11-18-2011 11:56 PM
39 12
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  1. Pronk's Avatar
    I am curious what was the reason was to downgrade the phones abilities. What would it have taken away from the phone to have included decent versions of Office getting thrown in from a ROM chip?
    One word: image. If you want a slice of the ultra-cool Apple pie with a side of Ice-Cream Sandwich, you don't get that with spreadsheets.

    I'm afraid the top-end business user who needs his/her phone to be a tiny laptop may be a heavy user, but a small market compared to the booming market for smartphones overall. So your needs have been jettisoned in favour of appealing to a much, much wider audience because ultimately, that's where the money is.
    palandri likes this.
    10-27-2011 10:47 AM
  2. VernonEL's Avatar
    Oh, to answer your questions:

    Bing is the default search engine on MS (and current Blackberry) devices, just as Google is default to Android. I know that Google is available on T-Mobile WP devices, and may even be default in some cases. If it is that important to some people, the can pin the Google search web page to the start screen.

    As far as I know, Android is the only OS that does support Flash, and I've heard that it may be getting phased out. As far as hindering web browsing, it is very rare that I cannot view something because it is displayed in Flash. More often it is Silverlight that I wish I had, and I have heard that it will be supported with WP8's version of Internet Explorer.

    True, the OS integration of Twitter does not yet support Direct Messages. I do not know which OS does though. There is a simple work-around though: Just set up text notifications from Twitter, and reply via email when you receive a DM. There has not been one case in which this has not worked for me. Email gives you more room anyways. If you still need DM capability, just use one of the many free and paid Twitter apps available for Windows Phone. Most feature toast notifications anyways.

    Music: False. You do not need to pay a monthly fee to put music on your phone. You can sync it up easily through the Zune software, very similarly like iTunes. The fee is if you want to take advantage of the many great features of Zune Pass, which is by nearly all accounts, well worth it.
    10-27-2011 11:06 AM
  3. dlcpa's Avatar
    Burn,

    I wasn't sure about Google on WP. I have a Blackberry and I hated Bing so I made Google.com the browser start page, so I guess you can do the same thing in WP.

    As far as which Office phone packages are better than what WP has, check out Documents To Go, which is what I use on my Blackberry and it has ALL the functions WinMo had. Here is the Android version (also available for IPhone, BB and Palm) Documents To Go for Android Smartphones: Word and Excel on your Android Smartphone I guess they don't make one for the WP phones and that's too bad.

    Microsoft is leaving many of us totally out in the cold because of their no sync without a Live A/C (I'll never do that) or pay for a cloud account interactivity. I want local. Does WP have potential, absolutely, but who trusts people who can't even keep the good stuff they have?

    As far as Xbox and Music, I never said music wasn't important, I said I don't need a phone that's a Gameboy. Whether or not that helps it sell to the kids, I don't care, and I have a PlayStation 3 so I am not anti games.

    Getting email addresses on Twitter is not as easy as you think, especially if you cannot DM because people don't want their emails floating on the net and if it's in a regular Tweet it will be. If you can use other programs then the point is moot. Why didn't you say that right away?

    I believe MS will have it all eventually but right now it is a little pathetic that it took some of it's great strengths from WM and let them disappear or it is unable to put out on the net what their WP Office packages have and don't have and how one can sync a WP phone locally.

    It's not one thing for me. MS has made WP too hard to use and missing lots of the features I want, not to mention syncing on my local computers and connectivity to a Bluetooth keyboard, like WM had and like IOS and Android now has.

    As far as my complaining, thanks. Without people who can think, analyze, compare and try to make things better, we'd live in mediocrity. If it weren't for Steve Jobs, we'd still be using MSDOS on PCs. C:\ remember_those_days?
    10-27-2011 01:12 PM
  4. aximtreo's Avatar
    Hey guys it's snowing in Arizona today. Let's all go out and write our name in the snow. All of the responses posted here is becoming a ******* contest. I did not see the most used business app, Outlook, and a clean solution to synching with the phone. I bet that Outlook is the most used business app in Office by a long ways. Am I wrong?
    10-27-2011 03:45 PM
  5. Pronk's Avatar
    I would imagine Word is the most used office app by miles. There are tons of email clients as good as or better than Outlook, but pretty much everyone uses Word.
    10-28-2011 01:37 AM
  6. joe-1981's Avatar
    One thing most people foget about "cloud storage" is most security managers for enterprises will never approve corporate data being stored in an environment that doesn't meet its criteria. Mobile data is not yours it belongs to your company and taking company information and putting it on Skydrive effectively hands control of that data to Microsoft.
    One potential fix for this is Microsofts DPM client in conjunction with a VPN client (is there one?) to connect to corporate cloud storage appliances. Currently no DPM client or VPN client prevents this approach but for now no one in our organisation has approval for using SkyDrive.
    Again this is another area MS may have chosen to hit the consumer market first and hopefully it will catch up with Enterprise clients in a future update
    10-28-2011 08:12 AM
  7. dlcpa's Avatar
    There is only one spreadsheet in existence these days and that is Excel, as unevolved as it is, EVERYONE uses it.

    I am not a fan of The Cloud as it has been pierced too many times and many have to know how to pierce it or it would be unusable.

    Maybe we should start with what can WP Office programs actually do. Can someone take a look at Outlook, Excel and Word on 7.0 and 7.5 and tell us if:

    Outlook WP has every field as Outlook in MS Office Suite?
    What functions are available in Excel. Can it do Series, lookups and logic operations.
    As far as Word, can it do outline, indenting etc so if a document has to be changed, it can be and sent on without having to go back to a PC?

    However, for me, I believe I am gone from WP until I can do local syncs. I returned my first Droid within hours (2 years ago), thanks to a moron at the Verizon store, when every single piece of my contact information appeared on Google, 3,900 contacts. WP is noplace yet for small business users. It offers absolutely nothing but potential if Microsoft gets it's act together. Right now, it is much worse than either the IPhone or the Androids as their Office packages, via Documents to Go, run circles around WP's (I think), there are programs for local syncing and you can use a Bluetooth keyboard on them. So what is it that WP offers the small biz user? Does anyone know?
    10-28-2011 10:11 AM
  8. palandri's Avatar
    There is only one spreadsheet in existence these days and that is Excel, as unevolved as it is, EVERYONE uses it.

    I am not a fan of The Cloud as it has been pierced too many times and many have to know how to pierce it or it would be unusable.

    Maybe we should start with what can WP Office programs actually do. Can someone take a look at Outlook, Excel and Word on 7.0 and 7.5 and tell us if:

    Outlook WP has every field as Outlook in MS Office Suite?
    What functions are available in Excel. Can it do Series, lookups and logic operations.
    As far as Word, can it do outline, indenting etc so if a document has to be changed, it can be and sent on without having to go back to a PC?

    However, for me, I believe I am gone from WP until I can do local syncs. I returned my first Droid within hours (2 years ago), thanks to a moron at the Verizon store, when every single piece of my contact information appeared on Google, 3,900 contacts. WP is noplace yet for small business users. It offers absolutely nothing but potential if Microsoft gets it's act together. Right now, it is much worse than either the IPhone or the Androids as their Office packages, via Documents to Go, run circles around WP's (I think), there are programs for local syncing and you can use a Bluetooth keyboard on them. So what is it that WP offers the small biz user? Does anyone know?
    Surely there must be a couple of CPA sites that you visit. You might find your answers quicker at a CPA site. I am sure they all use a variety of phones and can cater to your concerns better.
    10-28-2011 10:16 AM
  9. dlcpa's Avatar
    Surely there must be a couple of CPA sites that you visit. You might find your answers quicker at a CPA site. I am sure they all use a variety of phones and can cater to your concerns better.
    You know, that is a very good idea!

    I saw a phone today that I fell in love with. The Samsung Galazy Note. 5.3 Super Amoled Screen, dual core 1.4 MHz processor, changeable battery, 16 gig on board with up to 32 gig micro sim. It does 4G LTE so Verizon, get it already! It looks pretty fast with little lag..I am in love with this phone or phablet
    10-28-2011 07:12 PM
  10. welsbloke's Avatar
    dlcpa,

    I think you need to understand where the marketplace is going, for the functionality you are seeking I suspect it is better catered for by the tablet devices. Now I will be the first to admit that maybe the current crop of Windows based tablets may not be to your liking but they do have the mobile functionality you desire.

    This is really just about a 80/20 rule scenario. You fall into the 1/20th of the 20% this does not mean your points are not valid just that they are unlikely to be catered for until your voice becomes louder.

    When I think about business reasons for this phone I think the ability to perform basic tasks on the hoof. You paint a scenario of when your WM helped you out but I do not see this as a requirement for all phones.

    Prior to mango I think they definately missed the boat and the focus was heavily on the consumer. Windows 7.5 has not really moved the focus to far away from the consumer but they have at least found the time to include some glaring obvious ommisions.

    I choose Windows Phone for my mobile fleet for the following reasons:

    Office integration
    Office 365 integration - (Looking forward to Lync)
    Ease of use (Never underestimate this one)
    Value for money
    Social connections (This is increasingly more important in business, not everyone will agree but the world is moving and business needs to connect to it better).

    The windows live account can be a problem but if you configure it to send all phones data to Skydrive it actually helps with data recovery on the phone so in the end I appreciate this function too.

    Laters got to dash.
    VernonEL likes this.
    11-01-2011 07:33 AM
  11. dlcpa's Avatar
    Wels, I got a new computer to replace my desktop. It uses Windows 7 Professional and I have Office 2010. I used to link to a hotmail account I had. Now, all of a sudden it stopped linking the hotmail account into Outlook and I get a message saying that for this hotmail account to work I need to send my cell phone number to Windows Live so they can send me back a code. My answer is F___k that!

    I don't like Windows live and I don't like Bing. I want to sync locally and I want to know what office functions WP7.5 has. I want an HID Bluetooth connectivity profile, so if I have something long to type I don't have to do it on a little phone screen. I also want a large screen. I really have no desire whatsoever for an IPad or any tablet. They don't fit in my pocket so who needs it? I'd rather type on a laptop than an IPad screen. If I was a real estate agent, then I'd want an IPad but for me, a big phone is much better.

    Microsoft is offering me nothing that I want and they don't even have the decency to get their butts here to answer questions or at least tell us how much more than Cut & Paste WP7.5 does. To me it's imbecilic to throw away a market segment they owned by keeping what you already had. That's one reason why I don't trust the Microsoft group running this phone system.

    I am hoping the Samsung Galaxy Note comes to Verizon in 4G LTE mode. If Microsoft explained what WP7.5 has and can do and if they added Bluetooth HID and local syncing I'd strongly consider it; if they offered a large phone. So, I check back here once and a while because nothing is moving too fast on the Verizon end.
    11-03-2011 01:38 PM
  12. welsbloke's Avatar
    dlcpa,

    I am not here to sell the Windows Phone but if you do not like Windows Live and you do not like Bing then it makes it very difficult to propose any size Windows Phone as your solution.

    It is actually admirable that you even considered the phone despite this dislike. Actually the disliking of Microsoft sometimes (mostly) irrationally is a common theme and one reason why making it so closely tied to the Microsoft name and Windows seemed irrational but as a long game I think it will become a lot clearer in 2012 with Windows 8.

    I think you have some very specific needs which I cannot see being catered for in 7.5 but maybe with the advent of Windows 8 and the ecosystem that will go with it that may change.

    I believe the Windows Phone makes a good case for many business users with Office 365 tight integration and Office 2010 baked in even if it is the light version.

    This brings me back to the market changing... from millions of devices to tens of millioins to a more diverse audience. Makes more financial sense to the beancounters.
    11-04-2011 11:53 AM
  13. dlcpa's Avatar
    dlcpa,


    It is actually admirable that you even considered the phone despite this dislike. I think it will become a lot clearer in 2012 with Windows 8.
    Admirable, I'm not so sure, hopeful and pragmatic sounds better. I am a Yankee fan who doesn't hate the Mets and a NY Giant's fan that also likes the Jets. I try to be rational. I was so excited when I heard Microsoft was pushing a new phone O/S because I remembered how great my Dell Axim was. I knew as far as apps there'd never be as many WP7.5 apps as there are IPhone and Android apps, not for at least 5 years but that ease of transferring data was what I wanted first. As it turns out, Microsoft makes it the hardest of any of the platforms. I keep coming back because the phone I want hasn't been announced yet and maybe I believe Microsoft would, at the very least, address this situation and talk about what WP7.5 doesn't have that WM5.0 did have. Maybe it is hidden someplace and can be released. However, not a word and no hope.

    I think you have some very specific needs which I cannot see being catered for in 7.5 but maybe with the advent of Windows 8 and the ecosystem that will go with it that may change.
    I love the Samsung Galaxy Note and as soon as it is available from Verizon in 4G LTE, I"ll buy it or a phone very much like it. I think Hotmail is a mess and continually gives me problems on more than one computer. It is very vulnerable to viruses and the fact that it will not feed into Outlook unless I give it my cell #, is not what I want to see. Maybe they can sell the cell numbers of millions of suckers to List creators, but not mine.


    I believe the Windows Phone makes a good case for many business users with Office 365 tight integration and Office 2010 baked in even if it is the light version.
    What is tight integration? I am not sure what you mean about WP7.5 doing anything for business, unless ignoring it an slapping it in the face is a good thing?

    This brings me back to the market changing... from millions of devices to tens of millions to a more diverse audience. Makes more financial sense to the bean counters.
    What makes financial sense to me is to have 2 reasons to have something, much better than 1. If the phone does my business calcs and interfaces almost totally with MS Office that is one reason to buy it. Then if I like the social media stuff or GPS and location stuff there is another. The IPhone and the Androids do both and WP7.5 does one, plus ******* off the loyal data base who will normally buy MS even though it never evolves.

    Maybe MS thinks WP7.5 is evolution but they aren't changing anything by addition, only by subtraction. Will WP7.5 do anything incredible that Android 4 can't do, I doubt it. Does it do less, yep!

    If I was running the WP division I'd kick these guys in the butt and get them back on track to creating multiple reasons to buy a WP phone. Right now, I'm not even sure what the reasons are to buy that phone b/c MS doesn't even tell anyone what it does or does not do. That is not being friendly to business. The future isn't a reason because you can always change when that future comes.
    11-18-2011 04:29 PM
  14. VernonEL's Avatar
    Admirable, I'm not so sure, hopeful and pragmatic sounds better. I am a Yankee fan who doesn't hate the Mets and a NY Giant's fan that also likes the Jets. I try to be rational. I was so excited when I heard Microsoft was pushing a new phone O/S because I remembered how great my Dell Axim was. I knew as far as apps there'd never be as many WP7.5 apps as there are IPhone and Android apps, not for at least 5 years but that ease of transferring data was what I wanted first. As it turns out, Microsoft makes it the hardest of any of the platforms. I keep coming back because the phone I want hasn't been announced yet and maybe I believe Microsoft would, at the very least, address this situation and talk about what WP7.5 doesn't have that WM5.0 did have. Maybe it is hidden someplace and can be released. However, not a word and no hope.



    I love the Samsung Galaxy Note and as soon as it is available from Verizon in 4G LTE, I"ll buy it or a phone very much like it. I think Hotmail is a mess and continually gives me problems on more than one computer. It is very vulnerable to viruses and the fact that it will not feed into Outlook unless I give it my cell #, is not what I want to see. Maybe they can sell the cell numbers of millions of suckers to List creators, but not mine.




    What is tight integration? I am not sure what you mean about WP7.5 doing anything for business, unless ignoring it an slapping it in the face is a good thing?



    What makes financial sense to me is to have 2 reasons to have something, much better than 1. If the phone does my business calcs and interfaces almost totally with MS Office that is one reason to buy it. Then if I like the social media stuff or GPS and location stuff there is another. The IPhone and the Androids do both and WP7.5 does one, plus ******* off the loyal data base who will normally buy MS even though it never evolves.

    Maybe MS thinks WP7.5 is evolution but they aren't changing anything by addition, only by subtraction. Will WP7.5 do anything incredible that Android 4 can't do, I doubt it. Does it do less, yep!

    If I was running the WP division I'd kick these guys in the butt and get them back on track to creating multiple reasons to buy a WP phone. Right now, I'm not even sure what the reasons are to buy that phone b/c MS doesn't even tell anyone what it does or does not do. That is not being friendly to business. The future isn't a reason because you can always change when that future comes.
    This thread is getting old.

    Just face it, we all know that some of your points are very valid, but you are just too small of a slice of the customer base. Windows Phone will likely offer what you desire at some point but it is not there now. Even if it was, you would find something else to nit-pick at. It is not perfect, but it is pretty dang good for most everyone.

    I am un-subscribing to this thread.
    11-18-2011 11:56 PM
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