Microsoft well known for breaking promise

[Krystianpants]

Wrong... Wrong... Wrong.

W10M will NOT be "erased" by W10oA.

Why not? Because W10oA comes with all the same issues W10 has:

W10 and W10oA require continual maintenance and administration. For "non geeks" it's far too easy to screw something up and nobody likes being dependent on others to get their computing devices fixed. Consumers have no certainty that uninstalling software actually deletes all of it. It's impossible for MS to protect Win32 users from themselves. Win32 software neither knows nor cares about the restrictions typically placed on low power mobile devices... and it never will care (Win32 software is a power hog). Malware abounds... etc. Basically, everything that has given Windows a poor reputation.

W10M exists to remedy all those problems. W10oA remedies none of them! These are two completely different beasts. They technically overlap in only two ways: both run on ARM chips and they both run UWP apps. That's all. That's a pathetic amount of overlap for anything hoping to "erase" something else.

W10oA exists to solve one or more of these (completely unrelated) problems:

a) To reduce the price of portable Windows computers
b) To bring mobile SoC features to Windows computers
c) To popularize the UWP

It is true that W10oA will likely replace W10M on MS' mobile devices (at least for now). However, "replace" does not mean "erase". W10M will continue to be developed for quite some time yet.

If UWP ever becomes successfull (big "if"... I know), then W10M will make perfect sense again.

So you still believe that after all the recent news?

http://www.reddit.com/r/windowsphon...nd_microsoft_kills_off_windows_phone_windows/

 

[FXi2]

You ought to compare this to the Nexus owners who were left out in the cold that past few version upgrades. They got to find out just how long "updates forever" meant in Google-ese.
And you probably haven't seen the joy of the "touch of death" or the "you are holding the phone wrong" or the "no 6 doesn't have a battery problem" issues from folks who spend nearly 1k on their phones.

It's painful to think really, because none of these vendors should be treating customers like this, but it's not uncommon for any of them. I swear the 3 meet in a Starbucks each month just to see who's going to outdo the other in enraging their customer base.

 

[a5cent]

So you still believe that after all the recent news?

http://www.reddit.com/r/windowsphon...nd_microsoft_kills_off_windows_phone_windows/

Yes.

It's not being killed off like these people claim. It's the same old confusion. There is a difference between all W10M related development ending, and it just not being made available to the public. I understand that to many this argument will seem very theoretical. Many will ask why anyone should care about an OS that isn't available to the public. That's a reasonable question, but only from the perspective of a person who has no interest in MS beyond consumerism. I'm the opposite of that.

I loved WP7.5 (great for its time). I liked WP8 (good for its time). I can't claim the same for W10M. I'm neither interested in W10M as a consumer product, nor am I trying to defend it here. However, I am still very much interested in MS' business strategy. That's what I usually converse about with MS folks.

W10M is just the currently used name for the people-as-clients (not IoT) and pure-UWP (excludes Win32) version of Windows. These two things are at the core of W10M and they aren't going anywhere. MS is in a pickle because these days, few want a device that runs nothing but UWP software. The instant that changes (IF it ever does), is the instant W10M resurfaces. Although I'd hope MS wouldn't relaunch W10M under the same name (it better not be called W10M), and although a new layer of paint will have been applied (something like NEON), it will still be W10M at heart. It will still embody those two core principles.

Here's a different way to look at it:

As most forum members probably know, I've repeatedly disputed WCentral's claims that W10M and W10 are technically the same OS. W10M and W10 are different, because W10 is far larger and supports a boatload of Win32 related features that aren't part of W10M. However, the vast majority of components used by W10M are also shipped as part of W10. In other words, W10M is largely contained in W10. So, while W10M and W10 aren't the same, they do share a set of common components. As long as (a) these common components continue to evolve and improve, and (b) MS maintains the ability to install a pure UWP version of Windows that excludes Win32, well, that's W10M right there. Then W10M lives on. MS is still very much committed to both of those things.

BTW, if W10M and W10 are truly one and the same, as many people at WCentral claim, then it's logically impossible to kill one without killing the other. People who believe both of those mutually exclusive things must either throw sanity out the window or start dealing with major bouts of cognitive dissonance. ;-)

So, yes, my position is unchanged. W10M will continue to be developed. We may eventually get a new and improved version of W10M, or MS might fully retreat from the consumer market and flush UWP down the toilette and W10M along with it.

We shall see..

 

[a5cent]

@Krystianpants
Okay, it's 7:30 hours later. I just noticed that WCentral released an article discrediting the tweet you referenced (that's not your fault of course). That tidbit of misinformation was, as usual, the result of a tech journalist who has virtually no understanding of the software world he is reporting on.

The title of the article is "Windows 10 mobile is NOT dead". Here's a quote from the article:

Interestingly, not one person we spoke to would definitively say or even imply that Windows 10 Mobile is being phased out and development is being discontinued.

Yeah. No kidding. That's because, like I've been explaining here for about a year now, W10M isn't going anywhere unless the UWP goes with it. The second MS starts questioning the UWP, that's when you'll hear me chiming in with everyone else that W10M is dead ;-)

How can I possibly know all this:

• Some contacts at MS (although they don't tell me stuff they aren't allowed to).
• A lot of experience in the software world, on all levels, from software engineer to program manager.
• A better understanding of software technology, or at least better than 99% of the people reporting on it.

 

[techiez]

Yah that's how MS sees it, like it or not. You sticking around with some old phone instead of getting the latest phone that they reveal means you're not worth it. This phone was the most powerful at the time, had this cool continuum feature and this is the first time they revealed a flagship in YEARS. You still didn't buy it. You had no idea whether the phone was going to have issues or not, you just didn't buy it. The issues were being brought up slowly over time, especially as newer builds came in. But you never knew this at launch and you didn't support them. To them it looked like there was no market for phones even with their hardcore audience. And they started pulling back and getting rid of stock with ridiculous price cuts.

I'm not saying you're a fan or not on my own volition. I'm telling you what it looks like to MS. To MS it looked like it was just a Nokia crowd that didn't care for MS products but wanted to keep that Nokia nostalgia.

My 950XL is great. It took them a year to get it right no doubt. Surface Book had a lot of growing pains too, but it sold like crazy, because there was demand.

There is no demand for windows phone, just accept that. It is dead. I always had some hope but man I realize that it's impossible. Windows mobile will be erased by windows 10 on arm. And a consumer hololens is the only thing that can make UWP really take off if any future mobile devices have any chance of having an app ecosystem.

950 failed not because of hardware or no demand, it was because of software, W10M was not ready for launch, the production release was horrible and riddled with bugs. Fans also need a reliable device as daily driver, so they promptly rejected.Also 950 was not marketed across markets. only in US where WP already failed to take off

 

[HM84]

950 failed not because of hardware or no demand, it was because of software, W10M was not ready for launch, the production release was horrible and riddled with bugs. Fans also need a reliable device as daily driver, so they promptly rejected.Also 950 was not marketed across markets. only in US where WP already failed to take off

If you felt that the 950 was not marketed across the board, what did you think of the Elite and the Idol? The Idol is finally available (online) where I live, but only after its price has been slashed in the US and worldwide, and with a 25% markup to take full advantage of my innocent, naive nature, should I opt for a device that is effectively being disowned by its mother(s?)

 

[Krystianpants]

@Krystianpants
Okay, it's 7:30 hours later. I just noticed that WCentral released an article discrediting the tweet you referenced (that's not your fault of course). That tidbit of misinformation was, as usual, the result of a tech journalist who has virtually no understanding of the software world he is reporting on.

The title of the article is "Windows 10 mobile is NOT dead". Here's a quote from the article:



Yeah. No kidding. That's because, like I've been explaining here for about a year now, W10M isn't going anywhere unless the UWP goes with it. The second MS starts questioning the UWP, that's when you'll hear me chiming in with everyone else that W10M is dead ;-)

How can I possibly know all this:

• Some contacts at MS (although they don't tell me stuff they aren't allowed to).
• A lot of experience in the software world, on all levels, from software engineer to program manager.
• A better understanding of software technology, or at least better than 99% of the people reporting on it.

Maybe you should do some freelance writing using your expertise and not rumors.