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  1. MikeSo's Avatar
    All you did is reward the evil company for being evil. If you really want to teach them you need to leave verizon.
    Yup, and judging by forums, they rarely seem to update Android phones either.

    Of course, if it wasn't for the extra functions that Cyan/Denim provide I would just be happy with the Preview for Developers.
    awilliams1701 likes this.
    11-19-2014 10:50 AM
  2. mike2q's Avatar
    Does anyone know of its possible to install Lumia 930 firmware on the Lumia 929(Icon)?
    11-19-2014 10:54 AM
  3. AlastorX50's Avatar
    Does anyone know of its possible to install Lumia 930 firmware on the Lumia 929(Icon)?
    Follow this link
    11-19-2014 11:31 AM
  4. xX_Solaris's Avatar
    I think at this point the Icon is so far behind the curve that Microsoft will probably give us the combo cyan/denim update along with the 8.1.1 update.

    If O2 can release a combo update I suspect that Microsoft will just combo it for Verizon since its back under development.
    11-19-2014 11:57 AM
  5. AlastorX50's Avatar
    I think at this point the Icon is so far behind the curve that Microsoft will probably give us the combo cyan/denim update along with the 8.1.1 update.

    If O2 can release a combo update I suspect that Microsoft will just combo it for Verizon since its back under development.
    This was the conversation i had with one of the MS reps at the store, but who knows Verizon likes to take their time with updates to reverse engineer them to work with their out-dated applications.

    I'm wishing that the the rumor about DP pushing out firmware to be true, but i guess you can't have everything.
    Last edited by AlastorX50; 11-19-2014 at 12:10 PM. Reason: Adding thoughtful wishes
    11-19-2014 12:06 PM
  6. gernerttl's Avatar
    This was the conversation i had with one of the MS reps at the store, but who knows Verizon likes to take their time with updates to reverse engineer them to work with their out-dated applications.

    I'm wishing that the the rumor about DP pushing out firmware to be true, but i guess you can't have everything.
    I seriously doubt Microsoft will push out firmware updates via DP to carrier branded devices (CDMA or otherwise); at least not without prior approval from the carriers. For non-carrier branded devices such as the 930 and 1520.3, that is an entirely different story. Microsoft does not need approval from ANY carrier to do this.
    11-19-2014 01:27 PM
  7. Indistinguishable's Avatar
    I seriously doubt Microsoft will push out firmware updates via DP to carrier branded devices (CDMA or otherwise); at least not without prior approval from the carriers. For non-carrier branded devices such as the 930 and 1520.3, that is an entirely different story. Microsoft does not need approval from ANY carrier to do this.
    It does seem crazy, doesn't it? But it would be a huge step forward for Windows Phones.

    Daniel Rubino and Paul Thurrott both seem to think it's going to happen.
    11-19-2014 03:04 PM
  8. gernerttl's Avatar
    It does seem crazy, doesn't it? But it would be a huge step forward for Windows Phones.

    Daniel Rubino and Paul Thurrott both seem to think it's going to happen.
    That would be great if it did happen. But, let's say for the sake of argument, that the carriers allowed Microsoft to push firmware updates along with the OS using the DP. Then what would stop Microsoft pushing out the OTA when the final carrier specific builds are done? Also, who would be responsible or liable if a firmware update causes major problems on a carrier's network? The user? The Carrier? Microsoft? There are a lot of factors involved when it comes to this kind of stuff. It's not as cut and dry as people seem to think it is...

    I just don't see the carriers allowing firmware to be updated without their approval (at least on carrier branded devices). The carriers would be giving up a LOT of control over their respective networks in doing this.
    11-19-2014 03:44 PM
  9. awilliams1701's Avatar
    Its not possible someone posted a thread in here on it. The phone or recovery software (I don't recall which) notices that 929 and 930 aren't the same number. Also it would fail to work on Verizon after the update even if it was possible.

    Does anyone know of its possible to install Lumia 930 firmware on the Lumia 929(Icon)?
    11-19-2014 04:36 PM
  10. Kieta's Avatar
    That would be great if it did happen. But, let's say for the sake of argument, that the carriers allowed Microsoft to push firmware updates along with the OS using the DP. Then what would stop Microsoft pushing out the OTA when the final carrier specific builds are done? Also, who would be responsible or liable if a firmware update causes major problems on a carrier's network? The user? The Carrier? Microsoft? There are a lot of factors involved when it comes to this kind of stuff. It's not as cut and dry as people seem to think it is...

    I just don't see the carriers allowing firmware to be updated without their approval (at least on carrier branded devices). The carriers would be giving up a LOT of control over their respective networks in doing this.
    I'm guessing it would be the same as DP now. It voids the warranty if installed. Now we know that there are loopholes for the consumer on that but if they put out the disclaimer that installing DP/Firmware voids the warranty then we take a chance as a consumer.
    Indistinguishable likes this.
    11-19-2014 05:29 PM
  11. larry0987's Avatar
    I think the best thing would be to break out what's in the firmware, Verizon cares about the radio and modem so leave those as is. Include all the rest of the parts in the OS update.
    11-19-2014 08:23 PM
  12. Ruined's Avatar
    All you did is reward the evil company for being evil. If you really want to teach them you need to leave verizon.
    Only problem is Microsoft failed to release a compelling 5" flagship on any carrier this fall!
    11-19-2014 10:33 PM
  13. Tjarren's Avatar
    It does seem crazy, doesn't it? But it would be a huge step forward for Windows Phones.

    Daniel Rubino and Paul Thurrott both seem to think it's going to happen.
    Got links?
    11-19-2014 10:33 PM
  14. Indistinguishable's Avatar
    Got links?
    I've heard them say it before. It may have been a Windows Weekly episode.

    But here's Rubino saying it in a comment on reddit. http://reddit.com/r/windowsphone/com..._1_and/cm5k2df
    Tjarren likes this.
    11-19-2014 10:51 PM
  15. gernerttl's Avatar
    I'm guessing it would be the same as DP now. It voids the warranty if installed. Now we know that there are loopholes for the consumer on that but if they put out the disclaimer that installing DP/Firmware voids the warranty then we take a chance as a consumer.
    Not really. If the defect is hardware, then what ever OS is on it, is irrelevant. The difference is currently the developer program is for the OS only. The OS is a completely different animal than the firmware. The firmware operates at the hardware level and therefore can cause hardware performance problems and damage. It is also the part of the system that if improperly done, can open severe security holes in the network. Ever hear of Stuxnet? It was malware programmed into the firmware that controlled the uranium centrifuges in Iran. THAT is the level of control firmware has versus the OS.

    So who is responsible for the firmware if it is pushed out with the DP and causes network problems? Microsoft? Verizon? User? OEM?
    11-20-2014 12:59 AM
  16. gernerttl's Avatar
    I think the best thing would be to break out what's in the firmware, Verizon cares about the radio and modem so leave those as is. Include all the rest of the parts in the OS update.
    That's essentially what they are doing now for the most part. Now if Microsoft were to push out all of the Lumia specific goodies as a separate OTA then that would be good.
    11-20-2014 01:04 AM
  17. feeked's Avatar
    I've heard them say it before. It may have been a Windows Weekly episode.

    But here's Rubino saying it in a comment on reddit. Daniel_Rubino comments on Microsoft to begin Windows Phone 8.1 Update 1 and Lumia Denim rollout next week
    Yes, basically Paul said weeks ago that he was shocked it hasn't already happened. Nice to see Daniel continue to weigh in.
    11-20-2014 09:04 AM
  18. gernerttl's Avatar
    I don't think AT&T's process is more streamlined because of lack of bureaucratic interference. I think it is because AT&T (and T-Mobile) are GSM networks which therefore simplifies the OS/firmware builds for Microsoft and the other OEM's. Phones like the Icon and 928 have all of the GSM stuff that the 1020 and 1520 have, as well as CDMA. That adds another layer of complication to the mix. Android device OEM's suffer the same problem.

    Verizon is gradually phasing it's CDMA/LTE network out in favor of GSM/LTE and eventually LTE only. This is not only to provide better service to its customers, but to also cut operating costs. It costs a lot of money to run 3G and 4G networks simultaneously.
    MikeSo likes this.
    11-20-2014 01:04 PM
  19. Indistinguishable's Avatar
    Sometimes I go to Software update for Lumia with Windows Phone 8 - Nokia

    First I go to North America and note that Verizon's phones are "Under Development." then I go to places like Africa, Asia, the Middle East, Europe, Etc... And I just fix my eyes on the Cyan column and scroll down...

    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
    Available
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    Available
    Available
    TheRickshaw and MikeSo like this.
    11-21-2014 10:00 AM
  20. MobileVortex's Avatar


    I've been tweeting this to @lumiahelp and keep getting the same response "we have sent this to the appropriate team to have it looked into"

    The left hand never knows what the right is doing.
    hepi and Tjarren like this.
    11-21-2014 10:37 AM
  21. Mirage85's Avatar
    Long time Reader of these boards, first time poster. I just wanted to say a few things that I've experienced with the Icon since picking it up in July.

    Both my wife and I have the Icon, got them in July and we've both experienced many of the problems that a lot of people here complain about (spotty wifi, quickly discharging battery, etc). The difference for us is that we are on 8.0, we've never installed the developer preview on our phones. My first Icon was replaced because it wouldn't charge via USB, only wirelessly, otherwise that one seemed to work better than my current one. Both of our phones will randomly lose connection to our router or have a diminished connection, even though our other items (laptops, Xboxes, etc) are working fine. Heck, there have been times we've been we'll beyond where we should be able to get a signal (back yard at the fire pit) and it worked great, then other times where it should work (laying in bed directly above the router) and it doesn't.

    I've experienced the quickly discharging battery on my phone where it gets really hot. I did a soft rest and that fixed it. Seems like something gets hung up once and awhile, no biggy... My wifes phone on the other hand has done this, and I have to do a factory reset. That fixed it for a few weeks, and now its doing it again, but without getting super hot. We've disabled all the background tasks etc, and she really has almost nothing on her phone to begin with, but it just keeps happening. Doing a factory rest and then not restoring a backup worked last time, but it doesn't appear to be a perminanet solution.

    To me it really seems like there is something very faulty with these phones. I didn't own it before the Black firmware came out, so I don't know if these are new issues since then or not, but in its current state we are both very dissatisfied with the Icon. We love windows phone (I'm a previous Trophy owner) and the camera on the Icon is amazing. I have no complaints about the speed many others do, but I don't have other newer phones to compare it too, works fine for me.

    Its taken since July until just this week to get the money deal sorted out with Verizon for replacing my Icon, so I'm hesitant to replace my wife's. It might be better for us to go into the store to do so. I'm hoping they give her the option to upgrade to the M8. Not because we dislike the lack of 8.1/cyan, but because she needs a phone that has a reliable battery...

    Anyway, I just wanted to throw out there that I don't think 8.1DP is the cause of many of the problems as seems suggested, but it may in fact be the Black firmware (hopefully) or worse yet, a hardware issue (hopefully not).
    11-21-2014 10:54 AM
  22. MobileVortex's Avatar
    Ugh i have a friend who has a Lumia 928 who has no idea what Lumia Cyan or Windows Phone 8.1 is, so obviously he doesnt care about it. Ignorance is bliss haha.
    Tjarren and DavidinCT like this.
    11-21-2014 11:04 AM
  23. TheRickshaw's Avatar
    It's obviously not a technical problem, nor an issue with the amount of work.
    11-21-2014 11:26 AM
  24. mtalinm's Avatar
    I don't think AT&T's process is more streamlined because of lack of bureaucratic interference. I think it is because AT&T (and T-Mobile) are GSM networks which therefore simplifies the OS/firmware builds for Microsoft and the other OEM's. Phones like the Icon and 928 have all of the GSM stuff that the 1020 and 1520 have, as well as CDMA. That adds another layer of complication to the mix. Android device OEM's suffer the same problem.

    Verizon is gradually phasing it's CDMA/LTE network out in favor of GSM/LTE and eventually LTE only. This is not only to provide better service to its customers, but to also cut operating costs. It costs a lot of money to run 3G and 4G networks simultaneously.
    at last, wisdom. this, and they want to keep earning $ on Visual Voicemail as well as from the three people who pay $10/month for VZ Navigator
    11-21-2014 11:33 AM
  25. dkhbike's Avatar
    Glad I don't have to put up with all this cra p from my ISP for my desktop/laptop/tablet devices. Maybe VZW will catch up with Africa someday with respect to timely updates. BTW WP8.1 DP works flawlessly on my Icon.
    11-21-2014 11:59 AM
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