11-17-2015 06:45 AM
46 12
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  1. yanpaulo's Avatar
    I'm very hopeful that this is going to happen, specially because these bridges seem to work very well.

    But no matter how much I think, I have no idea if Windows will finally be a widely used mobile platform (and therefore not being at risk of dying). Any thoughts?
    11-10-2015 02:07 PM
  2. rhapdog's Avatar
    For us to know the answer, we will probably need to wait at least another year for the bridges to be both available and to start being used. Only time will tell.
    11-10-2015 02:29 PM
  3. Steve Adams's Avatar
    I am thinking that they (the "projects"), will be available by the end of the year, and about 6 months for them to really gain traction.
    11-11-2015 04:37 AM
  4. prasanna moholkar's Avatar
    I think we can install side loaded .apk file directly in windows10 mobile so chill.
    11-11-2015 05:27 AM
  5. a5cent's Avatar
    I think we can install side loaded .apk file directly in windows10 mobile so chill.
    We already know that will not be the case. Most apps will not function fully or "as advertised" on WP without the developer getting involved. Then there are the legal issues which also require developer involvement.

    The bridges are for developers only. They aren't for end users.
    xandros9, libra89 and sahib lopez like this.
    11-11-2015 05:18 PM
  6. anon(3463402)'s Avatar
    Windows Mobile doesn't need to be saved as it's much better than Android or iOS.

    Better questions is: Can they save users from switching to Windows devices.
    yanpaulo likes this.
    11-11-2015 05:21 PM
  7. FearL0rd's Avatar
    no more. Astoria was removed from the OS
    11-11-2015 07:33 PM
  8. Mad Cabbie's Avatar
    We already know that will not be the case. Most apps will not function fully or "as advertised" on WP without the developer getting involved. Then there are the legal issues which also require developer involvement.

    The bridges are for developers only. They aren't for end users.
    Talking of legal issues, has anyone actually sat down and gone through Playstore / apple store.. How many different versions of apps are there? Just look at a few of the 'game' apps. I'll kick off with one of my favourite time killers. 2048. I always used the original, but there are a plethora of blatant imitations of it. I counted 12 the other week, when I found it on windows store, no not 12 in windows store (lol). How many different defence / strategy games are just blatant copies of others?? It's OK for Google and Co to say they have the most apps, but statistically, when removing the blatant imitations of an original, how many do they really have??

    Surely, from a 'legal' standpoint, this must amount to theft of a devs intellectual rights?? Or, as usual, are google immune from this type of behaviour, just like their tax evasion practices. Strange really, I should like droid, being a fanatic linux user and a rom cooker, but I just fell out of love with it. Clunky, little integration with Fedora, Opensus, windows etc. Linux was OK for cooking but android always seemed to be a standalone platform. Even Chromebooks had limited integration with it.

    As for windows 10 mobile, I don't think the long game involves us social users. The 950 / 950xl are obviously aimed at the enterprise market, and I guess that's where MS is heading, especially with the abundance of users of W10. The only budget device that was 'unveiled', albeit it very briefly, was probably an attempt to 'let Google and Apple know they were still around'. What could be interesting is if MS developed the linux system they have been working on.

    Anyways, sorry for going off topic there...
    11-12-2015 06:33 AM
  9. yanpaulo's Avatar
    Windows Mobile doesn't need to be saved as it's much better than Android or iOS.

    Better questions is: Can they save users from switching to Windows devices.
    Yes, sorry, that's what I meant. Just used bad words :p
    I think Windows is much better than Android, and maybe iOS (never used it, and that's why the "maybe").
    By "save" I mean saving its existence, because it's not much likely for na OS to exist and be supported if much people don't use it.
    anon(3463402) likes this.
    11-12-2015 10:28 AM
  10. Steve Adams's Avatar
    no more. Astoria was removed from the OS
    No, its not. I was NEVER in the OS. That was a test program that was in the OS. Astoria and the others are separate programs desgined to give developers assistance to port their apps into the windows ecosystem.
    rhapdog and anon(3463402) like this.
    11-12-2015 04:31 PM
  11. bemiquel's Avatar
    I think Astoria and Islandwood are really key to making W10M succesful. I have been using Windows Phone since 2012 with WP8. Even though all this time there were not that many apps in the store, most of the essential apps and funcionalities were covered by Microsoft's and specially Nokia's apps (all the Lumia collection).

    But Microsoft removed and quit support for many of them, I guess because they were being pressured by other OEMs, and now we are really lacking MANY quality apps in the platform. I don't feel like since the release of the preview of W10M nine months ago we have seen many apps coming to the platform.

    So these two projects really are the last hope for us who wanna stay with Windows. They were announced in April and we haven't seen almost any progress yet. I really hope that Microsoft haven't dropped even partly the bridges, and I wish they were not so slow and missing their internal deadlines all the time.

    Honestly I wish we could just freely run Android apps on our phones. I think Windows (desktop) has always been known as a platform in which you could freely run anything you wanted without much restrictions. I understand that people might not want bad-quality Android apps coming to the platform but it is their choice not to use them. The ONLY but BIG drawback of Windows 10 Mobile is the lack of apps.
    11-12-2015 06:16 PM
  12. anon(3463402)'s Avatar
    Yes, sorry, that's what I meant. Just used bad words :p
    I think Windows is much better than Android, and maybe iOS (never used it, and that's why the "maybe").
    By "save" I mean saving its existence, because it's not much likely for na OS to exist and be supported if much people don't use it.
    Microsoft is very serious here. They are working very hard on Windows Mobile, more than ever before.
    Microsoft is committed to Windows phone (they just have a hard time showing it) | Windows Central
    11-12-2015 07:04 PM
  13. Asskickulater's Avatar
    I think Astoria and Islandwood are really key to making W10M succesful. I have been using Windows Phone since 2012 with WP8. Even though all this time there were not that many apps in the store, most of the essential apps and funcionalities were covered by Microsoft's and specially Nokia's apps (all the Lumia collection).

    But Microsoft removed and quit support for many of them, I guess because they were being pressured by other OEMs, and now we are really lacking MANY quality apps in the platform. I don't feel like since the release of the preview of W10M nine months ago we have seen many apps coming to the platform.

    So these two projects really are the last hope for us who wanna stay with Windows. They were announced in April and we haven't seen almost any progress yet. I really hope that Microsoft haven't dropped even partly the bridges, and I wish they were not so slow and missing their internal deadlines all the time.

    Honestly I wish we could just freely run Android apps on our phones. I think Windows (desktop) has always been known as a platform in which you could freely run anything you wanted without much restrictions. I understand that people might not want bad-quality Android apps coming to the platform but it is their choice not to use them. The ONLY but BIG drawback of Windows 10 Mobile is the lack of apps.
    It's much much bigger than "I understand that people might not want bad-quality Android apps coming to the platform but it is their choice not to use them" The issue laying with in this, and what people fear, is what happened to black berry, if Microsoft just allows android apps on WP, then devs are just gonna be like "well, if my app already works on it, then what's the point in making a native app for it" BB tried this, and it pretty much damned them, destroyed what little app market they had left, and forced them to rely solely on the android support.
    a5cent likes this.
    11-12-2015 07:10 PM
  14. mnsiw's Avatar
    I'm very hopeful that this is going to happen, specially because these bridges seem to work very well.

    But no matter how much I think, I have no idea if Windows will finally be a widely used mobile platform (and therefore not being at risk of dying). Any thoughts?
    Don't know about it but app gap is serious problem with WM, like my bank, my telecom and other utility companies have apps for Android and iOS but not for WM, I can not login to internet banking on Edge or UC on WM but it works on Droid Mini (DM) in Chrome. I can stream audio from Mac to DM using Airfoil server / speaker, on WM tried many DLNA / UPnP apps but no luck so far. Copying / Moving photos, music or video DM to Mac or Mac to DM is simple using Android File Transfer, but no proper way to do this with WM.

    Even available apps on WM are not as polished as their Android versions. So they need to address this issue to gain market share. Let's see if Project Astoria improve this situation.
    11-13-2015 02:09 AM
  15. yanpaulo's Avatar
    It's much much bigger than "I understand that people might not want bad-quality Android apps coming to the platform but it is their choice not to use them" The issue laying with in this, and what people fear, is what happened to black berry, if Microsoft just allows android apps on WP, then devs are just gonna be like "well, if my app already works on it, then what's the point in making a native app for it" BB tried this, and it pretty much damned them, destroyed what little app market they had left, and forced them to rely solely on the android support.
    Actually, Project Islandwood isn't a way to run iOS apps on Windows.
    It works by actually making a port of the iOS app, building a full featured Universal Windows App, able to run on desktop, Xbox, Mobile, etc.

    Astoria in the other hand runs Android apps, yes. But it also provides an SDK for the developer to implement Windows-specific stuff, like Live Tiles, Notifications, Microsoft services, etc. It is far different than an emulator. It's much bigger (and better) than that.

    Windows Bridges are incredible Technologies, and I have very high hopes for what they'll do for Windows. Guess I'm just gonna have to wait :/
    11-13-2015 12:13 PM
  16. bemiquel's Avatar
    So apparently Astoria has been put on hold (and I think cancelled).
    11-13-2015 01:34 PM
  17. yanpaulo's Avatar
    So apparently Astoria has been put on hold (and I think cancelled).
    I don't think so, since there's a whole tool/SDK for Astoria. Also, it seems to be one of the keys for Windows' strategy next year.
    11-13-2015 03:01 PM
  18. elindalyne's Avatar
    I don't think so, since there's a whole tool/SDK for Astoria. Also, it seems to be one of the keys for Windows' strategy next year.
    Article on the front page :/
    Laura Knotek and xandros9 like this.
    11-13-2015 03:15 PM
  19. seb_r's Avatar
    Article on the front page :/
    Not really new. MSFT has a long tradition in abandoning support for devices or software rather quickly, sometimes even before officially released.
    I wouldn't be surprised if in next months we see more former features of W10M being canceled cos resources are limited andW10M is still a mess in latest build.
    11-13-2015 03:56 PM
  20. Asskickulater's Avatar
    Actually, Project Islandwood isn't a way to run iOS apps on Windows.
    It works by actually making a port of the iOS app, building a full featured Universal Windows App, able to run on desktop, Xbox, Mobile, etc.

    Astoria in the other hand runs Android apps, yes. But it also provides an SDK for the developer to implement Windows-specific stuff, like Live Tiles, Notifications, Microsoft services, etc. It is far different than an emulator. It's much bigger (and better) than that.

    Windows Bridges are incredible Technologies, and I have very high hopes for what they'll do for Windows. Guess I'm just gonna have to wait :/
    My comment was referring to Astoria, all the other bridges are godly things that can only help the platform, Astoria on the other hand, its cool, and I enjoyed using android apps on my phone, but its a gamble using it, I believe that windows 10 can build its own ecosystem and doesn't need to fall back on emulation
    a5cent and xandros9 like this.
    11-13-2015 04:54 PM
  21. Allen Rhodes's Avatar
    Astoria was never going to be the savior of the "app gap". Name a single android app you cant live without? Exactly. Islandwood is the answer to the "app gap". Yes there is an app gap, no need to take this thread down that road. As long as we keep hearing about Islandwood produced apps, we are on the right track.
    yanpaulo likes this.
    11-13-2015 05:18 PM
  22. a5cent's Avatar
    Up until now it was hard to find anybody on WCentral even mentioning Islandwood.



    It was all about the inferior, and for the UWP potentially deadly (and therefore dangerous for the entire W10 ecosystem), Astoria. I'm glad we've finally turned that corner.
    11-13-2015 06:48 PM
  23. elindalyne's Avatar
    Islandwood wasn't really mentioned because there were working examples of Astoria. While Islandwood is the much better project, it's kind of hard to get excited about something that still seems to be vaporware.

    Yes, there are examples of Islandwood (CandyCrush), but it's a lot more difficult to compile Objective C code to WinObjC than it was to run the Android emulation.

    For me personally, there are no apps I can't live without on W10M so the bridge platforms for me are more getting other people into the platform so the few apps that would be great to have actually come to the platform I love.
    xandros9 and yanpaulo like this.
    11-13-2015 06:59 PM
  24. a5cent's Avatar
    Islandwood wasn't really mentioned because there were working examples of Astoria. While Islandwood is the much better project, it's kind of hard to get excited about something that still seems to be vaporware.

    Yes, there are examples of Islandwood (CandyCrush), but it's a lot more difficult to compile Objective C code to WinObjC than it was to run the Android emulation.
    Non developers typically care squat about how difficult a porting/programing task is, and considering there are already Islandwood ported apps in the store, I'd say Astoria is far more deserving of being called vaporware than Islandwood.

    IMHO there is more too it than that.

    AFAIK you are the first person on WCentral beside myself to say that Islandwood is the better technology and more important project. A week ago such a statement would have been mostly ignored and sometimes viewed as a little bit crazy. Anyway, whatever that was I'm glad it's over.

    In regard to the technical points raised:

    I never bought the idea that Astoria is so much simpler to use. The idea that recompilation is such an issue is like saying a cook would find a dish complicated because it requires a frying pan (big deal not). We also seem to keep ignoring that for an Android app to not just run, but to run CORRECTLY, developers also need to get out their compilers (i.e. to deal with Google Play issues). The real fun starts when an Astoria ported app doesn't display the desired runtime characteristics (as a result of partly running on an emulation layer), or not integrating well with WP's security model. When that happens, Astoria is instantly far more complicated than Islandwood.

    The issue with Islandwood has nothing to do with the necessity to recompile. It's the fact that iOS apps must be slightly modified. For example, it's very common that developers would have to hide the software back button in the ported iOS app, and hook up the same functionality to WP's hardware back button.

    For me the biggest question is why they are dropping Astoria now. It was obviously going to torpedo UWP (Astoria ported apps aren't universal) and therefore represented a threat to the entire W10 ecosystem. It should have been killed long ago.
    11-14-2015 02:40 AM
  25. theefman's Avatar
    Up until now it was hard to find anybody on WCentral even mentioning Islandwood.



    It was all about the inferior, and for the UWP potentially deadly (and therefore dangerous for the entire W10 ecosystem), Astoria. I'm glad we've finally turned that corner.
    Probably because people were anticipating being able to just grab android apk's and running whatever app they wanted. Islandwood would be my choice too from an app quality standpoint at the very least.
    Laura Knotek, a5cent and yanpaulo like this.
    11-14-2015 06:24 AM
46 12

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