01-24-2012 11:46 AM
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  1. snowmutt's Avatar
    I post on a couple other mobile sites, and I am the self proclaimed Windows Phone cheerleader. I try to stay current on WP news, and try to keep my facts straight to help people who may be interested in WP to understand what to expect from a OS that is still developing.

    Lately, I am being peppered with questions about WP8 and what to expect. I know the basics: Microsoft is going to push huge business improvements, it will be more integrated into Windows PCs, the hardware capabilities will be improved (hi resolution screens, dual core processors, ECT.). But I have heard very little in specifics. Some questions I have been asked:

    What about legacy support for 1st and 2nd generation devices?

    What about landscape screen support? (home screen, XBOX live screen, Office hub, ECT.)

    Transferring Bluetooth files?

    Better gaming chips for graphics?

    Larger memory storage?

    Has anyone heard anything on these or other upcoming Apollo improvements? I trust the WP Central community. I want to pass on good info, and not leave people disappointed by what is offered, but I also want to encourage them to give it a chance.

    Help??
    01-20-2012 11:56 AM
  2. selfcreation's Avatar
    honestly ... so far its all still 100% rumors....noting has been confirmed by MS.

    so its hard to tell you exactly whats up...

    - more storage is coming for sure...

    - Xfer Bluetooth files phone to phone: i can almost guaranty at 100% we will NEVER have this. 50% of carriers doesn't allow it on ANY phone due to copy rights issues.

    -landscape i highly doubt it. but you never know.
    snowmutt likes this.
    01-20-2012 12:38 PM
  3. index1366's Avatar
    I so hope that 1st gen phones will be supported, because Microsoft I think it wants the multi-dupport for all the phones on market, perhaps also for market share. But the question is, if the new Apollo would need the second generation of processors, you may never know..

    The landscape support would be very welcome, but I'm also extremely doubtful about that. We'll see, let us surprise.
    01-20-2012 01:00 PM
  4. Reflexx's Avatar
    What about legacy support for 1st and 2nd generation devices?
    I'm just about 100% sure that 1st and 2nd gen devices will still be getting updates and support.

    I don't know if the "Apollo" that they will get will be the real same Apollo as WP8. Not because I don't expect them to try to match features. I do expect feature parity. But there are a lot of things that will be in WP8 that won't apply to older devices because of the hardware differences.

    What about landscape screen support? (home screen, XBOX live screen, Office hub, ECT.)
    No info. Though I don't think it's high on their priority list. It's pretty much just the tile screens that don't support landscape. And those screens aren't exactly reading intensive.

    It would be nice. But I'm guessing that there are about a million things listed as more important. But who knows? Windows 8 is landscape.

    Transferring Bluetooth files?
    Doubt it. Though I do expect NFC support.

    Better gaming chips for graphics?
    Guaranteed. The chips in these mobile devices are normally "System on a Chip." Newer processors normally also include newer and faster GPUs.

    I would expect the GPU will be the Adreno 220. Here's a sample video for the Adreno 220.

    By the time WP8 is released, the Adreno 320 might be out. But I doubt it would be in the WP8 spec since MS isn't looking to be the most expensive handset on the market. And with screens this small, it may just be overkill. The Adreno 320 may be something we'll see in tablets.

    Larger memory storage?
    I would hope so. But I think a lot of that depends on what carriers are telling OEMs they want. Because larger storage devices cost the carriers more to buy from OEMs, before we see phones with larger storage, carriers need to see a lot of the regular ones selling first.
    snowmutt likes this.
    01-20-2012 01:15 PM
  5. mprice86's Avatar
    So far literally nothing has been confirmed. In an interview at CES one of the heads of Windows Phone development, when asked about Apollo said; "I can say it ends in 'o'."

    I can appreciate MS is playing their cards close to their chest, but as much as I believe that they are saving the news to announce huge things; I have the tiniest worry that they're not talking because they have nothing major. In all likelyhood though, they're not saying anything so that Google/Apple can't rip them off and produce their own version of the ideas before MS get Apollo out the door.

    Anyway, I'm 90% sure first gen devices will get legacy support, especially given how adamant MS have been about trying to prevent fragmentation. I'm 100% confident that 2nd gen devices will be supported.

    Beyond that I think you're right in saying they'll expand business support, particularly in adding security features to the OS that will make it more attractive to corporations and government agencies.

    Personally, I'd like to see landscape home screen support to bring WP in line with xbox and PC. In my opinion it would really add to the experience, as would swiping up from landscape to see the app list which could be scrolled horizontally. I'm reasonably confident that this will be added at least as an option.

    Some kind of notification centre would be a nice addition, it seems to be one thing that a lot of people miss when making the switch to WP. I don't miss it myself, but if MS wants to attract Android/iOS users then they will have to offer a similar function for notifications. I'm confident, given the elegance of the rest of the OS, that MS can come up with an attractive solution for this. At the moment I would be satisfied with Toasts not disappearing until they've been pressed/dismissed.

    As Se1fcr3ation said, Bluetooth file transfer isn't going to happen.

    As for hardware, it's pretty clear that Apollo will add support for dual-core processors which will enhance the gaming capabilities of the 3rd gen handsets. In line with that I would expect to see a launch line up of handsets with 1.5ghz dual-core chips and probably 1gb of RAM. As well as a new range of XBLA titles.

    While 32gb phones will certainly be released I think it's at least 1 year (more likely 2 years) away from becoming the standard phone storage size. Costs are coming down, but flash storage is still far too expensive. I'm not convinced we'll see a screen resolution boost and if we do it'll certainly not be 720p. More likely 1024 x Something.

    That's my two cents anyway. Feel free to tear it to shreds gang.
    snowmutt likes this.
    01-20-2012 01:18 PM
  6. canesfan625's Avatar
    I so hope that 1st gen phones will be supported, because Microsoft I think it wants the multi-dupport for all the phones on market, perhaps also for market share. But the question is, if the new Apollo would need the second generation of processors, you may never know..

    The landscape support would be very welcome, but I'm also extremely doubtful about that. We'll see, let us surprise.
    What would be the point of tango if apollo required high end hardware? an update to bring windows phone to a lower end hardware specs just to make it moot a few months later? I don't think the first thing MS is going to do is fragment the ecosystem they are building. It would be 10 steps forward 100 back. Windows 8 can run on the 1st gen atom cpu for crying out loud lol.
    snowmutt likes this.
    01-20-2012 01:18 PM
  7. zoomy942's Avatar
    The Apollo update is what's keeping me from getting a Trophy on VZW... no way to know if the Trophy will get updated.
    01-20-2012 01:54 PM
  8. selfcreation's Avatar
    ALL first gen phones ++ WILL HAVE Apollo!! 100% guaranty!!

    tango will basically bridge the first GEN phones with the Apollo phones.

    Balmer , Elop both said they where staying away from Fragmentation.... that's why MS has NOT given Nokia the ability to COOK IN application ( like Nokia road map is an APP and NOT built in)

    that would of created the first fragmentation of WP if they had. but hopefully they will cook it into ALL the phones at some point :) After all BING MAPS has adopted NOKIA`s Name :P


    at some point in time doh, first gen phones WILL stop getting updates .. but thats easy 2-3 MAJOR updates away ( WP10 , hehe i cant wait for WP10!!)
    snowmutt likes this.
    01-20-2012 02:00 PM
  9. Premium1's Avatar
    ALL first gen phones ++ WILL HAVE Apollo!! 100% guaranty!!

    tango will basically bridge the first GEN phones with the Apollo phones.

    Balmer , Elop both said they where staying away from Fragmentation.... that's why MS has NOT given Nokia the ability to COOK IN application ( like Nokia road map is an APP and NOT built in)

    that would of created the first fragmentation of WP if they had. but hopefully they will cook it into ALL the phones at some point :) After all BING MAPS has adopted NOKIA`s Name :P


    at some point in time doh, first gen phones WILL stop getting updates .. but thats easy 2-3 MAJOR updates away ( WP10 , hehe i cant wait for WP10!!)
    Actually Nokia does have the ability to change the OS they are the only ones who can.Nokia Allowed To Modify Windows Phone 7 In Ways Others Can't | TFTS
    Nokia allowed to modify Windows Phone while rival OEMs locked out - SlashGear
    01-20-2012 02:17 PM
  10. selfcreation's Avatar

    ok... but they said they wouldn't to prevent fragmentation.... did you only read the title?
    hence why Nokia made apps instead of cooking in the features.

    ** instead, Elop has said that Nokia will prioritize compatibility across the Windows Phone platform rather than differentiation for its own sake. Nokia and Microsoft have positioned the partnership as a co-engineering project to collectively drive Windows Phone forward, introducing new advantages and abilities in the OS that other OEMs will also be able to enjoy.***
    01-20-2012 02:32 PM
  11. Premium1's Avatar
    ok... but they said they wouldn't to prevent fragmentation.... did you only read the title?
    hence why Nokia made apps instead of cooking in the features.

    ** instead, Elop has said that Nokia will prioritize compatibility across the Windows Phone platform rather than differentiation for its own sake. Nokia and Microsoft have positioned the partnership as a co-engineering project to collectively drive Windows Phone forward, introducing new advantages and abilities in the OS that other OEMs will also be able to enjoy.***
    You said they "were not allowed to change the os" I was just showing that they indeed are. I think if wp takes off you will see more customization on their part. Right now they are just trying to get back on track(nokia that is)
    01-20-2012 02:51 PM
  12. selfcreation's Avatar
    You said they "were not allowed to change the os" I was just showing that they indeed are. I think if wp takes off you will see more customization on their part. Right now they are just trying to get back on track(nokia that is)
    well my bad...

    they do , but they most likely wont. ( is what i should of said)

    cause if they start to do it .. then we are going to see a fraged up OS :( (android style) maybe not AS bad cause it be restricted to NOKIA.... but it would hurt the others(samsung, HTC ect..)

    well i guess will see... but it wont happen before Apollo thats for sure..
    01-20-2012 03:06 PM
  13. canesfan625's Avatar
    well my bad...

    they do , but they most likely wont. ( is what i should of said)

    cause if they start to do it .. then we are going to see a fraged up OS :( (android style) maybe not AS bad cause it be restricted to NOKIA.... but it would hurt the others(samsung, HTC ect..)

    well i guess will see... but it wont happen before Apollo thats for sure..
    Nokia wont change anything super major at risk of the paradigm. I fully expect to see them bake in their own apps and stuff like that though.
    01-20-2012 04:12 PM
  14. straitda's Avatar
    I've been using the Windows 8 developer preview on a Samsung tablet and it has a notification system. Basically apps can tell the OS they offer notifications and you can opt in/out on an app by app basis.

    I can imagine we'll see the same system in Apollo.

    Sent from my T7575 using Board Express
    01-20-2012 08:10 PM
  15. threedog's Avatar
    I've been using the Windows 8 developer preview on a Samsung tablet and it has a notification system. Basically apps can tell the OS they offer notifications and you can opt in/out on an app by app basis.

    I can imagine we'll see the same system in Apollo.

    Sent from my T7575 using Board Express
    What does the notification center look like? And how do you access it? :)



    Sent from my SGH-i937 using Board Express
    01-21-2012 02:40 AM
  16. Winterfang's Avatar
    The storage problem is up to the companies. Windows Phone does support more than 32GB.

    Anyway a phone with 32GB is going to cost 300 dollars so people will complain anyway.
    01-21-2012 08:34 AM
  17. PG2G's Avatar
    The storage problem is up to the companies. Windows Phone does support more than 32GB.

    Anyway a phone with 32GB is going to cost 300 dollars so people will complain anyway.
    You sure? I thought I remember reading people adding 32 GB cards to their Focus for 40 GB total.
    aubreyq likes this.
    01-21-2012 10:43 AM
  18. PG2G's Avatar
    I've been using the Windows 8 developer preview on a Samsung tablet and it has a notification system. Basically apps can tell the OS they offer notifications and you can opt in/out on an app by app basis.

    I can imagine we'll see the same system in Apollo.
    How is it any different than the notification system that has been in WP7 since original release?

    What does the notification center look like? And how do you access it? :)
    There is no notification center, Microsoft is against that concept. They always refer to it as a "junk drawer." They feel Live Tiles do the job and you should pin the applications that you need that status from.
    01-21-2012 10:46 AM
  19. selfcreation's Avatar
    You sure? I thought I remember reading people adding 32 GB cards to their Focus for 40 GB total.
    yes , but they have no restriction on how much they can put in the phone *stock* ... the focus has 8G but it could have been 32G + sd card... is what hes saying.. its up the the OEM to decide whatt hey put int he phone when they build it.

    There is no notification center, Microsoft is against that concept. They always refer to it as a "junk drawer." They feel Live Tiles do the job and you should pin the applications that you need that status from.
    he was talking about W8 ( pc/tablet) not WP.... but dont be surprise if they add a TOAST section to WP. allot of people are voting for it on the suggestion page...
    01-21-2012 11:34 AM
  20. Reflexx's Avatar
    You sure? I thought I remember reading people adding 32 GB cards to their Focus for 40 GB total.
    The challenges with the Focus are because of certain properties that are required, but aren't measured for consumer SD cards.
    01-21-2012 12:45 PM
  21. straitda's Avatar
    PG2G - now that I am taking a closer looks, I think you may be right. There is a notifications settings section in the Control Panel where you can set which apps can notify you. Then there is a notifications icon under settings where you can select wireless networks, power down, etc.

    I was under the impression that notifications would stack up there but it appears it just gives you the option to turn notifications on or off. I don't have any apps on this tablet yet that would notify me for anything as I do not receive SMS texts and there is no built in e-mail capability. So I spoke too soon. We'll see what comes when they release the beta at the end of February.

    I attached a couple of screen shots of the notification settings and on/off switch.
    aubreyq and snowmutt like this.
    01-21-2012 02:25 PM
  22. snowmutt's Avatar
    Thanks to everyone for posting. Some of these were my guesses as well, but I am happy most of you believe 1st Gen devices will get the update. That will be a huge deal. I am also fairly positive we will see larger memory storage. I wasn't really sure what the question was about the Bluetooth files, so I appreciate ya'll clearing that up.

    Guess we will just wait a few months and than see how the introduction goes. I sure will ask again as rumors start to bleed out.
    01-21-2012 05:41 PM
  23. Wobjoi's Avatar
    Taking a step back to the Tango update before Apollo. For me Tango update needs to do 3 things.

    1. Implement bug fixes.

    2. Implement new features for current (New) generation phones (LTE etc).

    3. Implement at least some new features. This is imporant as existing users need to feel that we are not getting forgotten and that an update brings some sort of value add. I don't expect a lot of new features or even major onces, but it should at least offer us something so that we get excited about it. I would expect Skype integration of some sort and maybe a few more small features like taking screen shots and a few more settings etc.

    Am pretty sure that 1 and 2 will be implemented. Hoping that 3 does too.

    As for Apollo. Not sure what to expect yet. I am hoping that MS give us more info about Tango at MWC in Feb. Would be good to get release dates and full list of whats changing.

    Dan.
    01-24-2012 04:46 AM
  24. Big Supes's Avatar
    Wasn't there a mention on the home page regarding customised Live Tiles for Tango?
    01-24-2012 05:01 AM
  25. aubreyq's Avatar
    Wasn't there a mention on the home page regarding customised Live Tiles for Tango?
    Yes. A website reported that Tango will support grouping of apps into folders. We'll have to wait and see whether or not that will really happen.
    01-24-2012 08:50 AM
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