Start Screen option removed WHY ?

[mjrtoo]

I have no problem whatsoever with people complaining about what they don't like, or praising what they do like. That is, after all, the reason for the Preview in the first place.

(rant begin)

What is getting on my nerves is the whining that something "is absolute crap and I will go back to something else" based on an obviously unfinished design. Why not just calm down a little bit, try it out, if you don't like it that's fine, it does not mean that Microsoft should fire all their staff, have the top executives killed, and sell off the remaining assets. It just means you don't like it in its current form. By all means say that, leave the appropriate feedback, and patiently wait like the rest of us to see the next build.

(rant over)

What is getting in my nerves are the a holes that don't read the entire message and rant about the obvious.

 

[Michael Alan Goff]

I have it installed, it's currently crap.

Nope, it's currently alpha/beta. Poor performance, but getting better with each update and shows promise with the underlying ideas.

See? I can act like my opinions are facts too!

 

[mjrtoo]

Nope, it's currently alpha/beta. Poor performance, but getting better with each update and shows promise with the underlying ideas.

See? I can act like my opinions are facts too!

Not acting like fact, it's my opinion. I suggest that you preface everything you read with the letters imo, because that's what forums are.

 

[swanlee]

The difference is 8.1 was a finished product, this is a WORK IN PROGRESS and Microsoft clearly said THE TOUCH STUFF IS NOT FINISHED YET so stop whining that it's unfinished in a pre-release technical preview FFS. You have no business running the TP if you can't even understand that, you're just bogging things down with your uneducated whining and wasting everybody's time.

This is what the preview is, they take away features and build them, put them back in, disable features temporarily. Install Xp and stop whining.

Yes it is much better to whine about a finished product where the code is locked and they won't change anything as opposed to whining about a preview where MS might have the time to listen to people and actually change things.

The idea of only complaining till AFTER an OS is released is pretty silly. NOW is actually the proper and best time to complain and let MS know what needs to change in Win 10.

 

[swanlee]

It's likely removed because it will be possible to have Live tiles on the desktop.

Funny thing is the desktop is greyed out and untouchable in tablet mode. They'd have to change that and make the desktop scrollable and also auto hide the taskbar for it to be a decent Tablet GUI. Which means it would look just like the start screen anyway.

 

[swanlee]

Well, I've said this so many times in the past 4 days, I'm getting tired of it... let me put it in all caps, see if the message gets through:

THIS IS A TECHNICAL PREVIEW. IT IS UNFINISHED SOFTWARE. IT DOESN'T WORK WELL NOR IS IT FULL FEATURED YET.

Did that do it this time? Did the message finally get through some people's thick skulls? Maybe if I add a bit more color and boldness:

THIS IS A TECHNICAL PREVIEW. IT IS UNFINISHED SOFTWARE. IT DOESN'T WORK WELL NOR IS IT FULL FEATURED YET.

Now?

Wait for the final version if you want good software for 7 or 8 upgraders.

Do you know how STUPID it sounds to tell people to wait for the final code before giving opinions about the preview versions?

We are not complaining because our current pc's are buggy or having issues, we know that happens with Beta software we are complaining because the current direction of the OS is not going to work out as well for Tablet users compared to Win 8.

MS execs have said their intent for Win 10 is to remove the start screen and charms and have the taskbar visible at all time even in Tablet mode.

These items are not acceptable for a good Tablet GUI and are a huge step back from Win 8.1. If we waited to comment on this until it was released then it would be to late for MS to change anything about it.

 

[Michael Alan Goff]

Not acting like fact, it's my opinion. I suggest that you preface everything you read with the letters imo, because that's what forums are.

​I try to make sure that it's obvious that it's my opinion, generally trying to avoid stating things like they're facts. I might fail in a rush, but I try.

 

[mjrtoo]

​I try to make sure that it's obvious that it's my opinion, generally trying to avoid stating things like they're facts. I might fail in a rush, but I try.

I'm happy for you, I don't take forums that seriously that it matters in my life.

 

[Paolo Cardelli]

I installed the tech preview of Windows 10 in a hyper-v VM last night. (and unfortunately that's probably as far as it will ever get).

To my shock (not surprise, as it is Microsoft after all) they removed the option to disregard the start menu and return to the Windows 8.1 start screen.

After all the endless discussions about the start menu / start screen issue in Windows 8, they still haven't understood that people want OPTIONS. But no instead of keeping the option to run the start screen (which was still in build 9901) they simply removed the option in build 9926.

So now this Windows 8.1 user is going to be forced to using a start menu that is worse than the old start menu found prior to Windows 8 and far far worse than the start screen in Windows 8. How does Microsoft believe this start menu is going to convince anyone from switching from 8 or 7 to 10. Haven't they learned their lesson and still refuse to offer people options ?

Can Microsoft explain to me how this startmenu makes any sense on a tablet device ? How this even makes sense on a desktop PC. And why was it necessary to remove the perfectly viable option to continue using Windows 8.1 start screen with all the refinements made to it over the course of two years ?

Now before anyone comes in here and explains to me how I can make the start menu "full screen", I already know the option exist, but it doesn't even remotely resemble the start screen.

1) Vertical scrolling instead of horizontal scrolling.
2) no inline search, have to use the taskbar, which incidentially is always visible, even on tablet mode and on an actual tablet. Auto hiding the taskbar disables search by the way
3) no apparent way to select multiple tiles, grouping feature made worse
4) resizing tiles is broken
5) left side of the startmenu contains useless stuff that cannot be removed
6) pin to start is seriously broken
7) all apps list is now replacing the useless left stuff when clicking on all apps, instead of the far superior all apps list in the 8.1 start screen

Now I do appreciate this is a tech review, but specifically removing the ability to use the 8.1 start screen clearly indicates Microsoft is planning on retiring the start screen, hence making the exact same mistake as they did with Windows 8.

Please for the love of god, re-introduce the ability to select to use the start screen, so you guys can botch the startmenu any way you like, I don't want it on my desktops, and I sure as hell don't want it on my tablet.

I just opened a new topic about this on Official Windows Insider Forums right HERE

Just keep this fresh and updated, and they will surely notice this thing more.
They've still 8 or so months left, let's hope for the best...

 

[Jonnie LasVegas]

What surprises me is that now that people are starting to get used to, and like, using Windows 8, they're reverting back to the old look and feel of Windows. My mother now loves using Windows 8 in touch mode and avoids desktop mode. When I showed her that in Windows 10 it's reverted she was annoyed. Now my brother, who has been incessantly annoying her to ditch Windows for a Mac, has just won the battle.

What doesn't Microsoft understand about people liking options??? Some people would rather boot into touch mode, not desktop. Why remove the option (as far as I can tell it's been removed, correct me if I'm wrong)?

On the plus side, she is going to give me her PC when she does buy her Mac.

 

[Michael Alan Goff]

I'm happy for you, I don't take forums that seriously that it matters in my life.

Articulating your points, as well as having it understood, should always be important. What other point is there in communicating?

 

[mjrtoo]

Articulating your points, as well as having it understood, should always be important. What other point is there in communicating?

Here's my point, you've successfully derailed this thread off topic to discuss something that is a perception. To me it's crap, to hundreds of other people it's crap. I'm not going to preface everything I say with imo, that should be obvious and totally unnecessary.

 

[Michael Alan Goff]

What surprises me is that now that people are starting to get used to, and like, using Windows 8, they're reverting back to the old look and feel of Windows. My mother now loves using Windows 8 in touch mode and avoids desktop mode. When I showed her that in Windows 10 it's reverted she was annoyed. Now my brother, who has been incessantly annoying her to ditch Windows for a Mac, has just won the battle. What doesn't Microsoft understand about people liking options??? Some people would rather boot into touch mode, not desktop. Why remove the option (as far as I can tell it's been removed, correct me if I'm wrong)?On the plus side, she is going to give me her PC when she does buy her Mac.

"Oh god, there's change. I guess I should change everything now because of some build of Windows that isn't anywhere near a finished product" makes no sense at all. Even without knowing he cycle, OS X even further from 8 than this preview of 10. Makes no sense. As for whether or not you can have tablet mode by default, doesn't look like it yet. But this is quite a ways from done, and I suggest people use the feedback tool to ensure they know we want this.

 

[mjrtoo]

"Oh god, there's change. I guess I should change everything now because of some build of Windows that isn't anywhere near a finished product" makes no sense at all. Even without knowing he cycle, OS X even further from 8 than this preview of 10. Makes no sense. As for whether or not you can have tablet mode by default, doesn't look like it yet. But this is quite a ways from done, and I suggest people use the feedback tool to ensure they know we want this.

Ok man, WE KNOW THIS, it's not like you're revealing some hidden truth here. We know this is beta, we know to report this on insider. If you don't like what you're reading just don't read it, because right now, you sound like a pompous jerk. (Just my opinion of course)

 

[Michael Alan Goff]

Here's my point, you've successfully derailed this thread off topic to discuss something that is a perception. To me it's crap, to hundreds of other people it's crap. I'm not going to preface everything I say with imo, that should be obvious and totally unnecessary.

​I think the topic at hand has ran its course. Seriously, at this point nothing of any value is likely to be brought in. All I see are going to be people agreeing or disagreeing using the same lines of reasoning. People will also insult each other.

 

[psiu_glen]

Do you know how STUPID it sounds to tell people to wait for the final code before giving opinions about the preview versions?

We are not complaining because our current pc's are buggy or having issues, we know that happens with Beta software we are complaining because the current direction of the OS is not going to work out as well for Tablet users compared to Win 8.

MS execs have said their intent for Win 10 is to remove the start screen and charms and have the taskbar visible at all time even in Tablet mode.

These items are not acceptable for a good Tablet GUI and are a huge step back from Win 8.1. If we waited to comment on this until it was released then it would be to late for MS to change anything about it.

Some of the MS defenders were the same way with WP 8.1 Preview.

Criticize things like the complete gutting of People/Games/Photos? Dare to insinuate that the new dialer is a steaming piece of horse pooky? Not actually appreciate 30 games in the app menu?

Well, that meant you didn't have the l337 coding chops needed (to hit "install update") like they did. And thou shalt not criticize the Microsoft or their prophet Belfiore!

 

[mjrtoo]

​I think the topic at hand has ran its course. Seriously, at this point nothing of any value is likely to be brought in. All I see are going to be people agreeing or disagreeing using the same lines of reasoning. People will also insult each other.

It is rude to come in and push the thread off topic and criticize peoples posts and think everyone should be like them, you're right.

 

[PepperdotNet]

What surprises me is that now that people are starting to get used to, and like, using Windows 8, they're reverting back to the old look and feel of Windows. My mother now loves using Windows 8 in touch mode and avoids desktop mode. When I showed her that in Windows 10 it's reverted she was annoyed. Now my brother, who has been incessantly annoying her to ditch Windows for a Mac, has just won the battle.

What doesn't Microsoft understand about people liking options??? Some people would rather boot into touch mode, not desktop. Why remove the option (as far as I can tell it's been removed, correct me if I'm wrong)?

On the plus side, she is going to give me her PC when she does buy her Mac.

Your mother loves Windows 8 in touch mode so she's getting a mac. They have those with touch screens now? This really makes no sense.

Keep on providing feedback on what you want the final product to be. If, when it's released, it's not something she likes, what she has is not going to just quit working. Just don't upgrade, simple as that.

 

[Jonnie LasVegas]

I know it makes no sense, I think it was just her old stubbornness coming out. And my brother is her baby (youngest) so that may also have something to do with it. But what can you do, right?

 

[Michael Alan Goff]

It is rude to come in and push the thread off topic and criticize peoples posts and think everyone should be like them, you're right.

​It technically only derailed the conversation when you decided to make it a side conversation. I'm guessing, according to your own bad logic, that makes you rude. Also, a lot of the people here seem to think I should share their opinion of the start screen. I, on the other hand, am rude for suggesting people have standards.