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11-02-2012 10:01 PM
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  1. brmiller1976's Avatar
    When is $1 billion in subsidy payments not $1 billion in subsidy payments? When it is inconvenient for Nokia people to acknowledge. :P
    10-30-2012 12:52 AM
  2. Reflexx's Avatar
    When is $1 billion in subsidy payments not $1 billion in subsidy payments? When it is inconvenient for Nokia people to acknowledge. :P

    Or when they're actually paying for a product/service.
    a5cent likes this.
    10-30-2012 12:58 AM
  3. alpinestars1z's Avatar
    When is $1 billion in subsidy payments not $1 billion in subsidy payments? When it is inconvenient for Nokia people to acknowledge. :P
    I don't get it, lol. Someone explain.
    10-30-2012 01:17 AM
  4. db4williams's Avatar
    By the end of January, I should say.

    They aren't expecting it to move much once the 8S is introduced, so it will likely go to web only at that point. There'll be a lot of shuffling after the Christmas season. They'll clear out inventory in the physical stores.
    I don't know about this. I know the 8S looks better than the 822 but it has a lower performing processor. If I'm not mistaken the 8S only has a 1GHz dual core processor and the 822 has a 1.5GHz dual core. I know it probably wont matter with the OS but it may make a difference with 3rd party apps. So why replace a model with one that has even less performance?
    stmav likes this.
    10-30-2012 08:39 AM
  5. chevans920's Avatar
    42
    Love it! :lol:
    10-30-2012 08:52 AM
  6. stmav's Avatar
    I don't know about this. I know the 8S looks better than the 822 but it has a lower performing processor. If I'm not mistaken the 8S only has a 1GHz dual core processor and the 822 has a 1.5GHz dual core. I know it probably wont matter with the OS but it may make a difference with 3rd party apps. So why replace a model with one that has even less performance?
    This makes a lot of sense. I'll repeat the question, then why are they bothering with the 822 at all? Makes it seem like if you get one, you won't be getting much support. From the way a few have talked around here, they won't even be promoting it much in stores. It's like if you are interested in a nokia, don't bother with Verizon.
    10-30-2012 09:39 AM
  7. Mr. MacPhisto's Avatar
    This makes a lot of sense. I'll repeat the question, then why are they bothering with the 822 at all? Makes it seem like if you get one, you won't be getting much support. From the way a few have talked around here, they won't even be promoting it much in stores. It's like if you are interested in a nokia, don't bother with Verizon.
    As I've said elsewhere, Verizon was promised a high end Nokia and Nokia backed out when AT&T offered them a goodly amount of cash and full subsidized the phones themselves. But Verizon is still not entirely happy nor trusting of Nokia. They've been promised the quad core now, but they've had Nokia promise them things before only to have them essentially screw Verizon.

    Remember, Verizon has very little history with Nokia as of late. Most of that is because Nokia has not made CDMA devices much recently.

    This is a company that does not feel it needs the trendy handset - and they've done well without it. They turned down the iPhone initially and, despite its costs now, ended up paying much less for the iPhone when they got it.

    Thing is, Verizon knows that very few of their customers will leave because they don't have a Nokia 920. AT&T knows this too, but is hoping to draw T-Mobile and Sprint customers.

    My personal stance is that AT&T threw money at Nokia because they are trying to do something to put a dent in Verizon's armor. VZW's subscriber growth over the past couple of months has been extremely good. Their LTE advertising is gaining a lot of traction and they are even leaching off AT&T. That advertising campaign showing VZW with more LTE than all the other carriers combined has drawn people in.

    AT&T has a good network, but VZW does have a lot more LTE around the country and has also done an excellent job creating the perception of a vastly superior network. The data shows that VZW is slightly better with dropped calls (largely due to CDMA) and coverage, but there's not a massive difference between AT&T and VZW networks besides the LTE coverage. But Verizon made the network their branding long ago and has built a very loyal subscriber base because of it.
    10-30-2012 09:59 AM
  8. stmav's Avatar
    So Verizon is all about Verizon. And is butthurt because Nokia didn't bow to Big Red. I'm off contract and was going to either Verizon or AT&T. Verizon was first thought because I already have fios for internet and television. But lack of the 920, and things I have read here that have been very informative have changed that. Also I did research yesterday and for LTE in my city, AT&T scored higher than Verizon according to rootmetric's rootscore report. That clinched it.

    Though if someone were deciding between the two to switch, I would look up the report for their city. As I have no doubt the results vary from city to city.
    10-30-2012 10:13 AM
  9. Mr. MacPhisto's Avatar
    So Verizon is all about Verizon. And is butthurt because Nokia didn't bow to Big Red. I'm off contract and was going to either Verizon or AT&T. Verizon was first thought because I already have fios for internet and television. But lack of the 920, and things I have read here that have been very informative have changed that. Also I did research yesterday and for LTE in my city, AT&T scored higher than Verizon according to rootmetric's rootscore report. That clinched it.

    Though if someone were deciding between the two to switch, I would look up the report for their city. As I have no doubt the results vary from city to city.
    It wasn't about bowing to Verizon, it was about going back on what they'd said they'd do. There's a huge difference. Verizon's business model is not built on the phones and they tend to not subsidize phones as heavily as other carriers to get business. A big reason is because they don't need to. A lot of people that end up dissatisfied with their current carriers end up going to Verizon.

    The problem here was that there was a deal done. True, it was not signed but it was a handshake deal. From Verizon's perspective, Nokia broke a contract by not honoring their commitment.

    Nokia came to Verizon basically begging to be on their network and Verizon listened and liked what they saw.

    If Nokia doesn't deliver a high end device to them by early next year, don't expect to see much of Nokia from them in the future. And it'll all be Nokia's fault, not Verizon's. They wanted to expand their lineup.

    Granted, I understand Nokia taking AT&T's money considering the kind of shape they're in. And the Nokia was never going to be Verizon's one and only high end device. As we found out today, it appears that the HTC 8X for Verizon has wireless charging as well.

    I tend to think you'll see HTC taking the top line with Verizon going forward. A large part of it is that there's already a level of trust built up between the two whereas Nokia has to start out at ground level with Verizon and they didn't do a good job of it.

    There are still the promises of giving Verizon an exclusive on the quad-core Lumia in February/March, but the people at VZW are not holding their breath. They'll have the HTC quad core by then too - and HTC is reportedly working on integrating things like OIS into their phones to challenge Nokia and is working with Verizon to build more and better apps.

    I think HTC is Verizon's main dance partner for WP8. And I think HTC will end up as the top WP8 seller because they're getting their phones onto pretty much every carrier they can. Nokia may end up being AT&T only on the high end, meaning they'll only ever be a minor player in the US market. There's only so much you can do with one carrier - Apple found that out too. And the Lumia 920 does not have the same ceiling for market saturation as the iPhone does.

    Nokia is smart at launch for taking extra cash, but it could hurt them long term if they've alienated other carriers in doing so. T-Mobile wanted the 920 as well. I talked to a salesman in one of their stores recently who said their plan is to push the 8X strong.

    I think the 920 is a slightly better phone, depending on what you do, but I think the 8X will end up being the top seller once people get their hands on it.
    10-30-2012 01:23 PM
  10. stmav's Avatar
    Thank you for the informed response. I really hope that however you get your information, they appreciate the publicity you are giving them.

    And with what you said in that post, justifies that I've made the right decision for me. Phonewise and networkwise.
    10-30-2012 01:35 PM
  11. Gungzwei's Avatar
    I've gone out at 6AM on Black Friday for bags of horse feed (true story).

    I'll certainly have no problem hauling myself to a Verizon store for a great deal on a Lumia 922 (or whatever they want to call it).

    The Trophy has done well for me as a gateway windows phone. Hopefully all of Mr. MacPhisto's info is solid. For the areas I operate in, Verizon's coverage is solid. I have friends and family on other carriers that can't get a signal when I can. So, I really can't bring myself to leave Verizon for the 920 but I'll "wait and see" until February when my full 2yr contract is up on the Trophy before I pick up the HTC 8X. The 8X is a great phone, but it's still the Miss Congeniality to the bombshell of a 920.
    Last edited by Gungzwei; 10-30-2012 at 04:10 PM.
    10-30-2012 04:02 PM
  12. drjekel_mrhyde's Avatar
    The ATIV S is coming to Verizon as a exclusive, so just chill everyone
    10-30-2012 09:37 PM
  13. gkrew's Avatar
    Verizon could be getting the Lumia 1001 so don't fret about the 920. You will want the next one after the 920.
    Last edited by gkrew; 10-31-2012 at 09:15 AM. Reason: spelling
    10-31-2012 09:13 AM
  14. independentvolume's Avatar
    10-31-2012 10:08 AM
  15. fierywater's Avatar
    86
    That's Numberwang!
    10-31-2012 11:02 AM
  16. dogfish54's Avatar
    It wasn't about bowing to Verizon, it was about going back on what they'd said they'd do. There's a huge difference. Verizon's business model is not built on the phones and they tend to not subsidize phones as heavily as other carriers to get business. A big reason is because they don't need to. A lot of people that end up dissatisfied with their current carriers end up going to Verizon.

    The problem here was that there was a deal done. True, it was not signed but it was a handshake deal. From Verizon's perspective, Nokia broke a contract by not honoring their commitment.

    Nokia came to Verizon basically begging to be on their network and Verizon listened and liked what they saw.

    If Nokia doesn't deliver a high end device to them by early next year, don't expect to see much of Nokia from them in the future. And it'll all be Nokia's fault, not Verizon's. They wanted to expand their lineup.

    Granted, I understand Nokia taking AT&T's money considering the kind of shape they're in. And the Nokia was never going to be Verizon's one and only high end device. As we found out today, it appears that the HTC 8X for Verizon has wireless charging as well.

    I tend to think you'll see HTC taking the top line with Verizon going forward. A large part of it is that there's already a level of trust built up between the two whereas Nokia has to start out at ground level with Verizon and they didn't do a good job of it.

    There are still the promises of giving Verizon an exclusive on the quad-core Lumia in February/March, but the people at VZW are not holding their breath. They'll have the HTC quad core by then too - and HTC is reportedly working on integrating things like OIS into their phones to challenge Nokia and is working with Verizon to build more and better apps.

    I think HTC is Verizon's main dance partner for WP8. And I think HTC will end up as the top WP8 seller because they're getting their phones onto pretty much every carrier they can. Nokia may end up being AT&T only on the high end, meaning they'll only ever be a minor player in the US market. There's only so much you can do with one carrier - Apple found that out too. And the Lumia 920 does not have the same ceiling for market saturation as the iPhone does.

    Nokia is smart at launch for taking extra cash, but it could hurt them long term if they've alienated other carriers in doing so. T-Mobile wanted the 920 as well. I talked to a salesman in one of their stores recently who said their plan is to push the 8X strong.

    I think the 920 is a slightly better phone, depending on what you do, but I think the 8X will end up being the top seller once people get their hands on it.
    I don't doubt what you are saying is true, but I think there is more to the story. I would believe more that AT&T threatened to pull their support over them offering a large bunch of cash. Nokia really doesn't have a lot of clout in the US market, especially now.

    This story is also not consistent with what's going on in the rest of the world. Nokia is going after one launch partner for their premium device, Verizon hasn't exactly been a strong partner for Nokia, and from what I hear (from you) they feel like they hold all the chips in this poker game ... could Nokia really afford to trust them?

    Anyway, this is all just my opinion and not based on any insider information.

    For what it's worth, at $199, I think the 8X will have a hard time on Verizon, but I hope it does well and kicks Samsung and Apple to the gutter.
    11-02-2012 09:54 PM
  17. dogfish54's Avatar
    I think you'll start to see why Nokia chose an ATT exclusive. From what we can see, the list price of the Lumia 920 is greater than the 8X yet ATT are going to offer it for the same price. The 8X on Verizon is $199, what would they have tried to sell the 920 for, $249? (good luck selling millions of units at that price)

    Instead they have it on ATT (in all it's 32GB glory) for a rumored $149 and possibly a free charging pad. Killer.

    Part of me thinks $149 is going to be the price for discount retailers and it will be $199 at ATT. If that's the case, then my theory is blown ... oh well ...
    11-02-2012 10:01 PM
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