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03-14-2012 02:16 PM
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  1. eric12341's Avatar
    "Microsoft reps claiming Windows Phone 8 definitely coming to second gen handsets, probably to first gen"

    Microsoft reps claiming Windows Phone 8 definitely coming to second gen handsets, probably to first gen | WMPoweruser

    Wonder if this will help stop all the "sky is falling" nonsense around here
    with reduced video calling functionality I kinda already knew that. Really the only difference between Gen 1 and 1.5 is the FFC.
    03-09-2012 12:50 PM
  2. Pronk's Avatar
    Mmm, it's a bit "this guy I know said this...", but better than nothing I suppose.
    ubizmo and aubreyq like this.
    03-09-2012 01:16 PM
  3. canesfan625's Avatar
    If these rumors were true it would ultimately mean that MS would be forking the OS which negates the point of the kernel swap.
    03-09-2012 04:57 PM
  4. dreamfly's Avatar
    Unless the hardware among all the generations from Mango to earlier are drastically different, I don't see a technical reason why they won't upgrade Gen 1 phones.

    I see two possibilities of the dancing answer from Myerson:

    1. He couldn't disclose any information at all because his direct commander had forbidden any disclosure, regardless of any benefit it might bring. We all know the top managements at MS are mostly clueless. Whoever leaked that Apollo video must have been punished like any leaker at Apple having Steve Jobs at the helm.

    2. There is a possible hardware change such that the new shared kernel won't be able to support the old hardware. Making old apps working in the new kernel requires just porting silverlight over, which MS will have to do for WinRT. Making the new kernel working for the old hardware will require writing a new set of lower level drivers. That's quite undesirable from a technical's point of view.

    But I don't see a drastic hardware change as there are really only a select few processors out there. Thus I expect all old hardware are upgradable to WP8. Of course, new hardware dependent functions won't able available for the old hardware. Tango would have addressed that issue already.

    Still, for MS not coming forth with an answer will hurt the sales of the Lumia. But for us wanting to get the best, especially the higher resolution and the external SD slot, we will wait and ditch our old phones regardless.
    03-09-2012 05:38 PM
  5. canesfan625's Avatar
    dreamfly, there was a point not long ago where Joe wouldn't even so much as say the word tango. With tango not being officially announced yet its a guarantee that Myerson will not be speaking to Apollo yet. You're correct about your kernel statement. The point of the change is to prevent having to fork the platform based on hardware. With windows 8 the older the hardware the greater the performance increase you see over the same setup running vista/7
    03-09-2012 05:57 PM
  6. lvalen91's Avatar
    IMO

    1st Gen Officially won't possibly see an update to WP8 since it already got 7.5 unless MS states otherwise... As for the Dev Community seeing as i would assume all 1st Gen are already hacked (HSPL) it's only a matter of time

    2nd Gen will see an official update to WP8 since they came out with 7.5 and by the time they announce WP8 they are only like a year or so old while 1st are 2years.

    Basically I would think that Microsoft has a 1step update... Your phone will be updated One version up from what it was released with.

    The only main hardware difference from 1st to 2nd gen was the camera and faster clock speed.. sure theres more underlying differences but those are the two notable changes.
    WP8 will integrate the camera deeply with Skype/WLive and maybe a face unlock (doubt it).

    But the thing about WP7 is its simplicity so theres no reason why all WP devices shouldn't get an update to future version 9+ (carriers will stop them for new profit). Right now the only thing that would require real processing power are games and maybe a possible form of Desktop/Console integration.

    Or maybe a new SoC from NVIDIA or TI that would have a big architectural change, but then again i would think they wouldn't throw Qualcom in the fire.

    :giggle: I like speculations :giggle:
    03-10-2012 02:52 AM
  7. canesfan625's Avatar
    1st Gen not getting Apollo because it got 7.5 makes no sense and unless they backtrack they promised all devices would be supported through 2 major updates. Also not all 1st Gen devices are hacked.
    Last edited by Canesfan625; 03-10-2012 at 09:02 AM.
    03-10-2012 08:56 AM
  8. petersun21's Avatar
    Read an article claiming wp8 will be available to all WP. The question is will carriers allow it.

    Sent from my PI39100 using Board Express
    03-10-2012 09:12 AM
  9. kenzibit's Avatar
    imo

    1st gen officially won't possibly see an update to wp8 since it already got 7.5 unless ms states otherwise... As for the dev community seeing as i would assume all 1st gen are already hacked (hspl) it's only a matter of time

    2nd gen will see an official update to wp8 since they came out with 7.5 and by the time they announce wp8 they are only like a year or so old while 1st are 2years.

    Basically i would think that microsoft has a 1step update... Your phone will be updated one version up from what it was released with.

    The only main hardware difference from 1st to 2nd gen was the camera and faster clock speed.. Sure theres more underlying differences but those are the two notable changes.
    Wp8 will integrate the camera deeply with skype/wlive and maybe a face unlock (doubt it).

    But the thing about wp7 is its simplicity so theres no reason why all wp devices shouldn't get an update to future version 9+ (carriers will stop them for new profit). Right now the only thing that would require real processing power are games and maybe a possible form of desktop/console integration.

    Or maybe a new soc from nvidia or ti that would have a big architectural change, but then again i would think they wouldn't throw qualcom in the fire.

    :giggle: I like speculations :giggle:

    All current Windows Phone devices (1st & 2nd gens) will get Apollo update corresponding to hardware.
    03-10-2012 10:09 AM
  10. canesfan625's Avatar
    Read an article claiming wp8 will be available to all WP. The question is will carriers allow it.

    Sent from my PI39100 using Board Express
    Carriers are contractually obligated to push MAJOR updates.
    03-10-2012 04:00 PM
  11. tdeljr's Avatar
    what about us poor venue pro owners?
    Dell stopped selling them, and tmobile don't support them.
    03-10-2012 10:31 PM
  12. eric12341's Avatar
    I wish people would stop referring to mango devices as 2nd Gen, they are Gen 1.5
    03-11-2012 12:33 PM
  13. Dave Blake's Avatar
    I wish people would stop referring to mango devices as 2nd Gen, they are Gen 1.5
    I think the reason people call them Gen 2 isn because of the OS but because of the second generation Qualcom processor so it's the hardware upgrade not the Mango.
    03-11-2012 01:12 PM
  14. eric12341's Avatar
    then it's S1 vs S2 devices in that case.
    03-11-2012 04:30 PM
  15. sentimentGX4's Avatar
    I think the reason people call them Gen 2 isn because of the OS but because of the second generation Qualcom processor so it's the hardware upgrade not the Mango.
    The second generation processor is still a Scorpion. -.-

    Next Gen processors for iOS or Android use completely different architectures. ARM Cortex A8 to A9 and, now, A15.
    03-11-2012 05:52 PM
  16. jfa1's Avatar
    Mmm, it's a bit "this guy I know said this...", but better than nothing I suppose.
    And its a two edge sword cutting both ways. Rumors and speculation abound and many are riled up because they assume rightly ow rongly the woirst both about the upfrade from Mango to Tango to Apollo and beyond and the launch datre for this device or that device i.e the 900 and all they are doing is working themselves towards a CAP LOCKS diatribe rant of epic proportions over something they have absolutely no control over. If you want to do so its your right I personally have taken care of any possibility of doiung so by letting my daughter use my upfrade to get a new Iphone 4s as her 4 GS has cratered. So my upgrade will now not arrive until May 6, 2012. Hoipefully then a the 900 will have launched and b) the update toi Apollo situation will be clearer and c) we will have moved on to whining about other things such as whyt isnt Apollo here already or maybe we will just be calmly speculating about such matters. I for hope its the latter!
    03-11-2012 05:59 PM
  17. TexZenFool's Avatar
    The planned life of a phone is 2 years. Just look at the carriers 2 year contract lock-ins before an upgrade for proof. So I would hope that any new phone I buy receives OS updates during most of that lifetime. Notice I said "most", not "all".

    Since Tango is some 6 months away I would expect it to run on my Focus S that I bought in December. If WP8 is 9-12 more months after that I'm not counting on it. By then I'll be wanting to upgrade to the latest & greatest hardware anyway.

    Sent from my SGH-i937 using Board Express
    03-11-2012 06:27 PM
  18. canesfan625's Avatar
    The planned life of a phone is 2 years. Just look at the carriers 2 year contract lock-ins before an upgrade for proof. So I would hope that any new phone I buy receives OS updates during most of that lifetime. Notice I said "most", not "all".

    Since Tango is some 6 months away I would expect it to run on my Focus S that I bought in December. If WP8 is 9-12 more months after that I'm not counting on it. By then I'll be wanting to upgrade to the latest & greatest hardware anyway.

    Sent from my SGH-i937 using Board Express
    People mostly don't get this because of the hoopla over being able to veto some updates. The confusion lies in that it's only the ability to veto minor updates. You are correct and it was stated in this thread earlier that they promised two major updates per device and carriers are contractually obligated to push major updates.

    From now on this should be callelld the android effect.
    03-12-2012 08:59 AM
  19. 1jaxstate1's Avatar
    When you bought the phone doesn't really correspond with when the phone was released. If I get a Focus S in July, should I expected major upgrades from the time I bought my phone? No.
    The planned life of a phone is 2 years. Just look at the carriers 2 year contract lock-ins before an upgrade for proof. So I would hope that any new phone I buy receives OS updates during most of that lifetime. Notice I said "most", not "all".

    Since Tango is some 6 months away I would expect it to run on my Focus S that I bought in December. If WP8 is 9-12 more months after that I'm not counting on it. By then I'll be wanting to upgrade to the latest & greatest hardware anyway.

    Sent from my SGH-i937 using Board Express
    03-12-2012 09:56 AM
  20. selfcreation's Avatar
    The second generation processor is still a Scorpion. -.-

    Next Gen processors for iOS or Android use completely different architectures. ARM Cortex A8 to A9 and, now, A15.
    2end Gen have the Gyro and FFC ,

    I thinks that's pretty much the ONLY differents , maybe more ROM size as well. but cant confirm that,.
    03-12-2012 10:00 AM
  21. canesfan625's Avatar
    When you bought the phone doesn't really correspond with when the phone was released. If I get a Focus S in July, should I expected major upgrades from the time I bought my phone? No.
    what?
    03-12-2012 11:37 AM
  22. sentimentGX4's Avatar
    If I get a Focus S in July, should I expected major upgrades from the time I bought my phone? No.
    You can't count 2 years immediately from the launch date. That makes no sense because most consumers don't buy the device the day it's launched! The device is on sale for a lot longer than that.

    It's not unreasonable to ask an OEM/Microsoft to cover a device for 2 years and 3 months, to cover a reasonable term for when a device will likely be purchased. Actually, even asking for 2 years and 6 months wouldn't be too much; but, as we all know, if your name isn't Apple, there's no way we could ever expect any corporation to pull that off. Only through the magic of Apple. =/
    03-12-2012 12:41 PM
  23. canesfan625's Avatar
    You can't count 2 years immediately from the launch date. That makes no sense because most consumers don't buy the device the day it's launched! The device is on sale for a lot longer than that.

    It's not unreasonable to ask an OEM/Microsoft to cover a device for 2 years and 3 months, to cover a reasonable term for when a device will likely be purchased. Actually, even asking for 2 years and 6 months wouldn't be too much; but, as we all know, if your name isn't Apple, there's no way we could ever expect any corporation to pull that off. Only through the magic of Apple. =/
    Microsoft will likely go by what version the device ships with.
    03-12-2012 05:34 PM
  24. selfcreation's Avatar
    hes just comparing it to Androids 6months of fragmentation , 6 months after release Android phones ( most of them ) cant be upgraded!

    but it has NOTHING to do with period of time! its 100% related to the RTM/OEM adding special things that prevent Upgrades. ( witch is a easy work around for android , just flash your ROM with the new one from XDA and your good to go, lol )

    when the GS1 came out ( on day 1 ) we already knew that it wasn't getting ice cream sandwich,

    I think that's what he meant :P


    problem with that is that we know NOTHING about WP8! and this is 7 page argument about a topic that has no merit.
    03-12-2012 05:45 PM
  25. jfa1's Avatar
    Let's just say the topic is premature at best!
    03-12-2012 09:10 PM
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