02-29-2016 02:48 PM
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  1. triageatdawn's Avatar
    I'm friends with some people who are still on WM. If our platform dies completely some of us will switch to iPhone, and some, including myself, still have no idea what they're gonna do if it comes to that one day. I think I'm gonna miss ZEISS the most. Oh man. Really disappointed.
    01-29-2016 11:56 AM
  2. EspHack's Avatar
    I'm expecting the same thing Microsoft did with surface RT here, they just move on, but NOT being on mobile is not on their plans, it just doesn't make sense really, they have been losing this battle for decades, I don't think they really care anymore, and will just keep throwing phones at us, so I'm gonna be happy as long as I never have to ever consider a device that doesn't fit my "ecosystem"
    01-29-2016 12:15 PM
  3. WillysJeepMan's Avatar
    I think the biggest problem at this point is: how does Microsoft plan to ever get users who tried Windows Phone/Windows 10 Mobile and left for Android/iOS to return? Even if the apps eventually arrive, why would someone choose to switch back to what he/she left if his/her current mobile platform has all the apps he/she wants, especially if that person has invested money buying apps in the App Store or Google Play? What possibly could compel such a user to return?

    BlackBerry might have a better chance if it makes compelling hardware, since it is now an Android OEM, so previous Google Play app purchases could be installed on the Priv (and future devices) without requiring additional payments. A current Android user would have a more compelling reason to buy an Android device made by BlackBerry than to buy a Windows 10 Mobile device.
    Good thoughts, and good questions.

    IMO, Microsoft has done themselves in, in the mobile space. I remember in the early 2000's using some terrific PDAs and smartphones BEFORE the iPhone running Microsoft's mobile operating systems. Amazing devices! I frequently traveled from AZ to NY and even back then those PocketPC/Windows Mobile devices were powerful enough to handle my computing needs on the trip. Folding external keyboards and all.

    But they squandered their market lead. Every reboot dug the hole deeper, causing developers to leave the platform for good. With every reboot, Microsoft would need to commit more time, money, and resources to overcome the damage. But they didn't quite do that.

    Now with Windows Phone 10, it's too late. The only "hail Mary" they could throw would be to produce a "Surface Phone" that would actually deliver what Belfiore demonstrated. But that would be gambling on the Surface name which is finally beginning to receive a good reputation.

    It would take a ton more money, time, and energy than Microsoft is probably willing to invest.
    01-29-2016 01:10 PM
  4. donkiluminate's Avatar
    I'm friends with some people who are still on WM. If our platform dies completely some of us will switch to iPhone, and some, including myself, still have no idea what they're gonna do if it comes to that one day. I think I'm gonna miss ZEISS the most. Oh man. Really disappointed.

    I tell ya. I left WM back in November and I miss it a lot. I bounced from an iPhone to Android to iPhone and now I'm thinking about going back to Android. Neither of those platforms really do it for me.

    Despite the "app gap" and other frustrations i might have with the platform and MS' handling of it, I miss WM. Recently, I've been starting to talk myself into getting a 950 but I just don't have enough faith in MS to keep the platform alive enough and long enough to justify dropping $650 for the XL.

    WM is a great platform but the lack of shepherding by MS has hurt it.
    01-29-2016 02:02 PM
  5. telomoyo's Avatar
    After reading Jason's article http://www.windowscentral.com/viewin...proper-context , something caught my attention, NPS "(NPS is a customer loyalty metric. It is this measure that Microsoft is applying to determine its success with its fans, enterprise and value consumers)"-Jason. This may be a reason why Msft is not advertising the phones. MSFT wants to see how well the WM platform can do without any advertisements, and get an idea of how well WM would do if it was.
    Paul Stasik and aXross like this.
    01-29-2016 02:31 PM
  6. constantreader16's Avatar
    The impression I've gotten with Windows 10 (including mobile), is that it's essentially a "long con," for lack of a better name. The initial versions of mobile aren't necessarily supposed to save the platform, but it's supposed to be the building blocks towards creating an ecosystem with almost no barriers. You have desktop, mobile, hololens, IoT, Band, tablets, etc. Mobile is a major part of that, but it seems like they know that they aren't ready to give that next big mobile push. Despite how much I hate people saying it, W10 Mobile (I don't consider the PC this at all), is still in "beta."

    That's not to say it's unusable by any means or even incomplete, it's just very early and is being fine tuned. I also believe that once it hit 10586, it was incredibly stable. The difference I saw between some of the earlier builds, and that build in particular was monumental.

    What I mean by that is that this is how they are getting W10M ready for the big time, which would be the Surface/Panos Phone. I've been using it as my daily driver since about Thanksgiving and I've had no major issues with it. It may not have all the bells and whistles that everyone hoped for, but it does the job. It's just as stable as most of my Android phones ever were, if not more.

    All that said, Windows 10 (including mobile), is a very long term idea from Microsoft. It's about breaking down the barriers between devices and adapting to devices and form factors. Without Mobile, it fails. While I don't know what Microsoft is thinking, I'm sure they know what they are doing. The Surface line 4 years ago looked to be a total disaster, but look at it now. If Microsoft can garner even 30% of the success of the Surface if/when it is applied to mobile, they will have succeeded. Keep in mind, that the success the Surface line has generated so far has absolutely changed the definition of laptops and tablets. Both Google and Apple released their own versions of the Surface this year (neither with anywhere near similar capabilities), and it has inspired an entire new product line of 2-in-1's and transformed laptops and tablets with Windows 8/8.1/10.

    The whole idea of One Windows (or whatever this strategy was called) has been in the works for years, and this is only the beginning of the unity we're seeing of the platforms. This will continue to change and grow going forward, and it truly is something that will take a long time to fully manifest. The general unity between all the devices seen already is a very welcome start in my opinion.

    Personally, I think Microsoft has the right idea here, they've thinking long term and I wouldn't bet against them with how well the Surface line has done to move the entire marketplace. Additionally, given the traction Windows 10 for PC has gained, that likely will have at least some positive effect on Mobile as well, even if it takes some time to manifest.

    TL:DR; This is a long term plan, desktop might be able to carry mobile, and using similar techniques as were used with the Surface line could still save Windows 10 and Windows 10 Mobile.
    01-29-2016 02:46 PM
  7. Krystianpants's Avatar
    After reading Jason's article Viewing Windows phone in the proper context | Windows Central , something caught my attention, NPS "(NPS is a customer loyalty metric. It is this measure that Microsoft is applying to determine its success with its fans, enterprise and value consumers)"-Jason. This may be a reason why Msft is not advertising the phones. MSFT wants to see how well the WM platform can do without any advertisements, and get an idea of how well WM would do if it was.
    Yes but take the hammering of android/ios apps out as a factor in NPS. How do you think that makes the fans feel? So what would the satisfaction be in this case?

    I honestly do get that everything is being done from scratch and things like this take time. But the problem is that their goal is so far into the future that it gives them an excuse to take their time. Yes, they need to do it right, it needs to be secure and all that jazz. But let's step away from the core OS/APi and look at the actual APPS that MS makes. These are missing a lot of basic features for example. They should not rely on the coreOS. In fact, a lot of the work is coded right in the app including multiple mailboxes and features surrounding them. Even something like aliases. These are basic functions that don't need to wait on the OS to be finalized or API to be finalized. Third party app touchmail is an incredible windows 10 mail app. So if these guys could do it, why can't MS? Wouldn't MS have specialized coders for specifically that Mail app, so they wouldn't need to use their resources else where? Shouldn't each app get their own team? Just makes you wonder how basic features can just be missing when a full team should be working on the app.
    01-29-2016 02:52 PM
  8. Iain_S's Avatar
    Microsoft has just starting putting all its separate software under one code base, windows, mobile, xbox and iot. the windows 10 that was released last year was not the final step in that direction as it did not fully align all in one code base. Redstone is that step as they are finally at the point now that it is a true onecore system. If you recently seen the huge build number in windows 10 pc insider build? that was to align the code with the mobile build completely You will start seeing rs1 builds very soon that are actually true onecore builds, which means all devices will run the same build and same core at the same time, what gets updated in pc build also gets updated in the mobile and xbox build, the mobile build is going to get a lot more robust from here out. Once rs1 is at completion stage along comes rs2 which will add many new features to all builds. MS are years ahead of this stuff than both apple and Google, MS are on the cutting edge of this. That's what this long journey has been about and its all coming together in 2016, it took 7 years to get there but it is finally upon us, their are exciting times ahead for the platform and the devices that surround that platform, from tiny devices to whatever size devices. Apple are in big trouble right now, if the iPhone 7 is not something completely new and doesn't blow your mind they will be in for a rude awakening, Google is tipping on saturation point with android, I cant see it going anywhere but downwards in the future.
    01-29-2016 03:47 PM
  9. owensdj's Avatar
    I think people are just waiting for phones pre-loaded with Windows 10 Mobile. Once 10 Mobile is released we will see a surge in Windows Phone market share.
    01-29-2016 04:57 PM
  10. avlon's Avatar
    I think the biggest problem at this point is: how does Microsoft plan to ever get users who tried Windows Phone/Windows 10 Mobile and left for Android/iOS to return? Even if the apps eventually arrive, why would someone choose to switch back to what he/she left if his/her current mobile platform has all the apps he/she wants, especially if that person has invested money buying apps in the App Store or Google Play? What possibly could compel such a user to return?

    BlackBerry might have a better chance if it makes compelling hardware, since it is now an Android OEM, so previous Google Play app purchases could be installed on the Priv (and future devices) without requiring additional payments. A current Android user would have a more compelling reason to buy an Android device made by BlackBerry than to buy a Windows 10 Mobile device.
    The funny thing is that Microsoft has had the tools all along, and somehow can't get them in a cohesive mobile package. They've totally missed the boat on the little things that geeks love, such as easy pairing to any wireless keyboard, mouse, or controller. The option to install apps from outside the Windows Store. Multi-Window and pen support. These things are just rearing their heads now, but should have been their from the beginning. Xbox controller should have a proprietary wireless driver in Windows without needing a silly dongle for it to work.

    There should have been a compatibility layer for Windows Mobile apps and x86 apps similar to how Apple had with Rosetta when they switched mobile architectures. Would it run slower than native, or not at all? Sure, but some apps would run acceptably well, and it would increase the amount of apps available by leaps and bounds. Folks with old apps might have been willing to try the new platform.

    Xbox Live compatibility. The indie games, and many of the Xbox live arcade games should have been cross platform on Microsoft systems. Turtles in time, The Simpsons, or Scott Pilgrim on mobile? Yes, please! Now imagine that working with tv out and Xbox controllers natively supported.

    Microsoft Office. The Windows versions should be incredibly powerful and easy to use. The best of all platforms, and competitive with DOCS for non-professional use.

    Patents. Instead of suing Android manufacturers, Microsoft should have cross licensed with Google and got their apps on mobile Windows.

    Developers. Instead of charging developers the 30% fee that Apple and Google charge, they should really defer this fee for active developers for at least 2-3 years. Say, as long as the developer updates the app say, at least once every 60 days, they get no fee's or greatly reduced fee's (say 10 to 15%) for those first few years. This would entice developers, which in turn would lead to folks migrating, which would lead to more development.

    Offer to migrate users paid apps. That app that tells you which apps have equivalents? Use it to let users get those apps for upon buying a new device, say up to $20 to $50 of credit for first time switchers.

    It could be done. Look at how far the Xbone has come once they got fresh management to actually try and entice customers. They may not win the console generation, but they're at least in the race.

    Just my random rant. LOL
    01-29-2016 06:38 PM
  11. xandros9's Avatar
    The funny thing is that Microsoft has had the tools all along, and somehow can't get them in a cohesive mobile package. They've totally missed the boat on the little things that geeks love, such as easy pairing to any wireless keyboard, mouse, or controller. The option to install apps from outside the Windows Store. Multi-Window and pen support. These things are just rearing their heads now, but should have been their from the beginning. Xbox controller should have a proprietary wireless driver in Windows without needing a silly dongle for it to work.

    There should have been a compatibility layer for Windows Mobile apps and x86 apps similar to how Apple had with Rosetta when they switched mobile architectures. Would it run slower than native, or not at all? Sure, but some apps would run acceptably well, and it would increase the amount of apps available by leaps and bounds. Folks with old apps might have been willing to try the new platform.

    Xbox Live compatibility. The indie games, and many of the Xbox live arcade games should have been cross platform on Microsoft systems. Turtles in time, The Simpsons, or Scott Pilgrim on mobile? Yes, please! Now imagine that working with tv out and Xbox controllers natively supported.

    Microsoft Office. The Windows versions should be incredibly powerful and easy to use. The best of all platforms, and competitive with DOCS for non-professional use.

    Patents. Instead of suing Android manufacturers, Microsoft should have cross licensed with Google and got their apps on mobile Windows.

    Developers. Instead of charging developers the 30% fee that Apple and Google charge, they should really defer this fee for active developers for at least 2-3 years. Say, as long as the developer updates the app say, at least once every 60 days, they get no fee's or greatly reduced fee's (say 10 to 15%) for those first few years. This would entice developers, which in turn would lead to folks migrating, which would lead to more development.

    Offer to migrate users paid apps. That app that tells you which apps have equivalents? Use it to let users get those apps for upon buying a new device, say up to $20 to $50 of credit for first time switchers.

    It could be done. Look at how far the Xbone has come once they got fresh management to actually try and entice customers. They may not win the console generation, but they're at least in the race.

    Just my random rant. LOL
    I have some counterpoints to throw at you but I'll have to issue an IOU first because I'm kinda on the go at the moment.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    01-29-2016 08:33 PM
  12. bobwhi123's Avatar
    I'm done with windows mobile - for now. I've been a old fan boy for WM for many years, converted 8 of my friends to WM and all 4 in my family are on WM. Over the last 12-15 yrs trying Palm Phone, BB, IOS, Android for a year or two each, went to Windows Phone for the last ~7 years. Samsung Focus S, Lumia 920, Lumia 1520, then 950XL for one day.

    Love windows 10, love 85% of window 10 mobile. But could not use the 950xl for more than a day with so many bugs.
    -Camera was worse than my 1520 in low light
    -Took forever to process a photo
    -Battery lasted 1/2 day
    -Phone was nearly hot during charging and warm all the time in use
    -Glitches everywhere in WM10

    If it had been kick a... and minor bugs, then I would continue to put up with no notifications for fitbit or pebble, and limited new apps, and weak car integration, etc, etc. But I was so disappointed with the whole experience I'm done for now. Maybe someday, but new Microsoft apps are going to IOS before WM. I loved the idea of continuum, but I'll carry my laptop anyway until the business apps go universal.

    I don't trust Android or google with my data, BB is in worse shape than WM, so I guess I'm left with IOS... I kind of dread it... but at least I'll see who is texting me from my Pebble...
    01-29-2016 09:37 PM
  13. Protocol Rahul's Avatar
    People go through this podcast, hope your mind will be clear afterwards.

    01-30-2016 12:17 AM
  14. Chintan Gohel's Avatar
    01-30-2016 12:20 AM
  15. slivy58's Avatar
    Once 10 Mobile is released we will see a surge in Windows Phone market share.
    It'll be too late by then as many will have settled on another platform, besides, MS tarnished ways in the mobile division will take many moons to overcome and IMO we'd be lucky to see WM making any sizable impact in 2-3 years, just have to look at BB to see how their antics has fared for them and I see little difference here. Have a feeling many won’t be gauging WMs performance/advancements over the past 15 or so months but more since the 7.x days, doesn’t paint a very rosy picture when you factor all those years in, yep there were some exciting times but at every upturn there was multiple downturns, the trend continues.

    There is nothing wrong with a dream but if you already have an entity w/loyalists and basically cease advancements because you are working on the next evolution, you'll pay and pay dearly, alienating your supporters ain’t cool nor will it entice others to come onboard, throw in the fact they delayed outing new devices or chose the safe low-spec’d route when many wanted the cream of the crop, if you want to thrive then meeting all aspects of the spectrum w/minimal delays is a must especially in the tech world.
    01-30-2016 01:09 AM
  16. Tien-Lin Chang's Avatar
    Telling people is still growing and the future will be nice = telling people go some other platform now and come back when its ready?

    If so then why people want to invest their money on a developing platform before it's READY? A paying beta tester sound stupid to me.

    You can't using this excuse to cover MSFT for too long before it start driving people and app developer away.

    They already have gone slow in 2014 because the Nokia/MS merge, going even slower in 2015 because they are focuing on W10M. How many years we have to wait till we catch up MSFT claimed many years ahead?
    01-30-2016 04:40 AM
  17. Manfred Pohler's Avatar
    I don't have the insights to tell what the real reason for the WM problems are.
    But I want to share my "problems" with WM.

    I'm a MS developer for more than 20 years and you can call me a fan boy.
    Also I'm technical addicted. I run an automated home, have some HUE and LIFX bulbs run RaspBerry PIs...

    Going from Windows Mobile (those old "CE devices") to iPhone I learned two thing.
    With WP it was horrible to set up a network, and almost impossible to get a connection to my Exchange Server.
    On my iPhone it was just a few taps and I had push mail running - still with my Exchange.
    My thoughts were - why can a "third party" OS connect with MS products and MS to MS makes so much problems?

    Anyhow - I left my iPhone and changed back to MS.
    Things worked as expected - but from a developers perspective I was disappointed.
    Well knowing (from iPhone) that those mobile OSes have a lot of restrictions for a developer I was shocked how much more restrictions existed on WM.
    I had a "transportation goods tracking" application. First on WM (almost no restrictions at all) an later on iPhone - although nit took some time till Apple allowed background tasks.
    At WM - "no background due to battery concerns"...
    So I was not able to run this solution on WM...

    Next step was WP8.x.
    First to notice - my 500 Euro plus devices, about a year old will never get the update.
    So bad luck - while my iPhone 3GS still was on the most current iOS version.

    Meanwhile I got an Android Phone to run my smartwatch.
    And I needed it to access my VPN since WP8.0 couldn't do this.
    Another big problem - having a device which is advertised as "business device" not able to open a VPN connection.
    There were a lot of updates to WP8.0 - and I was always waiting for VPN - what they brought was "better X Box", "new Color schemas" and stuff like this...

    But with WP8.1 the things changed - VPN was introduced...
    And I felt like in the early days with my first iPhone - I could connect to my Windows 2xxx servers VPN with android - but not with the MS device.
    Oh yes - VPN on WP8.1 had a "plugin model" so third party vendors could write the "provider"...
    But - first (almost) nobody did it and second (more worse) MS didn't do it for it's own OSes.
    So I got (in theory) VPN - but couldn't use it - YES still talking about a business device.

    I wrote a lot about VPN - but this was one of the mostly asked questions from my customers.
    ...you run Windows Phone...can we securely connect to our infrastructure????

    Window 10 Mobile changed this behavior - years later...

    Currently I got another problem - related to BT-LE. Those little guys (BLE devices) are able to talk to "unpaired" devices.
    Which offers a punch of possibilities. For an example (I now that's not a perfect scenario - just an example) such a device could talk to my phone and an app there could say "hi I'm Manfred, please...". But not with MS - pairing is needed.
    And the same matters (again / still) to missing functionality (possibilities) of the API (developer access to the device).
    Which brings me to the current situation.

    A lot of writing is around about "missing apps".
    One fact is that developers want (need) to make money - so they (have to) choose a platform with a big number of potential customers.
    But (I think) this could be solved (like other wrote above) just by MS throwing in money (we pay XXXX for the best ZZZ client, the first porting XXX to WM gets...).

    The much bigger problem is what is (not) possible to make.
    Here I think about the (currently) "big thing" IOT.
    Microsoft "somehow" heard about it and is also part of the game (Windows 10 for IOT), but not with their Phones.
    Buy a HUE - and find that there are apps - for iOS and Android.
    Buy a LIFX - iOS / Android.
    Buy a smart fridge - apps for iOS / Android.
    Buy a home-control (home automation system) - plenty of solutions for iOS / Android.
    Remote control you smart TV - no problem - with iOS / Android.

    You want to impress your friends?
    Invite them home and show how cool the things work...
    Enter the door - lights go on, Say "Siri music please" and your sound system starts to work, "OK Google, I need coffee" - the coffee machine starts up (of course you have to place cups :-)), and a tap on your phone send the cleaning bot to it's corner...

    "Google, Siri" - not Cortana.
    You are right - this is some kind of "the extra cool guy" - but it was an example.
    Last not least a mobile phone has (beside other things) two roles - it must make your life easier (fulfill your "needs") and it should be impressive.

    And even if you are the "understatement guy" - never telling about what your cool things can do...
    The same thing work with store / customer.
    I need a phone...
    Here you have Andy 17... it works with your fridge, TV, home automation,...
    Ah and that is WM 10 - cool look..sorry no chance that it works with...

    Giving you the choice of a well designed OS (Live tiles and so forth) or on the other hand a "not so polished" thing which interacts with the rest of your "technical environment" - what would you choose?

    Or if you already got a WM device.
    You go to your power provider and they tell you - good news, you can now see what consumes most energy in your household...
    Just got to Android Store and download...
    I have no Android..
    Ah, no problem, we have a download for iOS too...
    Window Phone???????

    Last not least a simple scene.
    You are a sales person.
    And you have to sell a mobile phone doing an on stage presentation (a TV commercial)
    Your goal (of course) is to sell as much as possible.
    Two choices
    - show how cool it is to work with Excel sheets on a big screen (Continuum), show how cool office in general works on the device, show how cool it is to stare (for a too long time) at your phone to unlock...
    OR
    - show you walking through your house while lights turn on and off, take of your shirt while the heating is raised to a higher temperature, and last not least when it rings at the door have a peek via your phone who's coming...

    Ah, I forgot - if your second presentation is for "business guys" you still can show them Office running on your iPhone / Android.
    And this is a thing I'm also curious... Why the hell does MS provide office (in a fully polished version) for competitor OSes?
    This could be a "real difference" - yes on iPhone / Android you can... but on Windows Mobile you have full office integration, can work with your Documents like in the office...
    YES you can - but you can do this also with an iPhone...
    Does MS want to sell office - or to make WM a real competitor in the mobile OS market?
    If second - why don't they throttle (at least) office and other MS apps on competitor devices?
    Instead they make product which are as good as like those on the "in house OS" - if not even better.


    I'm from Europe (Austria) - here WM runs a bit better than in US - but last not least we have the same problems.
    And just now the weather becomes a bit worse (cloudy) - I'll take my Android phone switch on my HUEs...
    01-30-2016 06:25 AM
  18. Manfred Pohler's Avatar
    ... How many years we have to wait till we catch up MSFT claimed many years ahead?
    And meanwhile how many Windows Devices will end in your drawer because they no longer work with the "brand now almost done OS"
    Tien-Lin Chang and slivy58 like this.
    01-30-2016 06:29 AM
  19. Manfred Pohler's Avatar
    I think people are just waiting for phones pre-loaded with Windows 10 Mobile. Once 10 Mobile is released we will see a surge in Windows Phone market share.
    Waiting?
    And what do they use to make calls / run their apps... while waiting?
    The people "waiting" are those who are technical freaks.
    And they of course will buy the "latest cool" iOS / Android device.
    Will they really throw it away when the "under progress" Windows 10 Mobile is finally there?

    The same for WM7.x - wait for 8.0 this will be much better, OK lots of thing missing, but we are almost done with 8.1.
    Now what people here is "bad news" - WM7 device are dead (throw it away), Windows 8.x devices will get an update (of course missing some functionallity) to WM 10...

    But no problem at all - just wait for Windows Surface....
    And if this is not a big thing - we will bring out Windows... - just wait..
    And if you buy it now - be sure you can throw it away when the next "new things" will be "almost ready"
    aXross and uFlock like this.
    01-30-2016 06:40 AM
  20. slivy58's Avatar
    And meanwhile how many Windows Devices will end in your drawer because they no longer work with the "brand now almost done OS"
    Agreed as that has crossed my mind many a times especially lately, add to the fact when there needs to be carrier intervention for firmware and such, what company in their right mind is going to devote time and effort devising for 2+-3 year old devices on a platform they've already chosen to let go of or had little interest in (wouldn't blame them), most users will be left out in the cold just as in the past.
    01-30-2016 10:00 AM
  21. Manfred Pohler's Avatar
    ..., add to the fact when there needs to be carrier intervention for firmware and such....
    I agree to what you say too...
    Except what I quoted above.
    Updates where always much faster on WP than on Android (different on iOS) - and the latest changes (W10M) even bypass the carriers. That's a big step in the right direction.
    OK - there are faults with the MS update servers / process. But I get my updates in time - not like with my Android where I have to live with known bugs (security critical ones) for years before "someone" sometimes (if ever) decides that I can get an update.
    Latest situation - after more than a year I got a new Android version - a version which is already outdated an has existing know security issues
    01-30-2016 10:15 AM
  22. runamuck83's Avatar
    I am not a person that goes for "the sky is falling" easily. However, with the new report of 49% decrease in WM revenue, is the sky falling for WM? ios and Android remain kings. BlackBerry failed due to lack of innovation, Palm failed due to lack of money, and horrendous support and advertisements from Sprint. Of course, let's not forget the lack of apps in both occasions. Microsoft has the money and the development team necessary for success. Apps? Meh, advertising for phone?...nonexistent. Is the phone arena something that all companies, with the exception of android and IOs, should stop pursuing?
    PCWorld calls the Lumia a "Dead Phone Walking." Microsoft's Lumia may be a dead phone walking, as sales continue to fall | PCWorld. For the first time since becoming a WM user, over 3 years, I feel that there may not be any hope left. Your thoughts?
    I really don't get why people are shocked or surprised by this news.


    1. "Windows Phone" never took off and will never sell in any volume
    2. "Lumia" as a brand is not well known in most parts of the world, and almost completely unknown in the USA
    3. They stopped producing mass quantities of phones a year ago. The only reason marketshare for Windows Phone was what it was because they were flooding the market with devices. They effectively only released 4 phones last year (640/XL, 950/XL)
    4. They haven't advertised their phones... AT ALL. How would anyone expect them to sell without ads?
    5. They want to move away from the "phone business". This doesn't necessarily mean they won't make phones - what it means is they'll produce devices that do everything. Aka "Surface Phone". It won't just be a "smartphone". This is the only way they can compete - by changing the market.


    They're essentially phasing out the Lumia brand with their tactics - intentionally.

    Microsoft knows their strategy and they fully expected these results. The plan is to change the game - that's the only way they will succeed and it starts with Windows 10.
    telomoyo and editguy like this.
    01-30-2016 10:19 AM
  23. libra89's Avatar
    I really don't get why people are shocked or surprised by this news.
    You have valid points but I think the shock is how low it is. I was okay with it having 3% market share in the US. That is low too but 1.9 is very low. Also you forgot that they released the 435 too.
    01-30-2016 10:45 AM
  24. runamuck83's Avatar
    You have valid points but I think the shock is how low it is. I was okay with it having 3% market share in the US. That is low too but 1.9 is very low. Also you forgot that they released the 435 too.
    Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if it drops to sub 1% territory in the coming months...

    Microsoft is ditching Lumia and starting over with something they can be successful on. Windows Phone failed to catch on years ago. They're letting it fade off and something based on Surface will reemerge from the ashes.
    01-30-2016 11:18 AM
  25. Tien-Lin Chang's Avatar
    And meanwhile how many Windows Devices will end in your drawer because they no longer work with the "brand now almost done OS"
    I think it's better to stay in people's drawer rather than stay in the lost list of company annual balance table....at least it give reason for share holder and managing team to hold their big dreams tight.

    Not many company will accept lost money (=invaild investment) for a long time.

    So for before their dream come ture they still need some folks to donate some money to keep it alive I guess.

    I think the other reason MSFT stay in the market is to keep a good reason to charging those patents from google, if they quit the market completely then they will be like RAMBUS against the RAM industry and there will be lots of law suit for sure - they don't want that.

    One of the reason people used to defend MSFT is "W10 is a service, the device is not really important" which I think just sucks for mobile market. It is kind of sad if a phone equals to a computer stick in terms of importance....then how you expect they gonna really push hard (heavily invest) for this market when they can do well with others?
    01-30-2016 12:32 PM
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