11-16-2012 07:13 AM
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  1. jdevenberg's Avatar
    If there was an actual demand for Windows Phone device that would increase their share in the US market, then it would had been obvious to attract the carriers who have 2/3 Of the total market, a market which Microsoft refused to support devices for (yes, I am talking about CDMA carriers and not limited to Verizon and Sprint).

    Before anyone says Lumia 922 and HTC 8X, have in mind who will have to do direct support for those devices, and it's not going to be Microsoft unless they actually code for current Qualcomm CDMA standards (more specific to 512bit encryption, standard used currently for CDMA 2000 based EVDO and SVDO). Ironically, no one wants to ask Microsoft why they were not on more CDMA carriers in the US outside the three largest.

    BTW, why Sprint is treated as the ******* child on this site?
    Outside of sprint and verizon, the rest of the CDMA carriers in the USA combined would barely equal the number of subscribers T-Mobile alone has. Sprint is treated the way it is because of its lack of support of Windows Phone. They released one device, then made it their poster child for their unwanted phone buy back program, and are the only major carrier not to voice support for Windows Phone 8. Why should anyone on this site like them? CDMA may have a decent subscriber base in the USA, but out side of the US only China uses CDMA and it isn't even structured the same as CDMA in the US. The rest of the world is GSM. Even LTE that both Sprint and Verizon are adopting is an evolution of the GSM standard.
    10-27-2012 04:28 PM
  2. brmiller1976's Avatar
    Even LTE that both Sprint and Verizon are adopting is an evolution of the GSM standard.
    Not really. CDMA technology lives on in the form of HSPA+ (GSM 3G/4G), which uses CDMA concepts for faster data transmission.

    LTE is entirely different, based on neither WCDMA (GSM data evolution) or CDMA EVDO.
    10-27-2012 04:30 PM
  3. mrmdj316's Avatar
    Sprint did give the Arrive top treatment in adverstising for the same time the did for the Epic 4G and the Evo line, which is about two months of promotion after launch. And whoever said Sprint gave WP a middle finger treatment needs to revise what treatment a Microsoft gave to CDMA carriers.

    One more thing, most prepaid carriers are CDMA based, and the smaller regional postpaid CDMA carriers like USCC, nTelos, Credo, and Premier almost have as many customers as a T-Mobile. Do your research, and you will find out CDMA is bigger in the USA than what many in the US (and in the international circles) think.
    10-27-2012 06:34 PM
  4. brmiller1976's Avatar
    Sprint did give the Arrive top treatment in adverstising for the same time the did for the Epic 4G and the Evo line, which is about two months of promotion after launch. And whoever said Sprint gave WP a middle finger treatment needs to revise what treatment a Microsoft gave to CDMA carriers.

    One more thing, most prepaid carriers are CDMA based, and the smaller regional postpaid CDMA carriers like USCC, nTelos, Credo, and Premier almost have as many customers as a T-Mobile. Do your research, and you will find out CDMA is bigger in the USA than what many in the US (and in the international circles) think.
    CDMA sucks. And I say that as someone who used it for years. It is slow, proprietary, guzzles battery life, has no real upgrade path, and demolishes consumer choice.

    Carriers get it. CDMA has been shut down in Australia, New Zealand, Brazil and Canada. The US will join that list soon.
    10-27-2012 07:25 PM
  5. mrmdj316's Avatar
    CDMA has its limitations but sure has it's advantages over GSM.

    Better voice quality
    Better reach and transmission on proper bands
    Try activating a lost/stolen device without flashing (and even when flashing a ROM AND ESN)
    Better encryption for security purposes

    And if you say you cannot do talk and web at the same time, try EVDO revsion B aka SVDO.
    10-28-2012 07:23 AM
  6. johnmcd348's Avatar
    CDMA is a very strong technology. Anyone here geeky enough to know where it came from?



    Hint:

    Think Hedy Lamar an* ************. edit to remove some info. too much info....
    Last edited by JohnMcD348; 10-31-2012 at 06:48 AM. Reason: modify hint.
    10-31-2012 06:46 AM
  7. mrmdj316's Avatar
    John, don't say that loud lol. People don't understand CDMA 2000 and why the US military with the help of Qualcomm developed the technology. Shall I reveal why? I should

    Encryption! Yes, that 512bit encryption Qualcomm requires now for allowing EVDO and SVDO networks like the one Sprint's Network Vision is installing nationally, as well as the enhanced 3G improvements on all CDMA carriers are doing need that encryption for better performance of all the devices. Microsoft's Windows Phone team which is GSM based wants to code how GSM carriers want to code CDMA (which is 256bit encryption, which is obsolete if you run a network where 512bit encryption is needed to support EVDO and SVDO).

    And for those wanting CDMA carriers to switch to WCDMA (which is GSM in reality), think about encryption.
    10-31-2012 07:37 AM
  8. mrmdj316's Avatar
    Now you guys know why there were only two devices offered for CDMA carriers on WP7 and why only verizon is supporting at launch. 256bit or 512bit encryption? Your choice, wpcentral members who think Sprint and the rest of the CDMA community is wrong.
    10-31-2012 07:39 AM
  9. power5's Avatar
    CDMA sucks. And I say that as someone who used it for years. It is slow, proprietary, guzzles battery life, has no real upgrade path, and demolishes consumer choice.
    I am sorry, but I would say just about all that is not true. Internet bias from GSM sites and such.

    Funny part is, when I was on Verizon, all my friends on GSM networks could just get a new phone and drop their old sim into the new phone and have all their contacts, or they could switch between old and new phones whenever they wanted. I had to go to Verizon and hope that the tech could connect my old and new phone. If not, I would get a nice print out and have to manually re-enter all my contacts. Fun. Now, nothing is stored on the sim.
    fierywater likes this.
    10-31-2012 08:19 AM
  10. jfa1's Avatar
    If there was an actual demand for Windows Phone device that would increase their share in the US market, then it would had been obvious to attract the carriers who have 2/3 Of the total market, a market which Microsoft refused to support devices for (yes, I am talking about CDMA carriers and not limited to Verizon and Sprint).

    Before anyone says Lumia 922 and HTC 8X, have in mind who will have to do direct support for those devices, and it's not going to be Microsoft unless they actually code for current Qualcomm CDMA standards (more specific to 512bit encryption, standard used currently for CDMA 2000 based EVDO and SVDO). Ironically, no one wants to ask Microsoft why they were not on more CDMA carriers in the US outside the three largest.

    BTW, why Sprint is treated as the ******* child on this site?
    well maybe its that they only had one WP7 device and about a month after they came out with it their advertising for a recycle campaign featured the ariive with vines growing around it. And then they came out and essentially said they were through with WP7 and would wait on WP8 and they still havent said a peepo about WP8 only the TING Sprint MVNO indicated they would go with it. That and the fact they spent a ton on dougfh on the iphone. Don't think thats worked out very well for them either!
    10-31-2012 08:41 AM
  11. mrmdj316's Avatar
    Jfa1, you still failed to address why the support from Microsoft on those two HTC devices was nonexsistant, and why there were not more CDMA variations on devices. It comes down to encryption coding no matter how anyone can explain or defend Microsoft for this and their GSM only priority in a US Market where 2/3 of the market share in cell phone lines come from the CDMA 2000 side.

    We can slice it and dice it anyway you want, but the facts about Team Windows Phone not wanting to code CDMA the way Qualcomm and every carrier wants (including a Verizon), and providing ZERO support for the CDMA versions of the HTC Arrive/Pro and the HTC Trophy, and the fact other OEMs were either discouraged or forbidden to manufacture CDMA variants of their devices to offer them on postpaid (and more obvious to CDMA based prepaid carriers) are major fatal flaws. Microsoft failed on that, and no writer on any of the pro Windows Phone sites are even bothering to ask the questions to Microsoft regarding such.
    10-31-2012 11:40 AM
  12. fierywater's Avatar
    Jfa1, you still failed to address why the support from Microsoft on those two HTC devices was nonexsistant
    How do you figure? The HTC Trophy on Verizon recently got Tango. How much more support can a WP7 device get?
    10-31-2012 12:25 PM
  13. mrmdj316's Avatar
    I was referring to troubleshooting, and marketing support, not just software updates.
    10-31-2012 01:08 PM
  14. humboldt1's Avatar
    No one from @sprint or the employees that they follow on twitter will respond to HTC Arrive questions or WP8 questions.

    More Sprint customers need to let them know on twitter and on the phone.

    In fact feel free to call Tamara from sprint at 757-223-3233 and talk with her. It is her job to talk with customers.
    11-01-2012 12:41 AM
  15. mrmdj316's Avatar
    In the same way employees will not talk about the OG Evo, the Epic 4G, or many of the other devices which have reached the EOL status. Is no different with devices on other networks.

    I just noticed there is so much Anti-Sprint tension is not even funny, and even if Sprint would have joined the WP8 launch with two devices, and decides to carry a dozen more, none of you Anti-Sprint people would be happy with them, even if they carry the most high end devices like the Lumias from Nokia.
    11-01-2012 06:43 AM
  16. GG916's Avatar
    yes i got out of my contract without paying ETF since they discontinued the arrive and didnt even support it 2 years. Im so happy to be going to at&t which i hate but its true they always have the best and newest phones
    Excellent news! My contract is up March 2013 but I'm not waiting. I had planned to argue to not pay an ETF since they are not supporting the phone or the operating system (they don't send out available updates :mad:). I know that argument is valid, I'm glad to see they agree! I plan to shop between AT&T and Verizon to look for the best phone for me, and the best monthly plan. Thanks for the info!

    G
    11-01-2012 07:19 AM
  17. Arthur Wellesley's Avatar
    Outside of sprint and verizon, the rest of the CDMA carriers in the USA combined would barely equal the number of subscribers T-Mobile alone has. Sprint is treated the way it is because of its lack of support of Windows Phone. They released one device, then made it their poster child for their unwanted phone buy back program, and are the only major carrier not to voice support for Windows Phone 8. Why should anyone on this site like them? CDMA may have a decent subscriber base in the USA, but out side of the US only China uses CDMA and it isn't even structured the same as CDMA in the US. The rest of the world is GSM. Even LTE that both Sprint and Verizon are adopting is an evolution of the GSM standard.
    My Sprint CDMA Phone works well in China. Sprint's CDMA Phone gets Internet & Facebook in China as well.
    11-03-2012 01:27 AM
  18. mrmdj316's Avatar
    But people think CDMA is not capable of doing talk and web at the same time. Of course they would be right if you encrypt and code CDMA devices as if it was 2005 with 256 bit encryption. That's where nearly all CDMA carriers would not touch an under coded and under encrypted WP8 device for their networks. Sure LTE capabilities is nice, but when the major CDMA carriers already have made their networks ready for SVDO (which is 1X Advanced and EVDO revision B combined, thanks to 512bit encryption), they want devices that come coded properly in the OS, and WP8 is coded with obsolete CDMA encryption.

    I want Alan F and Aaron Michael Rowe and the pro WP/anti-CDMA (more like anti-Sprint ala HPCentral) to get to the bottom of this, rather than spend time writing juvenille reports about their disgust for what David Owens said early in the year (for which he is still correct as Windows Phone has dropped share below 3% in the US Market, and other Anti-Sprint reporting which is so similar to what HPCentral and their allies wrote before the demise of WebOS).

    I challenge you, WPCentral. I challenge you to get to the bottom on why there is no WP devices on CDMA prepaid networks as well.

    I am not getting my hopes high on either one, because the agenda is way obvious. Bash Sprint, and bash CDMA although is dominant in the US and China..
    AKA Preluva likes this.
    11-04-2012 04:48 PM
  19. mlm1950's Avatar
    In the same way employees will not talk about the OG Evo, the Epic 4G, or many of the other devices which have reached the EOL status. Is no different with devices on other networks.

    I just noticed there is so much Anti-Sprint tension is not even funny, and even if Sprint would have joined the WP8 launch with two devices, and decides to carry a dozen more, none of you Anti-Sprint people would be happy with them, even if they carry the most high end devices like the Lumias from Nokia.
    If Sprint did that, I guarantee there would be some love sent their way. The fact is that Sprint isn't doing that, and history has shown that they would never do that, so people are understandably skeptical about WP8 in Sprint's future.
    11-04-2012 05:12 PM
  20. btgusto's Avatar
    its so hard to leave unlimited data BUT when I crunch the numbers, I use more wifi anyways so... I am no longer playing the waiting game with Sprint. So long sprint/Softbank
    Last edited by gusto; 11-04-2012 at 05:13 PM. Reason: wrong word
    11-04-2012 05:12 PM
  21. mrmdj316's Avatar
    But what about the other CDMA carriers which didn't even carry WP7 devices? If the dislike for a carrier for just carrying one device because there were no other choices for CDMA devices, why not rant US cellular which carried the same device Sprint had, and why not go after the regional CDMA postpaid carriers, and all the prepaid market outside of T-Mobile. Unless the ones behind this site have a logical reason on why the juvenille bashing on reports can give me and the rest of the CDMA community a LOGICAL reason why only bash Sprint, NONE of you would change my mind.

    You still have to explain why WPCentral has not written juvenile articles about why most CDMA carriers in the US have not gotten one WP7 or WP8 device. It's about prejudice, and I am starting to believe some of you are former WebOS users still blaming Sprint for the death of WebOS which will never blame HP, which brings me back to a Microsoft and their Team Windows Phone only wanting to code and encrypt the 2005 way rather than the 2012 way.
    11-04-2012 06:07 PM
  22. AKA Preluva's Avatar
    But what about the other CDMA carriers which didn't even carry WP7 devices? If the dislike for a carrier for just carrying one device because there were no other choices for CDMA devices, why not rant US cellular which carried the same device Sprint had, and why not go after the regional CDMA postpaid carriers, and all the prepaid market outside of T-Mobile. Unless the ones behind this site have a logical reason on why the juvenille bashing on reports can give me and the rest of the CDMA community a LOGICAL reason why only bash Sprint, NONE of you would change my mind.

    You still have to explain why WPCentral has not written juvenile articles about why most CDMA carriers in the US have not gotten one WP7 or WP8 device. It's about prejudice, and I am starting to believe some of you are former WebOS users still blaming Sprint for the death of WebOS which will never blame HP, which brings me back to a Microsoft and their Team Windows Phone only wanting to code and encrypt the 2005 way rather than the 2012 way.
    Good point.... And I blame HP not Sprint.
    11-04-2012 06:32 PM
  23. mlm1950's Avatar
    I don't know who all of these CDMA carriers are that you are talking about, but in the US, Verizon and Sprint comprise about 95% of the CDMA market, and both of them carried WP7 devices, and Verizon will be carrying more than one WP8 device.

    None of that nonsense about 256-bit vs 512-bit encryption matters in the least with regards to Sprint deciding to not carry the first round of WP8 devices at launch.
    11-04-2012 06:45 PM
  24. dameon_03's Avatar
    i hope sprint gets onboard for wp8 and beyond. not only for windows phone but also the consumers. im on att but it sucks that sprint wp users have to jump ship for windows phone, especially those who have been with sprint for many years
    11-04-2012 07:51 PM
  25. Winterfang's Avatar
    Two words.

    LOL Sprint.
    11-04-2012 08:01 PM
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