I have a lot of music but since zune is no longer there what app can i use to upload my music, which was supposed to be xbox music, which no matter what i cannot see the download option for my pc
    Office 2013 won't be included on x86 based systems.

    What do you mean Zune is no longer there? It's just being rebranded to XBOX music. Same thing.
    10-18-2012 08:12 PM
  8. Sniper1087's Avatar
    Office 2013 won't be included on x86 based systems.

    What do you mean Zune is no longer there? It's just being rebranded to XBOX music. Same thing.
    I know rebranded but there isnt a software to download well at least I didnt see any :/.
    10-18-2012 08:45 PM
  9. Sniper1087's Avatar
    Office 2013 won't be included on x86 based systems.

    What do you mean Zune is no longer there? It's just being rebranded to XBOX music. Same thing.
    Yeah didnt see it before but found it thanks
    10-18-2012 08:48 PM
  10. gpatrick15's Avatar
    The app argument may be kind of irrelevant in terms of raw numbers, but take this note from an Android early adopter: it SUCKS not to have most of the commonly used apps. Android is still playing second fiddle to devs in terms of apps and app release dates. The numbers themselves may not matter, but knowing you have to wait for apps already on other platforms is kind of unsettling. If I'm not mistaken, the Chase app only recently launched on WP. That would have been a deal breaker for me if it hadn't been available. App selection is a significant barrier to entry for many, whether the numbers matter or not. Also, there's going to be official Office apps for both iOS Android in the future, so even that won't be an issue.
    Last edited by gpatrick15; 10-19-2012 at 09:47 AM.
    10-19-2012 09:42 AM
  11. a5cent's Avatar
    The app argument may be kind of irrelevant in terms of raw numbers, but take this note from an Android early adopter: it SUCKS not to have most of the commonly used apps. <snipped>
    Yes, I agree. My point is only that the "number of apps" isn't the problem. These are the problems:

    - apps for small/local venues not getting developed at all
    - trending apps coming late or not at all to WP
    - dearth of unique apps available only to WP
    - average quality of apps is low (only a small percentage of the developers are professionals)

    All of those problems can persist even with a million apps, and so they will. Nothing will change as long as WP doesn't become the platform offering developers the highest earnings potential. WP is still far away from that goal, and may possibly never achieve it. But by adopting a more sophisticated approach to the issues above and addressing them directly, as opposed to just discussing the symptoms, we can possibly do some good along the way.

    That is the message I'm trying to get across here.
    10-19-2012 12:23 PM
  12. snowmutt's Avatar
    Got to play around with my first iPhone 5. I get it. The ecosystem is great, there are a ton of consumers with iTune investments, and no device can touch the iPhone and iPad for local apps and Apple supports their products. Truly, I get it. Nice screen, smooth running, and the 4" screen is roomy.
    I get it.

    But..... It's icons, like millions if not billions of other devices. The OS is nearly stagnant. I still feel like it is simply a high quality app launcher. There just isn't anything.... "WOW" about it.

    Give me a 920. Let me have live tiles on a Hi Def screen. Let me have Nokia quality and support. Let me have an OS that is fresh and accomplishes something. I want Office, I want XBOX, I am fine with apps being developed because my phone will do things.

    You will be able to sell your iPhone 5 for more then enough to cover a 920. I hope you consider the option. The 920 should be a 454 foot bomb of a Home Run.
    a5cent, phatboy66 and csiguy1 like this.
    10-19-2012 03:20 PM
  13. Sniper1087's Avatar
    Got to play around with my first iPhone 5. I get it. The ecosystem is great, there are a ton of consumers with iTune investments, and no device can touch the iPhone and iPad for local apps and Apple supports their products. Truly, I get it. Nice screen, smooth running, and the 4" screen is roomy.
    I get it.

    But..... It's icons, like millions if not billions of other devices. The OS is nearly stagnant. I still feel like it is simply a high quality app launcher. There just isn't anything.... "WOW" about it.

    Give me a 920. Let me have live tiles on a Hi Def screen. Let me have Nokia quality and support. Let me have an OS that is fresh and accomplishes something. I want Office, I want XBOX, I am fine with apps being developed because my phone will do things.

    You will be able to sell your iPhone 5 for more then enough to cover a 920. I hope you consider the option. The 920 should be a 454 foot bomb of a Home Run.
    I have a 32 gb white iPhone 5 for AT&T and yes on eBay they are selling at high cost, I need to sell mine at least to cover the full cost of the lumia 920 out of contract, to break even.
    10-20-2012 10:50 AM
  14. snowmutt's Avatar
    I have a 32 gb white iPhone 5 for AT&T and yes on eBay they are selling at high cost, I need to sell mine at least to cover the full cost of the lumia 920 out of contract, to break even.
    It should cover the price of the 920. Especially the 32 gb model. But, we can really only guess until we see the non-contract prices of the WP 8 devices.

    I hope it works for you, I would love to know your opinion of WP8, especially compared to iOS.
    10-20-2012 05:03 PM
  15. csiguy1's Avatar
    Just sold my iPhone5 64gig for $500.00.
    baseballbert likes this.
    10-26-2012 03:52 AM
  16. baseballbert's Avatar
    You will love WP. I have the 4S (and the 3, 3GS, 4 phones), the Lumia 900 has been my favorite of the 5!
    10-26-2012 08:21 PM
  17. Silly Putty's Avatar
    Just sold my iPhone5 64gig for $500.00.
    That's it?
    10-26-2012 08:31 PM
  18. baseballbert's Avatar
    That does seem low, I've seen them on the ebay for as much as $1000.
    11-04-2012 07:36 PM
  19. vixez's Avatar
    My black one is matte.
    The surface doesn't show any fingerprints or smudges, so that's nice.
    11-05-2012 05:21 AM
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