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09-04-2012 02:09 PM
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  1. Timture's Avatar
    Heck, no more brand loyalty to anyone from me. I've learnt my lesson with Apple. Never again will I tie myself down to one manufacturer. This year, it looks like I'm getting the Ativ S. Two years later who knows what I get. But one thing is for certain, If this Nokia does turn out to be what we see in these leaks, Nokia are definitely off my list.
    I don't think fanboys of any brand realize they are the worst customers for an industry. They hold back innovation with their blind loyalty. Us swing voters want the best hardware out there, and we vote with our pocketbook. This is what keeps all these manufacturers on their toes. The fanboys let these fat cats get complacent and live off their past glory. How do I know? I was one of them. There's no bigger fanboy than an Apple fanboy, and look where it got me? I can finally admit I was attached to inferior hardware with great software. But mind you, that software no longer is the cream of the crop like it used to be. Android has now leveled the playing field. As I have said, I've held an S3 and gave it a go, the device is amazing. I've decided to go Windows Phone because of it's unique looks and because I'll be picking up a surface.
    Last edited by Timture; 08-31-2012 at 12:30 PM.
    snowmutt likes this.
    08-31-2012 12:06 PM
  2. X0LARIUM's Avatar
    My nightmare. Well almost ...but I like it..I thunk I might buy one of these..

    Sent from my RaZr NeXus.
    08-31-2012 12:20 PM
  3. Reflexx's Avatar
    I don't want a watered version of an original. The other companies are doing that, Nokia is supposed to had Windows Phone as priority.

    We shouldn't settle for second best for God's sake.
    Until WP has a huge market share, there is very little chance that Nokia will release a device as fat as the 808. And as the technology currently stands, it's unlikely they could fit that 41 mp sensor into a thinner device.

    The original 808 was mainly a tech demo device. It was sold to demonstrate what we have to look forward to with Nokia. To generate hype. But they did also mention that it will take a while to shrink that sensor.

    If Nokia wants to ensure low sales because of a fat phone, then sure, they could put in the full 41 mp sensor. It will make a few die-hards happy. But that's it.

    And right now, I don't think WP had a big enough install base for Nokai to make several high-end devices.

    The fact is, if Pureview with a 21 mp sensor is released, it will be THE BEST camera for WP. It will also be better than any camera on Android or iOS.

    If that's what's going to hold you up, you might as well just go buy the 808.
    Residing likes this.
    08-31-2012 12:34 PM
  4. Bentstraight's Avatar
    I don't think fanboys of any brand realize they are the worst customers for an industry. They hold back innovation with their blind loyalty. Us swing voters want the best hardware out there, and we vote with our pocketbook. This is what keeps all these manufacturers on their toes. The fanboys let these fat cats get complacent and live off their past glory. How do I know? I was one of them. There's no bigger fanboy than an Apple fanboy, and look where it got me? I can finally admit I was attached to inferior hardware with great software. But mind you, that software no longer is the cream of the crop like it used to be. Android has now leveled the playing field. As I have said, I've held an S3 and gave it a go, the device is amazing. I've decided to go Windows Phone because of it's unique looks and because I'll be picking up a surface.
    This! 100% Spot on.

    The fact is, if Pureview with a 21 mp sensor is released, it will be THE BEST camera for WP. It will also be better than any camera on Android or iOS.
    Best camera is not enough. People look at the overall package. The fact of the matter is, most of the shoppers out there don't care about camera quality after a certain point. Majority of the people out there buy with their eyes. Unless a sales guy is shoving specs down their throat, a good majority of shoppers aren't all that fussy about specs. They just pick up the device, look at it, and if they like the looks, done deal. This is why I'm saying Nokia cannot bring out thick and heavy phones. When these phones are sitting next to phones that are lighter and thinner, they will not look good. The sales of the GS3 are proof of what a thin, light, and snappy running phone will do for a company.
    Last edited by samzer; 08-31-2012 at 12:44 PM.
    snowmutt likes this.
    08-31-2012 12:37 PM
  5. Reflexx's Avatar
    I'm not anti-Nokia. But they had done nothing to make me a Nokia fan. When Nokia announce that it was going to be a WP partner. I was promised a couple of things.

    1-Amazing Cameras
    2-New designs
    3-Great qualities.

    What I got was Terrible cameras, Copycats and buggy phones.

    And they release this underwhelming, ugly phone and people are saying it looks better than the ATIV? Had you hold a Galaxy 3 in your hands? That phone becomes an extension of your hand, it's so comfortable you wouldn't believe it.

    If those ugly phones are the only thing they will announce, then I will be laughing when they go up in ruins. Nokia should never had worsts phone than the competition, especially Samsung which has Windows Phone as an after though.
    Then pick up a Samsung.

    A lot of people do like Nokia's designs.

    The fact that we have a lot of different choices is good.

    Nokia has their own style. They've always had different colors and stood out. If you don't like that, then stop looking at Nokia. They will not win you over because that's not who they are.
    08-31-2012 12:41 PM
  6. Reflexx's Avatar
    Why do people assume that people who like Nokia devices are fanboys?

    It's just dumb name calling.
    wolf1891, snowmutt and bear_lx like this.
    08-31-2012 12:44 PM
  7. Mitlov's Avatar
    I like the bezel. It helps to show off the color.

    Is that camera big enough to house a decent sized sensor though?
    No. Look at a picture of the 808 Pureview for comparison. This phone is "Pureview" in name only.

    08-31-2012 12:47 PM
  8. Big Supes's Avatar
    I really need a sales job at Nokia. You get your hands on these babies first and then you get to brag about them.
    snowmutt likes this.
    08-31-2012 12:52 PM
  9. bear_lx's Avatar
    i love the nokia design, and so do other people. its less than perfect sales are do to its OS, not the hardware or design. everyone i talk to loves this phone. and the ativ looks just like a gs3... how is that different from gs2, htc one x, or any other android phone.. they look too much alike. im sorry but i see nothing intuitive about samsungs designs
    08-31-2012 01:15 PM
  10. Reflexx's Avatar
    Best camera is not enough. People look at the overall package. The fact of the matter is, most of the shoppers out there don't care about camera quality after a certain point. Majority of the people out there buy with their eyes. Unless a sales guy is shoving specs down their throat, a good majority of shoppers aren't all that fussy about specs. They just pick up the device, look at it, and if they like the looks, done deal.
    You do realize my post was in direct response to Winterfang talking about the camera, right?

    This is why I'm saying Nokia cannot bring out thick and heavy phones. When these phones are sitting next to phones that are lighter and thinner, they will not look good. The sales of the GS3 are proof of what a thin, light, and snappy running phone will do for a company.
    The Lumia was just right in terms of heft. At least in my opinion, and the opinion of others who like the extra durability.

    Samsung and HTC will do great in providing phones for those people who want super light phones. I'm glad that Nokia is there to give an option to the rest of us that like something that feels solid.
    snowmutt likes this.
    08-31-2012 01:51 PM
  11. Reflexx's Avatar
    No. Look at a picture of the 808 Pureview for comparison. This phone is "Pureview" in name only.

    Click to view quoted image
    That's not really accurate.

    Pureview is a wide technology that encompasses much more than just a 41 mp sensor.

    Let's say someone made a 5 liter 8 cylinder engine.

    Then they a 3 liter 6 cylinder engine.

    Is the 2nd engine an "engine" in name only? Even if it uses the same technology?
    08-31-2012 01:55 PM
  12. Mitlov's Avatar
    That's not really accurate.

    Pureview is a wide technology that encompasses much more than just a 41 mp sensor.
    I thought the term referred to mind-boggling camera hardware in addition to exclusive software. They can apply the name to whatever they want it to, but if they start applying it to nearly everything that's got a few exclusive software gimmicks, they run the risk of diluting the Pureview name (see: Beats Audio).
    08-31-2012 02:18 PM
  13. Reflexx's Avatar
    I thought the term referred to mind-boggling camera hardware in addition to exclusive software. They can apply the name to whatever they want it to, but if they start applying it to nearly everything that's got a few exclusive software gimmicks, they run the risk of diluting the Pureview name (see: Beats Audio).
    The sensor they use would still need enough to get a decent amount of information for surrounding pixels.

    The original Pureview uses a 41mp sensor, and default pictures end up being 8mp. They take the colors of 7 pixels from the sensor to pick the best color to use for the one pixel that will be in the photo.

    If a 21mp sensor is used, that would still allow the technology to use about 4 pixels of information to derive a pixel color for a final 5 mp photo.

    Of course the 41 mp sensor would be preferrable if you want the maximum amount of lossless zoom. But right now, the price of doing that would be a fat phone. That's good for a niche market, but not for a mass market device.

    And since WP is a niche in itself, it would be very risky to try to produce something that was just for a niche within a niche.
    Residing likes this.
    08-31-2012 02:29 PM
  14. Mitlov's Avatar
    The original Pureview uses a 41mp sensor, and default pictures end up being 8mp. They take the colors of 7 pixels from the sensor to pick the best color to use for the one pixel that will be in the photo.

    If a 21mp sensor is used, that would still allow the technology to use about 4 pixels of information to derive a pixel color for a final 5 mp photo.
    If that's what they're doing, I'm fine with that. What I was afraid of was the 8mp camera from the Lumia 900 (which isn't even as good as other 8mp cameras out there, such as the Galaxy S3's and HTC One X's and the HTC Titan 1's), with a couple exclusive software tweaks, bearing the "Pureview" name.
    08-31-2012 02:33 PM
  15. Reflexx's Avatar
    If that's what they're doing, I'm fine with that. What I was afraid of was the 8mp camera from the Lumia 900 (which isn't even as good as other 8mp cameras out there, such as the Galaxy S3's and HTC One X's and the HTC Titan 1's), with a couple exclusive software tweaks, bearing the "Pureview" name.
    Yeah. That would suck.
    08-31-2012 02:34 PM
  16. Rico's Avatar
    The exact definition of Pureview is iffy. Nokia describes it as the combination of the 41mp sensor combined with Karl Zeiss optics, but the 808 Pureview also combines a special hardware image processor and of course software to interpolate images as needed. To me, "Pureview" is less about hard specs and more the idea of Nokia returning to being the king of cameraphones with a device that can take the best images and video possible on any device on the market. Sure, the 808 Pureview trumps it, but that was never going to be a mass market device. Nokia needs a device that will move, and if the Pureview brand takes off, we may see a more niche high spec Pureview in the future.
    Mitlov and snowmutt like this.
    08-31-2012 02:34 PM
  17. Reflexx's Avatar
    The exact definition of Pureview is iffy. Nokia describes it as the combination of the 41mp sensor combined with Karl Zeiss optics, but the 808 Pureview also combines a special hardware image processor and of course software to interpolate images as needed. To me, "Pureview" is less about hard specs and more the idea of Nokia returning to being the king of cameraphones with a device that can take the best images and video possible on any device on the market. Sure, the 808 Pureview trumps it, but that was never going to be a mass market device. Nokia needs a device that will move, and if the Pureview brand takes off, we may see a more niche high spec Pureview in the future.
    Don't forget the enhanced audio recording, allowing the phone to record a wider spectrum of sounds. I believe that they have that under the Pureview umbrella.
    08-31-2012 02:36 PM
  18. Rico's Avatar
    Don't forget the enhanced audio recording, allowing the phone to record a wider spectrum of sounds. I believe that they have that under the Pureview umbrella.
    I certainly hadn't forgotten about the audio. That's not part of the Pureview technology formally, but if Nokia spins Pureview as their brand for customers who care about media creation (like the old N-Series), then the two will likely be synonymous.
    08-31-2012 03:44 PM
  19. tk-093's Avatar
    And what's with all the cartoon looks and color. I want something I could pull out in a boardroom meeting without looking like a teenager.
    Please tell me how having color choice is a bad thing. Guess what? If you would be embarrased by having a yellow or a red phone, don't buy a yellow or red phone. Seems to me their renders also show black, white or grey. I don't understand this comment.


    Note: I've held a Galaxy S3 and the phone is so light, thin, and extremely ergonomic. One the most comfortable phones ever. Seriously my iPhone 4S really feels old at this point. I'm done with small heavy devices. I'll admit I was a big Apple fanboy, but my options and my eyes are now open.
    I'm also currently rocking the S3 after rotating back and forth between the 4S and the Galaxy Crapus.. er, Nexus. It's a great phone, that's for sure, but the actuall looks of it.. it's pretty blah, nothing special. I think the Nexus was a was a far, far, far better looking device. But maybe that's just me.

    I'm actually getting the first device that comes out on Verizon.. I don't care who makes it, the quicker I can get off Android onto my dream OS the better.
    08-31-2012 04:15 PM
  20. jusdis's Avatar
    I'm going to buy this and wrap it and put it under the tree for myself this Christmas. :D


    Edit** it won't make it til then. Who am I kidding.
    Reflexx, snowmutt and Sparkyscrum like this.
    08-31-2012 05:07 PM
  21. freestaterocker's Avatar
    That would be clever but, why would the sensor be the camera sensor spread through the phone?

    If this phone doesn't get the real Pureview, Nokia can forget about me. They already made a mockery of the Carls Zeiss name with the 900.
    I believe they were referring to the extra processing chip the 808 utilizes to process 38mp of information. Relocating it would help to preserve a slimmer profile, but might make it less battery efficient to process pics.
    08-31-2012 05:47 PM
  22. nokia4life's Avatar
    I am getting the 920 as soon as it's released can't wait this kills both Sammy and HTC so far from what been leaked and announced

    Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
    08-31-2012 05:53 PM
  23. AngryNil's Avatar
    Red one looks amazing, I hope PenTile doesn't ruin on-screen reds though. That said, I hope the camera module is larger. They've already diluted the Carl Zeiss brand with the 800/900, they better not call a subpar 8MP shooter "PureView".

    And they release this underwhelming, ugly phone and people are saying it looks better than the ATIV? Had you hold a Galaxy 3 in your hands? That phone becomes an extension of your hand, it's so comfortable you wouldn't believe it.
    Switched your tune from "amazing GS3 design" to "comfortable". Far too large for me to be comfortable.

    Also, you might want to take a look at reactions to the 920 versus the Galaxy S3 at large. Just about no professional has commended Samsung on a beautiful design. Why? Because the S3 is butt-ugly.
    Last edited by AngryNil; 08-31-2012 at 07:12 PM.
    08-31-2012 05:54 PM
  24. larrynj's Avatar
    08-31-2012 07:49 PM
  25. astraith's Avatar
    Nokia has a huge following over seas. In some parts if the world, they are considered the best.

    I surely didn't expect them to change the Lumia Design because it's the most unique design for a modern smart phone. You may not like it -- it is plastic - but it is well built and, especially with the rumored specs - they are the best and leading the way in terms of designs and features.

    With that said, i also love the Samsung Ativ S. It excites me, as a Samsung fan, to see them taking Windows Phone seriously.
    Reflexx likes this.
    08-31-2012 08:30 PM
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