Share a XBOX music pass?

[Big Supes]

I share my Netflix account with a couple of friends. I don't make money from it... I merely think that it would be a waste to see it not being used to it's full potential.

 

[hopmedic]

Can you specify that in the TOS?

Although one Live ID can be linked to 5 phones, the Zune Pass only works on 3 devices. Again, I'm not sure about Xbox Music.

You're right for Zune. When I was discussing, I said I didn't know the TOS of XBox Music, so I was using Windows Phone Store, but yes, that was the post prior to my reply to you.... But my brain was still on apps. Sorry. But looking it up on XBox Live TOS (which the Music Pass links to as being the TOS for Music Pass), it does say 5 Windows Phone Devices. I don't see anything about other devices (because that paragraph is specifically talking about apps). It seems to do a pretty poor job of addressing the Music Pass, IMO. But here are a few things you cannot do:
? resell or redistribute any part of the Services or access to the Services, including the sale or purchase of an account and/or Microsoft Points;
? use or attempt to use any unauthorized means to modify, reroute, or gain access to the Services;
? obtain (or try to obtain) any data from the Services or related hardware, except the data that we intend to make available to you;

I'm thinking sharing your account means that someone else is using an unauthorized means to gain access to the services, since the TOS of a Microsoft account prohibits letting someone else use your account. And if you obtain (or try to obtain) services that you didn't pay for, then Microsoft didn't intend to make them available to you.

1.10. How can I use the Services? You agree that the Services are only for your personal use, and you will not use the Services, any content available on the Services, or your account, for any commercial purpose. You may only access the Services with an Authorized Device or by logging into your account online. You may be unable to use the Services outside the country associated with your account ("Territory"). You may not sell, assign, or otherwise transfer your account to another person. You must keep your accounts and passwords confidential and not authorize any third party to access or use the Services on your behalf unless we provide an approved mechanism. You must contact Customer Support immediately if you suspect misuse of your accounts or any security breach in the Services.

I share my Netflix account with a couple of friends. I don't make money from it... I merely think that it would be a waste to see it not being used to it's full potential.

And what you're doing is breaking the law. You're violating the Netflix TOS, and to use the content outside of the TOS is theft. This one's even more cut and dry than the family sharing, which, admittedly with an XBox in play, has some gray to it if you want my opinion. Your friends using your Netflix account is stealing, and the penalty is up to $150,000 per infringed work in a civil court, and $250,000 and 5 years in jail if it were to go to criminal charges. And do NOT think that the movie industry wouldn't pursue something even as "innocent" as you think this might be. They've got a history of it. Not using it to its "full potential," as you put it, is costing Netflix potential customers. Why would they pay when they can steal so easily? It could land someone in jail, or in bankruptcy court (but the bankruptcy would not erase the penalties, if I understand right).

Now, to play Devil's advocate... Though if you're the one person paying both the cell phone bills, are they not both your phones then? An XBox is not always going to be used by one person. Am I the only one who is allowed to listen to my XBox Music Pass on my XBox? Do I kick my wife and kids out of the room when I want to listen to music? Are they not allowed to use that channel on XBox?

Yeah, like I said, it's not the best situation. Now that I've looked at the XBox TOS, they're pretty vague on music.

 

[smartrthanu]

Like I said in my original post, I have since changed it because of the issues with sharing XBox IDs.

That said, the configuration is not illegal like claimed. I purchased all the phones, I pay the cell service for all the phones, I pay for the Xbox music pass; therefore, all the phones belong to me and I'm allowed to play that music on multiple devices. That's not stealing unless its illegal to let my kids/wife use one of my phones.

 

[jgraves4480]

I really think if its family that is not a tos violation considering you pay for that service. Family gold account with one primary makes it hard for the others to get a music pass. Now sharing outside your family with friends is just wrong! Netflix was meant to be one acount in a household any way.

 

[hopmedic]

Like I said in my original post, I have since changed it because of the issues with sharing XBox IDs.

That said, the configuration is not illegal like claimed. I purchased all the phones, I pay the cell service for all the phones, I pay for the Xbox music pass; therefore, all the phones belong to me and I'm allowed to play that music on multiple devices. That's not stealing unless its illegal to let my kids/wife use one of my phones.

The issue isn't who pays. The issue is whose account is it? Terms of service rule.

 

[hopmedic]

I really think if its family that is not a tos violation considering you pay for that service. Family gold account with one primary makes it hard for the others to get a music pass. Now sharing outside your family with friends is just wrong! Netflix was meant to be one acount in a household any way.

I'm not sure a judge would accept "I really think" as evidence in a court of law. I think he'll look at the terms of service that you agreed to, and what they say, without asking what you think of them.

I understand the feelings. Like I've said, it's not the best situation right now. And as far as a family gold pass, I don't have an Xbox, so I didn't even know there was such a thing... Makes me wonder why they don't do something similar with music, though...

 

[hopmedic]

Although, maybe they couldn't get the music publishers to agree to a family deal. I don't know.

 

[TheDvlsAdvc8]

This could be really simple and handled entirely by microsoft on the backend. Allow a microsoft account to designate a certain number of children accounts... . When an app is purchased the first time by anyone in the group, full price is paid. When the same app is purchased by another member of the group, provide a discount.

With music its similarly simple. The children microsoft accounts can get access to music pass for a discount.

Providers still make more money, and families get a volume discount. This also encourages the use of a single ecosystem... so any loss from full app purchases is made up in greater volume that is created by the discount incentive.

As more and more smart phones are "cloud enabled" and it has become more and more clumsy to share a purchasing account, I think we'll see a model like this. Microsoft would do well to get ahead of the game.

 

[hopmedic]

This could be really simple and handled entirely by microsoft on the backend. Allow a microsoft account to designate a certain number of children accounts... . When an app is purchased the first time by anyone in the group, full price is paid. When the same app is purchased by another member of the group, provide a discount.

With music its similarly simple. The children microsoft accounts can get access to music pass for a discount.

Providers still make more money, and families get a volume discount. This also encourages the use of a single ecosystem... so any loss from full app purchases is made up in greater volume that is created by the discount incentive.

As more and more smart phones are "cloud enabled" and it has become more and more clumsy to share a purchasing account, I think we'll see a model like this. Microsoft would do well to get ahead of the game.

It might sound that simple, but since Microsoft doesn't own music, they can't arbitrarily decide how many accounts would get access to it. They would have to negotiate that with the owners of the music. They only have the ability to work within the rights that they negotiated.

 

[nathanb131]

This could be really simple and handled entirely by microsoft on the backend. Allow a microsoft account to designate a certain number of children accounts... . When an app is purchased the first time by anyone in the group, full price is paid. When the same app is purchased by another member of the group, provide a discount.

With music its similarly simple. The children microsoft accounts can get access to music pass for a discount.

Providers still make more money, and families get a volume discount. This also encourages the use of a single ecosystem... so any loss from full app purchases is made up in greater volume that is created by the discount incentive.

As more and more smart phones are "cloud enabled" and it has become more and more clumsy to share a purchasing account, I think we'll see a model like this. Microsoft would do well to get ahead of the game.

This is what I was hoping for when I switched from android to wp8, switched my wife from flip phone to wp8 and got us and my kids ( who live with me part time) xboxes specifically to chat via Kinect.

Looked forward to being 'all-in' in the MS ecosystem and be able to share the same music, SkyDrive,Skype, office apps, etc natively across all devices, etc. Basically I'm their dream customer as they seem to be pushing their family friendliness with things like kidzone and Xbox live family accounts.

Got a $99 Xbox live family pass, good deal for the 4 of us. Can't Skype to my kids Kinect from my 8x yet as far as I can tell. Xbox music doesn't have a family plan so we couldn't upload both our collections in one common place. We are required to have two separate accounts (on top of Xbox live) and then have to figure out who's music pass will be the one to sync with the laptops and Xbox.... Oh the 'Cloud storage' is confusing at best, playlist syncing across devices sucks right now. Can only download offline music by album, not playlist? One thing that DOES sync and share flawlessly is OneNote! Hope that same level of sharing starts to filter through the rest... Can anyone here even comprehend why we can't have Xbox live on a WIN7 PC?! Web access would be just fine!

I pay rhapsody the $15 instead of 10 per month to have the same playlists across all our devices. My personal collection remains on Amazon. If MS ACTUALLY offered strong cloud storage like amazon AND Xbox music pass where we could share ONE family account, I'd gladly pay 15 or 20 per month for simplifying our life.

I really hope they close this circle before apple gets music streaming/cloud-storage right. Not that I'd ever go apple but I want MS to succeed in this. I was so ready to be all in, if just me then maybe. But my wife is kind of a Luddite and is the prototypical apple customer who doesn't want to think about tech, just wants it to work. Thankfully she doesn't care for apple and trusts me as the cto in our house. It's not people like me who will make win8 succeed. It's people like HER who show how powerful AND easy the tech is to her non tech friends who all think that apple is the only way to get into the cloud. When I'm around those people if I do a voice command someone ALWAYS asks if I'm talking to Siri! So the last thing people like me need is to try to show those close to us a magical non-apple tech experience only to have it NOT WORK like you said it would!

Come on MS, help me help you then shut up and take my money!

 

[Big Supes]

And what you're doing is breaking the law. You're violating the Netflix TOS, and to use the content outside of the TOS is theft. This one's even more cut and dry than the family sharing, which, admittedly with an XBox in play, has some gray to it if you want my opinion. Your friends using your Netflix account is stealing, and the penalty is up to $150,000 per infringed work in a civil court, and $250,000 and 5 years in jail if it were to go to criminal charges. And do NOT think that the movie industry wouldn't pursue something even as "innocent" as you think this might be. They've got a history of it. Not using it to its "full potential," as you put it, is costing Netflix potential customers. Why would they pay when they can steal so easily? It could land someone in jail, or in bankruptcy court (but the bankruptcy would not erase the penalties, if I understand right).

Wow. Lets be honest, sharing something is not theft. I guess it would be ethically wrong in the eyes of the entertainment industry for people to 'car share' if they were making cars or running public transport services instead. Heck, they'd probably argue that sharing your pizza with a friend negatively effects pizza sales, if they were financially invested.

Let's look at this objectively... Microsoft evades paying ?151,000,000 per annum in taxes, here in the UK. Amazon and Starbucks also evade paying millions every year. Lastly, can you guess where Netflix's European base is? Yep, you got - Luxembourg. They're also not paying the British public millions per annum - what is owed to them. Now - who is the thief here exactly??

 

[rdubmu]

This is something that I want as well, my wife will not buy a windows phone until then. We can not share apps yet the most popular phone (iPhone) can. Because of this my next device will probably be an iPhone.

 

[philxor]

Wow. Lets be honest, sharing something is not theft. I guess it would be ethically wrong in the eyes of the entertainment industry for people to 'car share' if they were making cars or running public transport services instead. Heck, they'd probably argue that sharing your pizza with a friend negatively effects pizza sales, if they were financially invested.

Let's look at this objectively... Microsoft evades paying ?151,000,000 per annum in taxes, here in the UK. Amazon and Starbucks also evade paying millions every year. Lastly, can you guess where Netflix's European base is? Yep, you got - Luxembourg. They're also not paying the British public millions per annum - what is owed to them. Now - who is the thief here exactly??

I don't agree with the fire and brimstone you will be fined 150K, etc. But I agree with hopmedic in this instance. What you are doing with Netflix is considered theft of service the same as if you hooked a cable splitter up to your neighbors cable and ran a cable across the lawn. The terms of service are clear in those regards. Account sharing is a fairly large loss of revenue for Netflix. Corporations suck for the most part but it doesn't change the facts.

 

[hopmedic]

Wow. Lets be honest, sharing something is not theft.

Legally, you're wrong. It is. You've violated the terms of service by allowing access, and your friends have accessed an account that is not theirs, against terms of service. They have stolen content. Yes, it is. And yes, the penalties are exactly what I stated. Look it up.

I don't agree with the fire and brimstone you will be fined 150K, etc. But I agree with hopmedic in this instance. What you are doing with Netflix is considered theft of service the same as if you hooked a cable splitter up to your neighbors cable and ran a cable across the lawn. The terms of service are clear in those regards. Account sharing is a fairly large loss of revenue for Netflix. Corporations suck for the most part but it doesn't change the facts.

You might not agree with the fire and brimstone, but the music industry is one industry that has put fangs into the law, and has pursued it with a vengeance. I can't recall for certain if the movie industry has done so or not, but it wouldn't surprise me, given as organized as they are. It doesn't mean every case results in the maximum penalty, and I didn't say that every case would. I simply stated what the maximum penalties are.

 

[Mystictrust]

Xbox Music does allow up to three separate devices to use a pass, as long as the devices are using the same Microsoft Account, so if you shared the same Microsoft Account, you could share one pass.

+1

I came in here to post just this. It's not a big deal, even if the Microsoft Account is used for email by one person: Have the other person un-sync email from that account on their phone and just add their own. I know I've read of at least one person doing this on these forums. It sounds like it would be great for married couples - just start a separate Microsoft Account as one access point for app purchases and xbox music subscription, with a password known to both, and link it up to both phones.

 

[evilrobot]

This is something that I want as well, my wife will not buy a windows phone until then. We can not share apps yet the most popular phone (iPhone) can. Because of this my next device will probably be an iPhone.

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but I just wanted to add that if you have a WP and an iPhone you can use the same music pass on both devices (or two iPhones). Pretty lame that you can share a music pass on two iPhones but not on two Windows Phones.

 

[gsquared]

Could have picked up two Xbox Music passes for less than the cost of one normally priced a few days back from MSFT. You can actually get them pretty cheap off of eBay. I go my last yearly pass for under $60.00. MSFT was selling them for under $50.00.

 

[tk-093]

Check out the front page. MS Just released a seperate XBox Music app. I wonder if that will solve anything?

 

[JPDVM2014]

Check out the front page. MS Just released a seperate XBox Music app. I wonder if that will solve anything?

It does, my wife and I have been sharing my music pass since yesterday. It works perfectly. The only issue I have found, is that when she downloads music, it shows in my shuffle because it is added to the cloud collection. I believe there is a way to exclude cloud collection from shuffle, but me and my wife like similar music for the most part, so I'll probably just leave it.

 

[John Lamoureux]

So how can I get this to work? Four family members and four WP8 phones. Xbox music says I can use it across four devices...do I have to set up each phone with the same MSFT account to use it, or can I just log into the app only on the phone? They really need to simply this for families.