Lumia 920 camera is is not as good as we thought ????? How is this possible

corsica

New member
Oct 30, 2012
84
0
0
Visit site
I really don't get how Apple manages to be the only company to consitently bring very good cameras to their phones. They don't even make the parts themselves!
 

Reeves

Member
Mar 30, 2011
115
0
16
Visit site
Everybody has seen daylight photos on a phone not everybody is going to zoom in 300% to look for blurriness. With today's technology any phone is good for daylight photos most users Instagram the photos and add filters anyway.

Now low-light is not what every camera can do and a lot of photos get taken at night especially at clubs, parties, dinner whatever people love the night life especially young adults the 920 is perfect for taking low light photos no need to bring an extra camera just for that.

That's my take on it.

Agreed.
 

Smg-Uk

New member
Jun 14, 2011
192
0
0
Visit site
Desperate, how does a5cent sound desperate? All he's saying is nobody put you in charge of judging for everyone else how good a camera should have turned out.

And it's innovative because no one else has put optical image stabilization into a phone?

At least their advertising seems fine--"bright, blur-free photos"--which is what the Lumia produces. The problem is the lack of detail due to the noise reduction algorithm. I don't see where they claimed that it would produce detailed DSLR resolution photos. That was an expectation you set yourself.

And why should daytime shots come first and OIS and night time shots be extras? You mean if they couldn't get day time shots correct with the OIS, they should have just thrown the OIS out because it should have been extra anyway?

Another blind ****** I never said it should produce "dslr" resolution photo's that was a statement you said not me, I said don't advertise how good a camera Is if it can't take good day time photo's which is what most people use a camera phone for.

Why should day time shots come first? So you think its acceptable to buy a cameraphone that's only good at lowlight photo's?

Carl Zeiss are probably horrified their name is on this mess.

Its innovative to have OIS in a phone really yeah great really good I can have stabilised poor photo's.

The ignorance is unbelievable but whatever have fun
 

a5cent

New member
Nov 3, 2011
6,622
0
0
Visit site
Everybody has seen daylight photos on a phone not everybody is going to zoom in 300% to look for blurriness. With today's technology any phone is good for daylight photos most users Instagram the photos and add filters anyway.

Now low-light is not what every camera can do and a lot of photos get taken at night especially at clubs, parties, dinner whatever people love the night life especially young adults the 920 is perfect for taking low light photos no need to bring an extra camera just for that.

That's my take on it.

I agree. I don't think I stated anything contrary to that. As far as I can tell, this discussion revolves around these initial "reviews" (which I don't take seriously) and their take on the Lumia 920's daylight snapshot performance. Nothing more.
 

based_graham

New member
Oct 12, 2011
626
0
0
Visit site
I really don't get how Apple manages to be the only company to consitently bring very good cameras to their phones. They don't even make the parts themselves!

Pre processing? They have billions of dollar's and make the SW and HW so with that much 1st party work they can make things happen.
 

based_graham

New member
Oct 12, 2011
626
0
0
Visit site
Another blind ****** I never said it should produce "dslr" resolution photo's that was a statement you said not me, I said don't advertise how good a camera Is if it can't take good day time photo's which is what most people use a camera phone for.

Why should day time shots come first? So you think its acceptable to buy a cameraphone that's only good at lowlight photo's?

Carl Zeiss are probably horrified their name is on this mess.

Its innovative to have OIS in a phone really yeah great really good I can have stabilised poor photo's.

The ignorance is unbelievable but whatever have fun

So your saying the 920 sucks when it comes to day light photos I seen pictures its GOOD
 

vlad0

New member
Oct 9, 2012
1,069
0
0
Visit site
I still don't understand how people expect amazing quality from those small sensors. They are all using 1/3" sensors @ 1.4 micron pixels.. no way around the noise/grain.

Apple got the most out of the 1/3" sensor.. if Nokia can match that, great.. if not.. they still have work to do on the software side.

I wonder if they managed to port their jpeg work over from their Symbian line to Windows NT.

OIS won't help you with that.. as far as I can tell, its only good for video.

Either way.. they are way off from what the Nokia 808 can produce.
 

anon(5335877)

New member
Jan 27, 2012
1,457
0
0
Visit site
I really don't get how Apple manages to be the only company to consitently bring very good cameras to their phones. They don't even make the parts themselves!

Sony makes some pretty good cameras, I own a Sony NEX-3 and it's great.

IIRC Apple gets their iPhone camera sensors from Sony.
 

vlad0

New member
Oct 9, 2012
1,069
0
0
Visit site
^ its not only the camera module.. Apples jpeg algorithm is very good as well. Just compare the iPhone 5 to Sony's own Android based smartphones with that same sensor, the iPhone is better than pretty much all of them.
 

socialcarpet

Banned
Apr 4, 2012
1,893
0
0
Visit site
Evidently anything said around here about nokia that isn't positive is trolling now? Pathetic.

No, just people that go off half-cocked like idiots over one review when they have never even seen, touched or used the phone themselves yet.

Maybe we can wait until they actually start selling the phone and more than two people have one before we decide the camera is total ****?

Just a thought.

I know my thinking is a little radical though, so by all means get back to the armchair condemnation of the camera on a phone none of you have ever even used. I have more constructive things to do with my time than read this tripe.
 

anon(5335877)

New member
Jan 27, 2012
1,457
0
0
Visit site
Another blind ****** I never said it should produce "dslr" resolution photo's that was a statement you said not me, I said don't advertise how good a camera Is if it can't take good day time photo's which is what most people use a camera phone for.

Why should day time shots come first? So you think its acceptable to buy a cameraphone that's only good at lowlight photo's?

Carl Zeiss are probably horrified their name is on this mess.

Its innovative to have OIS in a phone really yeah great really good I can have stabilised poor photo's.

The ignorance is unbelievable but whatever have fun

Blind ******? Oh how convenient you would cut out the part of my post where I said I was DISAPPOINTED.

The photos are not poor dude, they're good, just not as good as iPhone 5! Geez, just because the Galaxy S III or the HTC One X doesn't always produce better pictures than iPhone 5 mean it's a poor camera too?

I'm still waiting for more reviews because in the CNET comparison, the colors looks saturated compared to the iPhone, but in another review from another site, the reviewer said while the colors were accurate, they were dull.
 

a5cent

New member
Nov 3, 2011
6,622
0
0
Visit site
I dont care if its software or hardware. The PHOTOS from the 920 are not as good as the ip5 in daylight. Not sure what a professional can do with a point and shoot taking a picture of a landscape a few hundred yards away across a river, but I don't see how it can get rid of the noise in this photos.

I agree with the gist of what you are saying. It really shouldn't require a professional photographer to get these types of pictures right. Unfortunately, it's a fact of life that many reviewers are simply incompetent. Can we be certain that both cameras had a comparable white balance setting and ISO values were set correctly? Maybe the Lumia 920 has some setting to determine JPEG compression levels. I don't know, but I don't trust these reviewers to know either. In that sense I think srmiller82 has a point too.
 

anon(5335877)

New member
Jan 27, 2012
1,457
0
0
Visit site
^ its not only the camera module.. Apples jpeg algorithm is very good as well. Just compare the iPhone 5 to Sony's own Android based smartphones with that same sensor, the iPhone is better than pretty much all of them.

Lol, funny how Sony can make these great sensors but can't figure out the software side of things.

Well at least they make some money from Apple, right?
 

mikewp

New member
Sep 25, 2012
140
0
0
Visit site
Well, not that my comments will make one lick of difference to the whiners here with all their righteous indignation with the supposed hype surrounding the 920 camera. First of all. Nokia has focused the marketing around the image stablization and low light shots. Capabilities that trump offerings from current phone makers. Full light photos are pretty damn good. If you have to zoom in to start pixel peeping on a freaking photo taken from a camera, you are trying wayyyyy too hard. The picture will be compressed even further when loaded to your favorite social networking site....even moreso when adding all those "must have" instagram filters. There is just not a lot of technical difference between daylight shots amongst all the current phone offerings.

Bottom line, the overall 920 package, to include the camera with its image stabilization and low light picture taken capability, appears to be a home run. Apple and Android fans don't need to get their panties all twisted. Others who act like Someone pissed in their Wheaties because some Apple/Android sites have (and will continue to) play down anything good coming from Nokia (Because of WP tie in) need to get over it. Be happy you are living in this time period where you have all these great choices.
 

a5cent

New member
Nov 3, 2011
6,622
0
0
Visit site
Lol, funny how Sony can make these great sensors but can't figure out the software side of things.

Yes. Software often ends up being the much more important and complicated part of these systems, particularly when it comes to things like image processing. Many companies excel at hardware development but completely fail when it comes to software. Sony is one of them. Nokia once was too, but they have accepted that fact and outsourced it.
 

vlad0

New member
Oct 9, 2012
1,069
0
0
Visit site
I really don't get how Apple manages to be the only company to consitently bring very good cameras to their phones. They don't even make the parts themselves!
They only have 4 phones with different camera modules ...

The best camera on a smartphone is made by Nokia.. by a pretty big margin. Their 808 is way ahead of the game when it comes to imaging, video recording, and sound recording..

Now, why they didn't use that technology in their Windows 8 phone flagship, since its already developed and ready to go.. I believe its a Windows NT limitation, otherwise we would have seen a PureView Pro by now.

Lol, funny how Sony can make these great sensors but can't figure out the software side of things.

Well at least they make some money from Apple, right?
Hah ya they do make money out of it... As far as I know their BSI tech is not the leading one, but they are doing fine.
 

anon(5335877)

New member
Jan 27, 2012
1,457
0
0
Visit site
The best camera on a smartphone is made by Nokia.. by a pretty big margin. Their 808 is way ahead of the game when it comes to imaging, video recording, and sound recording..

Now, why they didn't use that technology in their Windows 8 phone flagship, since its already developed and ready to go.. I believe its a Windows NT limitation, otherwise we would have seen a PureView Pro by now.

Because of the S4 only supporting up to 20MP sensors? But then someone said the 808 has a dedicated image chip or something like that, so I'm not sure how this all works.

Or they decided no one would buy the Lumia with a huge camera bulge.

Or they're working on combining the OIS and the 41MP sensor into a epic cameraphone next year?

Man, I really wish the 808 came in a WP variant.
 

vlad0

New member
Oct 9, 2012
1,069
0
0
Visit site
Because of the S4 only supporting up to 20MP sensors? But then someone said the 808 has a dedicated image chip or something like that, so I'm not sure how this all works.

Partially.. I don't know for sure, but from what I've gathered around the web we have the following:

First, the reason why you get the quality you do on the 808 despite the fact that it uses 1.4 micron pixels (just like the 920/iphone 5/gs3) is because Nokia figured out a way to combine 6-7 1.4 micron pixels into one bigger one.. approx. 3.0 microns. The bigger the pixels, the more light, less noise.. more detail, better low light performance, etc.

Currently, there is no SoC (system on a chip) that can handle more than 20Mpix, therefore Nokia had to implement an additional processing chip (for the 808) that is built into the camera module, and that way the processing load is spilt between the main GPU and the secondary unit (20Mpix each I guess). The main GPU and the companion chip need to be perfectly synchronized, so that all the oversampling and the other software tricks work properly. For that to happen, you either need an RTOS: Real-time operating system - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia / or a very, very low latency Monolithic kernel: Monolithic kernel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Android, iOS, and Windows Phone are all monolithic, Symbian is RTOS.

So, as far as I can tell, there are four options here:

1. They wait until there is a chip set powerful enough to handle the processing load coming from the camera module in the 808, and that way they bypass all the sync issues.

2. They create a secondary (very primitive) OS that handles the camera system separately, and runs under the main OS.

3. They bring down the megapixel count to 20Mpix, and don't perform any oversampling so that the system can handle the load.. and compensate with physically larger pixels.

4. They somehow manage to bring the latency in Windows Phone low enough, to where there are no sync issues.

There is also the question of Xenon, which requires a mechanical shutter.. more sync issues.

This is my own summery. Now.. if it was that easy, like a said before, there would be a PureView PRO Lumia already.
 

theefman

Active member
Nov 14, 2008
3,979
5
38
Visit site
Buy another phone (enough of the moaners have already newly "ahem" decided to get the 8X, you'd think they'ed be in those forums looking for info). Open the box, take pics, enjoy. Problem solved. :D
 

Members online

Forum statistics

Threads
322,915
Messages
2,242,889
Members
428,004
Latest member
hetb