01-02-2015 03:12 AM
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  1. ScruffyT's Avatar
    Any reason why you chose to show images at different zooms? That is hardly a fair comparison...
    The originals can be found on the exact same page he got that picture from and the superiority of the 1020, IMO, is still easily seen. As far as your question, your answer is pretty much on the first page of the gsmarena article + the second paragraph of the fifth page. gsmarena, "Camera shootout: Six enter, only one leaves"
    08-27-2014 07:17 PM
  2. Qtweeder's Avatar
    08-27-2014 07:23 PM
  3. salmanahmad's Avatar
    better flash? 1020's flash is Xenon, way brighter and better than 5S' dual-LED

    HDR? read this: http://www.gsmarena.com/camera_shoot...iew-1104p4.php

    and the yellow tint gets better after Black update, so it won't be THAT much unnatural compared to the 5S
    The sole purpose of the flash isn't supposed to be brightness, for a very long time people didn't use flash on their smartphones because it would wash out colors.

    The Xenon flash is bright no doubt but it can't match the color accuracy the 5S's flash can. The yellow tint was improved after Lumia Black but is still very much there.

    HDR is needed, not just for boosting contrast but for when you are shooting a subject with a lot of backlight.

    The 1020 had an amazing sensor but if you compare it as a whole, 5S beat it, maybe not in the megapixel count or sharpness but that's not the only aspect of photography.
    08-27-2014 07:27 PM
  4. trekgraham's Avatar
    Why can't they do model numbers or names like they do cars? Keep one model number and just make it the 2015 Lumia 1020?
    08-27-2014 08:02 PM
  5. DavidinCT's Avatar
    2k video 4k video are just gimmicks, how many Percentage people own 2k-4k TVs or laptops.
    will you record 1-3 min of 2k-4k video or 2-xx mins FULL HD video with lossless zoom ?
    choice is yours.
    This is like DONT buy a car that can go 150 mph because it's a gimmick because your never going to go that fast.

    LOL, seriously, I own a 1080i Rear projection TV right now...still, WHy ? Because I plan on going 4K all the way(70"+), Prices are down now but, waiting for a TV to fully support HDMI 2.0 (it's multiple standards like Bluetooth profiles, any thing that has PART of it can claim HDMI 2.0 but, I want the full support). Even the $12,000 85" 4K model does not fully support all the standards of HDMI 2.0...

    Just because you wont use it, or "THINK" anyone else will, does that mean it's a actual gimmick ? LOL

    Yummy !!!! :)
    08-27-2014 08:35 PM
  6. DJCBS's Avatar
    thats just sad and lame, Pureview should be WPs secret weapon forever,why should evil google get their hands on it
    WP carries on the legacy of symbian,maemo/meego and Windows Mobile and WP7
    5 Operating systems which ruled the world before android and ios and the best of each OS has made it into WP8.1(some are yet to feature though :( )
    nokia has always been my favourite brand and ive seen symbian,meego/maemo etc stumble because Elop stopped it at the last minute instead of letting the platforms mature
    history shouldnt repeat itself,nokia should continue being WP exclusive
    The problem is, although Microsoft bought the PureView name, they didn't bought the tech. The tech belongs to Nokia as Nokia holds the patents which are now open to licensing. Being Nokia an independent company, they can do whatever they want and have no more obligations towards Windows Phone.
    Windows Phone wasn't making Nokia any money. The moment Microsoft bought Nokia's D&S, Nokia turned to the operating systems that offer them opportunities for money. Ultimately, it was Microsoft's purchase of the D&S division that put an end to the exclusivity of Nokia-tech. It sucks for Microsoft because they can license the tech but have no exclusivity on it and have to invest in their own R&D to offer something unique. But from Nokia's perspective, it allows them to make more money out of the tech they created. Microsoft was aware of what they were doing when they decided to move on Nokia's D&S division.
    Karthik Naik likes this.
    08-27-2014 08:37 PM
  7. Zulfigar's Avatar
    The problem is, although Microsoft bought the PureView name, they didn't bought the tech. The tech belongs to Nokia as Nokia holds the patents which are now open to licensing. Being Nokia an independent company, they can do whatever they want and have no more obligations towards Windows Phone.
    Windows Phone wasn't making Nokia any money. The moment Microsoft bought Nokia's D&S, Nokia turned to the operating systems that offer them opportunities for money. Ultimately, it was Microsoft's purchase of the D&S division that put an end to the exclusivity of Nokia-tech. It sucks for Microsoft because they can license the tech but have no exclusivity on it and have to invest in their own R&D to offer something unique. But from Nokia's perspective, it allows them to make more money out of the tech they created. Microsoft was aware of what they were doing when they decided to move on Nokia's D&S division.
    From my understanding, Microsoft bought the people, the patents, and the tech from Nokia. I never looked into it besides the WPCentral stories though.
    Karthik Naik likes this.
    08-27-2014 08:58 PM
  8. bijak_riyandi's Avatar
    HDR is needed, not just for boosting contrast but for when you are shooting a subject with a lot of backlight.

    The 1020 had an amazing sensor but if you compare it as a whole, 5S beat it, maybe not in the megapixel count or sharpness but that's not the only aspect of photography.
    did you read the article in the link?
    08-28-2014 01:15 AM
  9. bijak_riyandi's Avatar
    From my understanding, Microsoft bought the people, the patents, and the tech from Nokia. I never looked into it besides the WPCentral stories though.
    that's what I heard too...
    any patents related to the D&S belongs to Microsoft Mobile now
    Karthik Naik and bitwise like this.
    08-28-2014 01:17 AM
  10. salmanahmad's Avatar
    did you read the article in the link?
    Yes, I did.
    08-28-2014 07:40 AM
  11. BilalSoomro17's Avatar
    Wasn't Nokia using 41mp Pureview way back on a Symbian phone? The N900???? That used a hamster cage processor.
    N900 had 41 megapixel camera?
    08-28-2014 07:44 AM
  12. amrut_m's Avatar
    Their are Flaws, Cons, Positives, Negatives,Awesome things and their are Great things.
    Its the way you take it.
    No matter what their are very little things that will satisfy you completely.

    For me I can live with the shot to shot times, I most of the time shoot in .DNG so yellow tint is'nt a problem for me.

    The 1020 and 808 are of those niche devices which are hard to let go,even though they have aged,they are superior.
    Even after years, SONY and SAMSUNG who have good knowledge about cameras, are not able to beat the Nokia's 1020/808, heck even the Z series did not touch the 1520 camera's richness.

    had high hopes from SONY but disappointment, Samsung just attached a CAMERA to a Phone and called it the K Zoom.
    08-28-2014 08:10 AM
  13. salmanahmad's Avatar
    Their are Flaws, Cons, Positives, Negatives,Awesome things and their are Great things.
    Its the way you take it.
    No matter what their are very little things that will satisfy you completely.

    For me I can live with the shot to shot times, I most of the time shoot in .DNG so yellow tint is'nt a problem for me.

    The 1020 and 808 are of those niche devices which are hard to let go,even though they have aged,they are superior.
    Even after years, SONY and SAMSUNG who have good knowledge about cameras, are not able to beat the Nokia's 1020/808, heck even the Z series did not touch the 1520 camera's richness.

    had high hopes from SONY but disappointment, Samsung just attached a CAMERA to a Phone and called it the K Zoom.
    Actually, the Xperia Z2 beat the Lumia 1520 in some of the tests I've seen.
    08-28-2014 08:52 AM
  14. amrut_m's Avatar
    Actually, the Xperia Z2 beat the Lumia 1520 in some of the tests I've seen.
    Can you show ?
    Links, Pics.
    08-28-2014 09:41 AM
  15. Karthik Naik's Avatar
    N900 had 41 megapixel camera?
    no
    08-28-2014 10:47 AM
  16. BilalSoomro17's Avatar
    No I saw Both Z2's Camera is no Match For 1520 But Bad app Quality and Few issues Make Z2 Better overall
    08-28-2014 11:27 AM
  17. DJCBS's Avatar
    From my understanding, Microsoft bought the people, the patents, and the tech from Nokia. I never looked into it besides the WPCentral stories though.
    Actually no.
    Microsoft bought the people (well, some of them) and a couple of brands which AREN'T patents but copyrights. Microsoft bough the copyrights to the brands "Lumia", "Asha" and "PureView". They also bought the copyrights for the design portfolio (well, what was left of it anyway).

    HOWEVER they did NOT buy any of the patents. The patent portfolio remains entirely with Nokia. They, however, signed licensing deals to use those patents. That doesn't mean, though, that they own the patent. It means only that they'll be using that tech from Nokia legally. Nokia retains the patents and the rights to licensing them to whomever wishes to license it.
    Actually, it is very likely that, for example, the PureView tech, may end up on an iPhone as Apple hired one of the former senior leaders of the PureView Team (not all ex-Nokia employees accepted to move to Microsoft).
    DoctorSaline likes this.
    08-28-2014 01:33 PM
  18. DoctorSaline's Avatar
    Actually no.
    Microsoft bought the people (well, some of them) and a couple of brands which AREN'T patents but copyrights. Microsoft bough the copyrights to the brands "Lumia", "Asha" and "PureView". They also bought the copyrights for the design portfolio (well, what was left of it anyway).

    HOWEVER they did NOT buy any of the patents. The patent portfolio remains entirely with Nokia. They, however, signed licensing deals to use those patents. That doesn't mean, though, that they own the patent. It means only that they'll be using that tech from Nokia legally. Nokia retains the patents and the rights to licensing them to whomever wishes to license it.
    Actually, it is very likely that, for example, the PureView tech, may end up on an iPhone as Apple hired one of the former senior leaders of the PureView Team (not all ex-Nokia employees accepted to move to Microsoft).
    Could you provide some links that explain this patent licensing deal?


    Could be why they also signed cross patent licensing deal with Canon.
    Last edited by DoctorSaline; 08-28-2014 at 02:06 PM.
    08-28-2014 01:51 PM
  19. DJCBS's Avatar
    Could you provide some links that explain this patent licensing deal?


    Could be why they also signed cross patent licensing deal with Canon.
    All that is part of the proxy materials given to shareholders. Nokia has them online too but I'm not sure if they're still up. But Google "Nokia 2013 extraordinary meeting" and you may still find them.

    The cross patent licensing deal with Canon can indeed be related to camera tech. Also, remember Nokia had a close partnership with Carl Zeiss (now just Zeiss). It's not clear that the partnership continued with Microsoft. It's likely that either Zeiss was not interested in partnerships with Microsoft or that Microsoft decided to drop the Zeiss lenses in favour of cheaper ones by Canon that can bring the prices of the phones with them down.
    In either case, the partnership with Canon may indicate that they are trying to have something that differentiates them now that PureView will no longer be exclusive, yes.
    Let us remember that Microsoft will have to go not only against possible Nokia-imaging-powered handsets, they also have to face Samsung's increased optical capacities as well as the only company that can actually give Nokia cameras a run for their money: Sony.
    DoctorSaline and Beijendorf like this.
    08-28-2014 05:55 PM
  20. Carlos002's Avatar
    41 Megapixel, would be hard, housing snapdragon, remember this processor are already customized by qualcomm, Microsoft would have to wark hard to push the 41mpx
    08-28-2014 06:04 PM
  21. ScruffyT's Avatar
    Yes, I did.
    Then why do keep pushing your "overall" argument so hard. Both of the articles (also probably the two most detailed out there as well) mentioned, in response to your comments, that directly compare the devices come to the exact opposite of your conclusion, even with the faults that you're harping on. And as far as the hdr goes, again, the 5s lost to the 1020, not to mention that is still has a bracketing feature.

    I really don't understand. Why can't one of the higher end Android devices be the better overall camera phone considering that they fared better against the 1020's raw capabilities and beat both the 1020 and 5s in the video recording department?
    bijak_riyandi likes this.
    08-28-2014 08:31 PM
  22. Squachy's Avatar
    So my understanding of the 1020 and snapdragon S4 situation is pretty much like how a desktop PC handles graphics. Either the graphics card does it, or the CPU does it. The CPU can render the graphics but it renders it incredibly slow to be completely useless at the task, whereas the graphics card GPU handles it with ease.
    Im guessing the same thing happened with the 1020. The snapdragon S4 only supported 20megapixels (im shocked I thought it supported less) so they needed to go the software route to render it off the snapdragon S4 CPU's or whatever other hardware on the SoC it was allowed to access. It explains why the picture taking is super slow.

    Throw a snapdragon 805 in a 1020 and it the picture taking abilities would be enormously faster because the dedicated Image processor supports up to 55 megapixels.
    08-28-2014 08:51 PM
  23. bijak_riyandi's Avatar
    Then why do keep pushing your "overall" argument so hard. Both of the articles (also probably the two most detailed out there as well) mentioned, in response to your comments, that directly compare the devices come to the exact opposite of your conclusion, even with the faults that you're harping on. And as far as the hdr goes, again, the 5s lost to the 1020, not to mention that is still has a bracketing feature.

    I really don't understand. Why can't one of the higher end Android devices be the better overall camera phone considering that they fared better against the 1020's raw capabilities and beat both the 1020 and 5s in the video recording department?
    and salmanahmad, if you took your time to browse the whole article in the link I provided before from the beginning to the end, you should see that your arguments about flash and white balance are also inaccurate
    ScruffyT likes this.
    08-29-2014 02:48 AM
  24. Karthik Naik's Avatar
    i dont believe this, the 5S doesnt take better pics, its uses too much flash when on auto and pics arent as clear as my nexus 5,Z10 ,720 ,820(my dad had a 5S)
    nokia doesnt have a slow camera,it depends on the app,proshot and nokia camera need more time to load,microsoft camera is deadly fast to load and take pics and is better for low light as well apparently though it lacks manual controls
    as for faster focus on android phones i dont think so,i own a nexus 5 and it takes longer to focus than my other phones,often im left with a blurry image because it decided to refocus again,same with the S5,S4
    S Vaibhav and amrut_m like this.
    08-29-2014 08:13 AM
  25. bijak_riyandi's Avatar
    The yellow tint issue was on Amber
    after the Black update it gets better

    stop living in the past...
    08-29-2014 05:38 PM
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