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01-07-2016 03:52 AM
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  1. DBrandUSA's Avatar
    At work today, we had an all day meeting that lasted from 9am to 4pm. The meeting brought together several departments so that we could all collaborate and find out what our technology road map was going to be for the next fiscal year. We had several guest speakers including one from Microsoft that pitched to us why using Office 365 for SharePoint was great for our companies' needs. He stated that Microsoft Windows was a first class citizen and Microsoft Mobile was a third class citizen. He then clarified on what third class citizen meant. During his explanation he stated several times that Satya himself refers to Windows Mobile as third class citizen internally. They will ALWAYS develop and update existing apps in this order: Android (First), iOS (Second) and then "maybe" Windows Mobile (Third). There you have it folks, from the horses mouth!

    Over the months, I've read many comments and replies to people complaining about lack of features in Windows Mobile apps. I hope this validates those complaints and finally helps us realize that we will NEVER have the same features as our competitors.

    I am very saddened and angry. I 'was' a die hard Microsoft fan. I am no longer.
    12-14-2015 08:35 PM
  2. libra89's Avatar
    That's an interesting choice of words. My only guess is that Microsoft wants to go where the people are first, rather than locking it down to their stuff first and then everyone else next.
    12-14-2015 08:38 PM
  3. theefman's Avatar
    Strange that a Microsoft representative would say that to an audience in an official capacity, maybe he was projecting his own biases but in one sense I am not really surprised as the Microsoft guys where I work have echoed just such an internal posture, though with ios taking the favoured OS spot. Not sure it changes anything though, they have pretty much set this as their strategy for all to see right now so no real news here.
    libra89, a5cent, xandros9 and 3 others like this.
    12-14-2015 08:53 PM
  4. aximtreo's Avatar
    I don't tweet but those who do, send this to Gabe Aul and see what, if any, response he has. If this is true, and I truly hope it's not, my 950 XL luster just dimmed quite a bit.
    12-15-2015 09:01 AM
  5. justonlumia's Avatar
    Makes sense considering the way it has been in the recent past, Microsoft apps are better on other platforms compared to WP
    emjey and Ian_Superfly like this.
    12-15-2015 10:17 AM
  6. GabeAul's Avatar
    I think the person in question here either misspoke or was misunderstood. We would not just accept, nor settle for, 3rd place in Mobile for Windows. Weve released great new devices, a new converged OS, and a new Universal Windows Apps platform just this year. All of these are clear investments and show our commitment to a great Windows experience across a broad range of devices.
    12-15-2015 11:05 AM
  7. locodice's Avatar
    The big problem here is that MS is selling out its advantages over the other platforms,like office,one drive,outlook(recent post from windows central that IOS proves its steps ahead that WM) and not only sells them it doesnt keeps its OS updated and this may benefit MS for now but in the long term it gives no reason to a future buyer to choice the MS side on the mobile platform.And this is also making me angry us a buyer of many product and recently my new 930(that shows my support to the OS despite the trend) that MS doesnt respect its poeple us buyers and fans.

    Really disappointed to say that but microsoft doesnt show a single hint that he wants to keep its fans or buyers to her platform especially on the mobile side and that is very dissappointing.
    12-15-2015 11:30 AM
  8. Ma Rio's Avatar
    You know, words aren't important here. Actions speak louder than words. If you haven't realised by now that MS is clearly more interested about Android and iOS than Windows Phone (W10M), then you must be looking the wrong way. I can't blame them (too much) for that. W10M just isn't that profitable, it probably won't be any time soon, and MS needs money.
    But still, if you have a product (in this case a mobile operating system) and if you're not ready to give up on it, don't just hold it in limbo. Push an update to Android, but try to get the same update on W10M. After all didn't THEY invent the Android bridge to make cross-platform development easier.
    All in all, I'm just kinda disappointed.
    First I'm disappointed because Android just doesn't deserve to be that popular. Android on it's own is kinda OK, but the bad implementation of it just makes you wanna cry. Today I saw some random Samsung Android phone and wanted to puke when I saw the dialer.
    Second, I atleast once want to feel like my device matters. My last device was the N8, and boy, oh boy was it a bad experience. I mean, the device was great, a fine display, a superb camera. But talkin' about the apps and web experience and all that, it was just bad. I hoped that would change if I bought a high end phone, and spend a few bucks more than I wanted (420€ for a new 1520), but nope.
    So I'm kinda dazed now. There's this crappy OS that's on top of the world, and I'm always stuck with an OK one, but it has no support.
    12-15-2015 12:12 PM
  9. prasanna moholkar's Avatar
    I think the person in question here either misspoke or was misunderstood. We would not just accept, nor settle for, 3rd place in Mobile for Windows. Weve released great new devices, a new converged OS, and a new Universal Windows Apps platform just this year. All of these are clear investments and show our commitment to a great Windows experience across a broad range of devices.
    Can you please answer my simple questions then

    Why lock screen app from Microsoft in the play store is updated every month and we have live lock screen beta which is not updated from last 1 and half year???
    12-15-2015 12:24 PM
  10. tangledW's Avatar
    Sounds like someone talking out of their ace. From what I've seen, iOS is first in priority.
    I've also meet several Microsoft employees who talk like they know something... they don't.
    libra89 likes this.
    12-15-2015 12:47 PM
  11. rhapdog's Avatar
    I think the person in question here either misspoke or was misunderstood. We would not just accept, nor settle for, 3rd place in Mobile for Windows. Weve released great new devices, a new converged OS, and a new Universal Windows Apps platform just this year. All of these are clear investments and show our commitment to a great Windows experience across a broad range of devices.
    Thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule to respond here.
    The big problem here is that MS is selling out its advantages over the other platforms,like office,one drive,outlook(recent post from windows central that IOS proves its steps ahead that WM) and not only sells them it doesnt keeps its OS updated and this may benefit MS for now but in the long term it gives no reason to a future buyer to choice the MS side on the mobile platform.And this is also making me angry us a buyer of many product and recently my new 930(that shows my support to the OS despite the trend) that MS doesnt respect its poeple us buyers and fans.

    Really disappointed to say that but microsoft doesnt show a single hint that he wants to keep its fans or buyers to her platform especially on the mobile side and that is very dissappointing.
    Microsoft has shown lots of hints. How about a corporate Vice President actually stopping by this thread to let you know that Microsoft does indeed care? Thanks again, Gabe, for stopping by.

    Windows Phone 8.1 will no longer be updated, except to Windows 10 Mobile. Windows 10 Mobile has already pushed out an update world-wide to every Windows 10 Mobile phone that was in the market, everywhere, without having to go through carriers. Yes, Microsoft WILL be keeping the OS up-to-date.

    And Microsoft isn't selling out advantages over Windows 10 Mobile. They are putting their products on all devices being actively used in large proportions in order to keep the money rolling in on that side while Windows 10 Mobile and the Universal Windows Platform has an opportunity to take-off.

    You wonder what will be the reason for people to come to Windows 10 Mobile? The same thing Microsoft has starting pushing with Windows 10. One experience across all devices. You only get that when you have Windows 10 on all your devices. It will make you more productive and less attached to a particular device because you can use all the devices. Another thing that will bring people is Continuum, especially once Intel processors are being used so that in the future Desktop Apps can be run using Continuum. Many people who only use a laptop or PC for email, word processing, spreadsheets, or whatever else they do on their sub-$500 laptops will be able to do all that on their phone without having to purchase a phone AND a laptop. I'm ready for that.


    Can you please answer my simple questions then

    Why lock screen app from Microsoft in the play store is updated every month and we have live lock screen beta which is not updated from last 1 and half year???
    Live Lock Screen Beta was discontinued some time ago. It isn't compatible with Windows 10 Mobile's lockscreen API. Comparing lock screen apps for Windows 10 and Android is not a good idea. Capabilities and API for these are completely dissimilar.
    Sounds like someone talking out of their ace. From what I've seen, iOS is first in priority.
    I've also meet several Microsoft employees who talk like they know something... they don't.
    Gabe Aul isn't just a random Microsoft employee, FYI. His account here has been confirmed by Windows Central, and he's the real deal. He is Vice President of the Windows System Group and the one in charge of the Windows Insider program. You can be sure that this man is kept in-the-know at Microsoft.
    12-15-2015 02:22 PM
  12. xandros9's Avatar
    Gabe Aul isn't just a random Microsoft employee, FYI. His account here has been confirmed by Windows Central, and he's the real deal. He is Vice President of the Windows System Group and the one in charge of the Windows Insider program. You can be sure that this man is kept in-the-know at Microsoft.
    I think that guy was talking about the OP's post, not Mr. Aul here (whose presence is much appreciated) since I also believe iOS has become the unofficial preferential platform. Android does get more things but its from its more free nature. (and some are MS Garage projects)

    Although if it makes people feel better, Windows 10 Mobile has a better MSN News app than iOS and there was actually some grumbling over in Android-land about iOS getting a sizeable Hangouts update before Android so make of that what you will.

    Anyways, I'm feeling pretty outclassed here, being in the same thread as the WSG VP! Wow!
    I hope the Twitter spam and whatnot doesn't get you too down, I know I would have trouble putting up with it all I admit.
    And be warned, we got a lot of negativity out here like Twitter too so...

    I understand everything is being rebooted (for the third-ish time?) and I believe its absolutely the right call, but its hard to see our preferred platform remain stagnant and fall behind, whether by intentionally removed features or by its seemingly slow pace. (but yup I see building it all ground up isn't exactly easy)
    I remember knocking iOS a while back for its slow pace, but at least each step is an improvement.
    Hopefully work on Windows Mobile behind the scenes will break from its current trajectory, I'd love to see early 2013 levels of success again. Well, at least to me. I used to be able to easily recommend Windows Phone to people and believe it'd work well for them.

    Apologies if I come off as far too negative. Keep at it. Always looking forwards to your tweets, whether hailing the arrival of another build or not.
    12-15-2015 03:46 PM
  13. Dusan Randj's Avatar
    Personally, I couldn't say they don't care. They do. But they clearly aren't putting enough effort and money in WP or WM. It is advancing, but not fast enough.

    What kept me with 8.1 is speed, reliability,smoothness, Nokia hardware, OneDrive and offline maps. MSFT slapping in the face was present but I kept phone because I couldn't afford decent performing Android phone (I tried but I came but just because of fast and reliable OS).

    Since it looks like there won't be actual upgrade to 735, OS seems more demanding and slowed down,(althought non finished yet, will give it a time,I understand that), I see no more reasons to take slaps in the face and be experimental rat for them. Once I had enough money for decent performing Android device, I'll switch. And if they give good experience in some time, I'll come back.
    12-15-2015 04:15 PM
  14. Dusan Randj's Avatar
    Live Lock Screen Beta was discontinued some time ago. It isn't compatible with Windows 10 Mobile's lockscreen API. Comparing lock screen apps for Windows 10 and Android is not a good idea. Capabilities and API for these are completely dissimilar.
    This is just a poor excuse. If they wanted to make it more capable, they would. Don't tell me that MSFT which is one of the best, if not strongest software company, aren't able to make lockscreen for it's OS more useful. And if they can't, they could make API's for 3rd party developers, which would make decent lockscreens. But they disn't. When Live Lockscreen Beta showed, developers were begging MSFT to release APIs to take advantage of them, and they didn't. All that happened was Tetra Lock screen, which showed that Lockscreen is capable of some interactive actions, and that's all.
    They simply don't put enough effort and that's it.
    Last edited by xandros9; 12-15-2015 at 04:29 PM. Reason: cutting down on blank space
    Ian_Superfly and theefman like this.
    12-15-2015 04:26 PM
  15. Joe Acerbic's Avatar
    I think the person in question here either misspoke or was misunderstood. We would not just accept, nor settle for, 3rd place in Mobile for Windows. We’ve released great new devices, a new converged OS, and a new Universal Windows Apps platform just this year. All of these are clear investments and show our commitment to a great Windows experience across a broad range of devices.
    Can you say why I can draw in Android OneNote but not in W10M OneNote and is that how it's going to be forever?
    12-15-2015 05:56 PM
  16. rhapdog's Avatar
    I think that guy was talking about the OP's post, not Mr. Aul here (whose presence is much appreciated)
    Oops! my bad. I missed that. You may be right.

    @TangledW, if I read your post wrong, I'm sorry. Props.

    Can you say why I can draw in Android OneNote but not in W10M OneNote and is that how it's going to be forever?
    Honestly, I thought OneNote Mobile was a UWP and supposed to be the same on Mobile (phone) and PC (tablet or desktop). Apparently, I was wrong. Much of the functionality of the OneNote store app in Windows 10 for PC is removed for OneNote for Windows 10 Mobile on the phone.

    From what I understand, many of these apps are supposed to have expanded display scaling when used with continuum. I'd like to know from someone who is using Continuum if these features return to match the OneNote store app for the PC.
    xandros9 and libra89 like this.
    12-15-2015 06:41 PM
  17. chmun77's Avatar
    First I'm disappointed because Android just doesn't deserve to be that popular. Android on it's own is kinda OK, but the bad implementation of it just makes you wanna cry. Today I saw some random Samsung Android phone and wanted to puke when I saw the dialer.
    Second, I atleast once want to feel like my device matters. My last device was the N8, and boy, oh boy was it a bad experience. I mean, the device was great, a fine display, a superb camera. But talkin' about the apps and web experience and all that, it was just bad. I hoped that would change if I bought a high end phone, and spend a few bucks more than I wanted (420€ for a new 1520), but nope.
    So I'm kinda dazed now. There's this crappy OS that's on top of the world, and I'm always stuck with an OK one, but it has no support.
    You know, I was having the same thoughts. Android is just an OK platform, but hey, at the very least, Android users enjoy most of the apps in the world! I mean, for a smart phone, it is just a calling and texting device without apps. It is not "smart" at all without any apps, or to be precise, apps that are not even updated or polished like on the windows phone. Facebook beta JUST received its ability to reply to comments and edit posts, in end of year 2015! What a joke.

    I have a Note 4 as well, and no, I do not puke upon seeing the dialer. On the contrary, I'm glad that I'm holding onto a platform which has so much more apps supports as well as capabilities. If only Lumia 950 includes a pen and a multi-windows functionality. I think W10M has a long way to go to before it is welcome by the masses. And I'm not even sure if does it has the stamina to do so.

    Anyways, Android users are not missing any Microsoft services on their devices at all. Based on the development and now OP's statements, it seems like Microsoft is not putting much efforts on W10M at all. The platform may goes on, but don't expect prompt updates coming from Microsoft for any of its apps. "Coming soon" is their motto for W10M.
    cbobb123 and Ian_Superfly like this.
    12-15-2015 07:15 PM
  18. Kram Sacul's Avatar
    I think the person in question here either misspoke or was misunderstood. We would not just accept, nor settle for, 3rd place in Mobile for Windows. We’ve released great new devices, a new converged OS, and a new Universal Windows Apps platform just this year. All of these are clear investments and show our commitment to a great Windows experience across a broad range of devices.
    Continuously dropping the ball for the past few years, giving more attention to iOS and Android apps and releasing bland characterless devices with clearly not ready for prime time software is a strange way to communicate that MS is not settling for 3rd place in the mobile world. If anything MS is looking for 4th place, badly.

    The actual internal hardware is great and I appreciate some of the features MS has developed but overall as a long time fan and supporter of WP I'm embarrassed.
    12-15-2015 09:11 PM
  19. Spectrum90's Avatar
    Most Microsoft's W10M apps are universal. How could Microsoft be neglecting mobile if exactly the same apps are running on the PC?

    iOS and Android apps have years of development. Windows 10 apps have months of development and they're pretty good already.
    Lee Power likes this.
    12-15-2015 11:45 PM
  20. Loc Ngo's Avatar
    Wow, I just love how a random post without any confirmation or proof from someone with only 3 posts can cause such a stir here. I just can't get the way Windows/MS fans love Windows/MS sometimes.
    12-16-2015 12:25 AM
  21. xandros9's Avatar
    Wow, I just love how a random post without any confirmation or proof from someone with only 3 posts can cause such a stir here. I just can't get the way Windows/MS fans love Windows/MS sometimes.
    You may not have seen it, but he happens to have the flair reserved for confirmed Microsoft employees below his (unfortunately low-res) avatar - on the desktop site that is at least, like how us Moderators, Ambassadors, etc. are labeled.

    Meaning someone higher up has it on good faith it is indeed the same person whose Twitter we have been faithfully F5'ing.

    Well, some of us at least.
    Laura Knotek, libra89 and jmshub like this.
    12-16-2015 12:36 AM
  22. ImaMess's Avatar
    Do Android & i phones have the fake/scam apps too? Or is that a Microsoft store issue?
    12-16-2015 12:38 AM
  23. Loc Ngo's Avatar
    You may not have seen it, but he happens to have the flair reserved for confirmed Microsoft employees below his (unfortunately low-res) avatar - on the desktop site that is at least, like how us Moderators, Ambassadors, etc. are labeled.

    Meaning someone higher up has it on good faith it is indeed the same person whose Twitter we have been faithfully F5'ing.

    Well, some of us at least.
    Well, if you mean the one below Gabe's or your avatar, then I can see none from the below of the avatar of the OP, whose ID is DBrandUSA, here aside from a mere "member" just like mine. And he is the one who I was referring to in my previous post. He happens to have the same number of posts as Gabe's.
    12-16-2015 01:09 AM
  24. Visa Declined's Avatar
    The way some of you are talking to Gabe is childish, and flat out embarrassing. The man is actually trying to communicate with us, and include us in the process of improving the platform. There's no reason to treat him like dirt.

    These are mobile phones we are talking about here, but some of you act like they are the most important thing in your world. It's pretty scary. You need to also remember that Microsoft makes more money off of Android and iPhone users than they do you, that's just the way it is. Think about that next time you want to get angry that Microsoft is focusing more on them.
    rmeigs likes this.
    12-16-2015 05:22 AM
  25. v535's Avatar
    There's always a chance that guest speaker from MS misspoke as he/she could be a die-hard fan of wp and was forced to use these words "First/second/third class" so that developers focus trend in the market these days. App gap doesn't matter now, since I felt some exclusive app for Lumia is a step above than the same app developed for i0S or android. Take MSO or Office for Mobile, how many guys felt that MSO or OM worked the best on WP or w10m than using it on iOS or android. For me, quality of the app is important rather than chasing against competitors. @Gabe already knows this and CEO already said we're not chasing against competitors rather we keep the product alive so that users won't be disappointed.
    12-16-2015 05:58 AM
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