1. bigkevbosky's Avatar
    Something I don't understand about this community is the sensitivity to criticism of WP7. Most of you are nice people who debate intelligently, but some of you respond to any criticism of WP7 with "well maybe you need to go find another OS". That seems to be opposite of what a lot of people here preach - that we're all a community, and that even if we disagree we can do it intelligently. Saying "go look somewhere else" is not intelligent.

    To the people who are so sensitive I ask you this - have you developer or interop unlocked your devices and loaded homebrew apps? Because some of them add common sense functionality that MS simply overlooked. For example, the newest app from Windows Phone Hacker which lets you disable the accelerometer. This SHOULD be in the settings menu. But now that I said it SHOULD be there, I'm sure someone is going to say "well its on Android, go there if you want it".

    WP7 is the best OS I've ever used, but it needs work. Anyone who thinks WP7 is "perfect" is obviously too easily pleased.
    01-23-2012 02:34 PM
  2. cgk's Avatar
    It's the same all over (WebOSnation for example) and is part of a well researched and understood dynamics about how groups come together and interact on the web - it's nothing in particular to do with this site or WP7.
    01-23-2012 02:38 PM
  3. thed's Avatar
    It's really mostly just a vocal minority that are overly sensitive. But I think you might be oversimplifying things.

    I think "go look for a different OS" can be good advice sometimes. If there are features that are really important to you but WP doesn't have them, then what else are you supposed to do? Also, if you really don't like something fundamental like Metro design, then you probably shouldn't stick with WP, since that won't be changing anytime soon.

    I think we all know that WP still needs more work. But not everyone can wait for that to happen.
    01-23-2012 02:51 PM
  4. mhans311's Avatar
    WP is a great os, but I agree that you can't say it is perfect. There are a lot of things I like about android that I wish could be implemented in one way or another in WP.

    Having said that, there are a few people on these forums who want WP to be just like the OS they came from. To them, sometimes you just have to say that they may be better suited by another phone. But this should not be the default answer to anyone who posts in here about what they think could improve in WP.

    Sent from my Trophy using Board Express
    01-23-2012 02:53 PM
  5. Reflexx's Avatar
    I think it depends on what the criticism is.

    If someone wants increased functionality, then that's understandable.

    If someone wants to change the very core design principles to make it more like Android or iOS, then they're probably better off using Android or iOS.

    It's not an unintelligent thing to say at all. Some people really are better off with Android or iOS. It's not a knock on someone if they are. They just have a different preference. And recognizing that isn't bad.

    I agree that saying, "They should have an option to disable the accelerometer." shouldn't get a response of, "Maybe you should get Android or iOS."

    But if someone says, "I think the home screen would work better with icons instead of live tiles." then they probably would be better off with Android or iOS.

    However, if someone says, "They should have the ability to disable the accelerometer. It's very important to me and this is outrageous! It's a key functionality that I need!" then it would be fine to say, "Since it's a key function that you NEED, and doesn't exist in WP, then you are better off with Android or iOS for now."
    azimutha and mprice86 like this.
    01-23-2012 02:53 PM
  6. HeyCori's Avatar
    Something I don't understand about this community is the sensitivity to criticism of WP7. Most of you are nice people who debate intelligently, but some of you respond to any criticism of WP7 with "well maybe you need to go find another OS". That seems to be opposite of what a lot of people here preach - that we're all a community, and that even if we disagree we can do it intelligently. Saying "go look somewhere else" is not intelligent.

    To the people who are so sensitive I ask you this - have you developer or interop unlocked your devices and loaded homebrew apps? Because some of them add common sense functionality that MS simply overlooked. For example, the newest app from Windows Phone Hacker which lets you disable the accelerometer. This SHOULD be in the settings menu. But now that I said it SHOULD be there, I'm sure someone is going to say "well its on Android, go there if you want it".

    WP7 is the best OS I've ever used, but it needs work. Anyone who thinks WP7 is "perfect" is obviously too easily pleased.
    You're under the assumption that every criticism is valid. When you say things like "the ability to disable the accelerometer should be there" you're stating your opinion as fact. Not having that particular option does not hamper the phone or its usability. It may annoy YOU but it's not a problem that needs to be fixed. And I'm not sure if that really annoys you I'm just using it as an example. There are valid suggestions for things that could improve the OS but two people could have the same idea with different approaches. Basically, even if a criticism is valid that doesn't mean that's the end of the story. The core problem is that people treat their opinion as fact and treat everyone's opinion on the matter as being inferior. That applies to people with valid/invalid criticisms AND people with valid/invalid defenses. The internet still hasn't grasped the concept of dealing with a different opinion.
    01-23-2012 03:28 PM
  7. Major's Avatar
    This is actually one of the more mature forums I've participated in. However, all it takes is a couple of bad apples to ruin it for everyone, which is where the moderators come into play.
    01-23-2012 03:30 PM
  8. bear_lx's Avatar
    It's the same all over (WebOSnation for example) and is part of a well researched and understood dynamics about how groups come together and interact on the web - it's nothing in particular to do with this site or WP7.
    +1, agreed
    01-23-2012 03:34 PM
  9. azimutha's Avatar
    Winning Guy provided some good examples. I do think, relating back to the OP, that it is good to be reminded that constructive criticism is a positive thing and that there is always room for improvement. I've dealt with product managers that are so arrogant over even the easiest fixes that it has cost their companies some significant business.
    01-23-2012 03:41 PM
  10. Major's Avatar
    As far as the fact vs opinion matter is concerned, does it really come into play when talking about design decisions for a mobile OS? Lots of features are judgement calls made by the WP7 team. The decisions were made based on the educated opinions of the design team. That they're continuously tweaking the OS is proof that not all of the original decisions turned out to be the right ones. Or, maybe they were the right decisions then, but no longer are.

    Maybe they didn't think that disabling the accelerometer would ever be needed, but as the user experience has evolved, so have their wants and needs.
    01-23-2012 03:47 PM
  11. bigkevbosky's Avatar
    You're under the assumption that every criticism is valid. When you say things like "the ability to disable the accelerometer should be there" you're stating your opinion as fact. Not having that particular option does not hamper the phone or its usability. It may annoy YOU but it's not a problem that needs to be fixed. And I'm not sure if that really annoys you I'm just using it as an example. There are valid suggestions for things that could improve the OS but two people could have the same idea with different approaches. Basically, even if a criticism is valid that doesn't mean that's the end of the story. The core problem is that people treat their opinion as fact and treat everyone's opinion on the matter as being inferior. That applies to people with valid/invalid criticisms AND people with valid/invalid defenses. The internet still hasn't grasped the concept of dealing with a different opinion.
    Ah but then the question becomes, when all other OS's have something integrated, then doesn't it become standard and expected? WebOS has it, Android has it, iOS has it. When your three biggest competitors have a feature, its expected that you have it. These are the types of criticisms I have about WP7.

    Now, not having rotation lock doesn't bug me much - but I'm sure it bugs SOMEONE out there. Stating that MS should include a feature that ALL its competitors have is more a common sense statement than an opinion. Its like saying all TVs SHOULD include a remote. Yes that is technically an opinion, but its of such common sense that nobody would rationally argue against it.

    Maybe they didn't think that disabling the accelerometer would ever be needed, but as the user experience has evolved, so have their wants and needs.
    Again, the iOS team, the webOS team, and the Android team all decided its something their users would want, but the WP7 team didn't think their users would want it? Huh? My assumption is that its more of an oversight than something they didn't think their users would want. And that's why I like having these discussions, to see what everyone's point of view is with this OS - especially since nobody I know in the "real world" actually uses a Windows phone.
    01-23-2012 03:55 PM
  12. jeremyshaw's Avatar
    Well, that depends, now, doesn't it? All is relative, strangely enough.


    At any rate, there is one example I can think of, and it more had to do with someone who always complained (but rarely constructive and very touchy when it comes to opinion), but still stuck around wpcentral, almost as if to bother wp7 users.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    01-23-2012 04:00 PM
  13. Reaction80's Avatar
    I guess there's kind of an aspect of stoic defense going on because of WP7 being so new and relatively unrecognized by the public. Being the third player in the immense saga that is iPhone vs Android comes with a certain level of cynicism thrown at us by both camps. I see it on a day to day basis as a WP7 owner and a worker in a 3UK store. So many people have never even heard of WP7 and many that have just kinda laugh it off as though it's a quaint little diversion but hardly worthy of any real thought (See the Robert Scoble thing) Some of the community get so sick of the OS being dismissed out of hand that when they see a legitimate comment phrased in a well thought out and balanced manner that contains criticism they jump on it like it's a personal affront. Seriously though, You find this behavior on MANY forums so it's nothing exclusive to this community.
    01-23-2012 04:04 PM
  14. Winterfang's Avatar
    That will happen to anyone that considers themselves a fan of anything Topic Creator.You just don't pay hundreds of dollars and lock yourself on 24 months contract on something you are not passionate about.
    01-23-2012 06:13 PM
  15. Dave Blake's Avatar
    This is an unnecessary thread.

    Closed.
    jfa1 likes this.
    01-23-2012 06:41 PM
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