09-14-2012 07:55 AM
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  1. brmiller1976's Avatar
    Of course it is an option!
    Great! Where do I buy one, how much does it cost, and what carriers does it support?
    09-09-2012 02:25 PM
  2. Reflexx's Avatar
    The perception matters more then reality. People perceive Nokia to be scrambling and desperate.
    At least that's your hope, isn't it?
    09-09-2012 02:27 PM
  3. brmiller1976's Avatar
    Look at the stock price, quarterly financials, debt ratings, and analyst projections for Nokia.

    Do they look like the projections made for a confident company successfully executing a turnaround strategy with solid, profitable and well-delivered new product?
    09-09-2012 02:29 PM
  4. Winterfang's Avatar
    Is like Microsoft isn't even trying.

    Look at the Windows 8 development, they have being working hard, the hardware partners are everywhere, consistent betas, lots of cheap options, option to downgrade, top of the line beautiful devices that represent the best of the companies, Microsoft itself getting in to hardware.

    But windows phone 8, less partners than ever before, hand me downs copies from most partners, barely any info on it, no one gets to update to it.
    09-09-2012 02:32 PM
  5. poiman's Avatar
    Great! Where do I buy one, how much does it cost, and what carriers does it support?
    It's an option as you can chose to wait for it and then buy one. It wouldn't be an option if it didn't and was never going to exist.
    09-09-2012 02:33 PM
  6. Big Supes's Avatar
    We need to stop pretending WP8 is in the race. Until product is shipped, it's not an option for ANYONE.
    I don't think anyone is claiming Wp8 is in the race; WP is in the race.
    wolf1891 likes this.
    09-09-2012 02:35 PM
  7. Winterfang's Avatar
    For all we know it can still be cancelled. There's not set date.
    09-09-2012 02:36 PM
  8. Big Supes's Avatar
    For all we know it can still be cancelled. There's not set date.
    Huh?
    09-09-2012 02:39 PM
  9. poiman's Avatar
    For all we know it can still be cancelled. There's not set date.
    You can chose to make smart predictions (wait until WP8 is released by the end of October / beggining of November to buy one) or dumb predictions (it's goin to be cancelled).
    09-09-2012 02:39 PM
  10. brmiller1976's Avatar
    I don't think anyone is claiming Wp8 is in the race; WP is in the race.
    Oh c'mon.

    When someone asks you "what phone should I buy," and tells you he's considering Apple's new iPhone, a Galaxy S III, or an HTC One X/S, you're going to say "you should buy a WP7 device that will never run WP8 today, and then wait and buy another WP8 phone a few months from now?"

    Let's face it. Windows Phone 8, right now, is even less tangible than BlackBerry 10 (RIM has, after all, given demos of the UI and how to navigate the OS, something we have yet to see for WP8). Windows Phone 7 is an orphaned OS like Symbian or BlackBerry 7, without a real future.

    The fact that WP8 still isn't shipping makes me wonder if it would have been smarter for MS to simply upgrade the CE kernel to support multiple cores and keep pushing a variant of WP7, so there'd be fresh, competitive phones for Q3.

    What they did, instead, is publicly shoot WP7 in the head at BUILD in July, and then allow the market to languish for close to half a year with no current product (if the November launch dates are to be believed) and not even a timeline for when new devices come out.

    And this languishing was timed to happen when competing ecosystems would be launching their newest, hottest products and scooping up large gobs of new users and marketshare, ensuring only tiny crumbs were left when WP8 handsets finally come to market.

    Take a look at new Marketplace submissions. It's no coincidence that they've slowed so dramatically.
    09-09-2012 02:44 PM
  11. Winterfang's Avatar
    Huh?
    I'm saying that is true that Windows Phone 8 is not an option until it launches. I just posted a worse case scenerario of course.
    09-09-2012 02:44 PM
  12. Reflexx's Avatar
    Oh brother.

    How come every time a fan of a product sees something other than endless adulation of his preferred product, he imagines complex conspiracy theories?

    I've been accused of being paid by Google, Microsoft, and now Nokia competitors, simply for pointing out serious flaws with products or strategies.

    If you don't like the criticism, you can ignore it. But give the "paid poster" conspiracy theories a rest.

    PS -- Ever consider that the source of our fury MIGHT be the "overpromise, underdeliver" problem Nokia has?

    To claim that you're going to deliver a product better than the ATIV S, and "dine on Jellybeans," and then present fake videos of features that aren't yet working, along with prototype phones with no pricing or release date, tends to tick WP people invested in the ecosystem off.

    If you have nothing to show (and Nokia had nothing to show, face it), then don't make promises you can't keep.
    Considering neither product has been released, there has been no "deliver" from any of the OEMs.

    So basically, you're hoping to taint people's views before delivery.

    Whatever your reasoning for doing so doesn't really matter. It's just funny when you seem upset that people would jump to negative conclusions about you based on you jumping to negative conclusions about a company based on an unreleased product.
    poiman and wolf1891 like this.
    09-09-2012 03:00 PM
  13. Reflexx's Avatar
    I'm saying that is true that Windows Phone 8 is not an option until it launches. I just posted a worse case scenerario of course.
    Okay. Then you might as well say, "What if Earth is hit by a giant asteroid and all life is extinguished?"
    09-09-2012 03:05 PM
  14. GoodThings2Life's Avatar
    Considering neither product has been released, there has been no "deliver" from any of the OEMs.

    So basically, you're hoping to taint people's views before delivery.

    Whatever your reasoning for doing so doesn't really matter. It's just funny when you seem upset that people would jump to negative conclusions about you based on you jumping to negative conclusions about a company based on an unreleased product.
    I was going write a response, but as I clicked "Quote" it occurred to me that he wouldn't bother listening, let alone understanding, so I've opted to make him the first on my "Ignore" list instead.

    I can respond to criticism and intelligently debate the merits of an OEM or feature request all day, but for anyone whose majority of post history is platform bashing all I can do is choose to disengage.
    poiman likes this.
    09-09-2012 03:05 PM
  15. smoledman's Avatar
    Take a look at new Marketplace submissions. It's no coincidence that they've slowed so dramatically.
    You obviously hate Windows Phone. You seem utterly confident it will die, so why are you posting so obsessively about it? Do you just want to rub it in every day on this forum? I hope you get banned.
    09-09-2012 03:07 PM
  16. smoledman's Avatar
    I'm saying that is true that Windows Phone 8 is not an option until it launches. I just posted a worse case scenerario of course.
    Where did you come up with this scenario? Was the L900 cancelled?

    Fee, Figh, Fo, Fum! I smell a Troll!
    cedarlog likes this.
    09-09-2012 03:09 PM
  17. GoodThings2Life's Avatar
    Winterfang isn't a troll, just doesn't care for Nokia's products. Not sure why the speculation of "trouble in Windows Phone Paradise" though.

    Microsoft has consistently taken a secrecy approach to Windows Phone 8 and a public approach to Windows 8, but the timelines haven't really changed. They were always planning an RTM in September for WP8 and a launch in late October. I think people forget the fact that Mango went RTM about a month before release too.

    I wonder... was this dual-approach tactic a way of seeing which style generates more positive attention for Microsoft? If so, I personally feel like W8's public approach has been better.
    09-09-2012 03:15 PM
  18. brmiller1976's Avatar
    Considering neither product has been released, there has been no "deliver" from any of the OEMs.

    So basically, you're hoping to taint people's views before delivery.
    Well, you can be petulant about it, that is your right.

    I'm saying that there's nothing to buy, and by the time there is, nobody will be left to care to buy it.

    This is prime phone selling season, and all Microsoft has to sell is Windows Phone Tango handsets. The new stuff comes along in November (assuming rumors are correct), two months after everyone who was waiting-and-seeing for September announcements will purchase a new Android and Apple device.

    I'll probably own a WP8 -- not a Nokia one, unless they deliver far beyond my expectations. But I'm sure that, for yet another year, I'll be one of only a handful of people I know who have a Windows Phone, in a sea of Android and iOS users... because they blew their big chance this year to deliver.

    While there's some merit in the idea of getting people to upgrade to Windows Phone along with Windows 8, that's a strategy that will take a lot of time and slow, steady erosion to achieve.

    HTC and Samsung are profitable and cash rich... they can be patient. Nokia is staring death in the face. If sales don't get better immediately, they're out of business.
    09-09-2012 03:18 PM
  19. brmiller1976's Avatar
    You obviously hate Windows Phone. You seem utterly confident it will die,
    No, I use Windows Phone.

    I want to see it succeed.

    That's why I'm pissed off at Microsoft and Nokia. They're killing it.

    If banning me will make you feel better, that's fine. Doesn't change the fact that I represent an actual viewpoint that's quite popular in the WP userbase. Banning more users won't make the userbase larger.
    09-09-2012 03:20 PM
  20. eric12341's Avatar
    Ok here's how it's going down right now. In order for this thread to stay open we must stop the inflammatory statements and name calling.
    09-09-2012 03:20 PM
  21. Big Supes's Avatar
    Oh c'mon.

    When someone asks you "what phone should I buy," and tells you he's considering Apple's new iPhone, a Galaxy S III, or an HTC One X/S, you're going to say "you should buy a WP7 device that will never run WP8 today, and then wait and buy another WP8 phone a few months from now?"
    Whatever I might say, surely, wouldn't you apply this logic to the "new iPhone" and One X+:
    Until product is shipped, it's not an option for ANYONE.
    ?

    Let's face it. Windows Phone 8, right now, is even less tangible than BlackBerry 10 (RIM has, after all, given demos of the UI and how to navigate the OS, something we have yet to see for WP8). Windows Phone 7 is an orphaned OS like Symbian or BlackBerry 7, without a real future.
    Utter BS. Wp8 isn't even comparable to BB10. Why? Because it's not a complete makeover. We all know how to navigate the Windows Phone UI. Does Apple give a run down of the UI every new release of one of their products? Nope. They just showcase what's new.

    The fact that WP8 still isn't shipping
    What do you mean? It was never going to be shipping this side of October/November. Microsoft are building the platform at their own pace and will release it when they're good and ready. I couldn't give a flying funk what the competition's schedule is as a consumer who favours WP.

    makes me wonder if it would have been smarter for MS to simply upgrade the CE kernel to support multiple cores and keep pushing a variant of WP7, so there'd be fresh, competitive phones for Q3.
    And, it's a good job MS aren't so short-sighted, considering the eco-system they're building for the future.

    What they did, instead, is publicly shoot WP7 in the head at BUILD in July, and then allow the market to languish for close to half a year with no current product (if the November launch dates are to be believed) and not even a timeline for when new devices come out.

    And this languishing was timed to happen when competing ecosystems would be launching their newest, hottest products and scooping up large gobs of new users and marketshare, ensuring only tiny crumbs were left when WP8 handsets finally come to market.

    Take a look at new Marketplace submissions. It's no coincidence that they've slowed so dramatically.
    Maybe you're preaching to the wrong person, but I really don't see how this is relevant to Wp8. All they have done is take the momentum out of the Wp7 marketplace. Correct me if I am wrong, but IIRC, sales weren't effected.
    09-09-2012 03:28 PM
  22. Big Supes's Avatar
    I'm saying that is true that Windows Phone 8 is not an option until it launches. I just posted a worse case scenerario of course.
    Oohh... for a moment I thought you were predicting the launch of Wp8 being cancelled.

    09-09-2012 03:32 PM
  23. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    Well, you can be petulant about it, that is your right.

    I'm saying that there's nothing to buy, and by the time there is, nobody will be left to care to buy it.

    This is prime phone selling season, and all Microsoft has to sell is Windows Phone Tango handsets. The new stuff comes along in November (assuming rumors are correct), two months after everyone who was waiting-and-seeing for September announcements will purchase a new Android and Apple device.

    I'll probably own a WP8 -- not a Nokia one, unless they deliver far beyond my expectations. But I'm sure that, for yet another year, I'll be one of only a handful of people I know who have a Windows Phone, in a sea of Android and iOS users... because they blew their big chance this year to deliver.

    While there's some merit in the idea of getting people to upgrade to Windows Phone along with Windows 8, that's a strategy that will take a lot of time and slow, steady erosion to achieve.

    HTC and Samsung are profitable and cash rich... they can be patient. Nokia is staring death in the face. If sales don't get better immediately, they're out of business.
    If the WP8 devices are available for sale in early November, they will not miss the holiday shopping season.
    Reflexx, wolf1891 and cedarlog like this.
    09-09-2012 03:34 PM
  24. Simon Tupper's Avatar
    I see a lot of people complaining about the 920 on their spare time...
    09-09-2012 03:37 PM
  25. Winterfang's Avatar
    Oohh... for a moment I thought you were predicting the launch of Wp8 being cancelled.

    Now I was just humoring him point. He said that Windows Phone 8 isn't an option because it hasn't come out. Which is technically true, the other poster rebuttal was that even is it isn't out yet is still an option. I'm saying that it can still be cancelled so is not really an option in a way.

    Of course, Microsoft can pull out a Palm.
    09-09-2012 03:50 PM
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