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12-08-2015 07:28 PM
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  1. John M Beauchemin's Avatar
    This is my opinion, that the WP screen is too busy. A WC member that used to be on here a lot who is a graphic designer talked about the grid of icons causing "brain freeze" due to too much information available.
    Yeah but... you can make them all as large or small as you want. If your tiles are causing brain freeze (like my iPhone does with the wall o' folders... where is that app I'm looking for?!?!), then that person can easily make the UI simpler to look at with some reorganization/resizing. Nice thing too is that deleting tiles you don't use from the main UI does not uninstall the program. I like that, it appeals to me much more than icon-grid overload and seems much less confusing (in theory, I don't actually have a Windows Phone yet).
    Last edited by a5cent; 11-11-2015 at 01:53 PM. Reason: language edit
    920Walker, Hans Swolfs and M7H like this.
    11-11-2015 11:12 AM
  2. Spectrum90's Avatar
    Example: settings for Edge and Photos is in the ellipsis menu, settings for Outlook and One Drive is in the hamburger menu (One Drive used to be in the ellipsis menu).
    The preferred location for settings is the hamburger menu, but if an app is not feature rich enough to need an hamburger menu, then settings should be added to the ellipsis menu.

    You can't add an hamburger menu to an app just to increase consistency, that would be stupid.
    There a few design patterns that all designers use to solve common UI problems. Different apps will use different combinations of these patterns according to their needs.

    WP8.1 was more like a feature phone, so it was easier to force a few UI patterns to all of the feature lacking apps. However, the user experience in 8.1 was awful and It was the main reason why people weren't buying the phones according to MS data.
    11-11-2015 11:15 AM
  3. bpcooper14's Avatar
    I've read through some (but not all) of this thread and here are a few of my quick, unscientific thoughts from my point of view.
    When my family is looking for a new device, typically for the "younger" ones of the family, the first thing that influences their decision is that it's the shiny new toy that all of their friends have/are getting. The next thing the "younger" family members make sure of is functionality. By this I don't mean multitasking, ability to stream from the home media server, etc. I mean "does it have the apps I need" to stay up with all my peers/friends. Let's face it, snapchat, instagram, periscope, and whatever the next new social networking craze is going to be have not (for the most part) made it into the windows world yet. If they can't communicate with their friends that way, then the platform is DOA. One of my kids actually liked 8.1 but had to have an iphone because it was familiar and had all the ways to stay in touch with her friends.
    Now, for me, I'm always trying to give something new a try just to have an informed decision one way or the other if I'm able to utilize in under real world scenarios to be able to accomplish all that I want it to do. I currently use a OnePlus One as my phone of choice. I've tried apple (didn't like the simplicity) and wp8.1 (still rock a 520 on occasion when I am doing something that might put the OPO in harms way). Personally, I avoid the social networking crap like the plague. Want to know something about my life? Use the phone like a PHONE and call me.
    I think that unless there is a way for an upcoming w10 phone to become the "new shiny toy" that leads to overwhelming adoption, it will be relegated to the "Blackberry niche" type of market no matter how good of a value, investment, OS, etc. it is. Like I said, these are just random, unscientific, no basis for my opinion types of ramblings and opinions. I HOPE that the OS takes off and does everything that we all hope it will in the future.
    11-11-2015 11:20 AM
  4. tgp's Avatar
    (like my iPhone does with the wall o' folders... where the is that app I'm looking for?!?!)
    The iPhone is a whole different ball game! It doesn't have an app drawer, and you cannot place the icons where you wish on the page, other than shuffle them around. I was mainly referring to Android.

    That said, like has been already said, I don't think that UI is all that important to device sales. All current smartphone OS's have a "good enough" UI. It seems that consumers are not using that as a catalyst for their decision.
    Last edited by a5cent; 11-11-2015 at 01:54 PM. Reason: language edit in quoted post (sorry tgp)
    11-11-2015 11:22 AM
  5. mmcpher's Avatar
    If we're waiting for every potential user's idiosyncratic color palette to be adopted, we'll never get there. The builds have been usable as daily drivers for months, while issues and bugs have been systematically narrowed. Very few of the successive builds were a step back, which suggests an encouraging level of control on the process by Microsoft. So I vote "Yes", it's ready. There are still bugs that need to be stomped out and features to be added, but if all you do is go halfway home, you never get there.

    Windows 10 is supposed to be all about continual updating anyway, so if you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk already. The current build is close enough forme to worry that when I finally get my 950 XL with RTM on board, it will be something of a letdown because I've already had most of the features.
    11-11-2015 11:39 AM
  6. Jakoh's Avatar
    Beta Testing programs...Double edged swords.
    11-11-2015 11:55 AM
  7. muvig's Avatar
    what i thought they would change/fix on W10M is
    1)for users to have custom labels on contacts,
    2)and have call duration on call history,
    3)battery drain, at least 24 hrs before charge would be better, a Lenovo android phone can go up to 3 days but on WP you can't pass thru 15 hrs, and phone should be intelligent enough not to drain battery during night when it is not being used.
    4) that battery icon should be complemented with a % figure as there is a lot of space up there.
    11-11-2015 12:06 PM
  8. Nokia5110's Avatar
    How do I manually check for emails in w10m? The syncing went AWOL on my Nokia 630 dual sim.

    Not ready for prime time
    11-11-2015 12:07 PM
  9. kristalsoldier's Avatar
    I don't think it's anywhere near ready for release. Camera app is still horrible compared to Lumia Camera, and there is no new features added which are already available on other smartphones.

    Why Camera? It's like the first think people ask about.

    Photos app doesn't even have a light thrtr.

    UI is a complete mess, Microsoft's own apps all follow some other design language so there is no consistency.

    Nothing special about the Lock screen

    Nothing new about Livetiles, groupings

    No custom keyboards as keyboard in my native language is still useless.

    Yada yada yada yada yada, could go on..
    So, I guess you are not using W10M or planning to use it either in which case the question arises: Why are you thinking and talking about W10M and wasting your time?
    11-11-2015 12:19 PM
  10. bitcrazed's Avatar
    ALL software is a "work in progress". Don't forget, iPhone first launched without an AppStore, nor 3rd party apps.

    The point of Windows 10 is that it's the last multi-year big bang OS upgrade: In future app OS features and app features will be delivered incrementally on a more frequent basis. This will allow Microsoft to prioritize work and adjust course based on actual usage telemetry and real user feedback, delivering changes, features etc. in a more rapid manner.

    To enable Microsoft to do this, they're moving all their platforms to run atop a common OS, eliminating the multiple specialized OS' used in prior device incarnations (i.e. Windows CE under WinPhone7, NT Kernel + custom OS for WinPhone8 and a bastardized version of Windows 2000/XP for Xbox). This is a very heavy lift which will start delivering its value in the future. But to get there, Microsoft has to complete the porting of all the existing platforms to Win10.

    While many here may lament various UI/UXP changes, claiming that WinPhone8.x did it better, note that the "better" WinPhone8.x UXP didn't increase end-user adoption.

    Does Win10 have many rough edges? Sure. Will those rough edges get smoothed out rapidly in the coming months? I very much expect so, based on having seen Microsoft nail many of the razor-sharp edges found throughout the WinMo10 development.
    libra89 likes this.
    11-11-2015 12:21 PM
  11. Loco5150's Avatar
    Oh yes its ready talking MS standards.
    11-11-2015 12:31 PM
  12. Gregory Newman's Avatar
    you ever heard the statement "Ready or not here I come" I have no doubts the Windows 10 Mobile will RTM in a few days'
    Microsoft will have in this Operating system mainly those features that are stable so expect to see some features that were in the Windows insider builds not to be in the RTM Windows 10 Mobile Operating system because they do not work well. In this way Microsoft will have a Windows 10 Mobile OS that wont be broke when it debuts. At a later date new features will be added when microsoft feels that are good enough be added as an OS update
    11-11-2015 01:02 PM
  13. badMojo69's Avatar
    Okay the 10000 or so Windows phone users need to calm down.
    You're all non paid beta testers (I quit earlier this year) accept it and move on.
    11-11-2015 01:08 PM
  14. WoodyPWX's Avatar
    Looks ready to me
    11-11-2015 01:10 PM
  15. a5cent's Avatar
    Sorry, my English is not so good, and I can not explain good.
    Your English is perfectly fine. Don't worry about it. ;-)

    Anyway, the idea that a more familiar UI will get iOS and Android users to switch, boarders on insanity (or mass wishful thinking?). We know what the actual problems are (official apps, regional apps, no support from Google, stigma). The UI is just NOT important enough to get people to overlook those disadvantages, particularly not if all WM aims to offer is what those folks already have.

    I can't imagine a strategy more flawed than that (which is also why that's not actually what MS is thinking).
    And thats why they stand where they are
    No. You're misunderstanding what is driving these UI changes. The absolute most such UI changes can achieve are to lower the barrier to entry for iOS/Android users. If an iOS/Android user is enticed by some new hypothetical WP feature, lowering the barrier to entry can (at most) improve the chances of that person actually switching.

    You're confusing those two things. You're mistaking the lowered barrier to entry for the enticing feature itself. People are never particularly enticed by what they already have, and making WP's UI more familiar can, by definition, never be anything more than what iOS/Android users already have. Otherwise it wouldn't be familiar.

    Actually, the forces driving these UI changes have little to do with users and familiarity at all. It's about developers! More precisely, it's about making it easier for devs to port their apps using the Islandwood and Astoria bridge tools, and making it look like those ported apps at least somewhat fit in with the rest of the OS.

    I don't understand how you don't get the analogy. For all basic functions on the phones people are "accommodated" to find them on the bottom on the UI. Habit from other OS's, that are longer on the market. The same was with start button. Except the habit was from previous W desktops.
    Yeah... like I said... "familiarity" is not what is driving the UI changes. That's why the W10 start menu analogy, which is all about familiarity, makes no sense.
    11-11-2015 01:45 PM
  16. someone2639's Avatar
    Time to deliver my two cents: Is Windows 10 ready for the public?
    Yes.
    It has all the features I use every day. I constantly use File Explorer, Groove, Mail, Calendar, Facebook Beta, etc. and I've found literally one feature I wanted that was essential (That is replies on the Facebook app). The only apps I never used in the past month were the default (formerly) Bing apps, because their information is on Cortana, right in one place (Cortana is essentially the News/Sports/Health/Calendar/Search hub!!!!)

    Ease of use:
    Tired of too many app pages with a limited amount of apps per page? Well, Windows 10 brought it to only 2 pages: One with apps you want to access quickly/get info from and another with all the apps. On 8.1, I initially had trouble finding the search bar. On 10, it's right there. So is the background, which is a nice change from 8.1 and has a simple parallax scroll effect unlike iOS and Android (Which use their own style of parallax/none at all).

    And that's pretty much it. Except:

    Is Windows 10 Mobile ready for longtime diehard WP users?

    Maybe.

    Are the people that are switching to Android "forever" for the smallest reasons going to like W10 Mobile?

    Not quite.

    (insert explanation featuring fear of change, new outlooks on apps, OneDrive problems that never mattered to me, etc.)

    (phew)
    jmajid and libra89 like this.
    11-11-2015 01:57 PM
  17. loribinca's Avatar
    Of course it's the plan. No reason to deprive people of Windows services just because they choose an inferior phone. That would be like adding injury to insult.
    __________________________________________
    When in doubt, yes, I am probably joking.
    LOL - I must admit, I get to things quicker on my Lumia 1520, I actually like the start screen idea and it's a lot prettier than screen after screen of little app buttons.

    The only issue I have is that over time MS seems to have removed all the things that made WP great (hubs, multiple checkins - does anyone know if they're even keeping the 'ME' tile for Windows 10 Mobile?)

    but the main issue is going to be Apps - I thought the whole point of this was universal apps, but instead all I am seeing is developers abandoning the platform entirely

    Mint, Comixology are two recent one to name but a few.

    that's what ultimately scares me about windows 10 in general - it's manageable on a desktop - i just pull open a browser, but you can't keep doing that on a phone

    and don't even get me started on bugs - Windows 10 STILL does not work properly on their own devices - I've never had it working quite right on my Surface Pro 3 because there are STILL driver issues
    mariusmuntean likes this.
    11-11-2015 02:05 PM
  18. Jeddic's Avatar
    Don't get me wrong; I love the looks, but in real life usage I find that it can be a bit overwhelming. Even though fans love the Live Tiles, I can certainly understand why the general public doesn't seem to go for them.
    This is why Live Tiles are optional. For 99% of my apps I don't have that feature enabled, I just get the notification in my notification center, and go from there. Most of my apps are just transparent tiles with an icon and the background behind them. That design is similar to iOS and Android, but with better design, in my opinion. This gives users a great looking, minimalist homescreen, with the option for updates on your homescreen. I have the livetile enabled for weather, other than that my tiles are transparent with a number of notifications, or the first few words of an SMS at most.

    The problem with W10 isn't it's functionality. Are there features we'd like to see added? Yes. But that's also true with Android and iOS. Just go to their fan sites and look at the many threads speculating or wishing for future features. But the difference is that we expect new features, and many WP fans are super negative and critical of the platform. The real problem holding WP back at this time is consumer perception. People need to know that WP has a lot of great features, which is why we use it.
    kristalsoldier likes this.
    11-11-2015 02:05 PM
  19. CarlosDanielFP's Avatar
    I am a Microsoft fanboy but I agree with the title. W10 mobile is a mess, I don't like that gray color all over the white theme of the UI. I think the UI is too flat, it felt better in WP 8.1, the accent colors for the theme are really limited, there is no lime green!!! Another thing about the white theme, that white transparent layer on top of the background in the all apps section looks horrible, I know it's a white theme but doesn't Microsoft have money to pay for a designer and make it look great? The accessibility to the bottom options bar is so inconsistent, I liked more to swipe those three dots upwards to bring up the menu but not all new apps have that ability, and for the ones that do, it doesn't work well at all if you swipe the finger starting outside the screen (which made it much easier in WP 8.1) but now you have to start that swipe from those three dots... Believe it or not, it was exponentially easier to bring up that menu up without caring where your finger started that swipe, you just needed to do it. Action center: That gray color really looks ugly and it is not personalizable, you can't put in there driving mode, VPN, NFC, etc. The long press to open the settings app in that setting doesn't work in some apps like Bluetooth. That arrow in the notifications to expand them doesn't have animation anymore. Cortana: Bing search interface... Really??!!! Also it opens up just like any other app, in iOS Siri just comes up as a pop up and leaves your previous app open. WiFi: My phone daily needs a few restarts throughout the day because suddenly it won't connect to the WiFi modem and a restart solves it temporarily. Camera: Well, everyone knows that right now it is slow at "making adjustments". Microsoft Edge: PDF viewing is frustrating when you have to wait like a minute so that the page bar disappears instead of just taping the screen (sort of like when you are watching a video and the navigation bar can't be hidden with a tap), also it's missing the slider to navigate more quickly through a large document when you have not memorized all the pages (sarcasm*). Store: It seems like Microsoft is working really hard in the photos plugin because EVERYDAY there is an update for the app. Of course it's a bug, I have not been able to use that edit slow motion button on my Lumia 1520 because it has not installed the new version. Storage: I put a microSD 64GB SanDisk ultra plus in my phone and when I go to select where I want to install new apps, save pictures, etc. It just shows me an empty list with blank spaces and I don't what is selected, it also won't display the name of the SD, it just shows Chinese characters and they are different each time I open that section. And the list goes on and on.
    11-11-2015 02:27 PM
  20. Federico Turban's Avatar
    I haven't try it myself, but I watched a lot of videos and hands-on, and, well, the last build looks solid, that's all, just solid, I hope they have gone full steam to make things work better and fix some mayor bugs and all of that stuff, but the OS it's not in the best shape, and I'm talking about performance, that's what actually matter after you see the UI, the performance, and if the OS has a pretty bad performance and bugs, well, you know the rest.

    "But Windows 8 has a big performance boost compared to Windows 7, and everyone hate it because of the UI and the Start Screen!"
    -Someone out there.
    True, that's true, even if the drivers compatibility and some minnor bugs wheren't deals breakers for the users, the terrible imparity between Desktop and Start Screen and the Tiles and all that stuff put it on the dislike of many ones. Windows 10 on Desktop is managing to fix that in a very good way and it's doing so far a good work.

    The UI of Windows 10 Mobile it's not that inconcistent compared to Windows 8 for what I see, and that always happens on every OS, name it, when the OS pass through a mayor dessign overhawl, the Software takes a while until everything it's in shape and looking "the same" like the OS the software is running (Software, Programs, Apps, are the same), so, I don't believe the UI it's going to be a deal breaker or it's even a problem for the user.

    What I'm concerned about it's the performance. Windows 10 Mobile it's so new, so rough, so unpolished, that the performance it's going to be pretty bad (I'm putting this over the top, but it's true), even in the Lumia 930/1520, perhaps the good hardware on those are going to bring a better performance because raw power, but on lower hardware specs, well, it's going to be a bumpy ride.

    Sometimes I wonder, why, a Tablet like the HP Stream 7, with pretty low end hardware, runs Windows 10, a full desktop OS with a friggin lot of features and stuff, but not only runs it, runs it and in a nice way and well, you know it's not a Tablet for heavy duty work, but for the bassics, some games on the Windows Store, e-mail, Facebook, Twitter and some light duty work like Office Apps and some picture managing, it's actually pretty good deal for the money. If a low-end Tablet like the HP Stream 7 runs Windows 10 in a good way, why a you can't do the same with some low-end or mid-end or even high-end Windows phones with Windows 10 Mobile, a OS with a lot but really really LOT less features and services and a infinity more of things that makes it a more light OS compared to the mayor one and full Windows 10. And that is because optimization and stuff, and because Windows on Desktop is a work from decades now, when Windows on Mobile it's facing yet another reboot. I believe that some optimization and more fixes are going to come along the road (let's see iOS, now THAT's optimization).

    And finally, Apps.

    Yeah, I'm tired of that too, the App Gap and everything, and by now everyone knows what it is and what it needs. Just time will tell.

    To be honest, I'm pretty exited about Windows 10 on every device, but the Windows 10 Mobile branch it's still far behind the rest, because PC has anything, Xbox One has games, and Windows phones needs a lot more efford.
    11-11-2015 02:38 PM
  21. HoosierDaddy's Avatar
    Okay the 10000 or so Windows phone users need to calm down.
    You're all non paid beta testers (I quit earlier this year) accept it and move on.
    Its worse than that. There might be only a dozen, all like me with 800 or so multiple personalities and screen names to match
    badMojo69 likes this.
    11-11-2015 02:39 PM
  22. Muessig's Avatar
    Ladies and gentlemen, please keep discussion productive and on topic. Personal attacks, insults, taking threads off topic and other disruptive posting behaviors are not acceptable. If you do not like a post, please behave like an adult and move on, or if you feel it violates the forum rules, please report it. At no point should members be calling each other out in posts. Thanks.
    Federico Turban and jfa1 like this.
    11-11-2015 03:19 PM
  23. Kram Sacul's Avatar
    IAnyway, the idea that a more familiar UI will get iOS and Android users to switch, boarders on insanity (or mass wishful thinking?). We know what the actual problems are (official apps, regional apps, no support from Google, stigma). The UI is just NOT important enough to get people to overlook those disadvantages, particularly not if all WM aims to offer is what those folks already have.
    I agree. If a nice user friendly UI was the key to success Android would've been dead and buried a long time ago. Also the idea that Android and iOS users will leave their own comfortable OS for a wannabe OS with less apps and an uncertain future is asinine. Why bother switching to an inferior version of what you already have?

    I still think WP would've been dead in the water a long time ago without it's unique design language and user friendly UI though. It's what attracted me and many others to the platform in the first place. It just wasn't enough to compete with Google and Apple but you can blame that on MS who showed up late to the party and continually dropped the ball.
    Arunabha Goswami and aXross like this.
    11-11-2015 03:19 PM
  24. FearL0rd's Avatar
    Just like the title says, I believe that the current build or even the next one won't be RTM ready. I am not talking about performance, I am talking about the UI & UX of W10M. The UI is a mess (specially with all the gray color used everywhere).
    I mean how do they say it is ready if Cortana is still using the Bing mobile site to show search result.
    Users notice the UI first.if the Ui is a mess, don't expect the OS to be a success.

    I feel sad for the current state of W10M.
    I wish MS. would do something about their UI team.

    What do u guys think?
    Have you seen the last build? I cant tell without see it
    11-11-2015 03:21 PM
  25. Kram Sacul's Avatar
    The preferred location for settings is the hamburger menu, but if an app is not feature rich enough to need an hamburger menu, then settings should be added to the ellipsis menu.

    You can't add an hamburger menu to an app just to increase consistency, that would be stupid.
    There a few design patterns that all designers use to solve common UI problems. Different apps will use different combinations of these patterns according to their needs.

    WP8.1 was more like a feature phone, so it was easier to force a few UI patterns to all of the feature lacking apps. However, the user experience in 8.1 was awful and It was the main reason why people weren't buying the phones according to MS data.
    That just goes to show that MS' data people have amnesia or brain damage. Probably both. The reason people weren't buying WPs was because of the poor selection of major apps and overall incompetence of MS to make people aware of the platform.

    Saying it was the UI's fault is like blaming the lack of car sales on the gear shift and the floor mats.
    11-11-2015 03:27 PM
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