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03-21-2015 11:35 AM
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  1. Torcher Death's Avatar
    Yes we have an big situation in the case of app quality & what with even the apps made by Microsoft themselves are better on the other platforms than WP.
    The only remedy for this, that I see, is to start at home & make it mandatory for all MS employees right from the top executives to use only WP & other MS products atleast during office hours.
    prasath1234 likes this.
    03-16-2015 02:19 PM
  2. Spectrum90's Avatar
    The article is wrong. The smartphone market is transversal, a big part of the smartphone users couldn't care less about apps. The problems of Windows Phone are way bigger than the app gap.
    Tom Snyder likes this.
    03-16-2015 02:32 PM
  3. Torcher Death's Avatar
    The article is wrong. The smartphone market is transversal, a big part of the smartphone users couldn't care less about apps. The problems of Windows Phone are way bigger than the app gap.
    How so ??
    Pretty much everyone I've shown my phone to has been impressed & the only 2 negatives I keep hearing are -
    1) Sad state of apps
    2) OS limitations
    MikeSo and Laura Knotek like this.
    03-16-2015 03:19 PM
  4. Spectrum90's Avatar
    How so ??
    Pretty much everyone I've shown my phone to has been impressed & the only 2 negatives I keep hearing are -
    1) Sad state of apps
    2) OS limitations

    You and your friends aren't the world. Some people only basic features of the phone and apps, but they still don't want a Windows Phone.
    03-16-2015 03:36 PM
  5. MikeSo's Avatar
    You and your friends aren't the world. Some people only basic features of the phone and apps, but they still don't want a Windows Phone.
    Explain.
    03-16-2015 04:20 PM
  6. snowmutt's Avatar
    Remember when Microsoft brass announced with sighs of relief that they were at "criticle mass" of the app gap and all was good?

    Honestly agree with them. Now it is obvious we are at the bottom of the "update gap" as opposed to "app gap".

    By the way- while it is true apps are updated and have more features on iOS and Android, I swear the Android versions do not get the criticisms they deserve for how often they lag and freeze. If Android users are honest, they need to restart a ton of their apps more often than is mentioned, but it is such an accepted way of life it is done with barely a thought.

    iOS? No doubt- their strict requirements mean most of those apps run great, and it is a premium consumer pool they have, so updates come often from developers to kepp Apple users coming back and due to the competition for those dollars.
    Last edited by snowmutt; 03-16-2015 at 08:09 PM.
    03-16-2015 06:02 PM
  7. HeyCori's Avatar
    What they should do is exactly what Samsung is. They should partner with bestbuy and have a section dedicated to windows. Have their surface line, windows phones, and even the band I hear is going to best buy all on display and advertised really well. They should even add the blu devices Microsoft stores sell. Microsoft stores are hard to come by and I'm sure folk that know nothing about windows phone have never even heard of blu's devices. I feel best buy would sell them like hotcakes at their price points.
    Microsoft kind of already does that. Certain Best Buys' have a "Windows Store" that is supposed to showcase the entire range of Windows products. Not all of them do though. My Best Buy has a Windows Store but it only shows off Windows all-in-ones, desktops and some tablets.
    03-16-2015 06:21 PM
  8. Jazmac's Avatar
    Explain.
    dis-gon-b-gud.jpg
    03-16-2015 08:07 PM
  9. Eustis99's Avatar
    I hear what your saying but I mean they should have it show off everything. From the surface line, to their phones and even the band when it's in stock at best buy locations.

    Microsoft kind of already does that. Certain Best Buys' have a "Windows Store" that is supposed to showcase the entire range of Windows products. Not all of them do though. My Best Buy has a Windows Store but it only shows off Windows all-in-ones, desktops and some tablets.
    03-16-2015 08:13 PM
  10. mary beth hale's Avatar
    Click image for larger version. 

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    You've got the "image as a reply/comment" down to a fine art. Love it!
    Jazmac likes this.
    03-16-2015 08:16 PM
  11. Spectrum90's Avatar
    Explain.
    Windows Phone is too refined and unconventional for this filthy world.
    03-16-2015 11:10 PM
  12. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    Microsoft kind of already does that. Certain Best Buys' have a "Windows Store" that is supposed to showcase the entire range of Windows products. Not all of them do though. My Best Buy has a Windows Store but it only shows off Windows all-in-ones, desktops and some tablets.
    Unfortunately I haven't seen one yet. That's something that needs to be expanded.

    Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk
    HeyCori, mark233 and Eustis99 like this.
    03-16-2015 11:15 PM
  13. Phone Guy 4567's Avatar
    To me the reason that MS has failed with Windows Phone is simple they were very late to the party, and iOS and Android were already established as the market leaders. It would be crazy for the average consumer to pick Windows Phone over the dominant platforms, it would be like choosing Beta over VHS even though VHS had the majority of the market.

    At this point I think MS has just about given up on Windows Phone, with universal apps and Windows 10 for Mobile being their last attempt to get marketshare.
    MikeSo, MikeX74 and prasath1234 like this.
    03-16-2015 11:54 PM
  14. Tien-Lin Chang's Avatar
    By the way- while it is true apps are updated and have more features on iOS and Android, I swear the Android versions do not get the criticisms they deserve for how often they lag and freeze. If Android users are honest, they need to restart a ton of their apps more often than is mentioned, but it is such an accepted way of life it is done with barely a thought.
    It is pointless to judge users on other platform. M$ and fans need to earn them instead of judging them.

    Back to the time when korea cars were considered as junks, were they win the market share by judging customers buying cars from other brands?

    I don't know how MS can make up the app gap(I don't think univeral app will work thought), but those niche apps in different countries are the keys to attract normal user to "try" this platform. Remember when we say the word "try" it still cost money from their wallet, so the attracting force must be strong enough - from both hardware and software aspect. MS really need to change their strategy to a wat faster pace if they really want to gain some market share.
    03-16-2015 11:55 PM
  15. Robinsonmac's Avatar
    One of the biggest barriers besides lost mindshare & phones not being available to buy & displayed horribly if at all in stores is the lack of native Google apps. IMO a lot of consumers would at least try & stick with WP if it had native Google apps, Google knows this & that's why they don't make any apps for WP.
    03-17-2015 12:38 AM
  16. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    I completely agree with the OP in regards to the app problems not being solely about the gap but also about the update issues. I also agree with the poor displays at stores. Being in a country (UK) where WP has a fairly good share of the market the presence of MS in stores is still fairly dismal in comparison to Apple or even Samsung.

    Let's not get started on the crippling of phones by carriers exclusives in the US and even here in the UK and other parts of the EU.

    There is one other aspect I'd like to point out in regards to the app debate.

    It's difficult to change minds of people when your OS is rarely advertised with an app. You can have all the fancy TV commercials and even great store displays, however a local service is displaying a billboard and your OS isn't displayed as having an app and people start to think something is wrong with your OS.

    This is a constant thing I see. Lots of local services show iOS and Android. Rarely do you see Windows Phone. You can say that having the top apps is all that matters but that's really a small drop in the whole bucket. You can say people only use 'x' amount of apps but again it's the option of having the app or trying it. When you don't have that option you start to feel left out. That's what people don't want to feel. Which is one of the reasons why WP has such a poor take up.

    In some countries WP is doing better with this problem than others. Here in the UK and EU and I'm sure in the US, this is a huge problem. As we've seen lots of banks have dropped or haven't bothered with WP. Other apps have dropped WP support as well.

    It's kind of hard to change the minds of people when you cannot even keep apps you already have and can't seem to get apps that people may want.

    I am hoping, though I doubt MS would simply drop WP, that W10 will start to cause a shift. However it will be a mountain to climb.
    03-17-2015 04:19 AM
  17. Spectrum90's Avatar
    To me the reason that MS has failed with Windows Phone is simple they were very late to the party, and iOS and Android were already established as the market leaders. It would be crazy for the average consumer to pick Windows Phone over the dominant platforms, it would be like choosing Beta over VHS even though VHS had the majority of the market.

    At this point I think MS has just about given up on Windows Phone, with universal apps and Windows 10 for Mobile being their last attempt to get marketshare.
    If the three operating system have started at the same time, in their current version, with the same app support, the market share of Windows Phone would be better, but It still would be niche.
    That's evident in emerging markets. First time smartphone users choose Android over Windows Phone without knowing about the app gap. The unconventionalities of Windows Phone reinforce the idea that It's inferior or too difficult.

    Microsoft's biggest mistake was developing a product without thinking in the billions of people that were supposed to use it. Apple did the opposite, the tried to develop a product as familiar and easy to understand as possible, Android just followed Apple.
    prasath1234 likes this.
    03-17-2015 06:07 AM
  18. GCrane1982's Avatar
    I agree with and have experienced the app-update gap, but the only way the situation is going to get any better for Microsoft and Windows Phone is to get more devices in more peoples hands which I'll create value for developers. Windows 10 and universal apps might assist with this by including all Windows 10 devices as a target audience for developers but its not guaranteed.

    I would love to see MSFT spend $5b in a single quarter towards getting more people to use Windows Phone. This money could be spent on subsidized handsets, think aLumia 940 for under $300.00, 840 for under $200 and 640 for under $99. Put some serious money into world wide marketing and advertising and then spend money on in store displays, retail sales training and incentives. If this doesn't get people using Windows Phone nothing will.
    prasath1234 likes this.
    03-17-2015 06:50 AM
  19. TheCudder's Avatar
    Having the top 50 apps does not equate to having the apps people use on a daily basis. Those apps only represent the top world wide social and media "consumption" apps. I mentioned this before, and what WP has always missed are popular local, regional and national task and lifestyle oriented apps. Banking, credit unions, grocery store, drug stores, credit card, coupon, health/fitness and plenty more --- aside from consumption and entertainment, people also use smart phones to get things done, and for your typical user getting things done isn't always through Microsoft Office (if ever). And not everyone is a WP loyalist who is going to swap banks or <insert service > because there is no WP app when there are two other smart phone OS's that have app support.

    Then there's the everlasting scenario of when the iPhone or Android owner says, "Hey download the <insert fad app> app, it's great". Only to realize there is no such app for WP --- talk about feeling left out of the fun, it's like not being picked to play at recess because you're the odd man.

    Basically, your average user will realize and complain there are NO APPS long before they realize the existing apps are rarely updated or full featured.
    03-17-2015 06:59 AM
  20. ohgood's Avatar
    Windows Phone has an apps problem, only it's not the one most people think it is.

    One of the more commonly cited arguments made against switching to the third-place phone OS is the lack of apps available in the Windows Phone app store. That argument appears reasonable. However, when you look at the numbers, the argument falls apart under closer scrutiny.

    Yes, according to BGR.com, there were "only" 300,000 plus apps in the Windows Phone store when Microsoft made the number public last August. That's only a fraction of the one million plus offered for Apple iPhones and phones running Google'sOS.

    That looks bad for Microsoft and it makes for good headlines, but you have to consider whether the difference between over 300,000 and 1 million apps actually matters when the average person uses, according to research from Nielsen, fewer than 30 apps per month.
    That simple fact makes the gap between the size of the app stores less relevant if Microsoft has most of the most popular apps, which it does (as can be seen below).


    All of this being said, Microsoft does have a different kind of app problem. Only instead of it being the number of apps in its store, it's the infrequency with which its apps are updated. The problem for the Windows Phone is not its lack of having 7,000 flashlight apps and a few hundred Flappy Bird knockoffs (it has plenty of each). It's that the company had the muscle to get a lot of top app providers to launch Windows Phone 8 apps but not the muscle to keep them there when the relatively tiny audience for the phones gave them little return on their investment.


    The tops apps are (mostly) here
    Of the top 10 apps in Apple's app store as of March 10, the Windows Phone store has Facebook Messenger, Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, Pandora, Trivia Crack, Spring Ninja, and Google Maps. The only things missing are Apple's own iTunes U app (for obvious reasons), and Snapchat. Moving down the free list and it becomes clear that Windows Phone has nearly all the top titles. The same is generally true on the paid side where Microsoft's store has nearly all the big name apps and approximations or alternatives for the less-famous big sellers.

    So, what's the problem?
    Microsofthas a good selection of apps on the surface, but when you dig a little deeper you see that many companies launch a Windows app then don't update it at all. For the apps that are eventually updated, the actual update lags far behind the versions in Apple and Google's stores.
    Read the rest here:

    good points.


    with a mature platform, a decent amount of apps, and a few refreshes, it seems the only reason the platform hasn't accelerated is

    it just got started too late. at this point the android and ios users have been using their mobile for years, and there is no reason to change from those established systems. could have been ios and wp, had wp been launched when android was. or wp and android. or wp and blackberry. or a contest of all four, had they woken up at the same moment and realized there was consumer market about to explode.

    but, they didn't, and here we are.

    there are LOTS of really good ideas for how to rectify this. i think it will take a combination of several, if not ALL of them to succeed.
    tgp, HeyCori and Laura Knotek like this.
    03-17-2015 07:11 AM
  21. sanjeet_deshwal's Avatar
    Microsoft should do some give aways/ provide some buy one , get one free offers to increase market share.

    At least in India/Brazil/china it'll be an extremely hit !dea
    prasath1234 likes this.
    03-17-2015 07:13 AM
  22. ajayden's Avatar
    I have highlighted the top 10 free apps currently in Play Store and Windows Phone Store. You can see which list has the top 10 useful apps.

    top-10-free-apps.jpg
    We can see that out of the top 10 apps in the play store, there are 4 apps are irrelevant to the user . In the Windows phone store all the 10 apps are relevant to all the markets.

    Majority of the Play store and App Store listings are apps that are irrelevant.

    An average user just needs apps that useful for daily use. Examples are Whatsapp, Telegram, Photo editing, Social media etc.

    Yes there is an issue with the quality of apps but that has nothing to do with Microsoft. It is purely the developer of the app. Microsoft has provided all the tools for them to develop for the platform.

    So Microsoft needs to grow their phone market share, in order to attract the developers to produce quality apps with all the features, but they know that growing the market is not done over night. That is the reason they have come out with universal apps.


    Why universal apps?

    The reason is simple. Google and Apple are ruling the smartphone world but they are a far second & third in the PC/Tablet world. So universal apps open up the PC/Tablet market for windows phone developers. With minimum effort they can develop for two types of devices (PC/Tablet & Windows Phone).

    Microsoft & Carrier Partnership

    I also think that Microsoft & Carrier partnership plays an important role in the growth of the OS. Example is the band, if Microsoft can develop deals where the carrier gets incentives for pushing good deals with Surface & windows phone combo or windows phone & band combo, the market will definitely grow.
    prasath1234 likes this.
    03-17-2015 07:27 AM
  23. tgp's Avatar
    To me the reason that MS has failed with Windows Phone is simple they were very late to the party, and iOS and Android were already established as the market leaders.
    It's not accurate to use the word "failed", but I get your point, and I agree. I think the late start is the biggest problem. Microsoft used to own the mobile market with Windows Mobile, or at least they had a sizable share of it. In fact, my love for WP is what caused me to anticipate getting a Windows Phone. I remember drooling admiringly (not literally lol) over my boss' WP when it was released. He was on AT&T and was able to get one right away, but I was on Verizon and had to wait.

    Had WP been released in 2008 instead of 2010, I think it would have grown right along side iOS and Android. Because Android was open source it's likely that it would still be in front today in market share, but likely a healthy percentage of Android's market share today would be WP instead. We'd probably see a more even 3 way split, rather than a 2 way which even then is lopsided.

    Since we'll never know, I can make a guess that is totally accurate. At least nobody can prove me wrong!! I bet we'd see a market share of 50% Android, 30% WP, 15% iOS, and 5% other. I rounded to 5%, but it would basically take WP's market share from Android.

    While the problem now also has to do with the so called "app gap", the app gap is a by product of the platform never taking off. It's a result more than a cause. Although, it probably is part of the cause now. As been said here so many times, we have the chicken and egg situation.

    I've said this before, but I have to wonder what Microsoft would have done at the onset had they been able to see into the future. I highly doubt they would have gone ahead had they known that in 4 1/2 years the market share would be as low as it is. I'm sure they were expecting much more. We can even dig up tech articles from several years ago titled "By 2014 WP will overtake iPhone in Market Share" or something like that (I didn't look up any specifically). Of course, with foresight, Microsoft could have made changes at the beginning, but with my hypothetical question I'm thinking more if Microsoft had only the options of either going ahead as is or never letting it out of the gate.

    I'm looking forward to the show over the next couple years!
    03-17-2015 07:30 AM
  24. Phone Guy 4567's Avatar
    If the three operating system have started at the same time, in their current version, with the same app support, the market share of Windows Phone would be better, but It still would be niche.
    That's evident in emerging markets. First time smartphone users choose Android over Windows Phone without knowing about the app gap. The unconventionalities of Windows Phone reinforce the idea that It's inferior or too difficult.

    Microsoft's biggest mistake was developing a product without thinking in the billions of people that were supposed to use it. Apple did the opposite, the tried to develop a product as familiar and easy to understand as possible, Android just followed Apple.
    I disagree.

    People in developing markets don't live in a total information vacuum, so Windows Phone's reputation has followed it into those markets. Even if they themselves don't own a smartphone chances are they know someone that does and it will most likely be an Android.
    prasath1234 likes this.
    03-17-2015 07:46 AM
  25. Shobin Drogan's Avatar
    Wait a minute, yall saying MS started late, but didn't they have Windows Mobile?
    I think Windows 7 although very very fluid, just wasn't really good and was far too lacking in features for it to be a real contender.
    Even WP 8.0 was lacking in features, i think 8.1 was the first one that REALLY made a difference and the only OS update that i will gladly stay on regardless of the future updates. Currently i am happy with WP8.1 and wouldnt change a thing, but this is not to say im not excited for Win10 for phones.
    Spectrum90 and MikeSo like this.
    03-17-2015 08:32 AM
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