04-06-2013 06:00 AM
200 ... 5678
tools
  1. Bicpug's Avatar
    I cant see any reason for 1080 on a phone, other than for specification bragging; its just more pixels to push around in games for very little visual benefit.
    04-02-2013 03:49 AM
  2. ChMar's Avatar
    I cant see any reason for 1080 on a phone, other than for specification bragging; its just more pixels to push around in games for very little visual benefit.
    More PPI. Crisper looking text. And Metro is all about text. So for larger displays it makes sense
    04-02-2013 04:00 AM
  3. nessinhaw's Avatar
    More PPI. Crisper looking text. And Metro is all about text. So for larger displays it makes sense
    after some research i reached the conclusion that 450ppi is the max for a perfect human eye...very few pplz have this kind of "bionic" eye, in fact, it's rare...so for the majority of pplz, at around 350ppi they can't discern them anymore (Wikipedia says 300ppi is the limit)

    based on that, all this 350+ppi screens aren't necessarily any crisper simply because our eyes can't see pixels anymore so we can't rly tell the difference .-.

    i think industry makes screens with ppi much above our human limitation as a marketing/selling point - for the average consumer, more numbers means better - this type of consumer doesen't know about the human eye limitation so they immediatly assume 400+ppi as something better when in fact from 350ppi and above they can't differentiate pixels anymore!

    i believe the difference will lie on color/brightness/contrast/angles/sunlight leg. since basically considering the majority of population, 350ppi already looks crisp...unless you're one of the few with a "bionic" eye!

    edit: i did some more researching and found the max ppi number for a perfect human eye is bigger - i even found as high as 570ppi - but since this is a rare part of the population, i took 350ppi in account!

    edit2: plz don't bash me if i said something wrong in this post D: i'm not an expert, that's what i concluded after lots of reading...would be nice someone expert about this to give their opinion!
    Last edited by nessinhaw; 04-02-2013 at 06:05 AM.
    04-02-2013 04:39 AM
  4. Sanjay Chandra's Avatar
    after some research i reached the conclusion that 450ppi is the max for a perfect human eye...very few pplz have this kind of "bionic" eye, in fact, it's rare...so for the majority of pplz, at around 350ppi they can't discern them anymore (Wikipedia says 300ppi is the limit)

    based on that, all this 350+ppi screens aren't necessarily any crisper simply because our eyes can't see pixels anymore so we can't rly tell the difference .-.

    i think industry makes screens with ppi much above our human limitation as a marketing/selling point - for the average consumer, more numbers means better - this type of consumer doesen't know about the human eye limitation so they immediatly assume 400+ppi as something better when in fact from 350ppi and above they can't differentiate pixels anymore!

    i believe the difference will lie on color/brightness/contrast/angles/sunlight leg. since basically considering the majority of population, 350ppi already looks crisp...unless you're one of the few with a "bionic" eye!

    edit: i did some more researching and found the max ppi number for a perfect human eye is bigger - i even found as high as 570ppi - but since this is a rare part of the population, i took 350ppi in account!

    edit2: plz don't bash me if i said something wrong in this post D: i'm not an expert, that's what i concluded after lots of reading...would be nice someone expert about this to give their opinion!
    PPI needs viewing distance as well.

    300 ppi stand for 10-12 inch distance i think (not sure) , according to wiki.

    We use laptops with farther distance than tablet and we use a tablet farther distance than a phone (assuming average distances)

    So , pixel differentiation depends on viewing distance , eye sight , PPI and Software scaling capability.

    For example , Macbook Pro with Retina Display has only 220ppi (or near to that number as far as i know) but OS X scales things and renders them better than iOS/Android , therefore even with lower PPI ,John Gruber stated that , he found 220 ppi Retina Display of macbook pro to be equally appealing as 326/264 ppi in iOS devices
    04-02-2013 10:08 AM
  5. a5cent's Avatar
    I don't believe you would be able to notice a different DSP or media processor as end user.
    There are four such co-processors on every S4 SoC. What you are basically saying, is that Qualcomm is wasting their time designing and integrating them, and that MS is wasting their time utilizing them or exposing specific S4 features to OEMs. You are saying this is all for naught, because users won't notice a difference either way.

    I disagree.

    I'm going to skip the lengthy explanations detailing why, mainly because I think you'll understand without them. ;-)

    BTW... Android does the exact opposite, more along the lines you've suggested. The general purpose computing cores feature much more prominently, largely in the hopes of artificially making the hardware platforms more similar than they really are. This simplifies porting between SoCs, but makes the OS much less efficient on a whole.
    travisel likes this.
    04-02-2013 12:40 PM
  6. rbxtreme's Avatar
    :)))) Sure weekend is over. I didn't had time. But if you can't wait for me feel free to ask me anytime you wish. Rest assured I have not forgot
    we with our wp8 devices are so so tied up, with the exciting apps that's been pushed onto the store the whole of last week, forget borrowing, we don't even the time to think of the, "what phone was that, again"??? 😊On a lighter note folks
    04-02-2013 02:15 PM
  7. nessinhaw's Avatar
    PPI needs viewing distance as well.

    300 ppi stand for 10-12 inch distance i think (not sure) , according to wiki.

    We use laptops with farther distance than tablet and we use a tablet farther distance than a phone (assuming average distances)

    So , pixel differentiation depends on viewing distance , eye sight , PPI and Software scaling capability.

    For example , Macbook Pro with Retina Display has only 220ppi (or near to that number as far as i know) but OS X scales things and renders them better than iOS/Android , therefore even with lower PPI ,John Gruber stated that , he found 220 ppi Retina Display of macbook pro to be equally appealing as 326/264 ppi in iOS devices
    yes, i didn't even want to get into distances because i was tired and my brain almost went boom from all the scientific reading >.< so i just wanted to make it simple...

    in my understanding, higher ppi will only make a difference if we hold our phones closer than 8inches...but for the regular distance we use (10-13 inches) i think more than 400ppi is not needed! industry should focus more on improving colors, brightness, contrast, saturation...afterall ppi is not the only thing that matters in a screen
    04-02-2013 04:54 PM
  8. Mirtas's Avatar
    PPI needs viewing distance as well.

    300 ppi stand for 10-12 inch distance i think (not sure) , according to wiki.

    We use laptops with farther distance than tablet and we use a tablet farther distance than a phone (assuming average distances)

    So , pixel differentiation depends on viewing distance , eye sight , PPI and Software scaling capability.

    For example , Macbook Pro with Retina Display has only 220ppi (or near to that number as far as i know) but OS X scales things and renders them better than iOS/Android , therefore even with lower PPI ,John Gruber stated that , he found 220 ppi Retina Display of macbook pro to be equally appealing as 326/264 ppi in iOS devices
    A 40 inch 1080p TV only has 55 PPI and yet it look great. It is all about distance.

    Personally I see a big difference between a 4,3 inch screen with 800x480 (217 PPI) and a 4.5 inch 1280x768 (332 PPI), but seen very little difference between that and 1920x1080 on a 5 inch screen (441 PPI), unless I put is very close to my eyes, which I would never do in real life.

    I think a 4.3 inch screen with a 720p is a perfect match, put it in a 125x65x9.5mm phone with a quad-core 1,2 ghz CPU, 1GB ram, 8GB internal + up to 64GB SD, a pureview camera, 1080p video on the back, 480p video on the front, 2200 mAh battery at max 140g and it is my dream phone.

    But we are getting a bit offtopic.
    04-02-2013 05:48 PM
  9. ChMar's Avatar
    There are four such co-processors on every S4 SoC. What you are basically saying, is that Qualcomm is wasting their time designing and integrating them, and that MS is wasting their time utilizing them or exposing specific S4 features to OEMs. You are saying this is all for naught, because users won't notice a difference either way.

    I disagree.

    I'm going to skip the lengthy explanations detailing why, mainly because I think you'll understand without them. ;-)

    BTW... Android does the exact opposite, more along the lines you've suggested. The general purpose computing cores feature much more prominently, largely in the hopes of artificially making the hardware platforms more similar than they really are. This simplifies porting between SoCs, but makes the OS much less efficient on a whole.
    Definitely hw accelerating stuff is not a waist of time. But those day is not the software that demands those power increases. So I don't see how an app can take advantage of such features(not even games actually) not meaning that they will ever have direct access to them(I mean they still need to go through the OS for those). Even hw accelerating media encodings will not get used to full potential. It makes no sense to limit my app on the few supporting SoCs and not have a server to do those and support all devices(not only wp devices but iOS and Android).

    We can take all apps in the store and see how many of them do media encoding or anything more than accessing web services. And that is the reason for a broader use of chipsets. Because current software is targeted for casual consumers and does not truly need all that power. You won't even run math intensive stuff in the CPU. Those math stuff you will run only on photos and you will use a shader for that and use the GPU acceleration. And the same can obviously be used for sound too(As a side note I can hardly wait for directcompute to come with the newer GPUs on the phone landscape)

    I love the way you see the future I really do and I wish it to be true. But politics and economics does not let it be that way.
    04-02-2013 06:03 PM
  10. nessinhaw's Avatar
    I kinda laugh at how it is needed such powerful SoCs for calls, messaging, FB, Instagram, Skype...that's basically what common pplz use their phone for and why i don't invest money on a high-end (in Brazil they're even more expensive because of taxes)...i'm pretty satisfied with my Lumia 620, it's not the most powerful phone but it does all the basic stuff perfectly - all the common stuff we do with our phones! (it's was still a bit expensive tho, damn taxes ;-;)

    Many pplz will buy the powerful SGSIV or HTC One for FB/Instagram (as an example), what a waste imo lol

    But would this need of more powerful hardware be because Android is demanding more? So far, iOS/WP has been just fine with dual-core processors...it leads me to believe Android is a needy b1tch lol
    04-03-2013 01:56 AM
  11. AngryNil's Avatar
    No one's got it down to a science, but it's pretty obvious that pixel density has crossed into overkill territory. Many ordinary people can't make out the dramatic difference between the retina iPad and standard iPad screen. 400PPI is about sticking your nose in the screen.

    Simply put, insane PPI isn't where manufacturers should be going if they want to deliver the best all-round experience in a device. A lower resolution screen should mean less power draw, less volume, and less processing power. That means you can get better battery life, have a thinner phone, and either use a less powerful processor (that isn't as power hungry) or provide a smoother experience with the same processor.

    An interesting comparison on the Windows Phone side is the Lumia 920 vs 620. The 620 actually outperforms the 920 on occasion, yet has a worse processor. It also sports a smaller battery, yet by all indications doesn't suffer from worse battery life. WVGA might be slightly long in the tooth, but I'm hoping 720p becomes the new mid-range spec for Windows Phone come Blue. Hopefully then we'll be able to see a Lumia 720-esque device, but with 720p.

    But would this need of more powerful hardware be because Android is demanding more? So far, iOS/WP has been just fine with dual-core processors...it leads me to believe Android is a needy b1tch lol
    Some Android software - particularly manufacturer tweaks - perform really badly, and definitely do not unlock the potential of the great hardware inside. The insane chipsets inside these phones are there for two reasons - one, bigger = better, and two, high resolution screens.
    04-03-2013 05:23 AM
  12. ChMar's Avatar
    No one's got it down to a science, but it's pretty obvious that pixel density has crossed into overkill territory. Many ordinary people can't make out the dramatic difference between the retina iPad and standard iPad screen. 400PPI is about sticking your nose in the screen.

    Simply put, insane PPI isn't where manufacturers should be going if they want to deliver the best all-round experience in a device. A lower resolution screen should mean less power draw, less volume, and less processing power. That means you can get better battery life, have a thinner phone, and either use a less powerful processor (that isn't as power hungry) or provide a smoother experience with the same processor.

    An interesting comparison on the Windows Phone side is the Lumia 920 vs 620. The 620 actually outperforms the 920 on occasion, yet has a worse processor. It also sports a smaller battery, yet by all indications doesn't suffer from worse battery life. WVGA might be slightly long in the tooth, but I'm hoping 720p becomes the new mid-range spec for Windows Phone come Blue. Hopefully then we'll be able to see a Lumia 720-esque device, but with 720p.
    We all know you are right. But consider the bashing the HTC One got when they announced a 4mp camera :). How will any new phone sell now when they will not have 1080p and at least quad-core cpus (octa core to be king of the hill). No good review will surface on the internet. Even Z10 was bashed for spotting mid-level specs without any day to day real life usage to see if for that phone those were enough specs for smooth experience or not. No carrier will advertise them and any ads on tv will just be laugh at for spotting and old obsolete model(specs wise). So the good part is now apps can do less with more in a true full hd way. And you can charge your phone more if you find it lack in battery department :)
    04-03-2013 05:40 AM
  13. AngryNil's Avatar
    The beautiful world we live in. :/
    04-03-2013 07:47 AM
  14. Sanjay Chandra's Avatar
    we with our wp8 devices are so so tied up, with the exciting apps that's been pushed onto the store the whole of last week, forget borrowing, we don't even the time to think of the, "what phone was that, again"??? 😊On a lighter note folks
    You mean "The best selling phone on the market" ? :)
    rbxtreme likes this.
    04-03-2013 09:49 AM
  15. travisel's Avatar
    I think that they are going to choose the Snapdragon 600, because the 800 is mostly for tablets. If LG can put a 2460 mAh battery in a 4.3 inch screen device (P710) that is smaller and a tiny bit thinner than the Lumia 820 (2460 mAh battery) surely we can expect the next Lumia 9x0 to have 2200+ mAh. But it is not always about mAh, iPhone 5 only has a 1440 mAh battery and does a great job with it.

    Based on the past, the problem is that Windows Phones devices are a few steps behind in hardware and power efficiency. By the time a 2GB Quad-Core Windows Phone hits the market (I expect November 2013) it will be falling behind again. Although it should not be about having the latest hardware, but giving the best performance on the hardware you have. This does not hold up when you can't play the latest games or in terms of marketing. The average consumer sees 8 cores as better than 2 cores, 2GB ram better than 1GB ram and 13MP camera better than 8MP.

    Windows Phone needs time and I am positive that within 18 months they will catch up and we will see 15% marketshare. And this will force developers to be more efficient with their programming and will also force manufactures to provide the best hardware. And there will be more competition within the WP world. Developers will compute for your money and there will be more manufactures. I am positive that once there is money to be made in the WP world, brands like LG and Sony will join.
    Don't think they will use the Quad-Core Snapdragon 600 because it's just a rebranded Quad-Core Snapdragon S4 Pro with the older Adreno 320!

    Snapdragon 800 (MSM8974) uses the new Adreno 330 GPU hardware is next generation SOC for the next generation WP9.
    04-03-2013 11:45 PM
  16. ammarmalik2011's Avatar
    we with our wp8 devices are so so tied up, with the exciting apps that's been pushed onto the store the whole of last week, forget borrowing, we don't even the time to think of the, "what phone was that, again"??? On a lighter note folks
    Download Ms. Splosion Man on your Windows Phone 8 and let us know how it goes
    04-04-2013 02:46 AM
  17. Sanjay Chandra's Avatar
    Download Ms. Splosion Man on your Windows Phone 8 and let us know how it goes
    I see what u did there ^^
    04-04-2013 08:32 AM
  18. rbxtreme's Avatar
    Download Ms. Splosion Man on your Windows Phone 8 and let us know how it goes
    Dude,firstly why would I even care about a game that too some not heard of title. I think all that matters to you is to go around sniffing on what next,to complain about and waste everyone's time. If you think MS/whoever is jerking off on you releasing all these titles why do you even wait for another title to come up, just move on.. Or else just take things as they come.
    04-04-2013 11:21 AM
  19. Sanjay Chandra's Avatar
    Dude,firstly why would I even care about a game that too some not heard of title. I think all that matters to you is to go around sniffing on what next,to complain about and waste everyone's time. If you think MS/whoever is jerking off on you releasing all these titles why do you even wait for another title to come up, just move on.. Or else just take things as they come.
    MS said that WP7 apps work on WP8 but it turned out to be a BIG LIE.

    Yeah , Now users have no choice but " just take things as they come" because their precious new phones can't run what 2 year old phones are able to run.
    04-04-2013 11:48 AM
  20. rbxtreme's Avatar
    MS said that WP7 apps work on WP8 but it turned out to be a BIG LIE.

    Yeah , Now users have no choice but " just take things as they come" because their precious new phones can't run what 2 year old phones are able to run.
    Name one person/organisation who's never lied.
    04-04-2013 12:03 PM
  21. nfbsk's Avatar
    Name one person/organisation who's never lied.
    That is really irrelevant. I thought we have discussed this to death previously. Bottom line: 512MB devices will probably outsell 1GB devices so developers cannot ignore them much longer. If the developers are still lazy and stubborn, then too bad for them.
    04-04-2013 01:31 PM
  22. rbxtreme's Avatar
    That is really irrelevant. I thought we have discussed this to death previously. Bottom line: 512MB devices will probably outsell 1GB devices so developers cannot ignore them much longer. If the developers are still lazy and stubborn, then too bad for them.
    512's might outsell the 1gigs I'm not sure,about the sales figures, but then its also been discussed to death that its not because the devs are,ignoring a certain set of users,but the its the time crunch they encounter to, get the apps out on,time. I wanna pull up,what I said before that when I,got the 920 in,Dec 12 , there weren't even any good apps apart,from the Nokia exclusives, and now in 3 months, times have changed, I see momentum. Now the first 512, the 620 was out early march , so give the devs the breather to get,their apps customized for the 512s.
    04-04-2013 02:36 PM
  23. Shepard902's Avatar
    The fist 512 was htc 8s... Release in Novembar. But you are right.
    04-04-2013 03:26 PM
  24. rbxtreme's Avatar
    The fist 512 was htc 8s... Release in Novembar. But you are right.
    my bad about missing that detail, but then the devs,are getting apps for the 512 as well so, that's good news,for all.
    04-04-2013 11:30 PM
  25. Sanjay Chandra's Avatar
    Name one person/organisation who's never lied.
    So u are trying to use a logical fallacy ?

    All organizations lie and MS also lied , so MS is suddenly good company and problems are solved , right ?
    04-05-2013 08:30 AM
200 ... 5678

Similar Threads

  1. So what's up with the limited theme colors
    By the real smackbo in forum Other Operating Systems
    Replies: 37
    Last Post: 01-12-2015, 02:31 AM
  2. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 03-19-2013, 10:33 PM
  3. What's up with the email client?
    By Chris Parsons in forum Other Operating Systems
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 11-20-2012, 02:30 AM
  4. What's up with the secrecy???
    By TJWINS in forum Other Operating Systems
    Replies: 63
    Last Post: 09-28-2012, 10:33 AM
  5. What's up with the Weather Channel app?
    By JP724 in forum General Phone Discussion
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 06-01-2011, 12:06 AM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD