03-18-2008 07:36 PM
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  1. bubbatex's Avatar
    Scott - All true - but it is more information than we had before. I would bet that Sprint will have this phone. However, when is a big question. The PDA market is hot and both VZW and Sprint realize they have to keep up with AT&T now that the iFun is out and hot. I believe we will see more choices (and quicker intros) at Sprint. I have been there for years myself and I ain't leaving. I think it is Mogul or 8830 for me as my Q is getting very old - OK, "tired". I am the one getting old.
    07-19-2007 09:00 PM
  2. Daniel Rubino's Avatar
    Evidence points to a couple of things for Sprint:

    - Treo 800w with 320x320
    - That Treo or another may have WiMax
    - Vogue is probably heading to only Verizon

    The first to options are both enticing for myself, maybe not others.
    07-19-2007 09:04 PM
  3. bubbatex's Avatar
    - Vogue is probably heading to only Verizon
    Darn it - as soon as I typed that "I bet", I just knew you would see this and blow that out of the water! I should clear all of these opinions with you first! LOL ;)

    (PS - That Mogul is luring me.... I get a few hours of hands on tomorrow with a friends. We'll see....)
    07-19-2007 09:39 PM
  4. nsxprime's Avatar
    I can see how the Treo would be a better fit to many....but I personally would have a very hard time going back to Palm OS...at least until it gets an update. Just for the fact of not being able to truly MultiTask. This has become my daily life of using my phone. i.e. have GPS going, playing MP3 music, while forwarding on an email after I opened and edited the spreadsheet in ClearVue Spreadsheet, and all the while still know that my GPS is keeping track of where my fellow DM is driving.
    Remember that PalmOS can do almost everything that you just mentioned. Push email and music are both done in the background (multitasking) of spreadsheet editing or BT GPS.

    Why did they cripple the Mogul's RAM? What's the point of having a true, multitasking OS if you can't stand to have more than 2 programs open because you run out of memory?

    Once they fix the BT bug on the Mogul, I'll be getting one. I had to return my first one because BT headsets can't be used with the phone yet.
    07-19-2007 10:15 PM
  5. Daniel Rubino's Avatar
    Darn it - as soon as I typed that "I bet", I just knew you would see this and blow that out of the water! I should clear all of these opinions with you first! LOL ;)

    (PS - That Mogul is luring me.... I get a few hours of hands on tomorrow with a friends. We'll see....)
    lol, yeah the BoyGeniusReports Vogue is for Verizon and Sprint passed, at least that was that last I heard.

    Give the Mogul a shot, you have 30 days...why not? Maybe it'll work out!

    Personally? I'm holding for the 800w and a Foleo.

    If the 800w has WiMax...my god, that will be an amazing device. :thumbsup:
    07-19-2007 11:52 PM
  6. HobbesIsReal#WP's Avatar
    Remember that PalmOS can do almost everything that you just mentioned. Push email and music are both done in the background (multitasking) of spreadsheet editing or BT GPS.

    Why did they cripple the Mogul's RAM? What's the point of having a true, multitasking OS if you can't stand to have more than 2 programs open because you run out of memory?

    Once they fix the BT bug on the Mogul, I'll be getting one. I had to return my first one because BT headsets can't be used with the phone yet.
    By nearly all reports at PDAphone home and PCGeeks, the Jabra 8010 (along with the Sony DS970, Cardo Scala 500, jabra jx 10, and the moto h5 mini) is working flawlessly with the 6800 (plus you get to use it as a BT stereo headset too!). It is the same with a lot new releases concerning BT. You find the BT headset(s) that works with the phone until they fix the BT to work with all headsets.

    I have 22 mb of free memory which gives me a fair amount of room for multitasking. Just to make sure I understand, Palm OS can keep running my GPS program running in the background keeping track of where we are while my email is downloading while while our corp webpage is refreshing while I viewing and editing a spreadsheet? These are the type of situations I find myself in while away from the office.

    I honestly always forget, can Palm handle 4 BT devices at once or not?

    This is also how I have tested the Mogul and yes it can do it with it's memory. There is little doubt that I have to watch the memory usage and may have close a program, but I would have to the same if I went with the 700wx. Believe me I am the first to say that they should have included 128 mb of memory, but it can certainly do a lot more than just two apps. The Mogul is going to carry me through to the end of next year or the beginning the next after WiMax has had a chance to establish a firm footprint.

    Here is an example of how I have my phone configured at the moment:

    Plugins installed and running at reset:
    • SBP Weather
    • SPB Page+
    • SPB Time
    • PocketBreeze
    • ContactBreeze
    • PocketOutlook (plugin for PocketInformant/FlexMail)
    • WisBar
    • TopKey
    • TapText
    • ....and whatever else I cannot remember

    After a soft reset I will have 21-22 mb free mem.

    Then I loaded and kept active:
    • FlexMail
    • Pocket Informant
    • Pocket Excel with a chart spreadsheet
    • PocketMusic (actively playing songs)
    • Messenger
    • MyCalculator Pro
    • Resco File Explorer
    • z2 R2PC Client (actively remote controling my work desktop)
    • Windows Live
    • ActiveSync
    • SplashID

    I still have 12 mb (actually 11.8 mb) of free memory.

    If I needed to browse a lot of graphic intensive websites, I would certainly have to close some programs to support the cache (I haven't tried moving the cache to my card yet). But it can do a respectable job with running many programs at once.
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 07-20-2007 at 02:58 AM.
    07-20-2007 12:04 AM
  7. jaak3's Avatar
    Remember that PalmOS can do almost everything that you just mentioned. Push email and music are both done in the background (multitasking) of spreadsheet editing or BT GPS
    PalmOS can't really multitask. That was my number one reason for getting a Mogul. It's like using DOS with a task-switcher and TSRs compared to a modern version of Windows.
    07-20-2007 08:01 AM
  8. nsxprime's Avatar
    PalmOS can't really multitask. That was my number one reason for getting a Mogul. It's like using DOS with a task-switcher and TSRs compared to a modern version of Windows.
    We know. That's why I spefically stated that PalmOS can play music and do push email in the background while running other apps.
    07-20-2007 09:31 AM
  9. HobbesIsReal#WP's Avatar
    For those that are interested in how much real estate the Mogul screen has, here are some screen shots of how I currently have my Mogul configured:
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 07-24-2007 at 10:39 PM.
    07-21-2007 05:03 AM
  10. nsxprime's Avatar
    Official Sprint forum about the known BT bugs: http://forums.buzzaboutwireless.com/...cending&page=1

    Nothing like releasing a phone that doesn't work as a phone.
    07-21-2007 09:16 AM
  11. HobbesIsReal#WP's Avatar
    This is the same thing we went thru with the 6600 when it first came out. But Sprint never took the 6600 seriosly. At least this hopefully seems to be a different story with the 6800. It is barely a month old and they are already released a minor ROM update (granted that it was only to fix the Store). People need to bring their individual issues to HTC and Sprints attention. Apparently Sprint is waiting on HTC according to the Man at The Buzz in contact with HTC and Sprint:

    After discussions, it will be a MR (Maintenance Release) needed to fix the root cause (as soon as HTC can provide it). So the device (hardware) does not appear to be defective, but something in the build that is causing this issue. I can only tell you that we are working on it. If you are concerned about your 30 day return policy, you have every right to go back to the 6700 until we have this resolved.

    I can't offically provide any dates, however, I will not let them drag it out.
    Everyone's feedback here has helped my case tremendously!

    I don't know if I am supposed to. But I work on the Care Side for Device Launches.
    And as far as the HTC America's web site: here is the url:
    http://www.america.htc.com/support/mogul/default.html

    I am really sorry you feel that I will not work on this until it is resolved for everyone.

    *2 is only going to get you the answer, "we are aware of an issue and am working on it"

    If you really feel the need for a post on HTC's site, I will see what I can do.

    HTC is continuing to investigate and resolve. It involves Qualcomm and the radio stack. This is deep in the core SW and must be fixed carefully.
    At the moment most (with the exceptions) are reporting a few select headsets that are working without any concerns that I listed above. I just gave my wife my BT Headset and this next week I am going to buy the Jabra 8010. I will report on how it works once I get it.
    07-21-2007 10:18 AM
  12. Daniel Rubino's Avatar
    I don't think I envy at all the people who have to work with BT on these devices, it seems quite hard to work with. Considering it is a "standard" it seems very hard to get it right. I give Motorola credit on the Q, that was exceptional BT. But it seems HTC, Palm and even the iPhone have issues with getting it "just right".

    Hopefully it'll be addressed with a MR. It might take awhile but HTC seems to have a lot at stake here, now that they're more than just a 3rd party manufacturer.
    07-21-2007 01:06 PM
  13. TreoNewt's Avatar
    Well after a long try with the 6800 I have finally sent all of them back to Sprint and returned to the 700p.

    The 6800 as mentioned earlier is a cool looking device with lots of potential, as a PDA is fantastic with excellent features and functionality. Unfortunately the phone seems to be an afterthought addition with poor integration with the rest of the OS.

    After searching in vain for an answer I have come to the conclusion that SMS alerts on the 6800 (WM in general?) can not be muted like ringtones with a hardware button press. I failed to found any hacks or programs to achieve this simple function available in every phone including the 700p. Since I use my smartphone as a pager through SMS messaging, the ability to stop the alert once I acknowledge the message is crucial, using a shorter wav as suggested is not a solution to me, an unsatsfactory work-around that may easily lead me to miss an important page in noisy environments.

    The "last straw" came after a lengthy call a few nights ago. During the call, the PDA "timed out" and went to "sleep" leaving me on the call. When done, the other party hung-up but the 6800 didn't, pressing the red telephone key to hang-up did not work as the device was locked. Had to press the power button, enter the password and THEN hang-up the phone. Tried this a few other times with similar results. This is quite unacceptable and a clear symptom of absent phone/OS integration on this device; being a heavy bluetooth user, having to pull the phone everytime to hang-up or make sure it hung-up after a call defeats the purpose of using the headset.

    I am sure there may be add-ons, programs or hacks to address some of the phone's behavior (or lack thereof), but having to modify such an expensive phone so much just to offer basic phone functionality is not worth this kind of money.

    My final veredict on the 6800 is as written, a great PDA but a poor phone compared to my prior smartphones. This is not to be taken as an indictment of WM smartphones in general, but a specific conclusion regarding the Sprint branded HTC-6800 in it's present iteration. I do not believe this PDA/phone is well integrated or ready for the functionality is expected to deliver out-of-the-box.
    07-21-2007 01:13 PM
  14. nsxprime's Avatar
    Welcome to the wonderful world of WM Pro/PPC. You have to hack the cr@p out of everything just to get halfway acceptable performance. None have ever had good phone app integration. That's the one area where Palm and Apple shine.

    As for the phone going to sleep on a call, it also really sucks when you want to change the volume. Hit the power button, enter unlock code, change volume, hit power button again. What genius at HTC came up with that one?
    07-21-2007 09:32 PM
  15. HobbesIsReal#WP's Avatar
    After reading thru several BT headset threads for the Mogual on different forums, one headset seemed to be fairly consistent with delivering results....the Jabra 8010. So today I bought one.

    The headset itself is REALLY COOL!!!!! It has two pieces. The first is the real BT headset for using with phone calls. It has a screen on the headset and is extremely comfortable. I haven't had a chance to test all of its features but is suppose to be able access the last 15 callers and place a call from that list or create a headset phone book of your 30 favorite people and use that to call....all without touching you phone.

    Then when you want to listen to your MP3s you plug in the second head set and switch it BT Stereo mode and then listen to your music.

    Now the connection to my Mogul is okay with some issues. For the most part it sounds "okay" to the other end....like speaker phone quality. I have had a few breakups but overwhelming in the okay and livable classification. HTC certainly needs to address the BT stack issues, but this will certainly get me thru until that time.

    I went to a Verizon store and paid $99 for the BT headset, $29 for the second stereo earpiece (which they ship for free and do not carry in stock), and if I bought a third item I got $30 off the order. So I bought a nice pouch case that fits the Mogul perfectly for $19.95. So I ended up paying $10 less to get a free case for my phone too.
    07-23-2007 10:06 PM
  16. nsxprime's Avatar
    Told you. Even the "vaunted" 8010 doesn't work correctly with the Mogul. "Speakerphone quality with a few breakups" does not equal a business-class pdaphone experience. How scary is it when the Palm BT stack is MUCH better? Who would have guessed that day would come?
    07-23-2007 10:35 PM
  17. HobbesIsReal#WP's Avatar
    Told you??? You do seem very anxious to jump on the Mogul looking for and expounding on every flaw. Do you remember the BT stacks that Palm started with with nearly every new Treo release????? They were horrible too with only one or two headsets that would work to any degree of usability. This is not an uncommon issue from the time a new phone is released until the first real ROM update. This is an issue that can easily be fixed and all signs are pointing to it being addressed and fixed. It is all part of being early adopters.

    My experience is not the norm with the Jabra 8010 as when you see at PCGeeks and PDAphoneHome that the VAST majority of Jabra 8010 are working flawlessly. Maybe mine was like that because my BT only had initial charge of 30 minutes instead of the needed 2 hours....who knows. So for the most part the Jabra 8010 has been reported from okay to flawless.
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 07-24-2007 at 02:03 AM.
    07-23-2007 11:18 PM
  18. HobbesIsReal#WP's Avatar
    UPDATE: I just fully charged the Jabra 8010 and then made 8 calls to my office phone and left at least 2 minute messages each talking about whatever popped into my head. When I listened to them there was no breaking up or nothing was garbled at all. Even though Icould probably have guessed I was on a cell phone, I could never had guessed if I was on a headset or not. I am very happy with this BT on my Mogul!!

    EDIT: I did forget to mention that even though it was nice and clear during this last test, I did notice a very limited range of around 5 or 6 feet while testing it with my wife on the other end.
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 07-24-2007 at 10:32 AM.
    07-24-2007 02:03 AM
  19. TreoNewt's Avatar
    My experience with the 6800 BT was much the same as the 700p before the MR, hit or miss; occasionally missing connections, having to delete the device and re-pair it several times.

    With the 6800 I had no BT induced crashes like with the 700p; with the 700p I had not fluctuating volume issues while in-call like with the 6800.

    I agree with Hobbes, this is a software issue likely to be fixed with an MR update, and when it is should provide more functionality than Palm's antiquated BT stack.

    P.S. Palm is using the same BT version since I believe the T600, by now it should work flawlessly but it doesn't; what's up with that!
    07-24-2007 08:50 AM
  20. Jaggrey's Avatar
    P.S. Palm is using the same BT version since I believe the T600, by now it should work flawlessly but it doesn't; what's up with that!
    No wonder Palm's having problems with the BT stack... the T600 didn't even have BT!:D
    07-24-2007 09:01 AM
  21. TreoNewt's Avatar
    No wonder Palm's having problems with the BT stack... the T600 didn't even have BT!:D
    Sorry, you are quite correct; BT became available with the Treo 650 model.
    07-24-2007 11:38 PM
  22. Jaggrey's Avatar
    lol it's all good... just messin with ya. We all knew what u meant! :)

    One question I have about the Mogul's BT... can you send/receive files with BT? I tried this with a 700wx and it wouldn't do it, nor would it accept more than one address from my 700p.
    07-25-2007 09:12 AM
  23. nsxprime's Avatar
    lol it's all good... just messin with ya. We all knew what u meant! :)

    One question I have about the Mogul's BT... can you send/receive files with BT? I tried this with a 700wx and it wouldn't do it, nor would it accept more than one address from my 700p.
    As with most things on the Mogul, the answer is no, unless you hack the phone. Too bad there's no way to hack the BT stack with one that works.
    07-25-2007 09:31 AM
  24. HobbesIsReal#WP's Avatar
    Here is another review of the Jabra 8010 BT headset from PDAphoneHome:

    Hello all. Just wanted to add that the 8010 does in fact work for me as well. Got one from amazon.com and voila. Is it perfect? No. But, the constant outgoing breakups are gone. No more "What did you say?" ever other word as it was on my Plantronics explorer 320 headset. That being said, I'd also have to say try syncing this headset up to a Motorola Q once (which I also own) and wow. It's even better! Now, the only complaint (and this only comes if I ask people I'm talking to) is that I'll be told that I sound like I am right up on top of the microphone and that I should move it back some (which is not possible seeing as it's on your ear). This is only if I ask though - and if I speak a little softer, that goes away.

    Now, some basic comments about the headset. If you plug in the second headset piece, you can talk on the phone and hear your caller in both ears. I have not had the "too low" problem. I in fact generally have my volume set at around 70%. I've seen someone post that they paid 90 bucks for one part of the unit and have another part mailed to them. People, do not do that. Don't go to the verizon store, just go to amazon and get the device for $96.
    Amazon.com: Jabra BT8010 Stereo/Mono Bluetooth Headset: Cell Phones & Service

    or find it cheap at some other place.

    I also love the volume dial If I had to pick any cons, they would have to be (1) some might find the ear speakers a little too large to fit in the ear. (2) I was hoping that I would get some bass in my music. There is virtually zero bass when I play my songs. I tried this both with the Mogul and my Q and there's no bass. It's not tinny - but there's no bass. Is this a function of phones not delivering the music all that well? Or is it just a function of bluetooth? I'm not sure yet (though I'll bet people in the forums here know - and if someone would answer, that would be great) but I'll find out soon as I like the headset enough that I ordered a bluetooth dongle for use with Skype on my PC and maybe music. But that's another topic for another thread on another day.

    Bottom line is this headset makes the mogul acceptable on bluetooth; about as good as talking on on the mogul's crappy mic and listening through it's crappy speaker. (Come on HTC! On an expensive phone, give us stereo speakers and both speakers and a mic that are larger than an atom!)
    enigmatl, great review.

    I have not had a chance to try out the music yet in stereo, but there predefined equalizer options in the menu on the headset. Have you tried each different options......Menu / Setting / Equalizer / then choose from Neutral (default), Rock, Pop, Jazz, Classical.

    The other thing I love about this headset is it remembers the last 10 callers that you can view on the screen on the headset and select one of them to call.

    It also has a 30 personal address book on the headset so you don't even need to touch your phone to call the most called people. You will need to download the Jabra 8010 control center from their website. This lets you enter the names and numbers for you phonebook and to choose what order to list them on the headset screen (i.e. most frequently call to least called). Then connect your headset to the computer to download the address book. It is really cool!!!!!
    07-25-2007 10:56 AM
  25. nsxprime's Avatar
    Please don't repost from other forums. I could do the same with people who've used the 8010 and said that it sucked with their Mogul.
    07-25-2007 01:43 PM
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