03-25-2016 01:42 PM
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  1. Hans Swolfs's Avatar
    Don't worry. People are already gone. And soon enough we will leave the 12 of you to enjoy the beloved half OS.
    The thread is called "Microsoft cheated Lumia users". If you don't think that, what are you doing here?
    let them choose whatever they want... I'm VERY happy with Windows 10 Mobile and Windows 10 on my Surface and desktop computers... that's all that matters to me.
    03-25-2016 06:10 AM
  2. DeNachtwacht's Avatar
    And I do know devs won't make new app for Windows Phone 8.1 anymore but again, look at the prices of the list of supported phones you can buy now... Tech gets old and sometimes it's time to move on to a new phone.
    That's not a valid argument, it's just a matter of dumb margeting strategy. They want me to buy a new phone, that's something that can't be denied. What also can't be denied, is that my Nokia Lumia 925 runs Windows 10 Mobile 10586.164 fine. I installed it through the Insider app. It runs smooth, almost bugless and is superfast. So the argument that it can't work flawless is just simply wrong, and because of the hardware similarities that is also the case for other previous flagship devices such as the 1020, 920 and a bunch of other devices.

    Will it be able to run smooth in a couple of years with a few more OS updates? I don't know, but I know this works fine. And I also know that Apple allows users to decide for themselves if a new iOS update is making the device too slow for them. Microsoft did something really stupid here: they did exactly the same thing as they did a couple of years ago: kick loyal windows phone supporters in the balls. And this time, they even did it worse; when I bought my Lumia 800 I didn't have any promises of getting an upgrade to WP8. Now with my Lumia 925 I did get that promise so I get kicked in the balls even harder.

    My father -and many other Apple customers- buys a new iPhone every 3 to 4 years. iPhone 3 users still see new apps popping up in their app store every day. My Lumia 800 just had to be replaced in 2 years to be able to get the new WP8 apps, my lumia 925 is now 2 years old and it's the exact same thing all over again. I love the OS and would not want to go to Android or iOS, but they are making it really hard for me...

    Way to go, Microsoft! Keep shooing your most loyal customers away!

    PS Lumia 950/950XL owners, see this as a warning, by the end of 2017 you can also throw away your device!
    Last edited by DeNachtwacht; 03-25-2016 at 06:46 AM.
    03-25-2016 06:16 AM
  3. Kubanarin's Avatar
    where did you read the apps would just stop working? OK, no new ones will be released as devs are shifting to the UWP platform that makes the Windows 10 ecosystem nice...

    And I do know devs won't make new app for Windows Phone 8.1 anymore but again, look at the prices of the list of supported phones you can buy now... Tech gets old and sometimes it's time to move on to a new phone.
    Not sure if you remember what happened to the WP7 app store and apps - I do as I was there with my Lumia 800. Within a few months apps had started breaking and were not updated, were pulled from the shop entirely and nothing new was published to the shop.

    It is blindingly obvious that that is exactly how this scenario will play out again.
    John20212 likes this.
    03-25-2016 06:18 AM
  4. Grant Taylor3's Avatar
    I'll await the "evidence" because I haven't seen any.

    Evidence of what exactly anyway?
    • Were people led to believe their devices will be updated to Windows 10? Yes.
    • Were they holding out for a long time so they can finally see their devices on par - feature wise - with other platforms? Sure.
    • Had they received any real major updates compared to other platforms in the long period they were waiting? Of course not.
    • Haven't they been through this with Windiws RT and Windows Phone 7? They have.
    • Isn't the broken promise going to make their entire hardware obsolete because the WP 8.1 Store is going to be obsolete? Obviously.
    • Weren't they told that WP 8 and Windows 8 now have a unified core and so they believed their OS is unlikely to be declared dead? You tell me.
    • Is people giving negative feedback on how bad the software is a sign that the software needs to get better, or an excuse for the company to bail on users? Are you kidding me?!


    Even Daniel merely cites the financials of the operation as the excuse for Microsoft betraying the user base saying "you know, they had to betray people" (interestingly calling us obsolete audience) and he is more or less a fan of Microsoft. You go anything beyond that - denying the betrayal itself - and you are obviously a fanboy.

    But hey, I'll wait for the "evidence". Clearly list the evidence, and I'll respond to each one of them...one by one.



    The software is fine it is the old dual core S4 that is the limiting factor.



    The devices that can run Windows 10 Mobile well are being upgraded. The ones that cannot are not.



    Do not blame Microsoft for issues with outdated hardware.



    The Snapdragon S4 was outdated in 2013 when the 1020 was released.
    03-25-2016 06:23 AM
  5. DeNachtwacht's Avatar
    The software is fine it is the old dual core S4 that is the limiting factor.
    The devices that can run Windows 10 Mobile well are being upgraded. The ones that cannot are not.
    Please stop promoting microsofts marketing strategy that is only trying to convince us to buy a new W10 device. Read my post above to see proof that it's just not true that the devices have "outdated hardware".
    03-25-2016 06:39 AM
  6. AgentTheGreat's Avatar
    The software is fine it is the old dual core S4 that is the limiting factor.



    The devices that can run Windows 10 Mobile well are being upgraded. The ones that cannot are not.



    Do not blame Microsoft for issues with outdated hardware.



    The Snapdragon S4 was outdated in 2013 when the 1020 was released.
    Now this right here is "bulldozing over the contrary evidence". You say "The software is fine it is the old dual core S4 that is the limiting factor." and I reiterate the first bullet: "Were people led to believe their devices will be updated to Windows 10? Yes."

    The hardware thing is now an excuse and doesn't pardon Microsoft.
    Imagine if Microsoft figured Windows 10 doesn't run well on 950, but works well on 950 XL. If you are promised to get Windows 10 on 950, would a hardware excuse satisfy you? If you came here and said "I thought 950 is supposed to run Windows 10 well!" would you accept me saying "you see, 950 doesn't have this chip thing that 950 XL has so it won't work well".
    You were told your device runs Windows 10 when you bought your device just like I expected my 1320 to run Windows 10 when I bought it because I was told it would. The rest is an excuse.
    John20212 and Greg Wenzler like this.
    03-25-2016 06:40 AM
  7. Grant Taylor3's Avatar
    Windows 10 was not around withe the 1020 cane out. It came out with Windows Phone 8.0 on it and it was upgraded to 8.1

    You are talking bull****. The 1020 did run the preview but it was sub par running it.

    Insiders would put up with it running Windows 10 Mobile but the general public would not.
    03-25-2016 06:54 AM
  8. DeNachtwacht's Avatar
    Windows 10 was not around withe the 1020 cane out. It came out with Windows Phone 8.0 on it and it was upgraded to 8.1

    You are talking bull****. The 1020 did run the preview but it was sub par running it.

    Insiders would put up with it running Windows 10 Mobile but the general public would not.
    Please stop promoting microsofts marketing strategy that is only trying to convince us to buy a new W10 device. Read my post above to see proof that it's just not true that the devices have "outdated hardware".
    03-25-2016 06:55 AM
  9. Paul1266's Avatar
    You have served up exactly zero actual evidence so I am not sure where you're going with your post. Maybe it's just that his opinions bother you and your world view. Perhaps you're just afraid that he might be right and you would rather he kept quiet about it.
    If you bothered to read back I first got hooked on his 'proof' of a promise. This link which referred to 3 years support was presented as proof of a promise broken. Trouble is it was nothing of the sort. There was a plain, easy to read qualification which was nicely ignored. Read it yourself....
    03-25-2016 06:58 AM
  10. Grant Taylor3's Avatar
    The 950 came with Windows 10 on so your point is not valid.



    If the 950XL hardware supported some features in Windows 10 Mobile that the 950 does not that is just life and you have to deal with it.
    03-25-2016 07:02 AM
  11. John20212's Avatar
    The software is fine it is the old dual core S4 that is the limiting factor.
    The devices that can run Windows 10 Mobile well are being upgraded. The ones that cannot are not.
    Do not blame Microsoft for issues with outdated hardware.
    The Snapdragon S4 was outdated in 2013 when the 1020 was released.
    You are completely missing the point here.

    The blame is with Microsoft, because they knew perfectly well what the hardware in the older devices was when they made the promise that "all WP8.1 devices will get W10".

    It might be outdated hardware by todays standards but that does not change the underlying principle of Microsoft promising the update for said hardware and then breaking that promise.
    Sick Freak likes this.
    03-25-2016 07:04 AM
  12. Paul1266's Avatar
    Don't worry. People are already gone. And soon enough we will leave the 12 of you to enjoy the beloved half OS.
    The thread is called "Microsoft cheated Lumia users". If you don't think that, what are you doing here?
    Infantile b*llocks! Where did you get 12 from anyway, I'm pretty sure there are close to 20 of us ;)
    03-25-2016 07:07 AM
  13. Hans Swolfs's Avatar
    Not sure if you remember what happened to the WP7 app store and apps - I do as I was there with my Lumia 800. Within a few months apps had started breaking and were not updated, were pulled from the shop entirely and nothing new was published to the shop.

    It is blindingly obvious that that is exactly how this scenario will play out again.
    so because it happened in the past, it will happen again?
    That's not a bright future you're looking at with history repeating itself...

    Assumption is the mother of all ****ups; remember that.
    03-25-2016 07:08 AM
  14. Grant Taylor3's Avatar
    You are completely missing the point here.



    The blame is with Microsoft, because they knew perfectly well what the hardware in the older devices was when they made the promise that "all WP8.1 devices will get W10".



    It might be outdated hardware by todays standards but that does not change the underlying principle of Microsoft promising the update for said hardware and then breaking that promise.

    The S4 was outdated in 2013. Microsoft did offer the upgrade for said hardware via the insiders program but it was felt that the experience was not good enough to release it to the general public.
    03-25-2016 07:11 AM
  15. Hans Swolfs's Avatar
    You are completely missing the point here.

    The blame is with Microsoft, because they knew perfectly well what the hardware in the older devices was when they made the promise that "all WP8.1 devices will get W10".

    It might be outdated hardware by todays standards but that does not change the underlying principle of Microsoft promising the update for said hardware and then breaking that promise.
    I've said this before and I'll say it again : Microsoft messed up with communicating that all devices would get Windows 10 mobile but again (also) would you rather get a crappy experience than no experience (no upgrade)?
    03-25-2016 07:12 AM
  16. Grant Taylor3's Avatar
    If you want to be exact the 1020 was a Windows Phone 8.0 device not a Windows Phone 8.1 device.
    03-25-2016 07:14 AM
  17. Kubanarin's Avatar
    so because it happened in the past, it will happen again?
    That's not a bright future you're looking at with history repeating itself...

    Assumption is the mother of all ****ups; remember that.
    Hahaha - seriously that is actually quite funny. Brings a certain quote back to me:

    “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results”

    Let that sink in and don't worry about reminding me about the pitfalls of assumptions as you might have overlooked that your statement is probably more apt as a counterargument for your opinions in this thread.
    03-25-2016 07:19 AM
  18. Paul1266's Avatar
    Hahaha - seriously that is actually quite funny. Brings a certain quote back to me:

    The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results

    Let that sink in and don't worry about reminding me about the pitfalls of assumptions as you might have overlooked that your statement is probably more apt as a counterargument for your opinions in this thread.
    Seems to apply to this thread in general. A handful of dissatisfied punters howling at the void again and again, to no effect....
    groady-ho baluzy likes this.
    03-25-2016 07:25 AM
  19. Hans Swolfs's Avatar
    Hahaha - seriously that is actually quite funny. Brings a certain quote back to me:

    “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results”

    Let that sink in and don't worry about reminding me about the pitfalls of assumptions as you might have overlooked that your statement is probably more apt as a counterargument for your opinions in this thread.
    probably me that I don't get it but I didn't assume anything. I just take the facts and live with it instead of complain.

    This topic is really going nowhere so guess I'll stop wasting my time.
    03-25-2016 07:26 AM
  20. Paul1266's Avatar
    Likewise, I'm stepping away from this thread. It's achieving zero other than giving a few hurt bunnies somewhere to vent their spleen. Good luck and goodnight....
    03-25-2016 07:41 AM
  21. AgentTheGreat's Avatar
    so because it happened in the past, it will happen again? That's not a bright future you're looking at with history repeating itself... Assumption is the mother of all ****ups; remember that.
    ...and induction is the mother of all science. With your reasoning a wife should stay with a husband that has cheated 5 times already and hope "the past won't repeat itself".
    03-25-2016 07:44 AM
  22. AgentTheGreat's Avatar
    Likewise, I'm stepping away from this thread. It's achieving zero other than giving a few hurt bunnies somewhere to vent their spleen. Good luck and goodnight....
    Ciao.
    03-25-2016 07:44 AM
  23. AgentTheGreat's Avatar
    probably me that I don't get it but I didn't assume anything. I just take the facts and live with it instead of complain. This topic is really going nowhere so guess I'll stop wasting my time.
    The whole point of the thread is whether Microsoft cheated the WP user base. We argue they did screw up, you defend them. Do you expect anything else coming out of it? We know why we are here. But we don't know what you are here for, if arguing they didn't screw up isn't it. The "taking the facts and living with it" happens automatically. It will hurt Microsoft. It's like losing your children in an air raid: you will live with it of course. But if there is an argument somewhere defending the ones behind the bombings, do you expect the parents to say nothing? If they talk about it, wouldn't those who say "why complain? take the facts and live with it" be .... part of human anatomy that I can't explicitly mention here? If you have an actual point saying Microsoft is not to blame, bring it and expect to receive answers. If you are here just to say "don't talk about it" it is YOU who should remain silent and leave.
    John20212, kubiaxk and Kram Sacul like this.
    03-25-2016 07:52 AM
  24. Kubanarin's Avatar
    Well I am sorry that both of you feel that you were unsuccessful in shutting the dissenters down. C'est la vie.

    I hold people an companies and individuals to a reasonable, in my opinion, ethical standard and Microsoft has failed with flying colours several times. It saddens me that there are people out there that back up this behaviour and I consider it a sad reflection on modern society and the tech community.

    It is certainly not helpful for Microsoft in the long run that they receive feedback that leads them to behave in such a way. It is not sustainable to alienate significant numbers of your customers so regularly.

    People seeking to excuse or post rationalise this behaviour should consider its implications in the long run.
    03-25-2016 07:52 AM
  25. David630's Avatar
    So you wanted 10, but as you put it, your phone is getting worse? In what context is it getting worse? Why does it have the worst support? In my dealings with them, all my issues have been sorted in one call.

    Maybe it isn't bad coding? Maybe firmware updates have caused problems? Maybe there aren't enough devices left to warrant any further support? I can't see the logic of carrying on with 4 year old devices.

    Ok, here's one for you....You get a shiny new win10m .164. It doesn't work as you expected? What do you do? Complain? Moan that it is rubbish? The thing is, that's as far as you would go anyways. Are all and sundry going to moan then that they arent getting Redstone build??
    What is so hard to understand?
    I had to uninstall 5 applications 4 of them related directly to Microsoft or 5 if I count MixRadio was in their hands some time ago, another one that I use a lot Here maps will not see more updates, again Microsoft behind this move, this looks like a trend and you only have to look the store to see what other parties are doing. Not only that, the phone won't get more relevant updates from Microsoft and the new efforts will be focused on Windows 10 and its store.

    Obviously my grandmother doesn't code the firmware or the operating system for Lumia's phones, if there are problems the responsable is Microsoft, they could fix their software or abandon a part of their customers, both paths have consequences, they've chosen to abandon part of their customers, naturally a lot of us are not happy.
    My Lumia 630 is less than one year old, it's still being sold in some places, EOLed the past month, I think it was released in June or August 2014 here, November 2014 for USA according to Wikipedia's info. Now if people could explain my in what temporal dimensions they are living to consider this phone 4 years old because the excuses are getting ridiculous.

    What should I do? Applaud Microsoft? Obviously not and I think this is the thread to post what I think about Microsoft's latest move.

    Someone like Blizzard for gaming says we're cancelling a game (Titan) that we've been developing for years because it's just not good enough, and for the most part the internet gives a silent thumbs up for sticking to their guns on quality and not releasing a sub-par experience.

    Just a funny comparison, as it's all a matter of perspective.
    A better comparison would be Blizzard releasing the game and promising things because the state was bad, and one year later erasing stuff from the game, not updating and leaving it there with all the problems that they didn't solve and were huge upon release. Then they would show the new Titan 2 game giving it for free to some of their gamers, those users would tell the others, why do you care? Buy the new game.
    Meanwhile other companies have their own games, far more complete and Blizzard works with them adding their own stuff.
    Sick Freak likes this.
    03-25-2016 07:56 AM
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