05-21-2014 10:43 PM
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  1. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    Let me cut it short. Can you do this on 1 screen only with modern UI, assuming you need to do it?

    Attachment 66817

    There are 3 translating software, outlook, skype, MS word, yahoo on background but still clickable, Maxthon browser and 2 dictionaries missing because i thought these are enough to let you understand.
    .
    Just to be clear.... You complain that your old apps are not windows 8 style. STOP IT! That's like saying electric cars are no good because you can't put electricity in your gas powered car. seriously?

    The desktop is still there because it's needed. Windows 8 style apps are not intended to be the final solution for everything. USE THE DESKTOP!!!!! That's why it's there.

    You are basically saying that jets suck because you cannot put your car's rims on the jet.
    cyborg4 likes this.
    05-18-2014 04:01 AM
  2. Chregu's Avatar
    Isn't the problem that no Metro app offers more than a tab in a browser on desktops?

    And there I don't have to use two kinds of software with an entirely different behavior or to rely on terrible developer support. This trying to convince us of how great Metro is on 4 screens seems almost like preaching religious believes.

    It's very nice if it works for you on whatever number of screens, I just don't see any use in it.

    (Just by the way, these 4 monitor screenshots look like a terrible mess, not like something productive.)
    05-18-2014 04:04 AM
  3. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    Isn't the problem that no Metro app offers more than a tab in a browser on desktops?

    And there I don't have to use two kinds of software with an entirely different behavior or to rely on terrible developer support. This trying to convince us of how great Metro is on 4 screens seems almost like preaching religious believes.

    It's very nice if it works for you on whatever number of screens, I just don't see any use in it.

    (Just by the way, these 4 monitor screenshots look like a terrible mess, not like something productive.)
    The point isn't about the number of monitors. And you don't need two different apps that work different. If you are slow, just stick with one. For instance, I like the Windows Store Skype app, I don't like the desktop version. So I use the full screen app for that. I use many windows store apps all the time, they are not terrible. And FYI, if you are doing the kind of work I do, you need 3-4 monitors to get things done. Just because you can't use it, doesn't make it wrong.

    And the fact that you think windows store apps (what you call metro which is an old term) are nothing more than a browser tab, shows you have never used them. Or perhaps you are being narrow minded, or just trolling. Either way, Windows Store apps are very useful and great to use.
    05-18-2014 04:18 AM
  4. Chregu's Avatar
    The point isn't about the number of monitors. And you don't need two different apps that work different. If you are slow, just stick with one. For instance, I like the Windows Store Skype app, I don't like the desktop version. So I use the full screen app for that. I use many windows store apps all the time, they are not terrible. And FYI, if you are doing the kind of work I do, you need 3-4 monitors to get things done. Just because you can't use it, doesn't make it wrong.

    And the fact that you think windows store apps (what you call metro which is an old term) are nothing more than a browser tab, shows you have never used them. Or perhaps you are being narrow minded, or just trolling. Either way, Windows Store apps are very useful and great to use.
    You are the most condescending and arrogant person I have ever encountered in these forums. They way you talk down to people doesn't strengthen your arguments, the way you think you're right and everybody else is wrong just lets you look like a fanatic person.

    But this is not about some deep believes, there I do understand this behavior even though I don't approve of it, this is only about the preferences of how people use their software.

    If I'd go to my boss and tell him I need four monitors that I can have Netflix, Xbox music and the WPC forum on two of them, he would not even understand what I'm talking about. If he did he would either laugh very hard or fire me. It might be that your example screenshot was just a terrible choice, but from them I really don't understand why you have to have four screens and for what you are using Metro apps that productively.

    I have encountered no productive software that's more usable with Metro, they are not even available. I can't imagine somebody using a Metro version of Photoshop, Illustrator, Office, or any of the job specific programs I use. I wouldn't. Big buttons, less functions, that's something optimized to be used on a tablet, not to work with.

    Again, I'm happy for you that you love the Metro apps, but you really should accept that other people don't. Speaking about a narrow mind.
    05-18-2014 04:34 AM
  5. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    Judging by your posts, you have not used windows 8 apps. The two of you just want to hate for no reason. I've presented many arguments, but you both just ignore them. You fail to explain how windows 8 apps are bad. And the fact that you keep saying metro shows that you don't even know what they are called. Metro hasn't been used in a very long time.
    05-18-2014 04:57 AM
  6. EC Translating Services's Avatar
    The point isn't about the number of monitors. And you don't need two different apps that work different. If you are slow, just stick with one. For instance, I like the Windows Store Skype app, I don't like the desktop version. So I use the full screen app for that. I use many windows store apps all the time, they are not terrible. And FYI, if you are doing the kind of work I do, you need 3-4 monitors to get things done. Just because you can't use it, doesn't make it wrong.

    And the fact that you think windows store apps (what you call metro which is an old term) are nothing more than a browser tab, shows you have never used them. Or perhaps you are being narrow minded, or just trolling. Either way, Windows Store apps are very useful and great to use.
    Kev

    Let me explain once again. With W8 Modern UI you need 4 big screens to show 8 apps in all (+ 4 desktops). Your screens are big.
    Me, with one 14" screen and using the classic desktop can open and keep alive on the same screen as many as 10 or 12.
    Differences:
    A) you can only handle 2 per page on modern UI. More apps need to be brought back from behind to front
    B) You can't position those vertically in any random place of the screen but only resize horizontally.
    C) The amount of real estate you are wasting is huge.
    D) All my apps are updated and kept in good order. They are not old.

    I don't understand why can't you just admit what's obvious. You can't open 50 windows on Modern UI. So you just blathered a little initially and it was ok. Then you started to add to insult to wrong. For a moment, when you showed me those screenshots i even thought i was wrong, didn't make a big issue in asking you. However you sent me a screen with 8 miserable apps open in 4 huge screen (what's the total investment for that real estate? and how are you using it?) when my initial complaint was that modern UI in W8/8.1 wasn't suitable for productivity in multi windows environments.

    Now you have changed strategy and insist with comparisons with jets, cars and other stuff. Do you realize the image you are projecting of yourself in the forum is not surely positive and it's not going to improve for sure insulting people.

    Of course, should you manage to fit the same amount of apps i put in a screen in a modern UI for a single screen i am ready to publically apologize to you for my lack of knowledge on the OS and its functionalities. I rememeber you mentioning 50 pages but also 10 are ok and don't worry, i won't blame you for putting Netflix in it unlike you did with me for the Store.

    Ah, please stop using metaphoric sentences to divert the topic again. All what i asked, since you insisted, is how can you fit so many windows in a modern UI (sorry for repeating myself).
    Last edited by a5cent; 05-18-2014 at 05:35 AM. Reason: Cleanup
    05-18-2014 05:03 AM
  7. a5cent's Avatar
    Metro hasn't been used in a very long time.
    That is probably my fault. I call them metro apps too. I know they are officially called windows store apps, and that the UI design language is called ModernUI, but I can't get used to either.
    Chregu likes this.
    05-18-2014 05:06 AM
  8. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    That is probably my fault. I call them metro apps too. I know they are officially called windows store apps, and that the UI design language is called ModernUI, but I can't get used to either.
    I still accidentally say SkyDrive sometimes too.
    a5cent likes this.
    05-18-2014 05:08 AM
  9. jordanzhninja's Avatar
    I think Windows RT 8.1 is great (RT 8.0 not so much), but ONLY on my Surface RT. I love it so much on an RT style device.
    As for full Windows 8.1, why did they bring a tablet OS to a desktop operating system? Windows RT is unfinished because it still has the god awful desktop, but in full windows, the dekstop should be the only environment!
    Full screen "apps" on a 22'' monitor that take 10 seconds to load on a piece of s*** intel i3 laptop with 4gb of ram are a lot less appealing than desktop programs that take little to no time at all to start up.

    I love metro on Windows RT, hate it on Windows 8. It should never have come to Windows 8, and should have been developed as a tablet OS for Windows RT. That's not to say I hate the idea of the store on Desktop Windows, however the amount downloadable files from the internet (probably above 10 million at least) are a lot more useful than the Windows Store's 150000 apps.
    Chregu likes this.
    05-18-2014 05:20 AM
  10. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    ... That's not to say I hate the idea of the store on Desktop Windows, however the amount downloadable files from the internet (probably above 10 million at least) are a lot more useful than the Windows Store's 150000 apps.
    Most of those 10 million apps are either complete garbage or full of malware, spyware or viruses.
    05-18-2014 05:27 AM
  11. EC Translating Services's Avatar
    As for full Windows 8.1, why did they bring a tablet OS to a desktop operating system?
    That's a very good question. I suspect they were pointing at the portable device market first and foremost while trying to keep an eye to the business area. That's why you had Metro/Modern + the old desktop beneath it and everything was duplicated in Win 8. They have been very very daring indeed. However they screwed with 8. People like me got adapted quick with some small software to just add up the old start button etc. Many users are in their late 40s, 50s and aren't eager to do tricks to get the thing to work. The OS must be familiar and work out of the box. That's why everyone told MSFT to make Win 8 bootable in desktop mode. Something they did now with 8.1 and more will come to make 8.1 more similar to 7. Modern UI, not the tiles is to be blamed. They built it as a cage, like Android. So you have a paradoxical situation where the Desktop OS went from real multiwindow/classic desktop to birdcage 2 window/modern UI and then the WP environment, where those 2 windows would be good VS Android can just handle one single one. All in all, in this specific area they have managed to reach the incredible result of keeping everyone unhappy or partially happy
    05-18-2014 05:33 AM
  12. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    Many users are in their late 40s, 50s and aren't eager to do tricks to get the thing to work.
    That's no reason to live in the past. I know many older people that have no problems using the modern os.
    05-18-2014 05:37 AM
  13. EC Translating Services's Avatar
    That's no reason to live in the past. I know many older people that have no problems using the modern os.
    For once i agree with you. In fact i live in the present and fit well in the future too. I am an early adopter of a variety of software.
    I am more worried at those living in alternative dimensions where the world is upside down.
    05-18-2014 05:42 AM
  14. EC Translating Services's Avatar
    Most of those 10 million apps are either complete garbage or full of malware, spyware or viruses.
    Have you been following news recently? Caution: Fake Kaspersky antivirus app appears in the Windows Phone Store | WinBeta

    With a 3% adoption globally this is not a good start. It also took a while before MSFT realized.
    05-18-2014 05:44 AM
  15. Jan Tomsic's Avatar
    Let me cut it short. Can you do this on 1 screen only with modern UI, assuming you need to do it?

    Attachment 66817

    There are 3 translating software, outlook, skype, MS word, yahoo on background but still clickable, Maxthon browser and 2 dictionaries missing because i thought these are enough to let you understand.
    Now, 2 things
    A) Can you do this on modern UI should you need to?
    B) NETFLIX, then i think you understand judging people by what they open in a desktop to demonstrate things may not be the smartest thing to do.

    PS: i never asked you to see 2 apps per monitor.
    No you can't but for such cases as this, there is still desktop mode for such cases. Besides, there are no modern apps like that, so you have to rely on desktop programs. I managed to get 3 modern apps running side-by-side, one of those could be dekstop on which you could arrange programs even further.

    3 modern apps:
    s1.jpg

    2 modern + dekstop:
    s2.jpg

    2 modern + desktop split further, you could split it even more, like you did already on your screenshot before.
    s3.png

    No I don't use this feature often on my desktop because I have two screen, but I do snap 2 desktop windows on each screen, sometimes email (modern app) is one of them. You can use Windows 8 without even touching modern apps the same way you did before on 7, or you could take advantage of modern apps (pros for those: writing an app is simpler, distribution is much simpler (you submit it to the store, no need to set up your own servers), you can take advantage of Azure to sync settings across devices - all those things are built in the SDK and had to be taken care of by developer before, including the whole infrastructure behind it).
    I don't use many modern apps except calendar and email, those I use regularly. Desktop isn't going anywhere, they are even further improving in the summer as stated by M$ on their Build in April, it will allow you to run modern apps in windowed mode and then it will be possible to arrange them in the way you want to (like in your screenshot).

    A word of advice though, invest in a second screen if you multitask so much. You can get a decent 1080p for 150$ and it makes your life much easier.
    05-18-2014 05:46 AM
  16. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    Have you been following news recently? Caution: Fake Kaspersky antivirus app appears in the Windows Phone Store | WinBeta

    With a 3% adoption globally this is not a good start. It also took a while before MSFT realized.
    It was 3% like a few years ago. And that story doesn't make the ancient desktop applications look any better.
    05-18-2014 05:56 AM
  17. EC Translating Services's Avatar
    No you can't but for such cases as this, there is still desktop mode for such cases. Besides, there are no modern apps like that, so you have to rely on desktop programs. I managed to get 3 modern apps running side-by-side, one of those could be dekstop on which you could arrange programs even further.

    3 modern apps:
    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	66823

    2 modern + dekstop:
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	s2.jpg 
Views:	7 
Size:	238.5 KB 
ID:	66824

    2 modern + desktop split further, you could split it even more, like you did already on your screenshot before.
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	s3.png 
Views:	9 
Size:	745.6 KB 
ID:	66825

    No I don't use this feature often on my desktop because I have two screen, but I do snap 2 desktop windows on each screen, sometimes email (modern app) is one of them. You can use Windows 8 without even touching modern apps the same way you did before on 7, or you could take advantage of modern apps (pros for those: writing an app is simpler, distribution is much simpler (you submit it to the store, no need to set up your own servers), you can take advantage of Azure to sync settings across devices - all those things are built in the SDK and had to be taken care of by developer before, including the whole infrastructure behind it).
    I don't use many modern apps except calendar and email, those I use regularly. Desktop isn't going anywhere, they are even further improving in the summer as stated by M$ on their Build in April, it will allow you to run modern apps in windowed mode and then it will be possible to arrange them in the way you want to (like in your screenshot).

    A word of advice though, invest in a second screen if you multitask so much. You can get a decent 1080p for 150$ and it makes your life much easier.
    Thank you Jan,

    In a single post you answered a question someone else still now has issues to understand. It appeared strange to me that someone could use more than 2 windows at the same time. I had checked before, i had asked Microsoft and spent a considerable amount of time since first adoption to see what benefits the OS was offering.
    Multitasking: I need to move laptops around. Some customers won't send their files online and want me to work at their premises. I only connect the laptops to the big screen at home. I work fine with an 18" too (Acer 8951G but with some extra pepper in it). I have been working like this for 14 years. It's all good, as long as Microsoft leaves the desktop option. I haven't seen the Modern UI in months on the bigger PC. May consider a big all in one with two screens at a later stage. Also depends on what translating software you use...some only show text and they fit in small windows; some are Wisywyg and show menus as they will be in their final view with text to change and those would deserve a bigger screen indeed.

    PS I am Taiwan based. I get those much cheaper in any case. It's not a matter of costs. Rather space and real need.
    05-18-2014 05:59 AM
  18. EC Translating Services's Avatar
    It was 3% like a few years ago. And that story doesn't make the ancient desktop applications look any better.
    Lol. Ok. Now go take your pill.
    05-18-2014 06:04 AM
  19. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    Lol. Ok. Now go take your pill.
    That's about all I expected from you
    05-18-2014 06:05 AM
  20. EC Translating Services's Avatar
    That's about all I expected from you
    Desktop and infections in the market are not related. You have been trolling for a long while. I am surprised NO ONE (Where is the moderator when you need one) intervened to give you a stop.
    This topic is now closed.
    I renew my invitation :-)
    05-18-2014 06:15 AM
  21. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    Desktop and infections in the market are not related. You have been trolling for a long while. I am surprised NO ONE (Where is the moderator when you need one) intervened to give you a stop.
    This topic is now closed.
    I renew my invitation :-)
    Yeah, that makes no sense. I'm going out now.
    05-18-2014 06:23 AM
  22. Dragone's Avatar
    Been a while since the 8.1 update and a surprising lot on the internet still seen to have it out for the OS. Which makes me wonder if I'm missing out on a lot with my choice of operating systems. I'm actually considering Mavericks and maybe Linux. Those of you who have had experience with these OS's, do share your thoughts.

    As for me, I'm loving Widows 8.1 on the desktop (no touch) and haven't had any issues with it. Just wondering why there's so much hate towards it.
    Some people don't like chocolate.
    05-18-2014 06:33 AM
  23. Dragone's Avatar
    Some people don't like chocolate.
    Oh well, especially MS chocolate

    Put a Google before it and you'll have no problems
    05-18-2014 06:38 AM
  24. Chregu's Avatar
    Oh well, especially MS chocolate

    Put a Google before it and you'll have no problems
    Why do people always assume that somebody who doesn't like one product of a company hates the entire company?

    Why should anybody hate a company that produces tech products? That's what amazed me always the most, people having more emotions towards a company they have no personal connection to, than to many other things that are involved with daily on a personal level.

    I love Office. I love Windows Phone. I love OneDrive. I love Windows without Metro. And I still don't like Metro on my desktop computer. And yes, I use the term Metro because everybody knows what I mean and it's the easiest thing to write. I know the term isn't used anymore by Microsoft, I even know why.

    All of this is nothing personal, that's just a single product I think doesn't meet my requirements and Microsoft tried to force me to use with Windows 8. However they realized now that they can't do that, and they decided to bring back the Windows 7 feel many people appreciated. There was just no need to fix something that was already in a perfectly good shape.

    My personal theory? They thought they can push Windows RT apps when they bring the Store to every computer out there. It didn't work, as these apps are optimized for small touch screens and not multiple big screens.

    I think they hit the mark with making Metro optional now. For people who want to use it and think it's great, it's there. You can use it. For people like me who don't like it and don't need it, I don't have to anymore.

    So why did I hate Windows 8 (that was the question if you remember)? Because Microsoft tried to force me to use something I didn't like. Why do I like Windows 8.1. more? Because most of it hast become optional and they reimplemented basic stuff like right click context menus.
    05-18-2014 07:47 AM
  25. Jan Tomsic's Avatar
    Why do people always assume that somebody who doesn't like one product of a company hates the entire company?

    Why should anybody hate a company that produces tech products? That's what amazed me always the most, people having more emotions towards a company they have no personal connection to, than to many other things that are involved with daily on a personal level.

    I love Office. I love Windows Phone. I love OneDrive. I love Windows without Metro. And I still don't like Metro on my desktop computer. And yes, I use the term Metro because everybody knows what I mean and it's the easiest thing to write. I know the term isn't used anymore by Microsoft, I even know why.

    All of this is nothing personal, that's just a single product I think doesn't meet my requirements and Microsoft tried to force me to use with Windows 8. However they realized now that they can't do that, and they decided to bring back the Windows 7 feel many people appreciated. There was just no need to fix something that was already in a perfectly good shape.

    My personal theory? They thought they can push Windows RT apps when they bring the Store to every computer out there. It didn't work, as these apps are optimized for small touch screens and not multiple big screens.

    I think they hit the mark with making Metro optional now. For people who want to use it and think it's great, it's there. You can use it. For people like me who don't like it and don't need it, I don't have to anymore.

    So why did I hate Windows 8 (that was the question if you remember)? Because Microsoft tried to force me to use something I didn't like. Why do I like Windows 8.1. more? Because most of it hast become optional and they reimplemented basic stuff like right click context menus.
    They obviously listened to feedback (to some point) and fixed some thing with 8.1 update. I don't care about metro, I could live without it just fine, but check out ubuntu, and you'll see they change something with every version, and they're released every 6 months, recently they forced you to use Unity even though some people might have been happy with Gnome 2. Now thats linux, so of course everyone can modify the system to unrecognizable state. My point is this, yes, W8 is different then previous versions of Windows. You can use it, but you don't have to, there's plenty alternatives like windows 7, various linux distributions, OSX... If you were always driving Audis and they changed something that you don't like, and if you kept insisting on Audi because 'you used to like it', then people would think you're crazy. Get another car, or keep your old one, chances are it still runs just fine. W8 performance wise is a great update over W7, plenty of things on desktop mode are improved, graph when copying files and task manager being (to me) most noticeable ones.
    Microsoft didn't force you to use anything. The choice to buy a computer with W8 or to buy W8 and install it yourself was completely yours. It's like saying Samsung is forcing you to buy a new phone just because they released it. You don't have to get it, my dad still has a 2011 Xperia Ray and he's just fine with it. Life isn't only black or only white, it's mostly quite grey, almost never will you be able to find a product that you're 100% happy with, especially if you didn't make it yourself.

    About your theory, yes, you're quite right, they're leaning towards One ecosystem, they said so themselves on Build, they want one app to run on phones, tablets, computers, xbox and embedded systems, and only way to achieve that is to make some sacrifices.

    I also agree with your point on people being emotional about a brand, sadly this is becoming (it already is actually) a very big deal. Before it mattered which brand of clothes you wore, not it's way more important which brand of phone you have and which ecosystem you use. I see that mostly with apple users, at work they mostly hang out together and show off their iphones to each other. It's also like that with WP users, because there's less of them (us) and they're usually excited to see someone else is using the same platform. It's like belonging to the same church or sect. It's kinda sad. Stop fighting over which version of particular software is better and enjoy whichever one suits you the most.
    Chregu likes this.
    05-18-2014 12:20 PM
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