09-28-2015 07:24 AM
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  1. TheLumiaExperience's Avatar
    So there seems to be a recurring trend here.
    Every second post seems to be how WP is useless or how W10 for Mobile is dead.
    Interspersed in the comments are those incessantly tired claims that they're dumping WP and going to this or that. Comments trying to convince others that WP will fail and to ditch the OS.

    My question is; why are you here?

    Now, I get this site is for those who are users and POTENTIAL users. But it seems that some posters are neither current users nor potentials. It seems their main aim is to criticise, point out every flaw (in a tech build!) and urge others to switch to competing OS.

    I understand that the tech builds have been buggy, but still... they're previews. They frustrate me to no end some days (seriously!), but I signed up for them and I can revert to 8.1 if I want.

    These forums are great for people to share opinions and ideas, to improve the user experience, to pose constructive questions and criticisms, to vent even, but the same tired old comments from people who've given up on WP seem to be... sorely misplaced.

    Again, if you don't like the OS, don't use it, have nothing to contribute to the development of the phones other than spread hate, why are you here?
    Do you just want people to agree with you so you feel better about your decision? I'm sure there are other sites for competing OS where you can gleefully do that.

    If WPs do fail, and W10 for mobile becomes non existent and useless... then kudos to you. Till that happens, what's the use of saying 'I told you so'... when you got nothing to actually say?
    Last edited by a5cent; 09-10-2015 at 05:32 PM. Reason: language edit
    09-10-2015 03:50 PM
  2. nmercy's Avatar
    I think a lot of it is the troll mentality and right now WP users are an easy target unfortunately.
    Jas Holden, realwarder and Reflexx like this.
    09-10-2015 04:13 PM
  3. Vishca's Avatar
    I totally agree with you,I visit this site often as I am interested to hear what others think of the on going development of WP, but I am often left wondering how old our some of the sites users. Have people forgotten that it's a preview build and in testing. Having access to the preview build is in some way a privilege and meant to aid MS in identity some of the issues in the builds. The I want it now attitude drives me mad. If the builds are to slow then revert to 8.1. I would expect most to be using the preview build on a spare Lumia or similar, if not more fool them, either way they know what they signed up for.Whish they would stop moaning and suggesting MS have one chance left or do not know what they are doing. If they are so fed of waiting there are plenty of iPhones and galaxy phones wanting to be bought.
    09-10-2015 04:13 PM
  4. lucas.scott's Avatar
    I've been the biggest WP fan on earth since the Trophy launched on VZW. I've since owned the 900,920,928,8x,930,1520,635, and now the 640. The main reason i flew the WP flag for so long (and with such pride) was its efficiency. What the OS has always been able to achieve with minimal specs has always been incredible. The fact that something like the 640 even exists for 80 bucks is mind-altering. That said, the Windows 10 previews have me extremely apprehensive and saddened.

    An OS that was once the poster-child for uniqueness is gradually conforming to the norm. I can understand that. As someone that makes a living as a data analyst (in the mobile industry, no less) I get it. It makes sense. But as a fan of the platform for almost 8 years, I am shocked at how little MS is paying attention to details. Windows Phone has always been super minimalistic - mainly text on a solid background with images here and there all wrapped up in an efficient pivot. Perhaps they simply aren't used to working with a more "complex" UI on handsets. I'm not sure what it is, but something is very wrong. At least, in my opinion there is. The Preview defense is thrown around a lot, but as time passes, I'm not sure how much longer we can use it. Think about how long we've been dealing with "loading" and "resuming". Even on flagship devices on a rock-solid OS... it was still there. Maybe far less often, but present nonetheless. Are we really able to write off the continuation of this ever present annoyance on the preview program? Can we blame the design changes and missteps on a preview program?

    My biggest fear, as someone that adores WP, is that Microsoft may think that these shortcomings are "good enough" for something they don't get much return out of. I think some of the gross hyperbole can be explained by trolls, but I'd be willing to bet that there are just as many people in my shoes. People that are simply scared, or maybe even angry that this is what we're going to end up with after years of allegiance, and they don't know a better way to voice that frustration.

    I'm not saying Windows Phone/Windows Mobile is doomed, but I'm definitely saying that I'm worried. The OP raises the simple proposition of "If you don't like the OS, then don't use it". But what happens when I do like the OS... and I can't use it due to a degrading experience? That's the real bummer

    ** I never post replies like this... but this one felt like it needed to happen.
    09-10-2015 05:20 PM
  5. TheLumiaExperience's Avatar

    I'm not saying Windows Phone/Windows Mobile is doomed, but I'm definitely saying that I'm worried. The OP raises the simple proposition of "If you don't like the OS, then don't use it". But what happens when I do like the OS... and I can't use it due to a degrading experience? That's the real bummer
    [/I]
    That's kinda the boat I am in now and I'm only new to WP, so can only imagine what it's like to be a long time user.
    But I can't lose hope and believe that a company who is investing millions into this program is going to let it die. It doesn't make sense.
    I personally don't want to use any other OS, so I too am worried, but we're not here spouting mindless drivel. There are some who just are.

    Perhaps W10 is not optimised for the current generation of phones. But 8.1 was, to me, a very solid OS... so they were on the right path. Maybe W10 will work flawlessly on the new phones. Mind you, I have not done a hard reset yet on my 930... W10 works ok on it and I can't be too worried yet.

    I can totally understand why they're doing what they are. They have to compete with the other platforms. They're trying to build a fool proof universal OS. If most PCs are using W10, and more people are buying the Surface, then there is more support for apps for the phone. If even more people are familiar with using Microsoft apps on competing systems, then the transition to WP is easier. It's a business decision, for sure. They're not solely focusing on the phones and I think some people are seriously worried.

    Personally, I preferred most of 8.1 to 10, but it's progress.
    Last edited by TheLumiaExperience; 09-10-2015 at 07:03 PM. Reason: editing words
    09-10-2015 05:59 PM
  6. TheLumiaExperience's Avatar
    The other thought is, perhaps all the 'buggy-ness is because W10 for mobile, being universal across all platforms, is essentially more complicated to build, update and optimise than some other OS.

    I'm not an expert, so perhaps those who know more can elaborate; is W10 a more complex system, more robust than others used on other phones? If you can use it on a phone and on a computer seamlessly, then surely it's more complex, right?
    09-10-2015 06:05 PM
  7. lucas.scott's Avatar
    The other thought is, perhaps all the 'buggy-ness is because W10 for mobile, being universal across all platforms, is essentially more complicated to build, update and optimise than some other OS.
    I'd say this is pretty damn spot-on. It may just be a case of this being way harder than they thought it would be. I've been there. haha
    Ian_Superfly likes this.
    09-10-2015 06:12 PM
  8. Rising Mos's Avatar
    The other thought is, perhaps all the 'buggy-ness is because W10 for mobile, being universal across all platforms, is essentially more complicated to build, update and optimise than some other OS.

    I'm not an expert, so perhaps those who know more can elaborate; is W10 a more complex system, more robust than others used on other phones? If you can use it on a phone and on a computer seamlessly, then surely it's more complex, right?
    In terms of complexity:
    - There is an extra complexity as compared to iphones because the target hardware is diverse. The complexity as compared to android is trying to squeeze every little bit of optimization to run on low end device.
    - in terms of platform and app model, I don't think it is more complex. It is certainly less mature than other platforms but at the same time, it is trying to do alot for uts age. Other platforms evolved over years and years of iterations. The new universal app model has been around for 1 year, 2 if you count 8.1. So it is expected that they have some bumps along the way.
    lucas.scott, LeFreak and neo158 like this.
    09-10-2015 06:17 PM
  9. chuckdaly's Avatar
    Some negativity is good. Otherwise you create a MS based distortion field. People should be able to come here and get an honest picture of what the community of Windows product users is all about. Users have good experiences and bad experiences, and they should be welcome to share them. I've been visiting this site since before the "The Beta test is now over" commercials were playing. There has been far more blind sheep repeating the manta, of "Oh, just wait until.....then everything will be better", than desenters posting "WINDOWS FONE SUXXX".
    09-10-2015 06:40 PM
  10. gaumzi's Avatar
    I really wanted to try a Windows Phone. But with all the functionalities now availalble on different platforms, even Cortana. Their is nothing important to look for. My friend got a Lumia 935.

    1. OneDrive works awesomely on my Android. Even better than Windows Phones.

    2. Why in the hell we need a back option from HomeScreen...?????? Just Why. It is great to have back option from other apps, but not from HomeScreen. If I am on Homescreen and mistakenly clicked back button, I go to previous app..... WHY!!!

    3. While everyone hates a lag droid, but did ever saw that loading screen on Windows. I just hate it, even iPhones don't have it. When you say a powerful phone with no lags, so there should be no loading screens for even only two apps open.

    Even my 2 years old Android Phone works flawlessly.

    4. All apps are far better on other platforms.


    Thanks
    09-11-2015 02:25 AM
  11. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    I personally find myself using this site and the reddit less. The community itself is turning me off of windows phones.
    libra89, Jazmac, sleeve22 and 3 others like this.
    09-11-2015 06:09 AM
  12. nmercy's Avatar
    I really wanted to try a Windows Phone. But with all the functionalities now availalble on different platforms, even Cortana. Their is nothing important to look for. My friend got a Lumia 935.

    1. OneDrive works awesomely on my Android. Even better than Windows Phones.

    2. Why in the hell we need a back option from HomeScreen...?????? Just Why. It is great to have back option from other apps, but not from HomeScreen. If I am on Homescreen and mistakenly clicked back button, I go to previous app..... WHY!!!

    3. While everyone hates a lag droid, but did ever saw that loading screen on Windows. I just hate it, even iPhones don't have it. When you say a powerful phone with no lags, so there should be no loading screens for even only two apps open.

    Even my 2 years old Android Phone works flawlessly.

    4. All apps are far better on other platforms.


    Thanks
    Can answer 2. The reason the back button is on the Home screen is because from any app you can hit the home button to go to the home screen. The back button doesn't just take you to the last used app, but is also supposed to take you back to where you left off in the app. If I recall correctly from the design documents if you were to find the app and open it again, this should be treated as a new start of the app rather than picking up where you left off.

    Also if you have home'd out of multiple apps you can hold the back button on the home screen (or any screen for that matter) to bring up the task switcher view and pick up any of those open apps from where you left off (assuming it hasn't been closed by the OS for memory constraint in which case it will open as if it was new).

    One thing that does seem broken is that backing out of an app seems to be treated the same as homeing out of an app should force you to have to reopen the app rather than keeping it in the task switcher. It always bugs me when I expect to see 2 or 3 apps there and find every app I've opened that day and have to clear them out manually.
    gaumzi and Chintan Gohel like this.
    09-11-2015 08:12 AM
  13. gwinegarden's Avatar
    I posted some thoughts on another thread, but to summarize: Apple users wait for Apple to tell them what the want and, if their own expectations are not met, they just wait for the next phone. MS users, via rumors and Photoshopped renditions of futuristic phones and capabilities go nuts when these expectations are not met.
    09-11-2015 09:08 AM
  14. Manmikey's Avatar
    I personally find myself using this site and the reddit less. The community itself is turning me off of windows phones.
    Yes this^^^^^^^
    libra89 likes this.
    09-11-2015 01:01 PM
  15. T Moore's Avatar
    I'll just sit back and watch.
    I am not putting pre-release OS on my daily driver and my other Lumias are to old, 920, or don't have the horsepower, 521, 630 to deal with it, maybe when it is ready for release.
    How many call WM10 an update? They like the foam, not the beer.
    09-11-2015 09:13 PM
  16. slivy58's Avatar
    So there seems to be a recurring trend here.
    Every second post seems to be how WP is useless or how W10 for Mobile is dead.
    Interspersed in the comments are those incessantly tired claims that they're dumping WP and going to this or that. Comments trying to convince others that WP will fail and to ditch the OS.

    My question is; why are you here?

    Now, I get this site is for those who are users and POTENTIAL users. But it seems that some posters are neither current users nor potentials. It seems their main aim is to criticise, point out every flaw (in a tech build!) and urge others to switch to competing OS.

    I understand that the tech builds have been buggy, but still... they're previews. They frustrate me to no end some days (seriously!), but I signed up for them and I can revert to 8.1 if I want.

    These forums are great for people to share opinions and ideas, to improve the user experience, to pose constructive questions and criticisms, to vent even, but the same tired old comments from people who've given up on WP seem to be... sorely misplaced.

    Again, if you don't like the OS, don't use it, have nothing to contribute to the development of the phones other than spread hate, why are you here?
    Do you just want people to agree with you so you feel better about your decision? I'm sure there are other sites for competing OS where you can gleefully do that.

    If WPs do fail, and W10 for mobile becomes non existent and useless... then kudos to you. Till that happens, what's the use of saying 'I told you so'... when you got nothing to actually say?

    First off, If I missed the forum rules where it states this site was for the "happy" and accepting only then I apologize.

    I bought into MSs hype (blame me if you want) and "I CARE", I'm into this as much as anyone (Ativ S/L1020/L830) and want it to succeed as many others do, if some want to sit back and see everything in the WP world as being kosher so be it, me along with others choose not to.

    Don't know about you but when I came onboard in late 2012 I had no inkling we'd be in the position we are today, thought "moving forward" meant we'd have new features and hardware for the times, that kind of dwindled many moons ago and we ended up with previews, betas, the minimalist of decent hardware and a "reboot", sure many budget phones hit the market in that time but it has already been proven that most of those won't support some of the new features already here or purportedly coming, Continuum, 4K recording, Hey Cortana to name a few.

    For me it is about WP and its sustainability in the market place, if I make the switch and support a platform (WM here) then I expect it to support me, and just like I cant predict WPs demise no one can honestly predict WPs success, at this stage Id say the cons far outweigh the pros which is why you see the reoccurring trend of dismay, and "coming" is not "here" no matter how you word it.
    Last edited by Elky64; 09-11-2015 at 10:56 PM.
    09-11-2015 10:41 PM
  17. slivy58's Avatar
    Other platforms evolved over years and years of iterations
    Not sure if you are aware but a form of WP arrived in 2000 w/ the Pocket PC 2000 running Windows CE 3.0, their 1st official "smart phone" was designated the Pocket PC 2002 in 2001, Apple's debut was in 2007 and Android in 2008, just a little history ;-)
    badcat likes this.
    09-11-2015 11:34 PM
  18. libra89's Avatar
    Sometimes I wonder the same. I think some of these people are torn because of their long alliance, and how things are going, is just not good enough for them. It's really hard to read threads and comments here. No one is saying that only people happy with what is going on can speak, we are just saying that the "debbie downers" are making the "susie sunshines" want to be silent. You would think that Windows Central would be like a hub of positive and people who enjoy Windows (and their products), but lately, it's hard to tell. Some of the threads are almost as bad as the ones who truly hate and put down Windows phone (and in general) every given opportunity.
    a5cent likes this.
    09-12-2015 12:06 AM
  19. TheLumiaExperience's Avatar
    First off, If I missed the forum rules where it states this site was for the "happy" and “accepting” only then I apologize.

    I bought into MSs hype (blame me if you want) and "I CARE", I'm into this as much as anyone (Ativ S/L1020/L830) and want it to succeed as many others do, if some want to sit back and see everything in the WP world as being kosher so be it, me along with others choose not to..
    There'a difference between caring and having intelligent conversations and being an active fan, and spouting things like "Windows Phone is dead", "I switched to Android a long time ago", "W10Mobile is utter crap" etc etc etc.

    No one has to be happy all the time. I was even critical in my own post. So are many of those who 'care'. However, there's a way to be critical in a constructive manner, and then there's trolling.

    I'm just wondering why those who proclaim WP to be utter crap and long dead (i.e. the trolls) are on this site. What's the point then?

    And why are they tolerated?
    It's actually tiresome.

    The truth is I DO want to hear criticisms. Of course I do; I know that the products are not perfect. No product is. Hearing the criticisms, when valid, allows me to make the right choices for me.
    Wasting my time wading through unintelligent meaningless crap does not.
    libra89, badcat, LeFreak and 1 others like this.
    09-12-2015 06:41 AM
  20. Ian_Superfly's Avatar
    Why I'm here?
    I had the perfect combo with SP1&2, W8.1, and L925/930.
    I had office on my phones, OneNote and everything was in sync via Skydrive/OneDrive.
    The touch/pen experience on the SP was perfect w fullscreen metro IE etc.

    The package was unique for Microsoft. It was not possible to get this on any other ecosystem. Any invested money (as a customer) was well spent money.

    Now, W10 has ruined the touch experience of the SP, OneDrive is just a shadow of what it was, W10M will make the phones bleach Android copies and the Office package is better on ios and Android. I.e, I feel I did chose the wrong system. MS seems to give up what they accomplished with W8.1, SP and WP.

    The best product mix today seems to be a boring iPhone (fastest, most polished, the best office and less "will come in the future" BS) a SP with the mediocre W10 or "old W8.1" OR if you can live with it, iPad pro and an iPhone.

    Add to that that WP/W10M is so extremely slow adding features and that the new stuff (Cortana etc) is not even available but Siri is (Sweden). And no new interesting hardware has been released for ages.

    I feel betrayed by Microsoft/Nadella.
    Last edited by Ian_Superfly; 09-12-2015 at 10:35 AM.
    Tien-Lin Chang, slivy58 and neo158 like this.
    09-12-2015 06:50 AM
  21. Mark Baker3's Avatar
    Given some of the fanboi bait posts on these forums I think you'll find that people pop over from apple and android forums to bait the people here. If people bite then more fool them. Reality is that this place is for information and feedback. Anything else is usually fanboi nonsense and just amused the adults who sit back shaking their heads at the responses.
    realwarder and Sam_93 like this.
    09-12-2015 06:53 AM
  22. TheLumiaExperience's Avatar
    Why I'm here?
    I don't think your opinion on the products and the platforms amounts to that of the trolls on this site, even if you are sorely disappointed and considering switching phones.
    In fact, I agree with you about 8.1 vs 10.

    You do seem invested in WPs and related products, so opinions like this are worth the contributions.
    I like reading healthy debates about Windows - it's what makes the community stronger.

    Truthfully, what adds to this site is the many users, in addition to the mods, who have years of experience with the products, and insights that even the mods may not have.
    neo158 likes this.
    09-12-2015 07:06 AM
  23. realwarder's Avatar
    An OS that was once the poster-child for uniqueness is gradually conforming to the norm. I can understand that. As someone that makes a living as a data analyst (in the mobile industry, no less) I get it. It makes sense. But as a fan of the platform for almost 8 years, I am shocked at how little MS is paying attention to details. Windows Phone has always been super minimalistic - mainly text on a solid background with images here and there all wrapped up in an efficient pivot. Perhaps they simply aren't used to working with a more "complex" UI on handsets. I'm not sure what it is, but something is very wrong. At least, in my opinion there is. The Preview defense is thrown around a lot, but as time passes, I'm not sure how much longer we can use it. Think about how long we've been dealing with "loading" and "resuming". Even on flagship devices on a rock-solid OS... it was still there. Maybe far less often, but present nonetheless. Are we really able to write off the continuation of this ever present annoyance on the preview program? Can we blame the design changes and missteps on a preview program?
    Reportedly "Loading" has gone on the very very latest preview we don't have.

    UI design changes have been required because of several goals: UI Compatibility with Android apps coming to Windows Mobile. UI familiarity for users who might look at WM10 from Android. UI compatibility with the desktop. Yes, this does break some of the simplicity of WP but I think ultimately it is for the better.

    My biggest fear, as someone that adores WP, is that Microsoft may think that these shortcomings are "good enough" for something they don't get much return out of. I think some of the gross hyperbole can be explained by trolls, but I'd be willing to bet that there are just as many people in my shoes. People that are simply scared, or maybe even angry that this is what we're going to end up with after years of allegiance, and they don't know a better way to voice that frustration.
    They do get it. They are listening. Thinking back to earlier preview builds we couldn't pivot through the Alarms app. Edge had address bars at the top. Apps were slower to load. Changes were made to feedback. They know when things are not good enough. It's a preview!

    As you say, the Preview has caused some frustration because people see how long software development really takes. We're used to jumping to the end of an OS release development or app and magically massive changes appear and we think it happened instantly. I'm sure Microsoft will be reviewing the Insider program, however it is core to Windows As A Service, where we receive step changes throughout the year. Users need to realize this is the start of new journey. One where we gain continuous improvements. And get to preview them. Hopefully Microsoft will not find that too stifling as people inherently dislike change and yet advancement comes from change. Even when sometimes it doesn't quite work out (e.g. Win8). Oh well, time will tell. Personally I like seeing the evolution, but as this thread shows, some don't and some get frustrated seeing the step changes.
    LeFreak likes this.
    09-12-2015 09:10 AM
  24. HoosierDaddy's Avatar
    Now, I get this site is for those who are users and POTENTIAL users. But it seems that some posters are neither current users nor potentials. It seems their main aim is to criticise, point out every flaw (in a tech build!) and urge others to switch to competing OS.
    You don't fall for it. Do you worry others are dumber than you and believe it?
    09-12-2015 10:01 AM
  25. Jazmac's Avatar
    I personally find myself using this site and the reddit less. The community itself is turning me off of windows phones.
    Exactly my feeling dude. So much so, I'm entertaining the idea of actually buying an iPhone but at this point I can't get past what I would give up in this platform. But this community is a head scratch and those charged to protect it... let me stop right there.
    sleeve22 and libra89 like this.
    09-12-2015 10:15 AM
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