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  1. Abu Mathew's Avatar
    I'm beginning to think the extras + info bug is as close as we'll get to having Denim
    Well said
    02-10-2015 11:34 AM
  2. psiu_glen's Avatar
    ....

    Why on Earth would anyone do that?
    I still have my 928, keep it on ATT prepaid with no data. Use it daily (along with my Icon on VZW). Compared to the Icon:

    928 Good
    Battery life is better
    Camera indoors, with or without flash, is better
    Camera exceptionally better with people indoors using the flash
    Speaker is far louder
    Speed is comparable -- really don't notice a difference
    Better feel in hand -- "just right".

    929 Good
    Screen on Icon is better -- though I've seen another 928 with a better screen, and obviously there are complaints about some 929/930 screens, so...
    Screen size is a plus for viewing, reading, editing.
    Camera is much better outside, sunrise to sunset, oversampling + large originals are great options.

    The Ugly
    Both Feather cases for the Icon cracked.
    I'm sticking to WP8 and the beautiful Photo Hub, hearting songs in the Music app, and shooing kids off my lawn.
    Tjarren likes this.
    02-10-2015 11:36 AM
  3. Mr Hyde's Avatar
    a nice 930/Icon review to give you some idea of what to expect whenever Verizon gets off its *** and finally decides to release Denim for us Icon users
    Awesome article. The only down side of that article is that it makes me want the Denim update even more. I'm sure once it lands it will seem like it was well worth the wait but waiting and waiting isn't fun at all.
    jazz70 and aximtreo like this.
    02-10-2015 11:45 AM
  4. MikeSo's Avatar
    I'm beginning to think the extras + info bug is as close as we'll get to having Denim
    The conspiracy theorist in me thinks it's not a bug but quite deliberately a way to fool people into thinking they have it.
    02-10-2015 12:40 PM
  5. GoJays's Avatar
    You might like this speculation then. Please be aware: A tin foil hat must be securely fastened to your head before reading it.

    http://wmpoweruser.com/the-denim-ext...-be-by-design/
    02-10-2015 01:03 PM
  6. anywhereanytime's Avatar
    Awesome article. The only down side of that article is that it makes me want the Denim update even more. I'm sure once it lands it will seem like it was well worth the wait but waiting and waiting isn't fun at all.
    I am an active follower of Paul Thurrott and he typically has been "quite well connected within Microsoft" ... Paul "posted" back around Thanksgiving that "Microsoft - with Windows Phone 10 - will "reportedly" MOVE to a direct OTA "update" approach = BYPASS the carriers !!!

    Don't know IF this is still true ... but Paul said that Microsoft is "fed up" with all of the delays!!!
    02-10-2015 04:05 PM
  7. anywhereanytime's Avatar
    Just saw this = WOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Great news for Lumia Icon owners–Lumia Denim not required for Windows 10 Mobile Technical Preview

    Great news for Lumia Icon owners?Lumia Denim not required for Windows 10 Mobile Technical Preview - WMPoweruser
    Tepid and nunyazz like this.
    02-10-2015 04:23 PM
  8. grafixguy#AC's Avatar
    That's not necessarily great news. The fact is, WP 8.1 without Denim is not ideal. It's likely to be worse with Win 10.
    02-10-2015 04:41 PM
  9. anywhereanytime's Avatar
    That's not necessarily great news. The fact is, WP 8.1 without Denim is not ideal. It's likely to be worse with Win 10.
    Sorry to disagree ...I'll take this as we are fully engaged with Windows 10 Tec Previews on 4 PC "2-in-1 convertibles" and LOVE IT !! It may take Microsoft a "few months" to get the "Windows 10 Phone version" in shape ... but, SCREW Verizon ... perhaps Microsoft IS GETTING some BALLS!!!!
    Tepid likes this.
    02-10-2015 04:45 PM
  10. rich1lloyd's Avatar
    Denim is not required for WP10*

    *Cyan required for WP10
    02-10-2015 04:54 PM
  11. 2390's Avatar
    That's not necessarily great news. The fact is, WP 8.1 without Denim is not ideal. It's likely to be worse with Win 10.
    I'm not so sure about that. If I were MS, I'd focus on making WP10 work well on black and denim. Let's face it, if denim comes, and I believe it will, eventually, it will be the last update. We are a fairly large group, and I'd focus on making it run well on phones who have been abandoned by the carrier, like the icon
    02-10-2015 04:56 PM
  12. anywhereanytime's Avatar
    This "latest statement by Microsoft" jives with reports today that Microsoft "is trying to go RTM with Windows 10 in JUNE - to try an tap into the BACK to SCHOOL UPGRADE CYCLE !!!
    02-10-2015 05:06 PM
  13. mdb17's Avatar
    I wouldn't think denim would have anything to do with it, I mean the HTC One doesn't have denim and its going to get W10 TP2
    Montpbm likes this.
    02-10-2015 05:09 PM
  14. GoJays's Avatar
    That's not necessarily great news. The fact is, WP 8.1 without Denim is not ideal. It's likely to be worse with Win 10.
    I agree with this. Why are lowered expectations good news? A stable firmware update is needed. Give us Cyan for all I care.
    Tjarren and grafixguy#AC like this.
    02-10-2015 05:22 PM
  15. Indistinguishable's Avatar
    I wouldn't think denim would have anything to do with it, I mean the HTC One doesn't have denim and its going to get W10 TP2
    Denim is Lumia Firmware. HTC has other firmware updates for their phones that accompany software updates. So while the HTC One doesn't have denim, it does have other HTC firmware that works with the software.
    Tjarren, MikeSo and gernerttl like this.
    02-10-2015 05:32 PM
  16. Tepid's Avatar
    Sorry to disagree ...I'll take this as we are fully engaged with Windows 10 Tec Previews on 4 PC "2-in-1 convertibles" and LOVE IT !! It may take Microsoft a "few months" to get the "Windows 10 Phone version" in shape ... but, SCREW Verizon ... perhaps Microsoft IS GETTING some BALLS!!!!
    This a fully agree with.
    As stated in the article linked above.
    Something I have been saying for a long time now.

    This effectively gives *Windows Phone Smart Devices users another route for leapfrogging carrier restrictions, and we hope this marks a trend where carriers have as much control over our *Windows Phone Smart Devices as they have over our Windows PCs.
    *Edited by me a bit.
    02-10-2015 06:09 PM
  17. grafixguy#AC's Avatar
    To be clear...I think this will be a good thing for the future, but the way the Icon is designed it is way too dependent on firmware. There's no way MSFT is going to be able to push firmware to the Icon without VZW's approval.
    GoJays likes this.
    02-10-2015 06:19 PM
  18. gernerttl's Avatar
    This a fully agree with.
    As stated in the article linked above.
    Something I have been saying for a long time now.



    *Edited by me a bit.
    That's all well and good. What you will have is a non-final version of WP10 (it's Tech Preview not Developers Preview; huge difference) running on Black firmware.

    Developers Preview is the final release that is sent to carriers and developers. Tech Preview is not a final release and is NOT ready for release to the carriers and developers. You're essentially becoming testers for Microsoft.
    SpaceyO and Tjarren like this.
    02-10-2015 06:39 PM
  19. Indistinguishable's Avatar
    and we hope this marks a trend where carriers have as much control over our *Windows Phone Smart Devices as they have over our Windows PCs.
    In an ideal world, that'd be great. And I'm sure in the future it'll be a real possibility. Particularly as the FCC continues to weigh in on network & band types. Smartphones need to be recognized and treated as what they truly are, pocket pc's. They're not simply phones anymore. I think unlocked universal devices will be the norm soon in the US. That said, I don't think this is nearly as big a step towards that end as you think it is.

    Sorry to disagree ...I'll take this as we are fully engaged with Windows 10 Tec Previews on 4 PC "2-in-1 convertibles" and LOVE IT !! It may take Microsoft a "few months" to get the "Windows 10 Phone version" in shape ... but, SCREW Verizon ... perhaps Microsoft IS GETTING some BALLS!!!!
    Appreciate your post, man. But just so you know, I find it really challenging to understand your posts with all of the quotation marks, exclamation points, and capitalizations.
    Last edited by Indistinguishable; 02-10-2015 at 07:52 PM. Reason: typo
    nunyazz, GoJays and savagelizards like this.
    02-10-2015 07:19 PM
  20. 2390's Avatar
    All I want is for Microsoft to find some loophole to push firmware updates without the carrier. Whether that is through a "security vulnerability" combined with a mysterious leak, or a preview system, I don't care. I just want it done, if not, I'm going back to Android where that is possible. I'm sick and tired of the carriers screwing is over like this.
    02-10-2015 08:50 PM
  21. 2390's Avatar
    If I don't get denim this week, I'm looking for a new phone
    02-10-2015 08:57 PM
  22. Scorpio5x0's Avatar
    All I want is for Microsoft to find some loophole to push firmware updates without the carrier. Whether that is through a "security vulnerability" combined with a mysterious leak, or a preview system, I don't care. I just want it done, if not, I'm going back to Android where that is possible. I'm sick and tired of the carriers screwing is over like this.
    Even the billion Androids out there in the market have to wait for the Carrier to approve an update. Windows Phone, as far as updates, is experiencing nothing different then Android users experience. Even Apple has to wait for the Carrier to approve, they just give the impression that they have control because it is released when it is announced. But that is easy to do when you don't announce anything till you know that all Carriers have approved. Microsoft has never used that strategy, since for them it seems impossible for them to keep a secret for that long. I use an Android phone for work and I am still waiting for it to be updated to 5.0, although it was released last year, and there is no date set for that either.
    Last edited by Scorpio5x0; 02-10-2015 at 09:14 PM.
    MikeSo likes this.
    02-10-2015 09:04 PM
  23. lmnopotts's Avatar
    Roll out starts tomorrow :-)
    02-10-2015 09:16 PM
  24. Tepid's Avatar
    That's all well and good. What you will have is a non-final version of WP10 (it's Tech Preview not Developers Preview; huge difference) running on Black firmware.

    Developers Preview is the final release that is sent to carriers and developers. Tech Preview is not a final release and is NOT ready for release to the carriers and developers. You're essentially becoming testers for Microsoft.
    Actually not entirely true. The Tech Preview is just the beginning. I am sure they will release Dev Preview as well
    Which just as with 8.1 is a final release.
    And thankfully they did that, otherwise we would all still be stuck on a really OLD OS version for absolutely no reason whatsoever
    except the fact that a carrier wants to hold it's customers hostage to buying a new device, and dictating WHICH device that actually is.
    this favoritism and fascism is bull****. VZW are demonstrably guilty.

    Trust me, the first Service Provider to open and start selling all devices available and not holding updates back for no reason,
    I will be the first to jump to them.

    As for Firmware, Denim (if we ever do get it) will be the final firmware anyway for Icon.

    I personally have no issues with my Pocket Device that Happens to be able to make Phone Calls (PDHPC).
    I just want the additional features as promised.

    I am sure there will be bugs in Win10 Tech Preview, no doubt about it. I will still try it till I can't use it.
    If that makes me a tester for MS for free, so be it, it's really not for nothing,
    When you consider the price of the OS itself if you had to actually pay for it.
    think about that one for a while.

    In an ideal world, that'd be great. And I'm sure in the future it'll be a real possibility. Particularly as the FCC continues to weigh in on network & band types. Smartphones need to be recognized and treated as what they truly are, pocket pc's. They're not simply phones anymore. I think unlocked universal devices will be the norm soon in the US. That said, I don't think this is nearly as big a step towards that end as you think it is.

    Appreciate your post, man. But just so you know, I find it really challenging to understand your posts with all of the quotation marks, exclamation points, and capitalizations.
    I think this is going to happen a lot sooner than you think.

    People need to do more in this area themselves. but they won't cause they are too complacent in where they are now.
    savagelizards likes this.
    02-10-2015 09:17 PM
  25. Danbradford7's Avatar
    Even the billion Androids out there in the market have to wait for the Carrier to approve an update. Windows Phone, as far as updates, is experiencing nothing different then Android users experience. Even Apple has to wait for the Carrier to approve, they just give the impression that they have control because it is released when it is announced. But that is easy to do when you don't announce anything till you know that all Carriers have approved. Microsoft has never used that strategy, since for them it seems impossible for them to keep a secret for that long. I use an Android phone for work and I am still waiting for it to be updated to 5.0, although it was released last year, and there is no date set for that either.
    True, but the community can port software long after the carrier abandons it. For the perfect example, see the cockroach phone, HTC HD2. It has a lollipop build still in progress!
    02-10-2015 09:43 PM
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