Lumia 950/950xl or Surface Phone?

Cruncher04

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People are expecting to be able to store Win32 apps on the phone to use in Continuum. Not run full Photoshop on a 5" screen. I don't think that's a longshot, either.

Why would they expect that? Windows Mobile does not support Win32 at all. It is not a question of processor architecture but the OS needs to contain all the Win32 sub-system.
Microsoft has 2 OS' for a reason, Windows mobile (for both x86 and ARM) for Phones and Windows (for both x86 and ARM) for tablets and desktops. Unfortunately they kind of killed Windows for ARM (aka Windows RT), which had a complete Win32 subsystem.

And then of course people need to understand, that upcoming x86 phone will not be a high-end phone. It will most likely contain the Atom X3 SoC. As such it will be rather low-end but ok for business needs like email, Lync, Office etc.
 
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AR777

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Why would they expect that? Windows Mobile does not support Win32 at all. It is not a question of processor architecture but the OS needs to contain all the Win32 sub-system.
Microsoft has 2 OS' for a reason, Windows mobile (for both x86 and ARM) for Phones and Windows (for both x86 and ARM) for tablets and desktops. Unfortunately they kind of killed Windows for ARM (aka Windows RT), which had a complete Win32 subsystem.

And then of course people need to understand, that upcoming x86 phone will not be a high-end phone. It will most likely contain the Atom X3 SoC. As such it will be rather low-end but ok for business needs like email, Lync, Office etc.

But there is no Windows Mobile. It's Windows for Mobile and that's completely different thing!
It does supports Win32 apps, potentially, because it just needs to run as a Windows for Desktops - and making Windows run differently based on the device family is exactly what Continuum should do eventually!
 

AR777

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To reference the main question of this topic:
That's all a question of specs!
Personally, I'm a little disappointed with the choose of Qalcomm's failing-high hitting Snapdragon 810 for the 950XL, and I wish Microsoft would put 4GB RAM in the next flagship(s).
So yeah, if the "Surface Phone" is gonna have some high end specs it will be my choice, BUT only with the RIGHT Intel Processor!
The Intel Atom X3 is not an high end model no matter what - better be the X5, or even better, a Skylake gen. processor.
BTW, let's not forget that current Intel's processors doesn't support more than 13MP cameras, so that's another issue..
I guess we all just have to wait and see..
 

Cruncher04

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But there is no Windows Mobile. It's Windows for Mobile and that's completely different thing!

I do not care how you call it but Microsoft calls it "Windows 10 mobile". In either case, it does _NOT_ contain the Win32 subsystem. And Win32 is not something what Microsoft can easily add. If they want to have Win32 on a device, they would deploy Windows/RT not Windows Mobile.
Don't mix the 2 OS up, they only share part of the kernel and the WinRT runtime. It is the shared WinRT runtime, which enables Continuum.
 

Angry_Mushroom

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Surface Phone at best remains a rumor. Even the name is not confirmed. In fact the rumors of an Intel powered phone could simply be a Lumia 960. On the other hand... if we are talking a device aimed at businesses and productivity, I don't forsee ground breaking specs. All I can really say is to temper your expectations and delusions. Lumia has caused a lot of salt due to wild speculations, and doing the same for a theoretical surface device will lead to the same result.
 

Wevenhuis

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We know virtually nothing about the rumored surface phone of if it will come. could be it will never come just like the surface mini.

I hope the rumours are true that microsoft is making a smartphone that supports stylus functionality (Wacom or N-trig). Not still sure if this is the 950XL or this rumored supposedly surface phone timeline. It it also supports continuum, double goody!
 

AR777

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Guys, Satya Nadella himself confirmed the Intel powered smartphone, and sources inside Microsoft says it's gonna see light early next year, possibly Q2.
So it's gonna be here, pretty soon, and it's not the Lumia 960. It's probably the enterprise model.
As I said on my last comment, We just have to wait for both devices to compare between them. Every device has it's own Pros. and Cons.
 

a5cent

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WinRT is a fancy wrapper for Win32.
Absolutely not.

This statement was only true for W8 and its predecessors. It is no longer true for W10. It was never true for WP and it definitely isn't true for W10M either.

W10M ships with the same WinRT runtime and APIs as W10, but it only includes a small subset of Win32 which MS calls Windows Core.

Either way, Cruncher04's statements are correct. W10M will not run Win32 software. Any phone that runs Win32 software will ship with W10, not W10M.
 
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Cruncher04

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W10M ships with the same WinRT runtime and APIs as W10, but it only includes a small subset of Win32 which MS calls Windows Core.

Precisely! I might add that in addition to the missing Win32 components, there is much more missing. Strictly speaking Win32 are just the lower level components, which offer a native interface. But in order to run a desktop app you typically need much more, like .Net/CLR, WPF, COM etc.
 

Gamely Lounges

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if I buy a 950/xl I'm going to be really annoyed if MS releases an even better device 6 months later.

This happened to me with the 920. When the 1020 came out just a little later I was sad. But it would have cost too much money for me to switch.

If MS is going to release a surface phone I am confident it is going to have similar quality as the surface tablets.
 

a5cent

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Precisely! I might add that in addition to the missing Win32 components, there is much more missing. Strictly speaking Win32 are just the lower level components, which offer a native interface. But in order to run a desktop app you typically need much more, like .Net/CLR, WPF, COM etc.
Yup, although the CLR, despite not being part of WinRT, is still part of W10M. Unfortunately, there's no simple way to reference the gigabytes worth of desktop related components and APIs that exist only in W10 but are not part of W10M.
 

heickelrrx

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Hmm why Microsoft killing Lumia? I didn't see that.

For surface phone. Don't place your hope too high. Surface is a productivity thing and same goes to surface Hub. Surface phone may exclusive for business costumer and never step in consumer market
 

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