10-29-2017 09:18 AM
42 12
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  1. BajanSaint69's Avatar
    Came across this article today and it pretty much sums up what I think is going on here...

    "Saying that Windows 10 Mobile will no longer be developed only means that Microsoft has determined that it is time to consolidate its mobile OS into its desktop OS."

    https://www.pcmag.com/commentary/356...ones-not-quite
    Newfangled and DOGC_Kyle like this.
    10-15-2017 12:34 PM
  2. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Unless they can find a way to make "every program ever written" to be touch-friendly, this too shall fail. BlackBerry must have some kind of iron-clad grip on trackpads because it doesn't seem as if anyone else uses them for phone navigation. I can't see Windows 10 being useful on a 7" (or smaller) display. I've tried some of the 8" tablets when they were on W8 and were impossibly difficult to use. Slider bars and other buttons are simply too small and I don't see a stylus being the answer.
    10-15-2017 08:09 PM
  3. DOGC_Kyle's Avatar
    Unless they can find a way to make "every program ever written" to be touch-friendly, this too shall fail. BlackBerry must have some kind of iron-clad grip on trackpads because it doesn't seem as if anyone else uses them for phone navigation. I can't see Windows 10 being useful on a 7" (or smaller) display. I've tried some of the 8" tablets when they were on W8 and were impossibly difficult to use. Slider bars and other buttons are simply too small and I don't see a stylus being the answer.
    Ideally the idea of Win32 on ARM will catch on, and companies will make their desktop apps catered to it, if not going full UWP app.
    I could totally see desktop apps already in the store, such as Spotify, Arduino, making their desktop apps more touch-friendly and better scaling.
    A lot of desktop apps already adjust for touch navigation. Chrome (I think), Office (although that is a MS product), Adobe apps, Plex, Steam has big-picture. That covers a lot of people's most commonly used desktop apps.


    Even still, the convenience of having a pocketable device might outweigh the inconvenience of poor usability for some people.
    Not to mention you can still plug in an external screen, mouse, or as you said, a stylus, and it's perfectly usable in that case.

    They also DO have an on-screen touchpad already. I think they added it in the Creators Update. Could use more polish, but it still gives you a usable cursor without external devices.
    10-16-2017 01:00 AM
  4. PFSP's Avatar
    There is so much wrong with that article, I hardly know where to begin.

    1. It assumes everyone wants to carry a full PC around in a phone form factor. Sure some people do, but there is large part of the consumer base that wants a phone to be a texting/facebooking/tweeting/instagrammiing/photo taking/etc device and have no real interest in carrying a PC in their pocket.

    2. It assumes that even if I wanted a PC in my pocket - I would want to pay $1,200 for it.

    3. It assumes that even if I wanted both 1 and 2, that would trust Microsoft to stick with and maintain the platform for more than 2 years.

    4. It assumes that Microsoft will keep partner hardware manufactures in the loop so that a multitude of devices can be built for it and maintained.


    Look I have no doubt that there will be windows on ARM devices - but the viability of phone like devices being part of them is very slim at this point.


    I have a windows phone as my only phone right now - I love the interface and whish it would continue to be viable. But, as much as I like the pc in my pocket - I still use laptops and probably still will into the future. So I am not going to shell out 1 to 2 K for my "phone" Which means sadly I will probably be buying an android phone in the future.
    10-16-2017 10:29 AM
  5. BajanSaint69's Avatar
    in their current talk they are saying it won't be for everyone. I suspect something aimed at enterprise "road warriors"
    10-20-2017 04:53 PM
  6. L0n3N1nja's Avatar
    The people who want full windows on their phone is a small niche market of tech enthusiasts. People have spoken, they want apps.

    Windows tablets don't sell well unless they are a 2 in 1, Windows phone was a tough sell without the apps a few years ago, and that gap has grown considerably.

    Until Microsoft gets developers to produce the needed touch apps they won't succeed. Apps are the reason black berry switched to Android.
    10-21-2017 12:01 AM
  7. fatclue_98's Avatar
    The people who want full windows on their phone is a small niche market of tech enthusiasts. People have spoken, they want apps.

    Windows tablets don't sell well unless they are a 2 in 1, Windows phone was a tough sell without the apps a few years ago, and that gap has grown considerably.

    Until Microsoft gets developers to produce the needed touch apps they won't succeed. Apps are the reason black berry switched to Android.
    Painful, but all true nonetheless.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-21-2017 12:23 AM
  8. raycpl's Avatar
    You'll never know what people wants if you don't create and market it wholeheartedly... . just see what SSG did with their first Note... I mean, who wanted a ginormous behemoth like that, right??

    ... !
    RumoredNow likes this.
    10-21-2017 02:42 AM
  9. TgeekB's Avatar
    I agree with most everyone above.
    I just don’t see it working except for a small niche of diehards who will put up with the negatives and pay a high price for something that could be abandoned a couple years later.
    I’m not one of those people.
    10-21-2017 08:40 AM
  10. mtf1380's Avatar
    I see many uses for this type of device, with the proper capabilities and accessories:

    - Police communications and Video recording.

    - Corporate meetings: where any attendant is able to project their contribution to a huge monitor at the head of a table.

    - Sale meeting: where a salesperson is able to project their PowerPoint presentation to a huge monitor at the head of a table (no set-up time).

    - Voice-activated on-screen anchor points (either numeric or alphabetical) that would allow you to navigate by voice command, ie; voice-command: goto number 1... which then would open a particular drop down menu, which in turn would have all its content labeled - ie; 1.1 = Settings, and so on.

    - Bluetooth Accessories: mouse; keyboard; speakers; mointor; headset; smartglasses; IoT; remote camera; drone; etc. (ALL of which would add to the bottom line, BTW)

    - Oh! and you could use it as a phone:)
    fatclue_98 likes this.
    10-21-2017 09:55 AM
  11. theefman's Avatar
    Quote from the article: "He shoves the phone into the docking station". And when its not docked and being a modern smartphone is where it all falls down - again. Pointless article.

    Sent from mTalk
    10-21-2017 11:11 AM
  12. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Nobody ever said this has to be a primary device.
    10-21-2017 04:53 PM
  13. TgeekB's Avatar
    Nobody ever said this has to be a primary device.
    If I’m going to pay top dollar you can be damned sure it will be my primary device!
    Boutsen likes this.
    10-21-2017 05:02 PM
  14. fatclue_98's Avatar
    If I’m going to pay top dollar you can be damned sure it will be my primary device!
    The more expensive device is usually not the primary. At least, not up until now with thousand dollar iPhones and Galaxys. iPads have traditionally been more expensive than iPhones and Surface Pros more expensive than anything.
    10-21-2017 05:26 PM
  15. TgeekB's Avatar
    The more expensive device is usually not the primary. At least, not up until now with thousand dollar iPhones and Galaxys. iPads have traditionally been more expensive than iPhones and Surface Pros more expensive than anything.
    Very true, up until now. I think with true mobile devices doing more and more, that’s changing. For instance, people now rely on their iPhones much more than their iPads.
    At least that’s what I think.
    Boutsen likes this.
    10-21-2017 05:29 PM
  16. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Very true, up until now. I think with true mobile devices doing more and more, that’s changing. For instance, people now rely on their iPhones much more than their iPads.
    At least that’s what I think.
    Before the 6+ it was understandable to use both. Would you use an SE for everything today? Even the 4.7 iPhone is pushing it when it comes to productivity tasks. I mean, we are talking about productivity aren't we? That's the idea behind large screen gadgets right?
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-21-2017 06:01 PM
  17. TgeekB's Avatar
    Before the 6+ it was understandable to use both. Would you use an SE for everything today? Even the 4.7 iPhone is pushing it when it comes to productivity tasks. I mean, we are talking about productivity aren't we? That's the idea behind large screen gadgets right?
    The SE is a niche product for people that just want a small phone and nothing else.
    Productivity? Define that for me. It means different things to different people but, yes, larger screen devices have become the norm because you can use them for more things. But they must be easily carried and simple to use. The average person doesn’t want to dock it or do advanced Excel work on it.
    It’s hard to guess where we are going with this technology and someone will eventually come up with something different that will change the course. I just don’t think it will be MS. They’ve screwed up too many times.
    Laura Knotek, theefman and Boutsen like this.
    10-21-2017 06:08 PM
  18. fatclue_98's Avatar
    The SE is a niche product for people that just want a small phone and nothing else.
    Productivity? Define that for me. It means different things to different people but, yes, larger screen devices have become the norm because you can use them for more things. But they must be easily carried and simple to use. The average person doesn’t want to dock it or do advanced Excel work on it.
    It’s hard to guess where we are going with this technology and someone will eventually come up with something different that will change the course. I just don’t think it will be MS. They’ve screwed up too many times.
    The SE is the same size screen as the largest iPhone prior to the 6. Are you calling every iPhone before the 6 a niche device? It wasn't that long ago.

    That aside, productivity refers to tasks that have been traditionally done on a desktop. Spreadsheets, word processing, graphics editing, etc. In other words, things you wouldn't want to do on a smartphone unless you really had to.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-21-2017 06:30 PM
  19. TgeekB's Avatar
    The SE is the same size screen as the largest iPhone prior to the 6. Are you calling every iPhone before the 6 a niche device? It wasn't that long ago.

    That aside, productivity refers to tasks that have been traditionally done on a desktop. Spreadsheets, word processing, graphics editing, etc. In other words, things you wouldn't want to do on a smartphone unless you really had to.
    The iPhone 6 was released in 2014 I believe, which in technology years it like 50 years ago. I’m talking about today.

    I hear people throw the productivity word around phone forums all the time. Your definition is a business related one, but not what everyone means. Being productive in our daily lives could mean being connected to the people closest to us, having information at our fingertips or being able to purchase anything we want while sitting on a beach. Or talking with friends on Windows central.
    Boutsen likes this.
    10-21-2017 06:40 PM
  20. fatclue_98's Avatar
    The iPhone 6 was released in 2014 I believe, which in technology years it like 50 years ago. I’m talking about today.

    I hear people throw the productivity word around phone forums all the time. Your definition is a business related one, but not what everyone means. Being productive in our daily lives could mean being connected to the people closest to us, having information at our fingertips or being able to purchase anything we want while sitting on a beach. Or talking with friends on Windows central.
    My definition of productivity is things you wouldn't want to do on a smartphone.

    Fast forward to 10/21/2017, would you feel comfortable doing spreadsheets (home budget is acceptable), compose a long email to your grandmother that you haven't seen in years or add some cool effects to the 75 pictures from your daughter's 8th birthday? All this on an iPhone 8 (not the plus).

    No business-related items there.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-21-2017 08:48 PM
  21. TgeekB's Avatar
    My definition of productivity is things you wouldn't want to do on a smartphone.

    Fast forward to 10/21/2017, would you feel comfortable doing spreadsheets (home budget is acceptable), compose a long email to your grandmother that you haven't seen in years or add some cool effects to the 75 pictures from your daughter's 8th birthday? All this on an iPhone 8 (not the plus).

    No business-related items there.
    I would do all those on my laptop. To be honest, my iPad is just for couch surfing. I could do a lot more with it, but I don’t.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-21-2017 08:55 PM
  22. fatclue_98's Avatar
    I would do all those on my laptop. To be honest, my iPad is just for couch surfing. I could do a lot more with it, but I don’t.
    That's precisely my point. Many of us would be interested in a top-rung mobile PC but not as a primary device whether or not it has telephony. It'd be a big plus to have in the event one does some traveling and likes to pack light.

    Continuum is what we have right now but it's not perfect and it's certainly not for everyone. Just because you may not find a use for any of this doesn't mean there isn't a market for it. "You" doesn't mean you in particular, I'm generalizing. I read a lot of comments here and on other sites where posters give off the impression that if their iPhone or Android can't do something then it must not be important or needed.
    Laura Knotek and mtf1380 like this.
    10-21-2017 09:11 PM
  23. Bigsteelguy's Avatar
    Real Windows 10 mobile on Android, Launcher 10 gives Avid Windows mobile fans a true live tile experience with great additional features.
    10-22-2017 12:06 PM
  24. a5cent's Avatar
    Came across this article today and it pretty much sums up what I think is going on here...

    "Saying that Windows 10 Mobile will no longer be developed only means that Microsoft has determined that it is time to consolidate its mobile OS into its desktop OS."

    https://www.pcmag.com/commentary/356...ones-not-quite
    Nah, it's pretty much BS. Like most tech writers, he has so little understanding of software he's just not able to write about it accurately.

    W10 and W10M mobile are already a CONSOLIDATED OS. MS has been on a path towards consolidation since Vista and they concluded that journey with W10.

    Besides the launcher (a.k.a CShell, which is technically not part of the OS), the only difference between W10M and W10 are omissions. Every component (again, except CShell) which W10M doesn't omit is identical to that which is contained in W10. Drivers of course also differ, but they differ whenever hardware does (not to mention that drivers also aren't part of the OS).

    Of course, that doesn't mean W10 and W10M are the EXACT same things. To be actually the same thing W10M wouldn't be allowed to omit anything.

    This is the technically accurate way to understand the situation:

    W10M can't be discontinued! MS can stop using the name, and stop offering W10M as a separate package, but actually scrapping the technology would mean gutting W10 itself, because like I said, with the exception of CShell, nothing in W10M is unique to itself. Discontinuing W10M is literally the same as discontinuing parts of W10.

    That is why W10M kept receiving updates all this time, and why W10M will technically continue to receive updates long after the support period for the last windows phone is officially ended. MS can't update one without updating to other. The only way for this to change is if MS stops maintaining the ability to install a Win32 free version of Windows. That's all W10M is. While that's possible, it's highly unlikely MS would do that (for reasons I'll skip here).
    Last edited by a5cent; 10-25-2017 at 10:52 AM.
    Mach_E and fatclue_98 like this.
    10-25-2017 10:19 AM
  25. BajanSaint69's Avatar
    I understand what you are saying.... I don't think we disagree. There is no longer a need for mobile to have its own identity.
    10-25-2017 10:40 AM
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