09-14-2017 10:56 PM
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  1. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Hey, when it works and people want it..
    I got nothing against Apple. They've re-invented the smartphone and their marketing is the best, no doubt. But it doesn't change the fact they're proprietary and very closed off. Most people don't care about stuff like that but we're not most people.
    TgeekB, libra89 and raycpl like this.
    08-07-2017 10:02 PM
  2. TgeekB's Avatar
    I got nothing against Apple. They've re-invented the smartphone and their marketing is the best, no doubt. But it doesn't change the fact they're proprietary and very closed off. Most people don't care about stuff like that but we're not most people.
    Agreed. I have certainly changed my expectations though and now find that closed off ecosystem to be quite beneficial. The smoothness and efficiency of eliminating garbage from your ecosystem can reap benefits. It is leaps and bounds above, well, I won't say it but you know what I mean. That's what makes them so popular, I believe. I certainly understand some people want more though and that's where the other OS's come in. Good to have variety!
    fatclue_98, aximtreo and libra89 like this.
    08-08-2017 04:46 PM
  3. nasznjoka's Avatar
    Not when it's the truth. Apple is very proprietary, right down to their connectors, and Google can't help but being an ad-infested bot. It's how they make their coin. God bless capitalism.
    So microsoft has bing for search just like google and has ads just like google so tell me whats the difference btn the two if not their level of success?? All other strategies will be the same in order to have a successful ad business you ve got to keep up with your users... and many dont know or ignore this. Google does not sell your data bse thats what keep them in business, they just use your data for selling ads... Apple is not even in that business at all and that walled garden some says is just their way of having a really simple OS for everyone
    08-09-2017 01:15 AM
  4. fatclue_98's Avatar
    So microsoft has bing for search just like google and has ads just like google so tell me whats the difference btn the two if not their level of success?? All other strategies will be the same in order to have a successful ad business you ve got to keep up with your users... and many dont know or ignore this. Google does not sell your data bse thats what keep them in business, they just use your data for selling ads... Apple is not even in that business at all and that walled garden some says is just their way of having a really simple OS for everyone
    I walk into a McDonald's and a notification pops up saying Android Pay is accepted here. I walk into a Walgreens and I get a notification about my Balance Rewards or a sale going on. This goes on all day long.

    I don't need to be stalked by my phone, I'm happily married. None of my iPhones ever did this neither have any of my Windows phones - past or present.
    RumoredNow and aximtreo like this.
    08-09-2017 08:22 AM
  5. TgeekB's Avatar
    I walk into a McDonald's and a notification pops up saying Android Pay is accepted here. I walk into a Walgreens and I get a notification about my Balance Rewards or a sale going on. This goes on all day long.

    I don't need to be stalked by my phone, I'm happily married. None of my iPhones ever did this neither have any of my Windows phones - past or present.
    Apple will be leading AR real soon. That's the future of notifications and information sharing.
    All good points though. Each ecosystem has its own advantages and disadvantages.
    fatclue_98 likes this.
    08-09-2017 10:32 AM
  6. xandros9's Avatar
    I walk into a McDonald's and a notification pops up saying Android Pay is accepted here. I walk into a Walgreens and I get a notification about my Balance Rewards or a sale going on. This goes on all day long.

    I don't need to be stalked by my phone, I'm happily married. None of my iPhones ever did this neither have any of my Windows phones - past or present.
    Turn it off. Windows Phone never did it because they just didn't have any relevant features. As for the iPhone, it's a different set of compromise and default settings you will deal with.

    Granted, Google is taking advantage of location, Pay and Assistant to promote their own ends and glean data but there's still stuff that can be done. Heck, get rid of or disable Pay if you don't want anything related to it.
    libra89 likes this.
    08-09-2017 03:43 PM
  7. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Turn it off. Windows Phone never did it because they just didn't have any relevant features. As for the iPhone, it's a different set of compromise and default settings you will deal with.

    Granted, Google is taking advantage of location, Pay and Assistant to promote their own ends and glean data but there's still stuff that can be done. Heck, get rid of or disable Pay if you don't want anything related to it.

    Why should I have to be the one who disables it? Why should I have to disable a mobile payment system that comes with the phone because of an intrusive advertising company? It's Android Pay not Google Pay.

    I'm buying a phone, not a shopping assistant. If Google wants to subsidize the phone along with the cellular service that's fine, but I'm not paying good money to have my hardware resources taxed and my data allotment pinched by the Billboard Kings just for snits and giggles.
    RumoredNow likes this.
    08-09-2017 06:07 PM
  8. TgeekB's Avatar
    Why should I have to be the one who disables it? Why should I have to disable a mobile payment system that comes with the phone because of an intrusive advertising company? It's Android Pay not Google Pay.

    I'm buying a phone, not a shopping assistant. If Google wants to subsidize the phone along with the cellular service that's fine, but I'm not paying good money to have my hardware resources taxed and my data allotment pinched by the Billboard Kings just for snits and giggles.
    Hey my friend, Android is all about customization. You either like playing around with it constantly or you don't.
    fatclue_98 and Wbutchart1 like this.
    08-09-2017 06:17 PM
  9. RumoredNow's Avatar
    Hey my friend, Android is all about customization. You either like playing around with it constantly or you don't.
    No, @fatclue_98 has a very good point. Customization is NOT what he was talking about. I'm sure you know that and I'm reading your post as sarcastic even without the emoji.

    However, the consumer who has paid money shouldn't have to jump through so many hoops to calm that stuff down. It gets way over the top and does feel like harassment at times. Sure some people like it and find it helpful. I bet more find it irritating at best.

    For those that do like the "suggestions", let them dig around finding out how to turn it on. If it's viewed as an intrusion why should people have to make up their minds to just go along with it? If you had to get hit in the head with a rubber novelty hammer every time you entered a store, how many would laugh each visit and how many would shop elsewhere?

    This is the curse of the duopoly and why it should die. You either have to overpay for each and every thing because from moment one, Apple has to have everything changed from a universal standard to proprietary and they set the tone of "charge all the market will bear and not one cent less" - OR - you have to cede all your privacy rights and agree to become a sponge for advertising oversaturation.

    Neither of these alternatives appeal to me. Windows Phone no longer holds my interest and I'm parked on Android because I'll be damned if each and every time I look at my tech I feel like I've been shaken down by goons and ripped off. And I'm not long for Android either because I'm just waiting for Sailfish official to drop for my Xperia X.

    The longer people convince themselves and others that Apple and Android are the only viable choices, the longer it will remain that way and it is a disservice we do to ourselves. Perpetuating the duopoly shouldn't be a defensible position if you are a rational being. The system is glaringly flawed and needs to be broken so something new can emerge.
    08-09-2017 07:38 PM
  10. TgeekB's Avatar
    No, @fatclue_98 has a very good point. Customization is NOT what he was talking about. I'm sure you know that and I'm reading your post as sarcastic even without the emoji.

    However, the consumer who has paid money shouldn't have to jump through so many hoops to calm that stuff down. It gets way over the top and does feel like harassment at times. Sure some people like it and find it helpful. I bet more find it irritating at best.

    For those that do like the "suggestions", let them dig around finding out how to turn it on. If it's viewed as an intrusion why should people have to make up their minds to just go along with it? If you had to get hit in the head with a rubber novelty hammer every time you entered a store, how many would laugh each visit and how many would shop elsewhere?

    This is the curse of the duopoly and why it should die. You either have to overpay for each and every thing because from moment one, Apple has to have everything changed from a universal standard to proprietary and they set the tone of "charge all the market will bear and not one cent less" - OR - you have to cede all your privacy rights and agree to become a sponge for advertising oversaturation.

    Neither of these alternatives appeal to me. Windows Phone no longer holds my interest and I'm parked on Android because I'll be damned if each and every time I look at my tech I feel like I've been shaken down by goons and ripped off. And I'm not long for Android either because I'm just waiting for Sailfish official to drop for my Xperia X.

    The longer people convince themselves and others that Apple and Android are the only viable choices, the longer it will remain that way and it is a disservice we do to ourselves. Perpetuating the duopoly shouldn't be a defensible position if you are a rational being. The system is glaringly flawed and needs to be broken so something new can emerge.
    First of all, my point was everyone knows how Android is. It is not hiding anything. I assume many people enjoy it because they sell like hot cakes, mostly because there are inexpensive models due to being an open system. With that open system comes all those things you and others hate about it. No one is forced to use it.

    Second, while Apple is very proprietary, it creates a simple system without many of Androids flaws. I used to hate it, but have decided to just relax and enjoy what it brings. Not for everyone but working for me at the moment.

    Third, I completely agree a duopoly is not the best, but who's to blame? Not the consumers. Blackberry got cocky and sat on their hands while they got passed by. MS, I have no clue. They do things just to do them then change their minds every 6 months. Sailfish? I do wish you the very best with that but I don't see it as ever getting off the ground. Might be fun to play around with though.

    So what's the answer? To me it's pick the one you hate the least and don't stress out over it. Life is too short!
    libra89 likes this.
    08-09-2017 07:51 PM
  11. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Hey my friend, Android is all about customization. You either like playing around with it constantly or you don't.
    The problem is that whether you like it or not, you still have to fiddle with it regardless. That's not customization, that's a cluftersuck. We abhor workarounds on Windows but excuse this on Android.

    You're right, life is too short to be all bent out of shape over this, but let's call a spade a spade.

    Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk
    RumoredNow likes this.
    08-09-2017 09:11 PM
  12. TgeekB's Avatar
    The problem is that whether you like it or not, you still have to fiddle with it regardless. That's not customization, that's a cluftersuck. We abhor workarounds on Windows but excuse this on Android.

    You're right, life is too short to be all bent out of shape over this, but let's call a spade a spade.

    Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk
    Maybe open source would have been a better description. I know one thing it for sure is, not in my hands! 🤣
    08-09-2017 09:13 PM
  13. WAQASKHALID88's Avatar
    hi
    i love windows mobile so i think if i have these thing in mobile then i am more then satisfy with my mobile
    1. restart option directly form screen
    2. app so we can set glance screen for different notification and detail notification for more then 1 app
    3. volume increase or decrease from screen when playing video in app
    4. increase or decrease of volume from lock screen when playing music
    5. separate notification sound bar so increase or decrease because volume some time you need set ring high or some time notification high or low or off with out changing ringer volume
    6. some kind of app by which we can use android app in windows 10 mobile and fill the gap because there are several app which make windows left behind or you can only count popular app not available on windows 10
    7. set lock screen other then pin code
    8. app which can lock the apps so you can,t open app with out code for example i tried several in store even if you lock your photos it only lock from the start screen but you can still access it some time you have private thing you don't want anyone to enter in there
    9. no compatible app in set default video call ( i have Skype latest version from store install ) so some app by which we can use video calling feature directly from phone
    10. battery app for real time use because all app in store not work real time
    08-10-2017 06:07 AM
  14. Kimmo Toivanen's Avatar
    Why should I have to be the one who disables it?
    Option one: Notifications are off by default. Users must enable the notifications they want.
    Problems: How do users know what to enable? How do users know what could be possible? Why I'm not getting discount codes like others? Can I pay with my phone here? Why am I left out of the "inner ring"?

    Option two: Notifications are on by default. Users must disable the notifications they don't want.
    Problems: Stream of notifications until unnecessary ones are turned off.

    As a user I would pick #2 . As a developer I would pick #2 . If I was in management, I would pick #2 .
    Turning off things you do know is easier than turning on things you don't know.

    ---

    In future, AI will know you better, and offer only stuff you might be interested in and haven't responded previously with annoyed or sarcastic tone... The learning process though -
    nasznjoka and aximtreo like this.
    08-10-2017 10:23 AM
  15. RumoredNow's Avatar
    First of all, my point was everyone knows how Android is. It is not hiding anything. I assume many people enjoy it because they sell like hot cakes, mostly because there are inexpensive models due to being an open system. With that open system comes all those things you and others hate about it. No one is forced to use it.

    Second, while Apple is very proprietary, it creates a simple system without many of Androids flaws. I used to hate it, but have decided to just relax and enjoy what it brings. Not for everyone but working for me at the moment.

    Third, I completely agree a duopoly is not the best, but who's to blame? Not the consumers. Blackberry got cocky and sat on their hands while they got passed by. MS, I have no clue. They do things just to do them then change their minds every 6 months. Sailfish? I do wish you the very best with that but I don't see it as ever getting off the ground. Might be fun to play around with though.

    So what's the answer? To me it's pick the one you hate the least and don't stress out over it. Life is too short!
    Towards the first point: "...I assume many people enjoy it because they sell like hot cakes... mostly because there are inexpensive models..." Might lack of visible alternatives be a factor?

    Towards your second point... Good on you that you have that much acceptance... and disposable cash.

    Let's combine your third point and your summation as this is the only portion that actually addresses what I stated and that which you quoted.

    Remember I wasn't asking to have someone show me why they think Apple or Android is palatable. I'm well aware of the reasons why most consumers choose either or both. I don't live in a bubble. I was decrying the lack of alternatives. The carriers and tech press have long shunned anything that doesn't conform to the model they all make money off of. Have you read the articles regarding recently emergent mobile operating systems such as Ubuntu Touch, FirefoxOS and SailfishOS? They all read the same way: interesting, but they don't support InstaSnapTwitFace so you won't like it. How many carrier stores have even tried to promote a 3rd or 4th choice in the last five years? Disregard what the corporate buying policy is. I mean on the front lines where most consumers do their research, the local carrier (or big box) store. If you don't ask for the latest iThing or Galaxy Whathaveyou the staff quickly steers you that way. Try and talk about an alternative and it is immediately apparent that the "expert" rep is uninformed and uninterested in becoming informed. How can they recommend that which they know and care nothing about?

    So your summation looks something like this when pared down:
    "Third, I completely agree a duopoly is not the best, but who's to blame? Not the consumers... So what's the answer? To me it's pick the one you hate the least.."

    The answer to complacency with the status quo is become more complacent? And it IS the consumers who are to blame. People vote with their money in these situations. It's why I can no longer support Windows Phone. Too many times even the die-hards have shown a lack of willingness to invest in the ecosystem in sufficient numbers on an annual basis to keep the system afloat. I.E.: Buy an App Day, Get NuAns Neo out of Japan, Wharton Brooks and the Cerulean Moment.

    You also stated: "...Sailfish? I do wish you the very best with that but I don't see it as ever getting off the ground..." I'm glad it's not up to you, but also saddened when I realize that most think as you do. It's an uphill battle to be sure. Shrugging your shoulders and walking away from the fight you acknowledge needs to be waged does nothing but contribute to the problem.

    Enjoy your complacency, but don't insist I adopt it too.
    fatclue_98 and aximtreo like this.
    08-10-2017 12:43 PM
  16. tgp's Avatar
    I was decrying the lack of alternatives.
    On the other hand, there are plenty of alternatives. Currently we have, or had, Windows Phone/Mobile, Sailfish, Tizen, BB OS, Ubuntu Touch, and probably others I missed. The problem is that they don't take off. Here's my opinion on why they flounder:

    I've brought this up before, but why does the 2nd place desktop OS vendor have less than 4% market share? It makes sense to settle down to the best one or two at the top. If there were more viable platforms, a company such as Facebook would need to provide an app for each one. Right now 2 apps will cover 99.5% of the market. Why would they want to produce 3, 4, 5, or 10 apps for the same coverage?

    The same concept applies to carriers and other vendors selling devices. Everyone is going to buy a smartphone anyway. What gain would they see by spreading it out? They're not going to get any more customers. I realize that there are arguments for having more options, but if having more was advantageous (to manufacturers and vendors) to having less, there would be more. Customers arguably would gain, but it's not enough of an advantage to us to override the downsides, so we're content to leave things as they spin out.

    My 2¢.
    libra89 and TgeekB like this.
    08-10-2017 01:30 PM
  17. fatclue_98's Avatar
    InstaSnapTwitFace
    You just gave me a standing 8-count with that one.
    RumoredNow and aximtreo like this.
    08-10-2017 01:48 PM
  18. fatclue_98's Avatar
    In future, AI will know you better, and offer only stuff you might be interested in and haven't responded previously with annoyed or sarcastic tone
    I would quote Katt Williams but I know what would happen. Do you seriously want any form of artificial intelligence (there's an oxymoron if there ever was one) prying into your past in an effort to help you? Are you sure that machine is looking out for your best interest or Cyberdyne System's? Check your response, Skynet is watching.
    RumoredNow and aximtreo like this.
    08-10-2017 01:56 PM
  19. libra89's Avatar
    Option one: Notifications are off by default. Users must enable the notifications they want.
    Problems: How do users know what to enable? How do users know what could be possible? Why I'm not getting discount codes like others? Can I pay with my phone here? Why am I left out of the "inner ring"?

    Option two: Notifications are on by default. Users must disable the notifications they don't want.
    Problems: Stream of notifications until unnecessary ones are turned off.

    As a user I would pick #2 . As a developer I would pick #2 . If I was in management, I would pick #2 .
    Turning off things you do know is easier than turning on things you don't know.

    ---

    In future, AI will know you better, and offer only stuff you might be interested in and haven't responded previously with annoyed or sarcastic tone... The learning process though -
    As someone who has a phone of each currently (iOS, Android, Windows Phone) and have used them as phones, I strongly prefer the way iOS does it when you open the app for the first time. I hate that with Android, I have to dig to find what stuff to change. Having true notification control in a centered place is preferred.

    For your options, I would take 1 but with how iOS does it.
    08-10-2017 03:29 PM
  20. TgeekB's Avatar
    Towards the first point: "...I assume many people enjoy it because they sell like hot cakes... mostly because there are inexpensive models..." Might lack of visible alternatives be a factor?

    Towards your second point... Good on you that you have that much acceptance... and disposable cash.

    Let's combine your third point and your summation as this is the only portion that actually addresses what I stated and that which you quoted.

    Remember I wasn't asking to have someone show me why they think Apple or Android is palatable. I'm well aware of the reasons why most consumers choose either or both. I don't live in a bubble. I was decrying the lack of alternatives. The carriers and tech press have long shunned anything that doesn't conform to the model they all make money off of. Have you read the articles regarding recently emergent mobile operating systems such as Ubuntu Touch, FirefoxOS and SailfishOS? They all read the same way: interesting, but they don't support InstaSnapTwitFace so you won't like it. How many carrier stores have even tried to promote a 3rd or 4th choice in the last five years? Disregard what the corporate buying policy is. I mean on the front lines where most consumers do their research, the local carrier (or big box) store. If you don't ask for the latest iThing or Galaxy Whathaveyou the staff quickly steers you that way. Try and talk about an alternative and it is immediately apparent that the "expert" rep is uninformed and uninterested in becoming informed. How can they recommend that which they know and care nothing about?

    So your summation looks something like this when pared down:
    "Third, I completely agree a duopoly is not the best, but who's to blame? Not the consumers... So what's the answer? To me it's pick the one you hate the least.."

    The answer to complacency with the status quo is become more complacent? And it IS the consumers who are to blame. People vote with their money in these situations. It's why I can no longer support Windows Phone. Too many times even the die-hards have shown a lack of willingness to invest in the ecosystem in sufficient numbers on an annual basis to keep the system afloat. I.E.: Buy an App Day, Get NuAns Neo out of Japan, Wharton Brooks and the Cerulean Moment.

    You also stated: "...Sailfish? I do wish you the very best with that but I don't see it as ever getting off the ground..." I'm glad it's not up to you, but also saddened when I realize that most think as you do. It's an uphill battle to be sure. Shrugging your shoulders and walking away from the fight you acknowledge needs to be waged does nothing but contribute to the problem.

    Enjoy your complacency, but don't insist I adopt it too.
    So you blame consumers because you want it and they don't? Why should they put their hard earned money down on something that doesn't give them satisfaction? If any of those alternatives are worth a damned, people will come. Blackberry owned the smartphone market until the 2 current alternatives came along and provided more and look what happened.
    I'm not shrugging my shoulders about anything. This is not world hunger or racial inequality, it is a smartphone. It's not a fight because it holds little value. I'm more worried about the two idiots slinging nuclear jabs at each other and disregarding human lives. That's something to fight for.
    libra89, tgp, fatclue_98 and 1 others like this.
    08-10-2017 04:14 PM
  21. fatclue_98's Avatar
    So you blame consumers because you want it and they don't? Why should they put their hard earned money down on something that doesn't give them satisfaction? If any of those alternatives are worth a damned, people will come. Blackberry owned the smartphone market until the 2 current alternatives came along and provided more and look what happened.
    I'm not shrugging my shoulders about anything. This is not world hunger or racial inequality, it is a smartphone. It's not a fight because it holds little value. I'm more worried about the two idiots slinging nuclear jabs at each other and disregarding human lives. That's something to fight for.
    Are you referring to Kim Jong Un and Wun Dum Fuk?

    Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk
    aximtreo likes this.
    08-10-2017 06:03 PM
  22. TgeekB's Avatar
    Are you referring to Kim Jong Un and Wun Dum Fuk?

    Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk
    Yes, I believe those the two _________ I am referring to.
    aximtreo likes this.
    08-10-2017 06:05 PM
  23. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Yes, I believe those the two _________ I am referring to.
    Just to be sure, this one?




    Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk
    08-10-2017 06:07 PM
  24. TgeekB's Avatar
    Just to be sure, this one?

    http://i.imgur.com/aFRL9Pw.jpg


    Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk
    Yes, the visual confirms it. I am absolutely sure now. 🤣
    aximtreo, libra89 and xandros9 like this.
    08-10-2017 06:08 PM
  25. aximtreo's Avatar
    ROFLMAO

    Now that's 72 year old intelligence. Nothing artificial about ROFLMAO!!!!!
    TgeekB and Guytronic like this.
    08-10-2017 06:42 PM
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