08-01-2015 01:38 AM
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  1. DJCBS's Avatar
    Which is probably because Samsung holds the lion's share of Android devices. It's the most popular OEM, and it's what people are familiar with. In fact, the name Samsung has become synonymous with Android. I still say this: if Android is so bad, how can it have a market share of over 80%, and continue to maintain it and even grow? The image mustn't be hurting much. Users are evidently satisfied and returning.
    Well, the continuous decrease in sales of Samsung phones in favour of the likes of LG and Motorola seems to indicate that more people are becoming fed up with the experience they get on Samsung.

    I don't think Android is bad at all. That's why I switched from WP to Android once Nokia left. But there are many flavours of Android and that's its major strength, I believe.


    Unless Nokia is going to have Lumia esque designs that they originally had, I can't find any reason to be curious. The only people who would buy Nokia android phones are diehard superfans who won't acknowledge that Nokia has been irrelevant in most countries that aren't India. See above.
    1 - The "Lumia esque designs that they originally had" were made by people that remained at Nokia (assuming you're talking about the likes of the N9/Lumia 800 etc).

    2 - Again, your "irrelevance" is absolutely and only based in the US. Nokia is a household name in Europe and India, yes. And even in some other countries in South America and Asia. So no, Nokia is not irrelevant. They simply stopped offering what people wanted (and that started the moment they went with WP instead of Android)

    I'm not so sure if that would've been the case in the US. Nokia was never a popular brand in the US, except for some old feature phones.
    Yes, that would most likely not be the case in the US. Luckily, no OEM needs the US market to stay alive as long as they cater to the other markets they're popular at. And that was one of Nokia's mistakes. They wasted way too much time and money in the US market, time and money they should have spent nurturing the markets they are beloved in.
    The reverse of what happened with Motorola. No one cares about Motorola in Europe since the 90's. And therefore Motorola started to focus in the only market they're still popular in: the US. That allowed them to grow YoY. And I don't think that will change under Lenovo either.
    tgp, Laura Knotek and xandros9 like this.
    06-08-2015 10:39 AM
  2. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    The reverse of what happened with Motorola. No one cares about Motorola in Europe since the 90's. And therefore Motorola started to focus in the only market they're still popular in: the US. That allowed them to grow YoY. And I don't think that will change under Lenovo either.
    I believe that Lenovo is only going to keep the Motorola branding in the US. IIRC, the Lenovo name will be used outside the US.
    Guytronic likes this.
    06-08-2015 10:21 PM
  3. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Verizon and Sprint never even sold Nokia devices at all prior to the Windows Phones.
    Not 100% accurate. Verizon sold this thing called the Nokia Twist that reminds us all of the need to keep abortion legal. I'd dig up a link if you promise to look at it before eating.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    06-09-2015 01:49 PM
  4. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    Not 100% accurate. Verizon sold this thing called the Nokia Twist that reminds us all of the need to keep abortion legal. I'd dig up a link if you promise to look at it before eating.
    Yeah, I'd be interested in seeing just how ugly it was! I hadn't heard of it.

    Sent from my rooted Nexus 7 (2013) using Tapatalk
    06-09-2015 01:51 PM
  5. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Yeah, I'd be interested in seeing just how ugly it was! I hadn't heard of it.

    Sent from my rooted Nexus 7 (2013) using Tapatalk
    Don't say I didn't warn you.

    Nokia 7705 Twist specs
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    06-09-2015 01:53 PM
  6. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    Don't say I didn't warn you.

    Nokia 7705 Twist specs
    The keyfob phone!

    Sent from my rooted Nexus 7 (2013) using Tapatalk
    fatclue_98 likes this.
    06-09-2015 02:00 PM
  7. tgp's Avatar
    Don't say I didn't warn you.

    Nokia 7705 Twist specs
    Thanks! I just decided not to eat supper tonight.
    fatclue_98 and Laura Knotek like this.
    06-09-2015 02:21 PM
  8. DJCBS's Avatar
    I believe that Lenovo is only going to keep the Motorola branding in the US. IIRC, the Lenovo name will be used outside the US.
    If I understood their CEO correctly, they'll use "Motorola" in the Western World and Lenovo in Asia.
    Although Motorola is completely irrelevant in Europe these days, they still hold more water with consumers than Lenovo. So I guess it's a smart move by Lenovo to use the Motorola branding in the West. And hopefully infuse more cash into it. I wouldn't mind seeing Motorola resurge in Europe. Their Moto X's are pretty nice phones (only ruined by the crappy crappy cameras).
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    06-09-2015 09:32 PM
  9. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    If I understood their CEO correctly, they'll use "Motorola" in the Western World and Lenovo in Asia.
    Although Motorola is completely irrelevant in Europe these days, they still hold more water with consumers than Lenovo. So I guess it's a smart move by Lenovo to use the Motorola branding in the West. And hopefully infuse more cash into it. I wouldn't mind seeing Motorola resurge in Europe. Their Moto X's are pretty nice phones (only ruined by the crappy crappy cameras).
    I've actually had better results with the Moto X camera than with the Lumia 920 camera.

    Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk
    fatclue_98 likes this.
    06-09-2015 09:37 PM
  10. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    I just saw this.

    Actually Nokia's irrelevance came because they were stuck on Symbian for so long...when the world moved towards Android and IOS. Despite having far lower marketshare, Nokia became relevant again (to a degree) with Lumia and Windows phones.

    Sure there are many people who will buy a Nokia for the name(poor things) but most people have moved on from Nokia...not because of Windows phone but because Nokia stopped being relevant. They aren't blackberry relevant but let's stop pretending that Nokia is more than what it is and that windows phone is the sole reason(or biggest) for their fall from grace.
    Well, the continuous decrease in sales of Samsung phones in favour of the likes of LG and Motorola seems to indicate that more people are becoming fed up with the experience they get on Samsung.

    I don't think Android is bad at all. That's why I switched from WP to Android once Nokia left. But there are many flavours of Android and that's its major strength, I believe.




    1 - The "Lumia esque designs that they originally had" were made by people that remained at Nokia (assuming you're talking about the likes of the N9/Lumia 800 etc).

    2 - Again, your "irrelevance" is absolutely and only based in the US. Nokia is a household name in Europe and India, yes. And even in some other countries in South America and Asia. So no, Nokia is not irrelevant. They simply stopped offering what people wanted (and that started the moment they went with WP instead of Android)



    Yes, that would most likely not be the case in the US. Luckily, no OEM needs the US market to stay alive as long as they cater to the other markets they're popular at. And that was one of Nokia's mistakes. They wasted way too much time and money in the US market, time and money they should have spent nurturing the markets they are beloved in.
    The reverse of what happened with Motorola. No one cares about Motorola in Europe since the 90's. And therefore Motorola started to focus in the only market they're still popular in: the US. That allowed them to grow YoY. And I don't think that will change under Lenovo either.
    06-14-2015 07:38 PM
  11. DJCBS's Avatar
    Actually Nokia's irrelevance came because they were stuck on Symbian for so long...when the world moved towards Android and IOS. Despite having far lower marketshare, Nokia became relevant again (to a degree) with Lumia and Windows phones.

    Sure there are many people who will buy a Nokia for the name(poor things) but most people have moved on from Nokia...not because of Windows phone but because Nokia stopped being relevant. They aren't blackberry relevant but let's stop pretending that Nokia is more than what it is and that windows phone is the sole reason(or biggest) for their fall from grace.
    Yet again, you base your opinion on your American perception of Nokia.
    Yes, Nokia lost a lot of people because they stayed on Symbian too long. However the biggest decline came after the adoption of Windows Phone. That's based on numbers, not your wishes. Go look at the charts.
    By the time Eflop was done with Nokia, they had come down from the 1st mobile brand in Europe (and, well, the World) to total irrelevance in the US and number 4 in their European stronghold, having been surpassed by Sony, Samsung and Apple. And currently (because they've temporarily left the market) they've been also surpassed by LG. Nokia not only DIDN'T became relevant with Windows Phone, they became more and more irrelevant as they substituted an operating system no one wanted anymore -Symbian - with another one that no one wants either - Windows Phone.
    You simply can't deny facts.
    Now you'll tell me, "Nokia became more visible with Windows Phone in the US". THAT I would believe. Specially if we look at the very curious fact that since Nokia left, WP sales in the US came down along with marketshare. Which means apparently American consumers were more prone to give Nokia a chance than they are to give Microsoft (I would guess the image problem Microsoft has from the years past may still be playing a role here).

    However, I can assure you one thing and I'm ready to bet on this: the "irrelevance" you so desperately want to give Nokia, is enough for them to, upon their return with Android, quickly surpass Microsoft and quickly return to the top 5 mobile brands in Europe (and if, as I expect, they leverage their camera tech on Android as they did on WP, they'll certainly beat down Sony who has been clearly sleeping these last years and the rest of the competition in that department yet again. And camera, along with battery life, are the two things people value the most these days).
    06-14-2015 08:10 PM
  12. ROBBIE HALL's Avatar
    I like WP because it way different. My first experience with WP I think was the HTC surround. But honestly, I am kind of Nokia loyal. Even though I detested when Nokia went MS and Elop did the burning bridge remark about the Symbian platform. I still went to Nokia. Alot of Nokia engineers are now on Jolla. And alot of the Nokia we know are not at MS. I may be wrong but alot of the camera development team and r&d team are working other places. I miss Symbian to be honest. And I still think that the destruction of Nokia was due to American interest in the mobile world. Keep stating how bad Symbian was, bad review the devices and keep pushing American OSes until market share dropped. In comes MS buys Nokia and now no more Nokia. 3 American companies now dominate the mobile market. That is my "conspiracy theory" about what happened to Nokia. America saw the fruits of the mobile world and wanted all to themselves.
    Anyway, Nokia android device? Maybe I'd get one...still brand loyal...
    06-14-2015 08:12 PM
  13. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    However, I can assure you one thing and I'm ready to bet on this: the "irrelevance" you so desperately want to give Nokia, is enough for them to, upon their return with Android, quickly surpass Microsoft and quickly return to the top 5 mobile brands in Europe (and if, as I expect, they leverage their camera tech on Android as they did on WP, they'll certainly beat down Sony who has been clearly sleeping these last years and the rest of the competition in that department yet again. And camera, along with battery life, are the two things people value the most these days).
    LOL I forgot I was speaking to Nokia's biggest fan :D
    Well, I look forward to seeing that. Much like I don't care if WP is #3 OS, I really couldn't care if Nokia surpasses Microsoft as long as I still have amazing Lumias to choose from in the end with amazing cameras like I already have presently :)

    I thank Nokia for introducing the world to Lumia and I am glad Microsoft is carrying the tradition on(and also doing better with their models than nokia did...see the 640/XL for example) but I am Lumia biased, not nokia biased and as good as Nokia may be, you still have a far stronger competitor who is actually beginning to be a lot better in the photography department: Samsung. My friends new galaxy phone was used this past weekend and I was impressed with the picture quality. No lumia of course(But it did much better than the m8 windows from a friend) but still quite respectable.

    I'd be more concerned about Samsung than I would be about Nokia. But I forget Nokia is life, Nokia is love with you and in the next few years if Nokia doesn't make this epic comeback you are predicting....Nokia will be...wait for it...irrelevant :D Let's not forget, as great as blackberry is and as respected as they once were....and even with their superior features, they are still an afterthought because people have moved on for them to matter and they can only cater to their small but rabid fanbase...which wouldn't surprise me if this was the case with Nokia in the future.

    As much as I enjoy the debates, i'll take the L this time and tap out. game of thrones time :D
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    06-14-2015 08:19 PM
  14. DJCBS's Avatar
    I thank Nokia for introducing the world to Lumia and I am glad Microsoft is carrying the tradition on(and also doing better with their models than nokia did...see the 640/XL for example) but I am Lumia biased, not nokia biased and as good as Nokia may be, you still have a far stronger competitor who is actually beginning to be a lot better in the photography department: Samsung. My friends new galaxy phone was used this past weekend and I was impressed with the picture quality. No lumia of course(But it did much better than the m8 windows from a friend) but still quite respectable.

    I'd be more concerned about Samsung than I would be about Nokia. But I forget Nokia is life, Nokia is love with you and in the next few years if Nokia doesn't make this epic comeback you are predicting....Nokia will be...wait for it...irrelevant :D Let's not forget, as great as blackberry is and as respected as they once were....and even with their superior features, they are still an afterthought because people have moved on for them to matter and they can only cater to their small but rabid fanbase...which wouldn't surprise me if this was the case with Nokia in the future.

    As much as I enjoy the debates, i'll take the L this time and tap out. game of thrones time :D
    Well, now that I assume you've recovered from the latest GoT bloodbath...XD

    Microsoft doing a better job is quite debatable. The 640 is a very poor excuse of a phone in 2015 not to mention the design is atrocious.
    As for the competition in the camera department from Samsung. YES. But then again, that's now more of Microsoft's concern, not Nokia's. Nokia is still developing new tech to license (or eventually use themselves). If Microsoft doesn't license the new tech, that's their problem.
    But definitely Samsung is doing a good job. Or, actually, Sony is doing the job for them (and for Apple).
    But as far as cameras go, currently the best one is actually on the LG G4. At least until Samsung updates the camera software to add the missing manual controls that the G4 has.

    And honestly, both the S6 and the G4 put Lumia's current imaging flagship - the 930 - to shame. Especially the G4.
    We'll (well, you'll) have to wait for a true 2015 flagship from Microsoft to see what they did since Nokia left in the camera department.

    I do agree on your last comment though. Nokia is life, Nokia is love ;D
    And yes, they do have to make a comeback as soon as possible otherwise they'll not make one at all. All the signs point towards it. How will it be made? No idea. But I could see Nokia producing a flagship-reference device for example (kinda like the Surface is for Microsoft in the tablet department) to showcase all the awesome tech they have available for licensing.

    Which leads me to yesterday's news: Nokia and LG just signed a licensing agreement whereas LG will be licensing a bunch of mobile tech from Nokia Technologies. Well...I am assuming amongst that will be imaging tech. Which means, if that's correct, the imaging tech on Lumias will be available on LG Android phones. And given that the G4 has already the best smartphone camera in 2015...well, I guess even you can see the jump they'll give by accessing Nokia's imaging tech. And how that might spell trouble not only for Microsoft...but for Samsung itself.
    06-16-2015 07:07 PM
  15. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    I would hope that the S6 and G4 of 2015 are besting the Icon/930 cameras from 2014(which I believe is the exact same camera my 2013 1520 had). I'd be disturbed if it wasn't.

    There are a lot of what ifs and assumptions right now and speculation so I am going to wait and see really what happens. I have no ill will to Nokia(I wouldn't have the epic Lumias I've owned past and the future Lumias from Microsoft without them) but I find them irrelevant...as do most Lumia owners who are more or less ready to move forward with Microsoft Lumias. Time will only tell if Nokia still has the sway you say they have or if they are irrelevant to everyone else as well.

    In respect to the 640, I find the 640 to be a nice design. An evolution of the 635 with specs the 635 should have had. It's a nice phone(the gloss makes it look cheap...almost like a Samsung phone).

    I'm actually excited. I ordered myself(and my brother) a lumia 640 XL. It is my first Microsoft Lumia and I like what they are doing. From the adorable Lumia 435(which I brought for my other brother) to the 535 and the 640s not to mention the others, I like that they are being a bit smarter about their releases these days and I am looking forward to the 1020/930 successors coming later this year...from Microsoft.

    I could have chosen to buy myself a Nokia lumia 930 as I absolutely loved that design but I wanted to A. Support Microsoft's current efforts as well as B. I am curious to see how mid range works, so it was only natural(plus that orange XL called out to me).

    You are one of the few people I've seen speak negatively about the 640. I forget which tech site called it this but it was referred to as the Moto G of Windows Phone and that is definitely a compliment where I see it. In fact the main complaints are simply it's poor camera(Front and Back) and the screen but even then most people said it was a great phone for it's price point. Not too many negatives I've seen for it tbh. So Microsoft appears to be doing something right since that is presently the phone Windows Phone users are clamoring for(look at the debacle with the release date here in the US for example).

    So yeah Microsoft is doing a good job considering they are still going through growing pains. Now it's time to step it up with flagships.
    Well, now that I assume you've recovered from the latest GoT bloodbath...XD

    Microsoft doing a better job is quite debatable. The 640 is a very poor excuse of a phone in 2015 not to mention the design is atrocious.
    As for the competition in the camera department from Samsung. YES. But then again, that's now more of Microsoft's concern, not Nokia's. Nokia is still developing new tech to license (or eventually use themselves). If Microsoft doesn't license the new tech, that's their problem.
    But definitely Samsung is doing a good job. Or, actually, Sony is doing the job for them (and for Apple).
    But as far as cameras go, currently the best one is actually on the LG G4. At least until Samsung updates the camera software to add the missing manual controls that the G4 has.

    And honestly, both the S6 and the G4 put Lumia's current imaging flagship - the 930 - to shame. Especially the G4.
    We'll (well, you'll) have to wait for a true 2015 flagship from Microsoft to see what they did since Nokia left in the camera department.

    I do agree on your last comment though. Nokia is life, Nokia is love ;D
    And yes, they do have to make a comeback as soon as possible otherwise they'll not make one at all. All the signs point towards it. How will it be made? No idea. But I could see Nokia producing a flagship-reference device for example (kinda like the Surface is for Microsoft in the tablet department) to showcase all the awesome tech they have available for licensing.

    Which leads me to yesterday's news: Nokia and LG just signed a licensing agreement whereas LG will be licensing a bunch of mobile tech from Nokia Technologies. Well...I am assuming amongst that will be imaging tech. Which means, if that's correct, the imaging tech on Lumias will be available on LG Android phones. And given that the G4 has already the best smartphone camera in 2015...well, I guess even you can see the jump they'll give by accessing Nokia's imaging tech. And how that might spell trouble not only for Microsoft...but for Samsung itself.
    06-16-2015 09:50 PM
  16. adkrish22290's Avatar
    I rather jump in a septic tank and commit suicide than buy a LAGdroid phone.

    And I don't care much about Nokia, I'm primarily a MS loyalist and an ardent fan of the WP OS.
    08-01-2015 01:38 AM
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