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02-11-2017 08:44 AM
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  1. petvas72's Avatar
    You have brought up some good subjective points. You need to choose what works best for you and meets your needs.
    Doesn't DB have a mobile web site to purchase train tickets and look up arrival and departure times? I've been to Germany a couple of times (love it) and thought I had used it. My bank has an app but yours doesn't.
    I'm not worried about MS marketing the Surface phone when it comes out. They are a global company with millions of users. W10 is up to 25% on computers now so people will be used to the UI. Time will tell.

    Sent from my Alcatel Idol 4S
    Yes, the Deutsche Bahn has a mobile website and a W10 app! I am talking about the local RNV for Mannheim, which is only available for iOS and Android...
    02-04-2017 09:58 AM
  2. petvas72's Avatar
    That's correct



    The future of the platform IS NOT UNCERTAIN. MS has clearly been saying for a while now that they DON'T want to continue with Smartphones. They've repeatedly been saying they want to COMPETE with Smartphones indirectly with Pocket PCs running Windows 10 on ARM with Smartphone capabilities. WHAT'S UNCERTAIN?



    In the interim could you use banking and tram/busses websites? ON the others, your own recommended alternatives?



    You call it "Starting from scratch". Others call it Evolving or Morphing. The thing is we're conscious of it; we're impacted by this "birthing process" AND IT HURTS, I'll admit.


    Nonsense. Come on now....


    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    The future of the platform is uncertain. Microsoft is out of the smartphone hardware business, but it still supports Windows Mobile 10.There are many articles who wonder about the future of the platform, so I am not alone on that. Last week there was an article here on Windows Central about this very topic.
    Shamshi-Adad likes this.
    02-04-2017 10:03 AM
  3. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    The future of the platform is uncertain. Microsoft is out of the smartphone hardware business, but it still supports Windows Mobile 10.There are many articles who wonder about the future of the platform, so I am not alone on that. Last week there was an article here on Windows Central about this very topic.
    Well I read an article here on Windows Central to the contrary, albeit, quoting MS.
    http://www.windowscentral.com/game-c...&utm_source=wp
    So we have to just agree to disagree

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    02-04-2017 10:15 AM
  4. techiez's Avatar
    The future of the platform is uncertain. Microsoft is out of the smartphone hardware business, but it still supports Windows Mobile 10.There are many articles who wonder about the future of the platform, so I am not alone on that. Last week there was an article here on Windows Central about this very topic.
    Don't go by what this site says, MS has been clear, they will not compete with IOS and Android devices, even surface phone will be limited availability with enterprise focus. Mostly likely they will inspire OEMs to bring in more mobile 2in1s and mini tabs.
    Shamshi-Adad and TgeekB like this.
    02-04-2017 10:17 AM
  5. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    The future of the platform is uncertain. Microsoft is out of the smartphone hardware business, but it still supports Windows Mobile 10.There are many articles who wonder about the future of the platform, so I am not alone on that. Last week there was an article here on Windows Central about this very topic.
    You speak English extremely well. Are you an ex-pat, Foreign Service, well educated? I've been to Mannheim a few times back in the 60s and 70s

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    02-04-2017 10:29 AM
  6. petvas72's Avatar
    Don't go by what this site says, MS has been clear, they will not compete with IOS and Android devices, even surface phone will be limited availability with enterprise focus. Mostly likely they will inspire OEMs to bring in more mobile 2in1s and mini tabs.
    Yes, but mobile devices will also need good apps. When Microsoft and its partners bring 2 in 1 devices, these will also have to be competitive. If they lack basic functionality or apps that people want to run, then they will not be very successful.
    02-04-2017 10:30 AM
  7. TgeekB's Avatar
    Yes, but mobile devices will also need good apps. When Microsoft and its partners bring 2 in 1 devices, these will also have to be competitive. If they lack basic functionality or apps that people want to run, then they will not be very successful.
    They have most of the apps businesses need. They are not focusing on the consumer, though I do understand people want both.
    I think we have to stop thinking they're competing with iOS and Android. They are not.

    Sent from my Alcatel Idol 4S
    Shamshi-Adad likes this.
    02-04-2017 10:50 AM
  8. petvas72's Avatar
    They have most of the apps businesses need. They are not focusing on the consumer, though I do understand people want both.
    I think we have to stop thinking they're competing with iOS and Android. They are not.

    Sent from my Alcatel Idol 4S
    Currently they are not, but when the Surface Phone comes out they will have to! In order to make a device acceptable from business, you have to have a device that is accepted by consumers too. Look at the success of the iPhone in the enterprise for example..
    02-04-2017 11:05 AM
  9. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    Currently they are not, but when the Surface Phone comes out they will have to! In order to make a device acceptable from business, you have to have a device that is accepted by consumers too. Look at the success of the iPhone in the enterprise for example..
    If the Surface Phone is on ARM then apps won't be a problem, right?
    Won't be low-end either

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    TgeekB likes this.
    02-04-2017 11:17 AM
  10. petvas72's Avatar
    If the Surface Phone is on ARM then apps won't be a problem, right?
    Won't be low-end either

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    Windows Mobile 10 devices are also on ARM, but that didn't mean anything. Running full Windows on a small device is not really that important for many consumers. When I want a full blown computer I use my Surface Book. Even if the Surface Phone could do a lot of things, I would still prefer a proper computer for most stuff. I think that many are overestimating the Continuum features.
    02-04-2017 11:34 AM
  11. TgeekB's Avatar
    Windows Mobile 10 devices are also on ARM, but that didn't mean anything. Running full Windows on a small device is not really that important for many consumers. When I want a full blown computer I use my Surface Book. Even if the Surface Phone could do a lot of things, I would still prefer a proper computer for most stuff. I think that many are overestimating the Continuum features.
    Business. Business. Business.
    Not consumer... at least to start.

    Sent from my Alcatel Idol 4S
    02-04-2017 11:39 AM
  12. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    Windows Mobile 10 devices are also on ARM, but that didn't mean anything. Running full Windows on a small device is not really that important for many consumers. When I want a full blown computer I use my Surface Book. Even if the Surface Phone could do a lot of things, I would still prefer a proper computer for most stuff. I think that many are overestimating the Continuum features.
    I fold.

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    TgeekB likes this.
    02-04-2017 11:39 AM
  13. petvas72's Avatar
    Phones are very personal devices. You cannot expect to have success by targeting only the enterprise. People use these devices in their personal lives too and they expect consumer focused features too. You can call these devices whatever you want, but if they don't apply to both consumers and enterprises, they will not have a big chance of succeeding.
    Even in this future plan of Microsoft, universal apps will play a big role. Windows Mobile 10 is actually another windows sku and it uses a different shell than the standard windows 10. It supports uwp apps, so I cannot say that it is dead as a platform. I believe that it will just transform to something more powerful.
    Alyeldiin likes this.
    02-04-2017 11:55 AM
  14. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    I fold.
    No wait.... I don't fold. I just got weary of debate mode for awhile.

    It wouldn't be Windows Mobile, It would be Full Windows 10 on ARM with Smartphone features. Apps problem cured. I don't think it'll be Surface Phone either - that's pushed to 2018 so plenty of time for PLENTY more birth pains.

    For example:
    capture.png

    EDIT >>>> BTW that device is "2" screens, not "1".

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    Last edited by Shamshi-Adad; 02-04-2017 at 01:31 PM.
    02-04-2017 12:01 PM
  15. OldMillXxX's Avatar
    Currently they are not, but when the Surface Phone comes out they will have to! In order to make a device acceptable from business, you have to have a device that is accepted by consumers too. Look at the success of the iPhone in the enterprise for example..
    This seems to be the problem. Nadella stated they are building products we all will Love and want to use, not building product forced on you by your boss. THIS will not help at all. It WILL create further animosity towards MS (especially after the forced Win 10 debacle).
    Shamshi-Adad and petvas72 like this.
    02-04-2017 12:24 PM
  16. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    This seems to be the problem. Nadella stated they are building products we all will Love and want to use, not building product forced on you by your boss. THIS will not help at all. It WILL create further animosity towards MS (especially after the forced Win 10 debacle).
    THAT is an EXCELLENT POINT! But I AM sorry how true it may be.

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    petvas72 likes this.
    02-04-2017 12:50 PM
  17. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    A brief excerpt from the Windows Central article on the Surphace Phone which was almost 100% nothing but a quote from MS:

    Article: Is early 2018 too soon for a Surface phone? | Windows Central

    <begin paste>
    Though not a smartphone competing directly with rivals' smartphones, as a game changing "ultimate mobile device" positioned to redefine mobile, it will indirectly compete in that space and will need to do what smartphones do....
    <end paste>

    MS IS going to do that and we are/will suffer the birthing pains.

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    02-04-2017 01:19 PM
  18. a5cent's Avatar
    3 Phones per year, Redstone 2 will be more focused on Mobile. "Microsoft is fully committed to W10M" - What's happening now is not what looks like full commitment to me.

    Most likely reason of killing Lumia line is probably they plan to kill W10M or just let it die naturally.

    I THINK (could be wrong) both of you are making a similar and common mistake. MS is fully committed to W10M! MS is nowhere close to letting W10M die. I would argue they are more committed to W10M than they were ever committed to WP!

    Being committed to W10M just doesn't mean that MS is also committed to smartphones. MS will continue to invest in W10M, but they will invest next to nothing in smartphones. Those are two different things. Not differing between the two is the mistake I think you are both making.

    From here on out, when trying to understand MS, you must completely forget about smartphones. In regard to W10M, that means we may no longer view it as a pure smartphone OS (like iOS or Android). W10M is just a more lightweight, secure and consumer friendly version of W10 for running UWP apps.

    Right now there is simply no hardware platform MS plans to pair W10M with. In a sense, for some consumers, that means it may as well be dead. That's just technically incorrect. W10M will continue to be developed along with the rest of W10. At some point, when (if) UWP becomes a viable platform on it own, W10M will make perfect sense again.
    02-04-2017 01:29 PM
  19. petvas72's Avatar
    You speak English extremely well. Are you an ex-pat, Foreign Service, well educated? I've been to Mannheim a few times back in the 60s and 70s

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    Well, thank you! I learned English at school and then continued up to the First Certificate in the English language. I have studied German literature at the University, so my education background is very much related to languages. I have also been working for international companies, like Microsoft and now Deutsche Telekom, so I am used in communicating in English. :)

    Anyway, back to topic. I like using my Lumia 950XL despite its shortcomings. It is almost the perfect companion to my Surface Book.
    If Microsoft manages to make the UWP platform attractive to developers, then we will slowly see more apps appearing. It is not over yet for the Windows platform on mobile. Windows Mobile 10 can run UWP apps, so whatever strategy Microsoft has, the OS might also benefit from it (at least in the long run).
    a5cent, Shamshi-Adad and TgeekB like this.
    02-04-2017 01:54 PM
  20. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    I THINK (could be wrong) both of you are making a similar and common mistake. MS is fully committed to W10M! MS is nowhere close to letting W10M die. I would argue they are more committed to W10M than they were ever committed to WP!

    Being committed to W10M just doesn't mean that MS is also committed to smartphones. MS will continue to invest in W10M, but they will invest next to nothing in smartphones. Those are two different things. Not differing between the two is the mistake I think you are both making.

    From here on out, when trying to understand MS, you must completely forget about smartphones. In regard to W10M, that means we may no longer view it as a pure smartphone OS (like iOS or Android). W10M is just a more lightweight, secure and consumer friendly version of W10 for running UWP apps.

    Right now there is simply no hardware platform MS plans to pair W10M with. In a sense, for some consumers, that means it may as well be dead. That's just technically incorrect. W10M will continue to be developed along with the rest of W10. At some point, when (if) UWP becomes a viable platform on it own, W10M will make perfect sense again.
    WOW!!!! Where you hail from, son?

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    02-04-2017 01:57 PM
  21. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    Well, thank you! I learned English at school and then continued up to the First Certificate in the English language. I have studied German literature at the University, so my education background is very much related to languages. I have also been working for international companies, like Microsoft and now Deutsche Telekom, so I am used in communicating in English. :)

    Anyway, back to topic. I like using my Lumia 950XL despite its shortcomings. It is almost the perfect companion to my Surface Book.
    If Microsoft manages to make the UWP platform attractive to developers, then we will slowly see more apps appearing. It is not over yet for the Windows platform on mobile. Windows Mobile 10 can run UWP apps, so whatever strategy Microsoft has, the OS might also benefit from it (at least in the long run).
    Plus, you're a nice man.

    The thing is the "birth pains", as I like to call it, that we will have to suffer through. If we were on nothing but Android or iOS it wouldn't impact us. But we LOVE windows and we'd like all our equipment to be unified - so there's THAT pain.
    Then there's the Android and iOS users and media that we feel are laughing at us.

    All I can say is our day WILL come and WITH a ground breaking change in the Smartphone industry as well.

    In the meantime - we have to deal.

    I suspect we, you and I, are more in agreement than not. FOR SURE I know I could have a few beers with you...

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    petvas72, a5cent and TgeekB like this.
    02-04-2017 02:12 PM
  22. a5cent's Avatar
    WOW!!!! Where you hail from, son? :winktongue.

    Right now from Mexico. Next week from San Diego, but normally from beautiful Switzerland 👍
    libra89, Shamshi-Adad and sinime like this.
    02-04-2017 02:17 PM
  23. Shamshi-Adad's Avatar
    Right now from Mexico. Next week from San Diego, but normally from beautiful Switzerland
    Dayum... Every time I read one of your posts I think "WOW!"

    Seems like you and petvas72 BOTH have some creditentials...

    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.
    libra89, petvas72 and a5cent like this.
    02-04-2017 02:31 PM
  24. techiez's Avatar
    I THINK (could be wrong) both of you are making a similar and common mistake. MS is fully committed to W10M! MS is nowhere close to letting W10M die. I would argue they are more committed to W10M than they were ever committed to WP!

    Being committed to W10M just doesn't mean that MS is also committed to smartphones. MS will continue to invest in W10M, but they will invest next to nothing in smartphones. Those are two different things. Not differing between the two is the mistake I think you are both making.

    From here on out, when trying to understand MS, you must completely forget about smartphones. In regard to W10M, that means we may no longer view it as a pure smartphone OS (like iOS or Android). W10M is just a more lightweight, secure and consumer friendly version of W10 for running UWP apps.

    Right now there is simply no hardware platform MS plans to pair W10M with. In a sense, for some consumers, that means it may as well be dead. That's just technically incorrect. W10M will continue to be developed along with the rest of W10. At some point, when (if) UWP becomes a viable platform on it own, W10M will make perfect sense again.

    As you said, there is no hardware platform to pair with W10M, WoA will be used for hybrid computing devices, and Windows 10 cloud will be W10M's alternate for lightweight App only device.
    Shamshi-Adad likes this.
    02-05-2017 08:12 AM
  25. Alyeldiin's Avatar
    That's correct



    The future of the platform IS NOT UNCERTAIN. MS has clearly been saying for a while now that they DON'T want to continue with Smartphones. They've repeatedly been saying they want to COMPETE with Smartphones indirectly with Pocket PCs running Windows 10 on ARM with Smartphone capabilities. WHAT'S UNCERTAIN?



    In the interim could you use banking and tram/busses websites? ON the others, your own recommended alternatives?



    You call it "Starting from scratch". Others call it Evolving or Morphing. The thing is we're conscious of it; we're impacted by this "birthing process" AND IT HURTS, I'll admit.


    Nonsense. Come on now....


    Peace. Alan
    Galaxy S7Edge [MM6.0.1] Full Dresser
    Lumia ICON [Win10M 15025.1000] Sportster
    Even when I lose, I win.


    Man a PC pocket is still somewhat different from a smartphone. Just because you can carry your laptop around all day doesn't mean you won't be using your smartphone. And even when the surface phone comes out the app problem won't be solved, because there aren't that many programs for all services, and (if I get it right) they're not all optimized to work on small screens.
    02-05-2017 09:33 AM
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