08-25-2013 08:45 PM
53 123
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  1. jmshub's Avatar
    I was a real holdout when touchscreen phones came out. I didn't think I would be able to get used to a phone without a real keyboard. When I bought my Focus, I almost bought a Quantum with the slideout keyboard. I am really glad that I didn't. All touchscreen phones are clearly the future, and they will only get better as time goes on, with predictive text and possibly features like swype.
    Laura Knotek and krox1105 like this.
    08-22-2013 09:30 PM
  2. krox1105's Avatar
    Consumers are fickle. Keyboards are not in style now, but I wouldn't be surprised to see them make a comeback. Nokia needs to create the trends, not follow them, if they ever want to be top dog. Samsung brought back the stylus and made it "cool" with the Note, after many had claimed the stylus was dead. The thing about trends is that at some point people realize that the trend was stupid and then settle on something more practical.
    How I wish that there is another like N97 or the n900...
    The cravings get stronger day by day.
    08-22-2013 10:24 PM
  3. lippidp's Avatar
    How I wish that there is another like N97 or the n900...
    The cravings get stronger day by day.
    Nokia keeps cranking out new devices every other month it seems. It is only a matter of time before one of them has a keyboard, assuming the OS even supports them.
    08-22-2013 11:01 PM
  4. krox1105's Avatar
    Nokia keeps cranking out new devices every other month it seems. It is only a matter of time before one of them has a keyboard, assuming the OS even supports them.
    Yes, the OS does support them. HTC arrive and dell venue pro were with physical keyboards.
    08-23-2013 01:40 AM
  5. Brian Overby's Avatar
    I think a phone with a physical keyboard will be to expensive. With a software keyboard you can just change language (or add another) - so you can make one phone for a lot of different languages. That's not posible with a physical keyboard. I don't think we'll see a new Windows Phone with a physical keyboard - just too expensive.

    ...and I'm happy with a touch keyboard. Just my $0.10 ;-)
    krox1105 likes this.
    08-23-2013 03:12 AM
  6. cckgz4's Avatar
    I've always wanted an E7
    08-23-2013 03:31 AM
  7. krox1105's Avatar
    I think a phone with a physical keyboard will be to expensive. With a software keyboard you can just change language (or add another) - so you can make one phone for a lot of different languages. That's not posible with a physical keyboard. I don't think we'll see a new Windows Phone with a physical keyboard - just too expensive.

    ...and I'm happy with a touch keyboard. Just my $0.10 ;-)
    Well, this was my point earlier too: physical keyboards give flexibility. If someone did need to type in another language, then would have the touch keyboard at his disposal. And when he needs to type in English, he has that brilliant hardware keyboard.
    08-23-2013 05:57 AM
  8. krox1105's Avatar
    I was a real holdout when touchscreen phones came out. I didn't think I would be able to get used to a phone without a real keyboard. When I bought my Focus, I almost bought a Quantum with the slideout keyboard. I am really glad that I didn't. All touchscreen phones are clearly the future, and they will only get better as time goes on, with predictive text and possibly features like swype.
    Variety is the spice of life. What's the trouble in having both the types of phones?
    Besides, that slide out hardware qwerty phone WILL be an all touch device as well :)
    08-23-2013 05:59 AM
  9. ratsttam's Avatar
    Not quite a nokia, but before I upgraded to the 8XT, I had the HTC Arrive. It was WP7.5 with a slideout keyboard. SO... WP7/8 is capable of it, but the manufacturers just don't see a huge market for it, and the costs to design/develop/manufacture don't seem to be worth it to them :(
    I would have LOVED to get an "updated" Arrive, instead of the 8XT, but I certainly don't mind it.
    krox1105 likes this.
    08-23-2013 06:42 AM
  10. krox1105's Avatar
    Not quite a nokia, but before I upgraded to the 8XT, I had the HTC Arrive. It was WP7.5 with a slideout keyboard. SO... WP7/8 is capable of it, but the manufacturers just don't see a huge market for it, and the costs to design/develop/manufacture don't seem to be worth it to them :(
    I would have LOVED to get an "updated" Arrive, instead of the 8XT, but I certainly don't mind it.
    Just curious, why did you go for an HTC when you could have gone for a lumia?
    08-23-2013 07:19 AM
  11. WinFan1's Avatar
    I would personally be fine with no physical Qwerty board IF there were at least ARROW KEYS either physically on the phone or on the virtual keyboard. That is what I loved most about physical slide out Qwertys; the fact that I could just arrow back or up or down to move around my text. I realize I can tap and hold and then move the cursor around. But sometimes that causes you to move around the page too fast and you can't get it right where you want.

    But by far, a Lumia 1020 with a physical slide-out qwerty would be just about as perfect as the future could get (I realize there's no way that could really be physically possible and keep a decent shape to the phone, but i can dream).
    such a wonderful signature LOL i love it!!
    nohra likes this.
    08-23-2013 07:33 AM
  12. inteller's Avatar
    qwerty is such a niche market these days, Nokia needs to develop a case with a slide out bt keyboard that does the same thing. kind of like what they did with the camera grip for the few people who want to hold it like a camera.
    nohra and Laura Knotek like this.
    08-23-2013 07:37 AM
  13. gedzum's Avatar
    I remember the N97. I had the N97 mini and it was one of favourite pieces of hardware. It felt good in the hand and the keypad was a joy to type on. Shame the OS wasn't the best. Also had the N900 and that was also a nice device, but was on the chunky side.

    I have had moments where I wonder what those phones would have been like running WP, but I doubt we'll see anything like it.

    qwerty is such a niche market these days, Nokia needs to develop a case with a slide out bt keyboard that does the same thing. kind of like what they did with the camera grip for the few people who want to hold it like a camera.
    That would be an interesting concept and something I would like to try if it ever came to being.
    WanderingTraveler likes this.
    08-23-2013 07:44 AM
  14. MrWhiteman's Avatar
    The N95 was the worst phone ever. My brother must of had 5 at least after they kept failing.
    08-23-2013 07:46 AM
  15. brunoadduarte's Avatar
    If I know them right, the fans are going to kill me, since most of them hates WP, but:

    nokia-n950-1.jpgnokia-n950-2.jpg
    snowmutt likes this.
    08-23-2013 08:22 AM
  16. Paul Verizzo's Avatar
    Well, OP, you opened the floodgate.

    I had a Nokia 6xxx, a TDMA on AT&T basic phone ca. 2000. With a new job and needing decent calendaring and other functions, I discovered the Nokia 9000il, the first of the Communicator series. Nokia's own version of Motorola's brick. Coworkers were amazed, email, everything. It develeoped a charging problem, so I bought a 9290. See Nokia 9000 Communicator - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia for both phones. Bottom line, the 9290 is still my favorite phone I've ever owned, acknowledging its now tech limitations. Very easy and intuitive Symbian 80 OS, a keyboard that I've actually typed out long documents during a boring lecture. Rock solid operation. Never a fart or a reboot. Granted, they did fail after time, I must have owned four, finding replacements as needed.

    Time to move on: the AT&T Nokia 9300, an unlocked and updated version of the 9290. Never acknowledge as a Communicator, but it did the walk and the talk. It died one day, thank you Square Trade. Never owned a 9500. Went on to the E90 and Symbian 60. What a horribly unintuitive system, and the KB keys were too close together and no feedback, but at least they were there and it worked. Last of the clamshell flip phones, I think.

    Detour to Android with a four line slide out KB, hardly worth the effort. Came back to the last Symbian, touch screen ^3 OS on a TM Nokia C7. Also the last phone that could use all the features of the Nokia Ovi/Suite/Whatever programs. Text from a full size KB, etc.

    Anyway, I've come to accept that physical KB's are now history except for those few Motorola Droids. One idea I had was one of those $10 mini BT keyboards on eBay. With a large enough belt case, it fit with my C7. Sadly, it never could completely connect to either the C7 or my WP 810. But it works fine on two relative's Andoid. If it works, it's a good solution for that real KB craving.

    Will we ever see a real KB Nokia again? I doubt it, but I'd be happy to be wrong. Too many consumers think smaller form factors are the Holy Grail. I had a little Samsung (never again) that I could hardly hold in my large male hand. I'm happy with a clunker like the 9290.

    Ah, memories.
    08-23-2013 08:25 AM
  17. krox1105's Avatar
    The N950 :)
    A developer device but looks so classy!
    The best feature about such hardware qwerty devices is the slide tilt.
    08-23-2013 10:54 AM
  18. krox1105's Avatar
    The N950 :)
    A developer device but looks so classy!
    The best feature about such hardware qwerty devices is the slide tilt.
    snowmutt likes this.
    08-23-2013 10:55 AM
  19. snowmutt's Avatar
    I'm sure there is a reference to it out there somewhere. I'm not going to look it up. I'm just basing it off memory.
    You remembered correctly.
    Microsoft files patent for interchangeable-devices phone

    And it is just one of the million of really great ideas that has yet to be done anything with.
    krox1105 likes this.
    08-23-2013 10:58 AM
  20. snowmutt's Avatar
    I miss physical keyboards. Period. I bet a ton of people do. Know why I think QWERTY went away?

    1) Phones got a little too clunky. I do not think big or heavy will keep users away, but overly chunky does. It has to be thin-ish to be comfy in the hand. Physical keyboard's just required too much girth at the end of their run.
    2) Physical keyboard's became the "mid-range" option. Honest- go look. I think the last one to have a really high end feel to the device was the Photon Q on Sprint, but it recieved no love due to it's launch being buried by Sprints iPhone launch. Otherwise, to get a keyboard you had to settle for a little lesser screen, processor, and therefore performence. It was like they were aiming for feature phone converts and teenagers inlove with texting, but no one else.
    3) In this day and age of gaming and multi-media, users NEED a bigger screen. If it isn't 4.5" or better with high def, users do not feel they get the same experience with their videos, streaming media, or Angry Birds addiction. Physical keyboard's just never came with a good sized screen (Again, the exception was the Photon Q with a 4.3", high def screen.)

    I absolutely think a Physical keyboard device could rock the mobile world again. Devices are thin enough now there would be no real trade off in girth. High definition, larger screens are common place enough to fit one with a keyboard could be done. And let's face it: Everything old is new again. A Physical keyboard would be unique in every circle but BlackBerry's crowd. And doesn't Nokia and MS want those disenchanted BB users anyways???

    I still miss my keyboard. I truly do. It has been 2 years, and I still miss it. I would not move to a device I didn't like just for one, but I would sure take a couple trade offs to get one. Give me a 4.3" inch, higher res device like N97 and I am forking some cash Nokia's way.....
    08-23-2013 11:16 AM
  21. waazzupppp's Avatar
    I think something like the N71 would be a good seller with a portrait QWERTY if the OS wasn't as 'touched based' as it is. The biggest problem with "live tiles" is that they need real estate to show them off. Most of the portrait QWERTY phones have a 3"x3" max area for a screen. That would be insane for running anything but mini tiles.

    Moving to something like the "Touch Pro" series, this makes more sense (throw the N95/950 in this batch too) for something like Windows Phone. Even the Motorola Droid (OG) thin slider would be a good move here. Of course, sales history shows that these don't move well - or at least the Arrive didn't move well on Sprint. That said, the previous version of the Arrive - the Touch Pro 2 sold like gangbusters. So to say that the keyboard is dead isn't really that accurate...

    I would think the best option to do an NFC/Bluetooth keyboard case (maybe a clip in) that folds open to use... I love the WP keyboard, but I really do miss that amazing keyboard on my old TP2... That said, maybe Nokia could come up with a way to update the 950 and release a device with a 41MP camera, physical keyboard, 4.5" HD display phone with 4GB of RAM and 64GB of storage for $299-$399 (or $799 off contract)...
    08-23-2013 11:39 AM
  22. cj-m's Avatar
    I think smartphones lost a lot of their uniqueness in terms of physical keyboards and other differentiating forms, such as clam shell, slider and identity when the relevant manufacturers started chasing the "golden standard", ie iPhone.

    Say what you want about iPhone, but they have in many ways set or dictated what the user wants or the user experience, not the user dictating what they want (and this is shown in how everyone is still using the iPhone and ecosystem as a standard). This is why we ended up with slabs and slabs of look alike phones. In terms of form factor for example, I think the Lumia range is the only one slightly different from the iPhone and Sammy iPhone look alike range.

    That is why I think we lost a lot when phones, like the N900, N950 and E7 disappeared. There is nothing wrong with a physical KB, and with screens in excess of 4" nowadays, using a physical KB will be justified. I am also fairly sure that there are plenty of developers and tech, both field and office, types who would really be happy with a physical kb.

    But, at the end of the day, as has been mentioned before and beaten to death in Maemo Talk forums, kbs are a personal preference and the majority of people don't know about them and the minority who do and want, well...is that minority big enough to bring in profit?
    08-23-2013 12:32 PM
  23. krox1105's Avatar
    I think smartphones lost a lot of their uniqueness in terms of physical keyboards and other differentiating forms, such as clam shell, slider and identity when the relevant manufacturers started chasing the "golden standard", ie iPhone.

    Say what you want about iPhone, but they have in many ways set or dictated what the user wants or the user experience, not the user dictating what they want (and this is shown in how everyone is still using the iPhone and ecosystem as a standard). This is why we ended up with slabs and slabs of look alike phones. In terms of form factor for example, I think the Lumia range is the only one slightly different from the iPhone and Sammy iPhone look alike range.
    ....

    But, at the end of the day, as has been mentioned before and beaten to death in Maemo Talk forums, kbs are a personal preference and the majority of people don't know about them and the minority who do and want, well...is that minority big enough to bring in profit?
    Apple's really good at that. It doesn't give people what they want, but tell people what they need. And people go crazy about that *new* feature which Apple introduces with a new iPhone or iPad. Siri is a great example. No one really needed a virtual assistant before it, but now they can't live without it.
    iSheep have really polluted the tech world. Let apple include a hardware Kb in the next iPhone, and I can't personally guarantee you that not one phone from another manufacturer will come out without the hw kb. Its a shame.


    About that minority thing, you said that the majority doesn't know about them. Well how about a new Lumia with a HW qwerty and proper advertising? I think that would be effective because as mentioned earlier by some, they would love to see HW QWERTYs back.
    08-24-2013 12:50 AM
  24. Paul Verizzo's Avatar
    @snowmutt, I'll buy you a beer and we can cry in them. Some good observations.

    Obviously, cost is a huge issue, as manufacturers try to keep costs down. Most touchscreen users now probably came from the old ten key front pads, pushing buttons, texting predictively. They have NEVER know the joy, speed, and accuracy of a real KB. The industry is giving consumer Soylent Green and telling them it's as good as it gets.

    The other day I was trying to text someone my address. This is my WP. I live on Sylvan Drive, and it would NOT let me go there. Kept changing it to Dylan, I could not force feed it otherwise.

    IIRC, before I bought my 810, I saw that the 97's were still selling for around $200. There's no telling about personal valuation. I've also seen my beloved ancient 9290's selling for almost $100.

    Beauty is in the eye of the eBay buyer......
    WanderingTraveler likes this.
    08-24-2013 09:45 PM
  25. WanderingTraveler's Avatar
    I tried out the Q10 yesterday, and the E6 a week back. Here's what I have to say.

    Bring it back! Granted, I'd like an E6-style device, or something along the lines of the N95 or E7, just one last hurrah.
    08-24-2013 10:05 PM
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