1. worldspy99's Avatar

    America is in the midst of exploring its shadow. Nasty, suppressed feelings and thoughts have been bubbling up for quite some time, now. This election has been the collective representation of what's behind a lot of closed doors, and it'd rearing its ugly head in the form positive distinctiveness and downward comparison.... erroneously called nationalism. Just my thoughts. Apologize up front if I offend anyone.
    Thank you for very very succinctly summarizing what I have actually been seeing, hearing and experiencing for the last 20+ years.
    There will be a lot of summary discussion about this election, however, this is probably the best thing I have seen so far...
    11-09-2016 11:19 AM
  2. Scienceguy Labs's Avatar
    ^You'll have to excuse all of the typos. :)


    And if anyone is interested in a good read about Jungian psychology and the shadow, check out a book called Romancing the Shadow. Great read.
    http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...ing_the_Shadow

    Sent from mTalk
    11-09-2016 12:11 PM
  3. sinime's Avatar
    Now we hope for impeachment! Might be interesting to follow the Trump University trial and the sexual assault of a minor charge (if it hasn't been dropped?)
    11-09-2016 12:18 PM
  4. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    We are taught at an early age to organize things into groups. Schools teach comparing and contrasting in just about every subject. Looking for patterns in what we interact with is another learning strategy that is very important in today's educational world. Other animals do similar sorts of categorization. The green leaf tastes good, but the brown one tastes bad. So, putting things into groups based on certain characteristics is a tool that helps some organisms live, reproduce, survive, etc. Nationalism can be considered an extension of that. Now, in my opinion, categorization in the form of nationalism gets harmful when societal groups get caught up in a couple of psychological states:

    Positive Distinctiveness - viewing a group that you belong to as being better than other groups. This leads to favoritism towards other members of your group over outsiders. Degrading people who are not members of your distinct group improves self esteem and positive feelings towards whichever distinct group a person belongs. Trump was a master at this. He routinely said things like "My people" "my uneducated masses" etc. Clinton actually helped him out when she called Trump's group "deplorables". She made them even more of a distinct group than Trump was making them.

    Downward Comparisons - these happen when a group compares itself to other groups that it believes are of lesser value. This provides a positive feeling to the group because it convinces its members that they actually are better and they have the proof. They might say something like, "Well, at least I'm not from XYZ. It really sucks there, but not here. It's awesome here. Again, Trump was a master at this, too. He always touted his stance as being the savior of his group from all of the lesser groups intent on ruining America.

    America is in the midst of exploring its shadow. Nasty, suppressed feelings and thoughts have been bubbling up for quite some time, now. This election has been the collective representation of what's behind a lot of closed doors, and it's rearing its ugly head in the forms positive of distinctiveness and downward comparison....erroneously called nationalism. Just my thoughts. Apologize up front if I offend anyone.
    No offence here. I think you hit the nail on the proverbial head.

    His schtick is also known as populism politics. We had that here with the referendum. Trump was very aware of the group he was targeting and knew how to speak to them, and though I don't like to give him much credit, he probably knew the numbers in that group would get him to where he wanted to be.

    Just like the leave group here in the UK.
    11-09-2016 12:21 PM
  5. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    I was speaking of Trump and Clinton. Wasn't she the one that screwed some things up in the Middle East?
    The whole thing with the middle East is a bit of a mess but the USA has always had issues there.

    It's not just Clinton's thing either. The republicans, probably most have some connection to arms companies. The USA is a messy messy country.
    Laura Knotek and Rose640 like this.
    11-09-2016 12:24 PM
  6. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    One Bosnian artist explained US elections in a quite interesting way. I'll do my best to translate.
    He says that all this time, every one of the previous candidates focused on empathy of those who are not in best financual state, who are not pleased with their job, wage, life in general. On those who are rocking the very bottom of our society. But their problem was the one that they tried to reach out to those who have not the right to vote, or are outside US, in simple words, they were paying too much attention to world, and the problems of the world.
    Unlike them, Trump did almost thr same thing, but adressed American fukara (the one who's on a margin), adressed Americans who are not your most educated men. He also calls them (in rough words), rednecks and scum of the nation.

    Pretty non PC, and arguibly wron/right opinion, but nontheless interesting.
    As I mentioned earlier, what you basically have is disenfranchised people. Blue collar workers, not highly educated, who were once proud of their jobs and industry. They've become the left behinds of a society that has become globalised.

    It's what happened here in the UK and it's what's happened in the USA. Industries leave and communities suffer. No one has done anything to change their fate. Politicians have ignored them, hands tied by big corporations.

    So they have forced change, for good or ill. Tired of being ignored. Feeling that things can't be any worse than what they have already.

    I can probably guess some of the stories of families. Men committing suicide because of depression, family's divorcing, kids feeling they have no future. These are the people who have nothing to lose.

    These are the people who voted for Trump.

    I can totally understand their reasoning. I'm from that world myself. So I'm not immune to their way of thinking. Difference is though, I educated myself. Which is why I think differently.

    We can only hope, and I do mean this, that things won't be as bad as we think it will but I'm not holding my breath...
    Last edited by N_LaRUE; 11-09-2016 at 12:47 PM.
    11-09-2016 12:36 PM
  7. Muessig's Avatar
    We can only hope, and I do mean this, that things won't be as bad as we think it will but I'm not holding my breath...
    Quote of the election.
    11-09-2016 01:42 PM
  8. Rose640's Avatar
    ^You'll have to excuse all of the typos. :)


    And if anyone is interested in a good read about Jungian psychology and the shadow, check out a book called Romancing the Shadow. Great read.
    Romancing the Shadow: A Guide to Soul Work for a Vital, Authentic Life by Connie Zweig ? Reviews, Discussion, Bookclubs, Lists

    Sent from mTalk
    I already have Tool for that !

    Steppenwolf is all about shadow too. By far the best book I've ever read.
    11-09-2016 02:46 PM
  9. Rose640's Avatar
    The whole thing with the middle East is a bit of a mess but the USA has always had issues there.

    It's not just Clinton's thing either. The republicans, probably most have some connection to arms companies. The USA is a messy messy country.
    Ah, I get it. But what I can not get is why didn't anyone vote for Gary? That guy's just great. He gives zero **** about the conflicts in Middle East, or anywhere else. That's not a bad thinking from one perspective, meaning US would interfere less in other country's affairs.

    Or Berny. A guy with a dream that's hard to reach, almost impossible, but yet the nobel one.

    Those 2 out of 300 milion.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    11-09-2016 02:50 PM
  10. Scienceguy Labs's Avatar
    Ah, I get it. But what I can not get is why didn't anyone vote for Gary? That guy's just great. He gives zero **** about the conflicts in Middle East, or anywhere else. That's not a bad thinking from one perspective, meaning US would interfere less in other country's affairs.

    Or Berny. A guy with a dream that's hard to reach, almost impossible, but yet the nobel one.

    Those 2 out of 300 milion.
    We picked those two because that's where we are as a country, unfortunately.
    11-09-2016 02:57 PM
  11. Rose640's Avatar
    As I mentioned earlier, what you basically have is disenfranchised people. Blue collar workers, not highly educated, who were once proud of their jobs and industry. They've become the left behinds of a society that has become globalised.

    It's what happened here in the UK and it's what's happened in the USA. Industries leave and communities suffer. No one has done anything to change their fate. Politicians have ignored them, hands tied by big corporations.

    So they have forced change, for good or ill. Tired of being ignored. Feeling that things can't be any worse than what they have already.

    I can probably guess some of the stories of families. Men committing suicide because of depression, family's divorcing, kids feeling they have no future. These are the people who have nothing to lose.

    These are the people who voted for Trump.

    I can totally understand their reasoning. I'm from that world myself. So I'm not immune to their way of thinking. Difference is though, I educated myself. Which is why I think differently.

    We can only hope, and I do mean this, that things won't be as bad as we think it will but I'm not holding my breath...
    I can already tell you that the wall thing isn't going to happen. It's just ridiculous, even more than him winning.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    11-09-2016 02:57 PM
  12. Rose640's Avatar
    I have no problems discussing about the elections here, 'cause it's an offtopic. But I get really pissed off when I go to 9gag and all I see is people whining about the outcome. First, it was a fair win, if you had the right to vote you should have, every other man didn't vote, second, I came to 9gag to relax, to laugh not to read about how depressed you are because you don't like your new president. Damn this generation, they'd do anything for attention and to fit in.
    azcruz likes this.
    11-09-2016 03:06 PM
  13. Rose640's Avatar
    I've discovered this band not more than 3 weeks ago, and this song is already among my favourite ones.

    Laura Knotek likes this.
    11-09-2016 03:08 PM
  14. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    I can already tell you that the wall thing isn't going to happen. It's just ridiculous, even more than him winning.
    The wall is just hyperbole.

    Here's the simple truth about immigration. The vast majority of Trump voters could care less, so long as they have a well paying job.

    The only reason it's an issue at all is because there's this belief that immigrants take jobs from Americans for less pay.

    Truth is most immigrants take the jobs they can get and usually do the jobs that no one else wants. That's not to say some companies don't take advantage of the situation.

    Also notice what I wrote. It's not that immigrants want less pay. Companies take advantage of them. Immigrants just want to get money to live.
    11-09-2016 04:14 PM
  15. Rose640's Avatar
    The wall is just hyperbole.

    Here's the simple truth about immigration. The vast majority of Trump voters could care less, so long as they have a well paying job.

    The only reason it's an issue at all is because there's this belief that immigrants take jobs from Americans for less pay.

    Truth is most immigrants take the jobs they can get and usually do the jobs that no one else wants. That's not to say some companies don't take advantage of the situation.

    Also notice what I wrote. It's not that immigrants want less pay. Companies take advantage of them. Immigrants just want to get money to live.
    I know that, I think they do too. They're just acting ingorant in order to push their ideas and goals.

    It's sad that hard working people have been used in such a way.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    11-10-2016 05:37 AM
  16. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    I know that, I think they do too. They're just acting ingorant in order to push their ideas and goals.

    It's sad that hard working people have been used in such a way.
    It's the way things are. It's a lot easier to blame other people than it is to take responsibility for yourself.
    Laura Knotek and Rose640 like this.
    11-10-2016 05:58 AM
  17. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    I've read a couple of articles on Trump today and what exactly he's said in the run up to the election.

    It's a lot more scary and depressing than I thought it was. He's pretty much going to have total control over everything and basically no one to oppose him.

    I really do wonder if people know what they have just done? I'm curious to know if this is really what they want and if this the way they want the rest of the world to see them? Last question of course is, do they really care?

    Sad really.
    11-10-2016 06:01 AM
  18. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    Here's food for thought.

    The last time that republicans had total control of house, senate and president was about 90 years ago...

    What date was that? 1928... 1 year before the great depression... there's scary thought for you.

    Also, keep in mind that the Bush administration has removed a lot of the controls that were put in place to prevent another crash of that magnitude.
    11-10-2016 06:03 AM
  19. Rose640's Avatar
    I've read a couple of articles on Trump today and what exactly he's said in the run up to the election.

    It's a lot more scary and depressing than I thought it was. He's pretty much going to have total control over everything and basically no one to oppose him.

    I really do wonder if people know what they have just done? I'm curious to know if this is really what they want and if this the way they want the rest of the world to see them? Last question of course is, do they really care?

    Sad really.
    He's slowly removing such content from his sites. I think he's beggining to realise this is more than a game, and that **** got real.
    11-10-2016 10:46 AM
  20. sahib lopez's Avatar
    Here's food for thought.

    The last time that republicans had total control of house, senate and president was about 90 years ago...

    What date was that? 1928... 1 year before the great depression... there's scary thought for you.

    Also, keep in mind that the Bush administration has removed a lot of the controls that were put in place to prevent another crash of that magnitude.
    Oh wow that is a scary thought. Well like 99 said before , this is going to be one hell of a ride.
    11-10-2016 12:05 PM
  21. sahib lopez's Avatar
    Well didn't take long for protests to pop up. Sad part is nothing much will change :/ trump will be president , Republicans still have control over house and senate.
    N_LaRUE likes this.
    11-10-2016 12:07 PM
  22. sahib lopez's Avatar
    On another note I am liking the discounts for monitors for computers
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    11-10-2016 12:08 PM
  23. Muessig's Avatar
    Those are some scary issues, larue
    Laura Knotek and N_LaRUE like this.
    11-10-2016 04:29 PM
  24. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    Well didn't take long for protests to pop up. Sad part is nothing much will change :/ trump will be president , Republicans still have control over house and senate.
    It's actually worse than that. He will also be picking a new justice for the supreme court. Possibly another one, they're not very young... On top of that he'll be able to fill the lower courts as well with republican/conservative judges.

    So... It's not a pretty sight.
    11-11-2016 03:12 AM
  25. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    Honestly, that meeting between Obama and Trump looked uncomfortable. Worse is that Trump looked looked a bit frightened. Maybe it's just my perception but he looked really freaked out.

    His body language was not someone who was confident.
    11-11-2016 03:15 AM
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