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01-21-2015 10:09 AM
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  1. MicrosoftMobile4me's Avatar
    How about Microsoft Mobile on mobile devices, like phones and tablets without strong enough processors and Windows 10 on desktops, laptops, and tablets with strong processors. They really just want to run the same OS on phones and tablets (without strong processors, of course) and don't want to call the OS on those tablets Windows Phone ( because It's not a phone ). It's really all about the phone and tablet running the same OS, not what the Intel machines are running.
    01-19-2015 08:21 AM
  2. DJCBS's Avatar
    I really hate that argument. There may be some truth to it, but I don't think MS should brand their product just to avoid confusing the 2% out there that don't get it.

    Within the next 5 years, almost all the apps available on Desktop will be available on all devices. Desktop will just be reserved for those niche programs like AutoCAD, etc.

    Even Adobe is beginning to port their portfolio over to ARM devices.
    No, you will not. For the current Windows apps to be able to work on the phone, developers will have to turn them into Universal apps first. Currently, few are the apps that are Universal as many developers simply don't want to spend their limited time into rewriting their apps so that they'll work too on a OS that is in less than 4% of phones worldwide.

    Also, NONE of the desktop apps will work on your phone. Desktop apps are x86 based. You simply can't run them on a mobile engine.

    Microsoft will still have to do A LOT of work convincing developers to start releasing their Windows programs in the form of an app instead of an x86 program. And many of them simply won't do it because, in case you haven't noticed, the vast vast majority of Windows users (both private and enterprise) are on Windows 7, not Windows 8 or 10.
    They'll first need to manage to pass all those Windows 7 users to Windows 10 for developers to start caring. AND even then, as most people use Desktop and not Metro, it's still not very clear that they'll join in on the "use an app instead of a program" thing. They'll need a miracle, given the fact that they still haven't managed to make people move away from Windows XP.

    Windows 10 and Windows Mobile 10 will be an important step towards a cohesive OS experience. HOWEVER they will NOT be ONE operating system. They'll still be two different OSs that will require different programs. Microsoft's work is just about to begin.

    Seriously...LOWER your expectations on what Windows 10 will be. Way too many people around here are putting a ton of hope and dreams on Windows 10 and they'll be severely disappointed.
    Luisraul924 and hidayat225 like this.
    01-19-2015 09:19 AM
  3. spaulagain's Avatar
    No, you will not. For the current Windows apps to be able to work on the phone, developers will have to turn them into Universal apps first. Currently, few are the apps that are Universal as many developers simply don't want to spend their limited time into rewriting their apps so that they'll work too on a OS that is in less than 4% of phones worldwide.

    Also, NONE of the desktop apps will work on your phone. Desktop apps are x86 based. You simply can't run them on a mobile engine.

    Microsoft will still have to do A LOT of work convincing developers to start releasing their Windows programs in the form of an app instead of an x86 program. And many of them simply won't do it because, in case you haven't noticed, the vast vast majority of Windows users (both private and enterprise) are on Windows 7, not Windows 8 or 10.
    They'll first need to manage to pass all those Windows 7 users to Windows 10 for developers to start caring. AND even then, as most people use Desktop and not Metro, it's still not very clear that they'll join in on the "use an app instead of a program" thing. They'll need a miracle, given the fact that they still haven't managed to make people move away from Windows XP.

    Windows 10 and Windows Mobile 10 will be an important step towards a cohesive OS experience. HOWEVER they will NOT be ONE operating system. They'll still be two different OSs that will require different programs. Microsoft's work is just about to begin.

    Seriously...LOWER your expectations on what Windows 10 will be. Way too many people around here are putting a ton of hope and dreams on Windows 10 and they'll be severely disappointed.

    Lol, I'm fully aware that x86 apps don't run on ARM and that it will take a while for existing devs to move to universal apps. But most Windows users only need some of the basic apps that are available on Windows. Apps that are easily done in the Universal environment.

    My Dad and I have a client that he built an enterprise application for years ago. And now they need some updates and improvements. Guess how we're building it? Universal app. I also have another client that currently has a WinForms application we're making updates to. They plan on switching to Universal app in the next year or so.

    You also forget that most good Windows apps are written in the .NET environment. An environment that is still very much present in Universal apps. Moving to a Universal app is not nearly as difficult as you think. And Microsoft keeps making it easier. They're even working towards being able to port your Universal app to iOS and Android.

    Here's an example of a desktop app that has recently migrated to a Windows 8 app. Live Interior 3D Pro used to just be a OSX Desktop app, but they've now made a Windows 8 app and it's fantastic. This is a 3D rendering program...

    http://www.belightsoft.com/products/...n/overview.php

    In addition, many of the applications people are using are Web based now. So they can be available on anything. And since Microsoft made Web languages (HTML/CSS/JS) first class citizens in the Universal app environment, it's much easier to make a Windows app from that web based version.

    So I know you like to poo poo on Windows 10, but you also way underestimate the speed in which the market is Changing.

    I bet if you listed out the top 30-50 Windows applications used today, you'll find most of them are pretty easy to move over to Windows Universal apps if they haven't been already.
    Last edited by spaulagain; 01-19-2015 at 09:59 AM.
    01-19-2015 09:28 AM
  4. DJCBS's Avatar
    Lol, I'm fully aware that x86 apps don't run on ARM and that it will take a while for existing devs to move to universal apps. But most Windows users only need some of the basic apps that are available on Windows. Apps that are easily done in the Universal environment.

    My Dad and I have a client that he built an enterprise application for years ago. And now they need some updates and improvements. Guess how we're building it? Universal app. I also have another client that currently has a WinForms application we're making updates to. They plan on switching to Universal app in the next year or so.

    You also forget that most good Windows apps are written in the .NET environment. An environment that is still very much present in Universal apps. Moving to a Universal app is not nearly as difficult as you think. And Microsoft keeps making it easier. They're even working towards being able to port your Universal app to iOS and Android.

    Here's an example of a desktop app that has recently migrated to a Windows 8 app. Live Interior 3D Pro used to just be a OSX Desktop app, but they've now made a Windows 8 app and it's fantastic. This is a 3D rendering program...

    Live Interior 3D for Windows ? Overview

    In addition, many of the applications people are using are Web based now. So they can be available on anything. And since Microsoft made Web languages (HTML/CSS/JS) first class citizens in the Universal app environment, it's much easier to make a Windows app from that web based version.

    So I know you like to poo poo on Windows 10, but you also way underestimate the speed in which the market is Changing.

    I bet if you listed out the top 30-50 Windows applications used today, you'll find most of them are pretty easy to move over to Windows Universal apps if they haven't been already.
    First of all, I don't like to poo poo on Windows 10. I don't know where you got that idea, but I've said more than once that Windows 10 is what Windows 8 should have been.

    Now, you still completely fail to understand the point. You use your dad's experience with a couple of clients and expand it to everything. You still fail to understand the primary point: you NEED people to move to Windows 10 from Windows XP and Windows 7 which are the vast vast majority of users.

    Then you also fail to realize that the "app" idea is a concept that doesn't apply to Desktop. You can have apps running on desktop but none of those will be running on the phones. Furthermore, developers of x86 programs (which are probably 95% of all the programs available for Windows) will mostly NOT be interested in wasting money turning their programs into apps just because they *could* work on mobile. Why? Because Windows Phone is a neglect-able market as it's way too small. There's no profit to be make in turning x86 programs into Universal apps.

    Then you have the earnings process. Microsoft takes a percentage of all apps sold through the Store. WHY would any developer of a x86 program, that sells it directly to the user for him to install, would waste money in turning the program into an app that would see him lose a percentage of the profit he could make if he sold it as normal programs do?

    But most Windows users only need some of the basic apps that are available on Windows.
    You have no data to support this. Also, "basic" things for Windows Users are browswers and the Office suit. And guess what? Microsoft is NOT turning its office suite into an app or bunch of apps. They're preparing mobile versions of it but the office suite will remain a x86 non-universal PROGRAM, not app.

    The mobile market is changing rapidly but when it comes to the PC market, it isn't. Microsoft thought it was too when they released Windows 8. Then they realised that Windows 8 was a flop because, despite the changing of habits with smartphones and tablets, most people kept using PCs for the conventional uses. People kept using Desktop and desktop programs on a PC, not the store apps.
    01-19-2015 02:18 PM
  5. spaulagain's Avatar
    ^You do realize that the Office apps on RT/ARM right now are full versions right?

    What MS is working on is a touch friendly version of Office. We don't know the details yet as to what that will mean as far as the other "desktop" apps. They could be one in the same and just have a UI that adapts.

    Everything is the PC market. A tablet is a freaking PC. And that line people like you keep trying to draw between devices is fading more and more every year.

    I get it, you are a pessimist. Everyone knows that on this forum. I am an optimist, and just looking at my usage (I'm a power user). I see no reason why the majority of apps couldn't be made in the Universal environment.

    As for the "cut" MS takes. That could change any moment. Amd despite your angle, there is value in offering the apps in the Store and taking that hit.
    01-19-2015 06:01 PM
  6. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Has this community become that shallow that some are complaining about the name? I can't think of a dorkier name than Android yet I don't see our sister publication running threads bemoaning a name change. Can I get y'all some cheese to go with the whine?
    01-19-2015 06:25 PM
  7. Stefan Holder's Avatar
    Funny thing is I used to defend the forum when others pointed out that it's now become a haven for whiners...now I gotta admit defeat and throw in the towel. Windows Central has in fact become a haven for whiners.. I mean c'mon.. Users complain bitterly for every little thing. I've just come to accept it, and started frequenting other Windows focused forums..
    Geddeeee likes this.
    01-20-2015 07:23 AM
  8. BitPusher2600's Avatar
    Has this community become that shallow that some are complaining about the name? I can't think of a dorkier name than Android yet I don't see our sister publication running threads bemoaning a name change. Can I get y'all some cheese to go with the whine?
    I was speaking more on a common use / marketing perspective, while any other time I would avidly praise Windows Phone, that's all. But fine, I'll accept your point and will never waste anyone's time posting here again. Thank you and take care.
    01-20-2015 07:48 AM
  9. Xabier Granja's Avatar
    01-20-2015 07:48 AM
  10. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Funny thing is I used to defend the forum when others pointed out that it's now become a haven for whiners...now I gotta admit defeat and throw in the towel. Windows Central has in fact become a haven for whiners.. I mean c'mon.. Users complain bitterly for every little thing. I've just come to accept it, and started frequenting other Windows focused forums..
    I'd prefer you stayed. There is always the chance that you may have the answer to a problem I'm having. That's what makes these boards work, but I totally get your point.
    01-20-2015 10:44 AM
  11. Stefan Holder's Avatar
    I'd prefer you stayed. There is always the chance that you may have the answer to a problem I'm having. That's what makes these boards work, but I totally get your point.
    I'm not leaving Windows Central forums... 😏
    I just find other forums to chat in when most of the posts on WC are complainants..
    fatclue_98 likes this.
    01-20-2015 11:16 AM
  12. Ma Rio's Avatar
    I'm okay with calling it just "Windows".
    as someone said:
    those are all Windows devices.
    we have "Windows" PCs
    we have "Windows" phones (small p since it's not the brand name)
    also "Windows" tables
    maybe we'll later see "Windows" smart watches

    some will run full windows, some will run the mobile version
    Fire 29 and MikeSo like this.
    01-20-2015 07:10 PM
  13. Fire 29's Avatar
    Just hope they don't call it windows mobile. That's so lame sounding.
    01-21-2015 12:20 AM
  14. Gautam Kabiraj's Avatar
    Speaking of branding by Microsoft? Then take it: they may surprise you anytime, whether for good or bad. I'm being positive, though.
    01-21-2015 03:08 AM
  15. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Just hope they don't call it windows mobile. That's so lame sounding.
    It's accurate and it fits phones and RT tablets.
    DJCBS likes this.
    01-21-2015 08:35 AM
  16. a5cent's Avatar
    It's accurate and it fits phones and RT tablets.
    Yup... far more accurate than just calling it "Windows 10". I'm still cheering for the name "Surface OS" though
    MikeSo and fatclue_98 like this.
    01-21-2015 09:39 AM
  17. goldenpipes's Avatar
    This for sure. When someone asks my what kind of phone i have i say windows phone. IF they as which one i say Lumia 920.

    When i had an android phone. If i got asked the same question i never said android i just said galaxy S 2.
    01-21-2015 09:57 AM
  18. jeetu4444's Avatar
    I think its gonna be just called windows 10...its like uniform way of saying windows 10 is for pc and phone...newaz they planning to merge the store soo same apps work on phone and computer 💻
    01-21-2015 09:57 AM
  19. goldenpipes's Avatar
    I have been a windows power user since windows 98/2000. I find myself more and more looking in the windows app store for apps vs looking for programs to download. My brother in law has been making music on PC's for about 10 years now and even with all the money he has invested in Pro tools and other programs. He bought the 15 dollar version of fruityloops that is for windows 8 and uses it on his windows 8.1 tablet PC and gets more done easier on that device than in his studio. He can take the tablet with him and when he gets an idea he just pops it open and does his thing. on the fly. Also also the photoshop type apps for people who take pictures and can edit them right there on their phones. Windows is for everyone. that what microsoft is going for i think. Power users that need specific applications. AND everyone else that just wants things to work.
    01-21-2015 10:09 AM
44 12

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