Black Friday is almost here!

Get the inside track on all the best deals.

01-16-2014 01:29 PM
58 123
tools
  1. jwinch2's Avatar
    PC makers plan rebellion against Windows at 2014 CES, analysts say | Fox News

    For the record, I have both Windows Phone on a Lumia 920 and Windows 8.1 on my laptop. I adopted WP8 immediately upon the release of the Lumia 920 and Windows 8 early last summer upon the purchase of a new PC.

    Having said that, I do think there are some things that Microsoft needs to pay attention to when it comes to their Windows platform and its functionality on PC's going forward. They might think they know best, but they also need to remember that it is the consumer who decides what to purchase, and if you are not giving them what they want and like, you are going to lose in the long run.

    Personally, I really liked Windows 7 but when I bought my new laptop last summer I was ready to give Windows 8 a try. I did not like it but figured it was because it was new and I wanted to give it a fair chance. With the 8.1 update, I hoped some things would be smoothed out and some concessions for the non touch screen user and those who prefer the traditional interface would be made. That didn't really happen. Its now been 6 months since I adopted the platform and I am still not happy with it though I recently downloaded the trial version of StartIsBack and it has helped the experience dramatically.

    I am sure some will dismiss this since it is an article in mainstream media and they typically suck at tech reporting, and will dismiss my comments because they are not glowingly supportive of MS, but I think there are legitimate issues for MS to consider. Other reports suggest they are in fact taking these issues seriously, and I am hopeful that they are accurate:

    http://windowsitpro.com/windows-81/microsoft-windows-big-changes-coming
    Last edited by jwinch2; 12-27-2013 at 08:21 PM.
    12-27-2013 07:51 PM
  2. SnailUK's Avatar
    Its ironic that peoples main issue with w8 was that it was trying to merge tablet and pc, yet this goes even further down this route.

    Sent from my RM-821_eu_euro1_342 using Tapatalk
    ninjaap and JaiMento like this.
    12-27-2013 08:25 PM
  3. gedzum's Avatar
    Windows 8 isn't so bad. I mean it's basically Windows 7 with added store/metro applications. It has the desktop support that everyone is accustomed to. I think it works just fine on mouse and keyboard. Scroll wheel (Ctrl+Scroll wheel for semantic zoom) works well, thumb buttons for back, right click for in app menus. I actually think it works better than touch (on my laptop). The only thing I really don't like is how they changed the method to close apps in 8.1. I prefered it in Win8.
    12-28-2013 04:57 AM
  4. madyrocksin's Avatar
    I am using windows 8 on my PC and i kinda like it, if you know those few keyboard shortcuts then i don't think its gonna be a problem.

    But i think MS should provide an option to integrate the metro and the basic OS during the installation, this will keep most if not all happy :)
    WP8Expert likes this.
    12-28-2013 05:21 AM
  5. Ian Too's Avatar
    Thanks for posting the link, though the article isn't really anything new. Samsung already sell PCs contaminated with Android emulators, which is why I won't buy one. It's deeply ironic to me that just as Microsoft are cleaning up Windows and making it a secure platform, OEMs are introducing a whole new source of contamination. Wasn't Java enough?

    If you're using Windows 8.1, then using the boot to desktop option, your experience should be nearly identical to that you had on Windows 7, except faster and more secure.

    It seems to me that OEMs and the tech press are being deeply hypocritical against Microsoft and profoundly uncritical of Google. Lapping up the latest Android device despite its gaping security and Google's active invasion of user's personal privacy, while continually harping upon comparatively minor issues like the lack of a start button (Why incidentally, are you using StartIsBack when using Windows 8.1, which has the start button?) and lack of apps. Tech reporting lacks proportion and balance, almost as if it's being lead by an OEM - anti-Microsoft agenda.
    Kavu2, jfmanzo, theefman and 7 others like this.
    12-28-2013 07:56 AM
  6. jwinch2's Avatar
    Why incidentally, are you using StartIsBack when using Windows 8.1, which has the start button?
    Because the supposed start button in 8.1 does not work anything like what I want. The StartIsBack software remedies that. I have only had it for a few days now, but I am far happier with my experience since I installed it.
    12-29-2013 09:48 AM
  7. a5cent's Avatar
    With the 8.1 update, I hoped some things would be smoothed out and some concessions for the non touch screen user and those who prefer the traditional interface would be made. That didn't really happen. Its now been 6 months since I adopted the platform and I am still not happy with it though I recently downloaded the trial version of StartIsBack and it has helped the experience dramatically.
    Despite your post being rather vague and never quite mentioning exactly what it is that you disliked about W8.x, I was with you up until the part I quoted above. I agree that W8.x can justifiably be faulted for many things. That W8 replaced that Start Menu with a Start Screen is not one of them.

    IMHO the people complaining about the missing Start Menu have either (a) just not figured out how to use the Start Screen, which for people on this site shouldn't be an issue or (b) don't understand that the Start Screen is not the same thing as the metro environment. What I do understand is that people dislike being (apparently uncontrollably) switched back and forth between the desktop and metro environments, which have very different rules for navigation and window arrangement. I have experienced it far too often that people simply lack the technical background to articulate that problem, and instead blame the most visual entry point into that new, unfamiliar and app-lacking metro environment... the W8 Start Screen.

    There is almost nothing that the W7 Start Menu does better than the W8 Start Screen. If you really think the W8 Start Screen is one of W8's biggest problems, then you're fundamentally misunderstanding something. I would agree that the W8 Start Screen has by now become a PR and marketing liability, but I assume that this thread is more concerned with real technical issues rather than just how something is perceived.

    This is how MS can fix W8 (technically, I'm not sure the perception of W8 can be saved):

    1)
    Require that users explicitly enable the metro environment.

    1a)
    Failing to do so wouldn't mean that metro apps can't be used, but that they are instead opened in a window like any other desktop app. The metro app would only switch into full-screen mode when its window is maximized, but even then none of the traditional metro-ified means of navigation and window arrangement would apply. If you want to use metro apps side by side, then you would arrange the windows accordingly, just as if they were desktop applications. When not maximized, the metro app windows could be resized, within limits, and probably with some window size snapping that would correspond to the display resolutions that metro apps support. Without enabling the metro environment, there is no metro-like app snapping, there is no "pull down to close" gesture, there is no "cycle through apps by swiping from left" gesture. What I would retain are the metro side bars (left and right) and the W8 Start Screen. I also wouldn't bring back the inferior W7 Start Menu.

    1b)
    Enabling the metro environment wouldn't disable access to the desktop, but would simply have W8 function as it does today, including support for all metro-like gestures. Any metro apps that may have been running in a window on the desktop would instantly be removed from the desktop and moved over into the metro environment.

    2)
    Add folders to the apps list (which they should also do for WP), so people with dozens of applications can navigate the list with less clutter. Also provide a video tutorial explaining how the Start Screen is really just the same old W7 Start Menu in new cloths, with a focus on all the things it does better.
    Last edited by a5cent; 12-29-2013 at 12:34 PM. Reason: Spelling
    mpt15, mrpuny, jlzimmerman and 2 others like this.
    12-29-2013 11:55 AM
  8. Citizen X's Avatar
    foxnews.com
    Ummm... no thanks. Get a better source and we will talk.
    12-29-2013 11:59 AM
  9. sahib lopez's Avatar
    so pc makers want to put android and windows together as a dual boot option and option to use android .. a not secure os that only runs apps that are limited in nature, because people the minority tech people refuse to use windows 8. wow I would hate to see that as a computer guy. the thought of supporting android in the future gives me the shivers x.x this might sound immature but ..yuck
    The Black Mamba likes this.
    12-29-2013 12:11 PM
  10. jmshub's Avatar
    Windows 8 is fantastic. It suffers this failure of public opinion, but it has all of the best things of Windows 7. Things like the ribbon in Windows Explorer make it really difficult to go back to 7.

    Vendors are trying chrome for the same reasons they attempted to sell Linux pcs a few years ago...they are looking to cheap out.
    12-29-2013 12:45 PM
  11. sahib lopez's Avatar
    Windows 8 is fantastic. It suffers this failure of public opinion, but it has all of the best things of Windows 7. Things like the ribbon in Windows Explorer make it really difficult to go back to 7.

    Vendors are trying chrome for the same reasons they attempted to sell Linux pcs a few years ago...they are looking to cheap out.
    I have the same thing when I go back to use windows 7. when I use windows 7 im always trying to use it as windows 8 and have to change back my mind set. but I don't want to have android on that next computer that my family would buy and end up having to tech them and tell them this is not windows this is android where msft is not present :(
    12-29-2013 12:51 PM
  12. mpt15's Avatar
    I absolutely love the Start Screen. I like having all my important information displayed where I want it. It was a bit of a shocker at first, but in 3 days, I knew there was no way I was returning to W7. The few desktop apps I really want available to me without going to the start screen, I have created either a shortcut on the desktop or I have pinned to taskbar.

    I love just being on the start screen and typing something, and it just shows up in the search. I like not having to get to a second device like a tablet/phone just to use apps.

    I understand that for some people it may not be easy to accept the start screen , but it is the best thing to happen to Windows. Change is good, and I think MS got it right. People need to give it a chance. Just think about when you got your first iPad or smartphone.... You did embrace the change. Give W8 a chance.
    Guytronic and a5cent like this.
    12-29-2013 12:57 PM
  13. Reflexx's Avatar
    It looks like Android emulation is mainly going to address the lack of apps in the Microsoft app store. It may pose a threat to MS trying to get devs to make apps for the Modern environment.
    12-29-2013 01:00 PM
  14. SnailUK's Avatar
    And the moment Android apps work on a pc, Microsoft might as well close their app store, as no one will bother to write windows versions of the apps. And as a side effect that kills the windows 8 start screen, because there will be no more live tiles, or metro look apps. ๐Ÿ˜ž

    Sent from my RM-821_eu_euro1_342 using Tapatalk
    12-29-2013 01:10 PM
  15. Reflexx's Avatar
    And the moment Android apps work on a pc, Microsoft might as well close their app store, as no one will bother to write windows versions of the apps. And as a side effect that kills the windows 8 start screen, because there will be no more live tiles, or metro look apps. ๐Ÿ˜ž

    Sent from my RM-821_eu_euro1_342 using Tapatalk
    Well, if it'd done by emulation then a better more streamlined experience will be had by going native. This is especially true for budget machines.

    And lIke you said, there would be no live tiles for these apps. You couldn't pin them. You'd pin the emulator.

    Also, if people have trouble adjusting to stuff like the Start Screen, imagine what trouble they'll have with multiple environments. Techies might like it. Lay people will think it's confusing.

    Enterprise also won't want that on their PCs.

    So maybe there will be a few models with it, but I can't see it becoming the norm.
    Laura Knotek and a5cent like this.
    12-29-2013 02:04 PM
  16. Loco5150's Avatar
    I really dont understand people who complain about Windows 8.1 vs Windows 7. I dont like the modern ui apps, I have no need for them, I do everything at desktop side like I did at Windows 7. So, why Im not complaining? For me nothing has changed from Windows 7. Yes the "start menu" has changed shape, but its just a bigger version of the start menu on the W7. Its nothing else really to me as I use destop for everything.

    This is why I dont get the complaining. You know that you dont need to run modern apps in Win8 or Win8.1? You know you can only pin desktop shortcuts there, so its like the old start menu with different design? You know you can always boot direcly to desktop in Win8.1, if it anoying to have the start menu open when you boot up?

    If you know these things, Im lost here. IMHO nothing has changed from Windows7 to Windows8. Oh, except if you dont have SSD system harddrive, your boot time is much faster.

    I think considering what MS did here, they did a great job. They have the old and the new in the same package, without forcing anyone to use the new if they dont want.
    12-29-2013 02:18 PM
  17. Agent-P's Avatar
    Also provide a video tutorial explaining how the Start Screen is really just the same old W7 Start Menu in new cloths, with a focus on all the things it does better.
    This is what MS should've done when Windows 8 was first released. It should have been a mandatory interactive tutorial that was presented upon initial booting. Sure, people like us would've found it annoying, but I think it would have been hugely helpful in preventing Windows 8 from having such a negative perception. People as a whole don't like change and they're lazy. If you're not going to show them how to use it, they'll just dismiss it (which I feel is exactly what happened).
    a5cent likes this.
    12-29-2013 02:36 PM
  18. etphoto's Avatar
    Just another Microsoft better change or else thread.

    When ever there is change you'll always have a segment trying to hang on to the past.
    12-29-2013 02:56 PM
  19. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    If this is true perhaps we can see more surface things from Microsoft and the new Nokia. I always felt like surface was something being weakened because Microsoft didn't want to **** off their partners. But if I am not mistaken, surface is the highest selling windows tablet....if they want to dual boot android with windows, I want to see surface LAPTOPS and let Microsoft go full force. Then we can likely see the price of surface tablets go down a bit and see what Microsoft has in store for us.

    So I kind of hope this is true in a way though the thought of android anywhere near windows disgusts me.
    12-29-2013 03:20 PM
  20. raul_junior's Avatar
    I stopped reading after "fox news"
    12-29-2013 03:24 PM
  21. Reflexx's Avatar
    I stopped reading after "fox news"
    Reputable and legitimate news agency. Don't know why people get all weird about it.
    12-29-2013 03:28 PM
  22. WavingReds's Avatar
    I stopped reading after "fox news"
    yeah me too lol
    Guytronic and Citizen X like this.
    12-29-2013 03:29 PM
  23. hagjohn's Avatar
    I didn't even bother to read. Frankly, I'm enjoying Windows 8.1, Surface2 and WP. I don't care what the haters say. I think MS is moving into the right direction.

    Adding an insecure layer onto what has finally become a very stable/safe version of windows would be madness.
    12-29-2013 04:43 PM
  24. Guytronic's Avatar
    This might be a deflection and not relevant to the original post.

    Pointing to a CNN story about the biggest tech failures of 2013.
    I was telling my wife that the Surface RT and Windows the tiled start screen are two of the most hated\ragged subject items on the internet today
    She got somewhat miffed and then stated:
    "So I gave you a technological failure for your birthday then...?!"

    Being a well trained husband of 32 years I returned with:
    Not at all my sweet...I have studied relentlessly and knew the Surface would be a product that glowed brightly when held in my lap.
    I would not have specifically asked for a Windows product if I didn't believe in the purchase.

    As said many times before the recent price reductions on Windows hardware have drawn many to Windows on the go.
    I think the on-line news-review-opinion-battle means little, always fun to read of course.
    Most random negative news I've read has never swayed me if I wanted something bad enough.

    To me good marketing and price cutting win out over all.
    12-29-2013 05:21 PM
  25. fdalbor's Avatar
    If you have not tried or even experimented with a Android emulator on a computer you can give Bluestacks a try. Its free; but it is a very Beta program and it takes a good while to get used to. Don't try to use it for anything but experimenting with or you will be very disappointed. But if you don't have but would like to try Android it will give you the chance to do it with out any cash outlay. All my smartphones and my familys are WP8 and all my tablets (3) are Android, my desktops and laptops are Windows so I live in a world that has a bridge between Android/Windows/ and Windows phone. Sorry no Apple, not for any real reason except that I am happy with the stuff I use now. Oh yea just for informations sake; 2 of my computers are Win8.1 and 2 are still using XP. Why still XP, you would be surprised the number of older programs that will not run on 8.1, or 8 for that matter.
    12-29-2013 05:29 PM
58 123

Similar Threads

  1. ATT Go Phone on Contract Plan
    By boothes18 in forum Carrier Discussion Lounge
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 12-27-2013, 07:11 PM
  2. Send messages in Lolcat and other fun languages with T3XT K1NG for Windows Phone 8
    By WindowsCentral.com in forum Windows Central News Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-27-2013, 06:20 PM
  3. Windows Phone and eBooks.
    By Tichshew in forum Windows Phone 8
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 12-27-2013, 03:59 PM
  4. Free 30-day trial available for The New York Times on Windows and Windows Phone
    By WindowsCentral.com in forum Windows Central News Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-27-2013, 02:30 PM
  5. Master of music? Prove it with MixMaster for Windows Phone, powered by Nokia MixRadio
    By WindowsCentral.com in forum Windows Central News Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-27-2013, 02:10 PM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD