Personal opinions regarding WP8 vs Android

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Slayix312

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You may not care about wireless charging but it doesn't impact battery like you say.

False;See:

Avoid wireless charging

Wireless charging is can be incredibly convenient if your phone can do it, but it's not without its disadvantages. The inductive, wireless chargers out there today have this nasty habit of generating a fair bit of waste heat. And while wasted energy is just a bummer in general, that heat will also toast your battery in the process. That's no bueno. It's a little less convenient, but standard plug-in charging is going to keep your battery in better shape, especially if you're some place warm to begin with.

source: How To Take Care of Your Smartphone Battery the Right Way

I'll take a MUCH more solid metal phone without the battery-killing inductive charging and low heat.

The battery life is not good.

It is MUCH better than the Icon's battery life so I don't even think you know what you are saying lol.

Compare: Nokia Lumia Icon battery life test - GSMArena Blog

vs

HTC One (M8) battery life test - GSMArena Blog

The HTC One M8 had almost 6 hours more talk-time. That is crazy.

The cpu on the M8 is a slightly overclocked version of the one in the Icon so performance is on par.

The GPU also had a 30%+ higher GPU clockspeed and higher RAM bandwidth besides the faster CPU clock.

Just sayin.

Edit: The HTC One M8 also got the fastest touchscreen response times of any flagship phone btw. So you really can't even argue that the Icon is faster in any way.

It has crappier battery life, lower specifications (minus the camera), and a far more limited OS.

The best thing going for it is the Camera and WPs performance on crappy low-end phones.
 

anon(8938849)

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False;See:



source: How To Take Care of Your Smartphone Battery the Right Way

I'll take a MUCH more solid metal phone without the battery-killing inductive charging and low heat.



It is MUCH better than the Icon's battery life so I don't even think you know what you are saying lol.

Compare: Nokia Lumia Icon battery life test - GSMArena Blog

vs

HTC One (M8) battery life test - GSMArena Blog

The HTC One M8 had almost 6 hours more talk-time. That is crazy.



The GPU also had a 30%+ higher GPU clockspeed and higher RAM bandwidth besides the faster CPU clock.

Just sayin.

Edit: The HTC One M8 also got the fastest touchscreen response times of any flagship phone btw. So you really can't even argue that the Icon is faster in any way.

It has crappier battery life, lower specifications (minus the camera), and a far more limited OS.

The best thing going for it is the Camera and WPs performance on crappy low-end phones.

The M8 has mediocre battery life. I know exactly what I'm talking about, from real world experience.

You can prefer whatever you want, including the less efficient all metal design, that doesn't make it better. Your solid phones screen will break as easy as any other of it gets dropped so they're goes that. Not to mention aluminums propensity to scratch and dent.

Not trying to change your opinion about your favorite phone or argue benchmarks, as if they mean anything anyways. But any person being objective or professional in the least wouldn't trash the Icon as being garbage not on the same level based on their own personal preference.
 

twint7787

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Hello everyone,

I wanted to do a small little write up of what my opinion is of WP8 after having my Nokia Lumia Icon for a little over a week now.

WP8 Pros:
1. Very lean and fast. This means it works great even on lower end phones well from what I understand.

WP8 Cons:
1. The amount of quality apps is heavily behind Android and iOS.
2. No Google apps.
3. Some of the apps that it DOES have are atrocious compared to their iOS and Android counterparts. IE: Skype
4. Lack of customization.
5. Lack of customization.
6. Lack of customization.

Yes I only have 1 pro for WP8, and that is how great it works on lower-end devices.

Coming from the HTC One M8 running Kit-Kat; everything about the Nokia Lumia Icon (barring the camera) felt like a downgrade in terms of both hardware and software. Normally the biggest argument that WP users have about Android is how laggy it is. Well the M8 is virtually lag free and it has been proven. Both software wise and hardware wise. Source: The HTC One M8 is king of touch screen response time - GSMArena Blog

So in terms of responsiveness the Icon actually felt just slightly slower. So there goes typically the biggest advantage that WP usually offers. The stock IE browser also annoyed me on WP. It didn't want to play well with many sites and was noticeably slower than Chrome overall.

I could go on with more things I didn't like, but I will just cut straight to by FAR the biggest. (Can you guess what it is?) Yes, customization. The fact that there is close to 0 customization on WP as compared to Android is the biggest reason that I could never use my Nokia Lumia Icon as a daily driver and wouldn't ever get a WP as a personal phone. Every single thing I don't like about Android I can change or enhance in a way that suits my needs perfectly. With WP what you see is what you get. There aren't many options minus wallpaper and lockscreen changes. I can change my lockscreen, wallpaper, rom, icons, widget styles, overclock or underclock, undervolt, etc...etc... I can go on and on.

It basically comes down to......I can do everything I need to on Android, but the same isn't true vice-versa. So why bother getting an OS that limits what you can do drastically compared to what is already out their? The biggest draw for WP seems to be the smoothness of it and the live tiles. I personally don't care too much for the live tiles; I find widgets better personally, and I also think the live tiles are somewhat ugly and clutter the phone a bit.

I will admit that as a techy first and fore-most; I am still going to keep my Lumia Icon and follow the development of the platform. If only because I love gadgets!

Anyway I just wanted to share my own personal opinions regarding the matter. Thanks!

What was the purpose of this exactly? If you are a 'techy' as you claim to be, how is it you are so surprised by the lack of customization in WP? Also your one pro of WP alludes to something you haven't experienced first hand.
 

Slayix312

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The M8 has mediocre battery life. I know exactly what I'm talking about, from real world experience.

I do too. I have been using it since release date. Not to mention that all battery tests from every tech site list it as near the top in terms of battery life for flagship phones.

Again; objective tests show the M8 has much better battery life than the Icon. So no point in even trying to use that as part of your argument because if the M8 has mediocre battery life than the Icon has atrocious battery life.

What was the purpose of this exactly? If you are a 'techy' as you claim to be, how is it you are so surprised by the lack of customization in WP? Also your one pro of WP alludes to something you haven't experienced first hand.

Obviously I know WP wasn't going to be as customizable as Android nor have as many apps, but I never thought it was THIS bad. Hence my write-up. Btw are you surprised that there is a thread like this in the "Phone Wars" section?
 

twint7787

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That last post was not meant to sound passive aggressive. I just don't understand why you would post this. I also agree that WP apps are lacking. However my experience with Android was different than yours. The customization was only skin deep and once you got through that superficial layer it made everything look like a mess.
 

twint7787

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Yeah I guess because windows phone has been around for a while. Its lack of customization is kind of well known at this point so to say that you didn't know that is a little surprising I guess.
 

Slayix312

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That last post was not meant to sound passive aggressive. I just don't understand why you would post this. I also agree that WP apps are lacking. However my experience with Android was different than yours. The customization was only skin deep and once you got through that superficial layer it made everything look like a mess.

It depends how you customize it. I posted a pic of how my current home-screen looks in the first half of this thread. Although you can't tell; I am running a custom rom, kernel, animations, OC'd, etc...etc... I have added many modules via xposed that add privacy and some others to add several gestures. That screen that looks relatively clean is far more powerful than anything I can do on WP given the same UI. Hardly superficial; more like exceptionally functional and IMO it looks far less messy than all the boxy tiles flipping around everywhere on my Icon. I like the 'cleanness'of a customized Android homescreen.

Edit: Also yeah like I said; I knew WP wasn't going to be super customizable or anything, but I didn't think it would lag so far behind even iOS which is typically considered a "walled garden".
 

altafmahmood

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Although you made such nice points about customizing but believe me its a real pain in the *** for us non tech guys to go through custom ROMs and other stuffs.
Windows phone is not so much customizable but what it does have is enough for most users and hence they choose it. According to me it is rather simple and clean. And believe me windows phone is quite new with regards to iOS and Android hence you may not have that advancement. The analogy "My father is older than me hence knows more".
As for app gap there is nothing much that can be done by Microsoft, its up to the developers.
 

Ian Too

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This is a very good passive-aggressive post haha. I'll respond to all your points however.
Hello Mr Pot, have you met Mr Kettle? :p

I'd have some respect if I thought you had the ability to be unbiased or if you really were presenting your views as merely that, but your not are you? If you were you'd have given WP more than a week and would've allowed yourself to adapt to a different way of doing things.

1. In that case it is fair game to compare WP 8.1 to Android L than since kit-kat is "soon to be replaced" as well.

Over a million users are currently using WP8.1 and is Kit-Kat being replaced in something like the next month?

2. None of the points I made would have changed with 8.1. The apps selection is bad and the app quality is bad, and the customization is horrible. These don't get significantly better with 8.1. At least compared to Android.

The customization is better in WP8.1 than WP8, so that's a change and like a lot of things on WP, though modest has a surprisingly marked effect. Also the customization comes from the apps, my calendar app allows me to chose how many of the next appointments I see. That's true for every app in that by choosing the size of the tile, I chose how much information is fed to me.

3. I am not installing the 8.1 developer preview because this is a work-phone and I don't think my company would appreciate me voiding the warranty.

Fine, but the comparison is still unbalanced.

Um..a lot? Even the SGS2 got 4.1 and it started at 2.3. HTC One's have had about the same level of support. 2 year support isn't that impressive.

Then how come Android is so fragmented?

Yeah re-sizing tiles and changing the background says a lot about me, but changing my ROM, custom recovery; changing my boot-animation and down-animation. Changing my launcher, notification bar, color scheme, clock display, etc...etc... All say A LOT MORE about me. WP 8 or 8.1 isn't anywhere within 5 ball-parks of Android customization regardless of how much time you spend on it.

Yes, but these are very geeky things a tiny tiny proportion of users can or would want to do. Most people have lives to lead and buy smart phones to serve their needs, not as toys or status synbols. Your usage model is highly peculiar. I used to do those things when I used Windows Mobile, now when I want to play I play Mass Effect. My device is for work, I want it to do what I want, when I want and be reliable. I don't want to tinker, I have better things to do.

I keep my home-screen empty because I don't like it cluttered. I could have my Google now widget and Blinkfeed widget showing me everything I need to if need-be. My Google now widget could show me how long I can expect my commute home to be after work. It can show me all upcoming appoints on my calendars and reminders. It can show me any interesting stories I have previously read about that I would like to know more about. Far more robust than what you are showing.

Your screen shows lots of dead space. It amazes me that your screen is really just a smaller version of a desktop, as if you were still using a mouse. The desktop is an analogy introduced to make it easier for people to navigate through unfamiliar digital spaces and like any analogy, it only serves up to the point beyond which it breaks down. There is no reason to assume the spacial paradigm is the only or most efficient way to represent information space, after all it restricts you to two dimensions in discrete screen-sized chunks.

Probably to avoid patent troubles, Microsoft tried a fresh approach with a dynamic UI - a real paradigm shift you haven't even begun to appreciate though even Android and iOS has started to imitate it stylistically, so it can't be as bad as you say. Whatsmore, the live tiles idea has potential, for instance I've already seen demonstrations of interactive tiles, so you won't even have to open an app to get functionality.

iOS and Android are still restricted by this old paradigm, which means that although your device aggregates the information you want, you still have to act before you learn anything, whereas WP presents you with information all the time and you only have to act if something peeks your interest.

What do you mean Google Play Store isn't available in all markets? The only thing Google play is not available on is in highly modified versions of Android like those found on the Kindle, and thus it is up to Amazon to provide said protection. Also what do you mean apps are not "vetted" before they are published? Apps are automatically scanned when uploaded to the play store for any malicious algorithms and it does a superb job the majority of the time.

My bad, I was under the impression Google Play was not available in places like China, but in fact it's only censored. Of course, if an OEM decides not to pay for Google services, the Play store is unavailable to those users. It's a small percentage of course, but still cause for concern. I'm afraid I can't share your 'I'm all right Jack' attitude and blame people for poor decisions. It's only rational to do that where it's reasonable to expect people to have the knowledge. Digital space is still new and if you and I haven't fully appreciated the potential and dangers, how can we expect people with no interest in the field to do so?

Regarding apps not being vetted, my information might be out of date, but as I understand it, apps are not vetted before being published to the Play store. However, once an app is published, it is subject to scanning by robots, which trawl the Play store. If I am out of date, please supply a link.

Also, I am hardly reassured by your phrase 'majority of the time'. The Maginot Line only covered the 'majority of the border' between France and Germany, look how useful that was.

As you stated; it is a very small number of Android smartphones that is infected and Google keeps adding more security every major Android release. I would MUCH rather have an open environment and let users decide what to download and what not to download. If a couple of idiots get infected oh-well. You will always have idiots on any platform; yet we don't blame Google for someone downloading a Trojan on Windows 7 do we?

What I stated was that there was an infection rate of .25%, according to an independent study; that's a quarter of a million crimes. In exactly which fantasy land is a 250,000 crimes a small or insignificant amount? As I explained above your stance on this is irrational, it's also careless and immoral.

If they do that than it would be pretty damn impressive because they would have gone past Android's sandboxing. Which means WP 8 - 8.1 users and iOS users should be just as fearful as they won't be safe if methods have been developed to pass this. So I am not sure why you are saying iOS and WP will be safe.

I did say why: herd immunity. In medicine, a vaccine will only give an individual 75% or so protection(it varies from vaccine to vaccine), but because the whole population is vaccinated the virus can't spread far before it is blocked, thereby protecting the whole population, especially those like newborns who cannot be vaccinated. It's why anti-vaccination kooks are so dangerous, there have already been increases and fatalities from pertussis for instance.

The analogy, applied to OSs in general show .25% representing quite a substantial population from which an infection can spread. The previous accepted estimate was .0009%, so the new one is an increase by a factor of 277. If that rate of increase were to continue, 70% of Android devices would be infected within months. By comparison, the population of infected WP is too small to measure.

I don't trust or distrust Google any less/more than I do Microsoft.

I made this decision over a decade ago, before Android even existed and I had to choose who to trust my data with. I went with Microsoft on the assumption that being mainly an enterprise company, they would have to be geared to business' need for confidentiality. Microsoft would stand to lose an awful lot of custom were that confidentiality to be breached, so they would have to be geared up to safeguard the information their systems were entrusted with and so I opted for MS products and services before Google had any equivalents to offer.

When Android first came along I was intrigued, Google at that point were little more than a search engine and one I was a great fan of, but I was saved by being tied an iPhone and having all sorts of problems trying to get the thing to meet my needs, to the point that I had to carry my Windows Mobile as well.

Then all sorts of worrying headlines started to appear about invasions of privacy Google were committing, like publishing Street View pictures showing people without blanking out their faces. It took legislators to intercede to curb this irresponsible behaviour and it became clear to me that far from 'do no evil' Google's real motto was 'do what you can get away with.'

It was only as a result of public criticism that Google started scanning apps in the app store. I have watched the growth of Android and Google and witnessed the ongoing controversy around it business practices and the piecemeal and incoherent way new security features have been grafted into the ecosystem. Compared to iOS and Windows Phone, Android is very haphazard.

Another thing that really gives me the creeps is that Android devices routinely upload their position to Google, effectively putting you under surveillance. This is rationalised under the banner of convenience, but I wouldn't give that kind of information out willingly even to my friends, leave alone strangers. To me Google are the type of organisation we need to be wary of and I'm hardly alone.

Microsoft btw is the company who purposefully input back-doors into outlook/skype, etc...

Microsoft handed the NSA access to encrypted messages | World news | The Guardian

I've only had time to briefly scan the article, but it has already got me puzzled by "Skype worked to enable Prism collection of video calls", because it makes no sense, given what PRISM actually is.

Briefly, PRISM worked by physically intercepting the the data stream into data centres and duplicating it. One copy would be sent on and one copy would be stored by the NSA. This is similar to how a real prism is used in an interferometer, hence the name.

My point is that PRISM worked independently of Microsoft or anyone else, they couldn't have helped the NSA even if they wanted to.

Now I have the greatest respect for The Guardian, but unfortunately news media generally have been cutting back on science correspondents in particular, so these articles are often written by people who lack the detailed understanding of the subject. Steve Gibson's Security Now podcast is right now a necessity to keep up with security, even though he is an incurable Apple acolyte.

Also, where MS claim they were legally compelled to comply, you can bet your bottom dollar that Google and Facebook were too.

Hence why I use Android with multiple security features. ESET for device security, Xprivacy to regulate app permissions and avoid data collection, and PIA VPN.

View attachment 70790
Good for you, my 'I'm all right Jack' friend. You be the .0005% of people who has the knowledge to protect yourself while everyone else drowns. I simply cannot be so callous and smug. I have to point people in the direction of the best option for them, the one which best suits their needs as they are, not as they would be given a month's intensive training.

While WP8.1 does support VPN, to be honest I'm still trying to get people to use secure and unique passwords, before I try to induct them into the complexities of that.

I have no problem with your stance if there wasn't the implication that Android were universally the best option, but for the VAST majority a closed ecosystem is a necessity because they need to be protected from their own poor decisions. Digital security needs to be universal and automatic, not an expertise you have to master and enact. That is why Android is so hopelessly inadequate.
 

anon(8938849)

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One point on customization: I flashed roms like crazy on my Android devices. As well as using xposed framework by default. I found it more frustrating than satisfying. Most things just made it look worse. I do wish Windows phone had a bit more customization options, but what it does have is better than any default Android ability. Since 90 something percent of people won't root, they're stuck with how their Android looks other than wallpaper and maybe a launcher. Being able to change the theme color system wide to match everything in an elegant way, as well as being able to choose between light and dark backgrounds system wide is more than most androids can do out of the box. Not to mention the ability to change the tiles from 2 columns to three, which would be equivalent to changing the grid size on Android, which you typically need a custom launcher to do.

A fair comparison would be between stock Android and Windows phone, in which case Windows actually beats Android handedly in customization.
 

twint7787

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Are you saying that iOS is more customizable than WP? How? Third party keyboards are brand new but besides that it isn't anymore customizable than WP.
All that tinkering you do with Android is a nice bonus if you are into it. I had a galaxy nexus and rooted it, threw on a really nice theme, but like I said it is only skin deep. There is something to be said when an entire OS looks and behaves the same through out. I like android a lot and I'll probably like it even more once material design gets fully flushed out because right now Android is ugly and all the customization ppl do to it are only superficial like I said. To each his own but your initial evaluation of WP is pretty biased. I can see the major pros in all operating systems and for right now I am choosing WP because design is important to me. I feel WP trumps all in this regard. I also don't use a truck load of apps because if I did I would probably be on IOS, and if I really wanted to customize I would have stuck with android.
 

Slayix312

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Hello Mr Pot, have you met Mr Kettle? :p

I'd have some respect if I thought you had the ability to be unbiased or if you really were presenting your views as merely that, but your not are you? If you were you'd have given WP more than a week and would've allowed yourself to adapt to a different way of doing things.

Hello Kettle,

Of course I was going to respond in-kind to your passive aggressiveness silly.

Also a week is long enough to know the limitations of WP. I think I listed them clearly and explained WHY I came to those conclusions. If you think any of the factual statements I have made are wrong; please feel free to list them with an explanation of WHY I am wrong.

Over a million users are currently using WP8.1 and is Kit-Kat being replaced in something like the next month?

Actually yeah, probably. Early custom rom builds of Android L should start rolling out very shortly with the dev release of Android L. The modding community is pretty proactive when that happens.

The customization is better in WP8.1 than WP8, so that's a change and like a lot of things on WP, though modest has a surprisingly marked effect. Also the customization comes from the apps, my calendar app allows me to chose how many of the next appointments I see. That's true for every app in that by choosing the size of the tile, I chose how much information is fed to me.

Sure the customization is better compared to WP8; BUT terrible and not within 5 ballparks when compared to Android, and I made that point clear.

Fine, but the comparison is still unbalanced.

No it isn't, because none of the points I made are fixed with 8.1 as I already mentioned. Again; customization is still ****e in comparison to Android and not anywhere close.


Then how come Android is so fragmented?

Because Android is updated FAR more frequently than WP? Everything in the last 2 years has gotten at LEAST up to jellybean. Which is just behind kit-kat.

Yes, but these are very geeky things a tiny tiny proportion of users can or would want to do. Most people have lives to lead and buy smart phones to serve their needs, not as toys or status synbols. Your usage model is highly peculiar. I used to do those things when I used Windows Mobile, now when I want to play I play Mass Effect. My device is for work, I want it to do what I want, when I want and be reliable. I don't want to tinker, I have better things to do.

Obviously not that tiny because XDA is a massive developing community. Also my personal device is for enjoyment AND work. I can have my M8 open my garage door when I am within 500ft of my house if I wanted to actually do it. With my custom rom I can also record my screen and send the video to friends to show them how to access certain things on their phones or how to fix something. I can go on and on. Customizing my "toy" Android makes it far more functional than any WP "device for work" that you have.

Your screen shows lots of dead space. It amazes me that your screen is really just a smaller version of a desktop, as if you were still using a mouse. The desktop is an analogy introduced to make it easier for people to navigate through unfamiliar digital spaces and like any analogy, it only serves up to the point beyond which it breaks down. There is no reason to assume the spacial paradigm is the only or most efficient way to represent information space, after all it restricts you to two dimensions in discrete screen-sized chunks.

I know; its amazing that I can do more things with that "dead space" than you can do on your WP from your home-screen right? That was essentially my point.

Probably to avoid patent troubles, Microsoft tried a fresh approach with a dynamic UI - a real paradigm shift you haven't even begun to appreciate though even Android and iOS has started to imitate it stylistically, so it can't be as bad as you say. Whatsmore, the live tiles idea has potential, for instance I've already seen demonstrations of interactive tiles, so you won't even have to open an app to get functionality.

Imitated it stylistically? Really? All I see is WP getting notification "center" a.k.a the thing that Android has had since its inception.

iOS and Android are still restricted by this old paradigm, which means that although your device aggregates the information you want, you still have to act before you learn anything, whereas WP presents you with information all the time and you only have to act if something peeks your interest.

Really? Because I don't have to do anything to see new information on a google now widget. I can interact with it when and only IF I want to.

Regarding apps not being vetted, my information might be out of date, but as I understand it, apps are not vetted before being published to the Play store. However, once an app is published, it is subject to scanning by robots, which trawl the Play store. If I am out of date, please supply a link.

Yes apps are scanned WHEN they are BEING uploaded to the google play store. Thus if they have malware they will never be listed. Google play store now even scans SIDELOADED apps which is a MAJOR deal in combating malware. Sideloaded apps are by far the majority of where the Malware tradtionally came from.

Also, I am hardly reassured by your phrase 'majority of the time'. The Maginot Line only covered the 'majority of the border' between France and Germany, look how useful that was.

lolwut? Bad comparison is bad. The Maginot line was terrible because they stopped it at Belgium where the Germans flanked from. I didn't know Google play store app scanning stopped at some arbitrary spot lol.


I did say why: herd immunity. In medicine, a vaccine will only give an individual 75% or so protection(it varies from vaccine to vaccine), but because the whole population is vaccinated the virus can't spread far before it is blocked, thereby protecting the whole population, especially those like newborns who cannot be vaccinated. It's why anti-vaccination kooks are so dangerous, there have already been increases and fatalities from pertussis for instance.

The analogy, applied to OSs in general show .25% representing quite a substantial population from which an infection can spread. The previous accepted estimate was .0009%, so the new one is an increase by a factor of 277. If that rate of increase were to continue, 70% of Android devices would be infected within months. By comparison, the population of infected WP is too small to measure.

Yeah I know you said why; it is just a silly made up fantasy with no merit in this regards considering no present way is available to by-pass Android's sandboxing. Until someone figures out how to do this; than this comment is meaningless.

Another thing that really gives me the creeps is that Android devices routinely upload their position to Google, effectively putting you under surveillance. This is rationalised under the banner of convenience, but I wouldn't give that kind of information out willingly even to my friends, leave alone strangers. To me Google are the type of organisation we need to be wary of and I'm hardly alone.

You can turn off google location services OFF, and you can use Xprivacy to ENSURE it stays off or feed it false data. Another thing not available on WP.


I've only had time to briefly scan the article, but it has already got me puzzled by "Skype worked to enable Prism collection of video calls", because it makes no sense, given what PRISM actually is.

Briefly, PRISM worked by physically intercepting the the data stream into data centres and duplicating it. One copy would be sent on and one copy would be stored by the NSA. This is similar to how a real prism is used in an interferometer, hence the name.


Why doesn't Prism collecting video calls make sense? Even in the corporate world companies use secure VMRs for sensitive meetings. I know; because I work in that field. Not exactly sure why that seems far-fetched too you.

My point is that PRISM worked independently of Microsoft or anyone else, they couldn't have helped the NSA even if they wanted to.

Now I have the greatest respect for The Guardian, but unfortunately news media generally have been cutting back on science correspondents in particular, so these articles are often written by people who lack the detailed understanding of the subject. Steve Gibson's Security Now podcast is right now a necessity to keep up with security, even though he is an incurable Apple acolyte
.


Sorry but the same information has come up from MULTIPLE sources including German IT firms.

Microsoft Windows 8 NSA back door alleged | BGR

Microsoft CLEARLY helped the NSA.

Also, where MS claim they were legally compelled to comply, you can bet your bottom dollar that Google and Facebook were too.

I'm not saying they don't. MY POINT was that you made Microsoft sound like some kind of security saints.

See your previous comment:

All of this ignores the biggest security breach of all: Google itself. The central tenet of security is TNO and yet you have, for the sake of convenience, decided to trust a for profit advertising company with all your personal information; allowing them to scan your emails, text messages, address books and even track your movements - all on the assumption that Saint Sergei and co never find anything nefarious to do.

Microsoft is AT LEAST as bad as Google if not worse.

Good for you, my 'I'm all right Jack' friend. You be the .0005% of people who has the knowledge to protect yourself while everyone else drowns. I simply cannot be so callous and smug. I have to point people in the direction of the best option for them, the one which best suits their needs as they are, not as they would be given a month's intensive training.

Multiple warnings come up when you try to install an app from an unknown source. If people are idiots to press "ok" on all of them then that is on them. It has less to do with letting people "drown" and more to do with expecting people not to be stupid.

I have no problem with your stance if there wasn't the implication that Android were universally the best option, but for the VAST majority a closed ecosystem is a necessity because they need to be protected from their own poor decisions. Digital security needs to be universal and automatic, not an expertise you have to master and enact. That is why Android is so hopelessly inadequate.

Again; many screens come up that announce the danger of possibly downloading malware filled ads, and now with the google play store scanning even side-loaded apps that is even more protection. If someone bypasses all that then I am sure it is only a matter of years before Darwinism catches up to them anyway. You can't rid the world of mental illness.
 
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Slayix312

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Are you saying that iOS is more customizable than WP? How? Third party keyboards are brand new but besides that it isn't anymore customizable than WP.
All that tinkering you do with Android is a nice bonus if you are into it. I had a galaxy nexus and rooted it, threw on a really nice theme, but like I said it is only skin deep. There is something to be said when an entire OS looks and behaves the same through out. I like android a lot and I'll probably like it even more once material design gets fully flushed out because right now Android is ugly and all the customization ppl do to it are only superficial like I said. To each his own but your initial evaluation of WP is pretty biased. I can see the major pros in all operating systems and for right now I am choosing WP because design is important to me. I feel WP trumps all in this regard. I also don't use a truck load of apps because if I did I would probably be on IOS, and if I really wanted to customize I would have stuck with android.

Except it isn't just superficial and I already listed multiple ways of how the customization's on Android are actually functional. Go back up and look through the comments. Maybe it is superficial for you, but all the tweaks I do are made for functionality. If you like WP for its asthetic that is fine, but I have laid out multiple OBJECTIVE reasons for why Android is far more functional than WP.

Also iOS is more customizable because it at LEAST allows jailbreaking. That alone puts it 100 steps ahead of WP. Especially with Cydia. Oh and yes the keyboard is a plus too I guess. Still I would take the ability to jailbreak over resizing tiles and changing your homescreen/lockscreen on WP. I had changing homescreen/lockscreen since my Palm Pre on WebOS.
 

chezm

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From someone like me whos used all the major mobile OS's, and who has considered going back to Android...i do find the overall purpose of this thread to just point out WP is full of flaws or features not as full fledged as Android, and that Android is GREAT with no flaws to be found. While i can respect the level of discussion and detail involved throughout the thread defending both Android and WP, i find the TC to be way too biased to fairly present his opinions of WP to be legitimately equal to those of Android. While a lot of the positions he stands on are trying to seem unbiased and "equally tested", in the end one would conclude his opinion as mostly ignorance, sorry TC this is how i honestly feel from what I've read.

Good luck with the HTC M8, which is a beautiful device, and the Android experience lending you to what works best for you.
 

twint7787

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Except it isn't just superficial and I already listed multiple ways of how the customization's on Android are actually functional. Go back up and look through the comments. Maybe it is superficial for you, but all the tweaks I do are made for functionality. If you like WP for its asthetic that is fine, but I have laid out multiple OBJECTIVE reasons for why Android is far more functional than WP.

Also iOS is more customizable because it at LEAST allows jailbreaking. That alone puts it 100 steps ahead of WP. Especially with Cydia. Oh and yes the keyboard is a plus too I guess. Still I would take the ability to jailbreak over resizing tiles and changing your homescreen/lockscreen on WP. I had changing homescreen/lockscreen since my Palm Pre on WebOS.

Oh I'm not arguing about the functionality of your customizations; I'm arguing about the aesthetics of them. They are ugly.
 

Slayix312

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From someone like me whos used all the major mobile OS's, and who has considered going back to Android...i do find the overall purpose of this thread to just point out WP is full of flaws or features not as full fledged as Android, and that Android is GREAT with no flaws to be found. While i can respect the level of discussion and detail involved throughout the thread defending both Android and WP, i find the TC to be way too biased to fairly present his opinions of WP to be legitimately equal to those of Android. While a lot of the positions he stands on are trying to seem unbiased and "equally tested", in the end one would conclude his opinion as mostly ignorance, sorry TC this is how i honestly feel from what I've read.

Good luck with the HTC M8, which is a beautiful device, and the Android experience lending you to what works best for you.

Sorry you feel that way. Although I did my best to sound unbiased while still presenting factual statements that I have yet to be corrected about. I thought a post like this would be inflammatory either way since many people get protective of their favorite OS' hence why I posted it in 'Phone Wars', and not in the Nokia Icon forum.

I'll agree that I may be possibly being too biased (unwittingly) but facts are facts. If you think I made something up then feel free to present some sort of evidence or statement on why I am incorrect and I would be happy to respond.

Oh I'm not arguing about the functionality of your customizations; I'm arguing about the aesthetics of them. They are ugly.

Actually you did, see:


and all the customization ppl do to it are only superficial like I said.

That seems to heavily imply that you think it is not functional. Aesthetic customization's typically have HEAVY functional value as well. IE: Most top launchers on Android.
 

chezm

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I don't feel you purposely made up stuff or made this thread to start arguments, you've got an opinion and I appreciate that part. And being harmfully opinionated on WP8, unlike some here I can agree with a lot of your points.

With that said, you actually don't seem to have anything really positive to say about the OS...and while your opinion is yours, this is the WP forums (yes phone wars but still). You've got nothing positive to say about it (unless I missed something), so why post to only rant? That's my opinion.

As I said, I'm considering Android after I'm absolutely fed up with WP (I'm slowly getting there, only been back for 2 months running 8.1 which is an improvement indeed ). More recently quick use of HTC M8 and the LG G3 reviews have me impressed.

The fact you can't appreciate anything about WP leaves me feeling this thread is meh.
 

Slayix312

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I don't feel you purposely made up stuff or made this thread to start arguments, you've got an opinion and I appreciate that part. And being harmfully opinionated on WP8, unlike some here I can agree with a lot of your points.

With that said, you actually don't seem to have anything really positive to say about the OS...and while your opinion is yours, this is the WP forums (yes phone wars but still). You've got nothing positive to say about it (unless I missed something), so why post to only rant? That's my opinion.

As I said, I'm considering Android after I'm absolutely fed up with WP (I'm slowly getting there, only been back for 2 months running 8.1 which is an improvement indeed ). More recently quick use of HTC M8 and the LG G3 reviews have me impressed.

The fact you can't appreciate anything about WP leaves me feeling this thread is meh.

Well I apologize if I am overtly negative. I am trying to be as level-headed as possible.

You say I don't have a single good thing to say about WP. Which is somewhat true (besides it running on lower-end hardware well, probably), but if I said I liked anything else I would be lying.

Its not just cause I am some Android ****** either; if WP really had another cool feature that is exclusive to them or an area where they were superb in; I would ABSOLUTELY bring it up in their favor, but that isn't the case.

I mean I HATE iOS for example, but I will give them MASSIVE amounts of credit for their app store being far more conducive to good developers. The swift development platform they announced this past WWDC will ensure they always have top-notch apps for the forseeable future. Many developed better than their Android counterparts even.

Android evens it up though (or surpasses) iOS by having a more open OS with FAR more customization than any of the competition.

WP however has terrible app selection, and the apps they do have are severely lacking compared to those on other platforms. It is even more sad that Microsoft doesn't fix Skype on their own platform compared to its iOS and Android counterpart.

And unlike Android. WP doesn't have customization (or some other special X-factor) to fall-back on.

WP doesn't even have the customization that iOS has (jailbreaking/Cydia) which is somewhat sad.

So what is left for me to give them a huge amount of props for? I think that would just be dishonest to say I liked something if I really didn't.
 

z33dev33l

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I gotta say, this is comical. First you compare Android and iOS in terms of quality apps. I've yet to use a quality app on Android and the one truly enjoyable game not available on my platform (Dark Meadows) only works on like three android phones because of fragmentation. I won't get into just how horrid HTC's hardware is in comparison to Nokia as to some degree that's opinion. Also, if you want all your data kept in some cloud bank for governments to prod at as they see fit then enjoy your Google apps. I've yet to see an app that's better on Android than Windows phone.
 
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