05-09-2012 01:19 PM
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  1. tekhna's Avatar
    Holy crap people, stick with the original thread, which was an interesting and constructive understanding of the market and WP7. This thread was one of the only signs of intelligent life I've seen around here, don't mess it up!
    nizzon and Nakazul like this.
    04-26-2012 10:01 AM
  2. BackToAndroid's Avatar
    well WP growth are UP so obviously they are doign something right .. and its continuing to grow. ...

    and MS does listen to people like you * we put people first*

    its just that you need to make sens for them to really listen. .. they herd you ... then ignored you . lol

    then did what was logical . and look where its heading.. UP UP UP!

    you have the right to not like WP..... we just dont care .. and frankly getting sick of seeing 10 threads a day about negative WP comments.... specially when its not constructive---> Customer Feedback for Windows Phone
    The numbers are growing (at least in the UK) because they have drastically reduced the price of the lumia 710. That's the reason I bought one. Now I've satisfied my curiosity, this will very likely be the last Windows phone I ever buy. I'll give it another try at WP11... maybe.
    04-26-2012 10:03 AM
  3. BackToAndroid's Avatar
    Holy crap people, stick with the original thread, which was an interesting and constructive understanding of the market and WP7. This thread was one of the only signs of intelligent life I've seen around here, don't mess it up!
    Your right. I'm off. Carry on.
    04-26-2012 10:05 AM
  4. bear_lx's Avatar
    honestly we sorta do have a list of things that WP needs

    more or less:

    - notification center
    - more colors ( just for more of a custom feel i guess)
    - custom ring tunes ( for each number/txt )
    - more apps... w/e
    - BT file transfers.
    - mass storage option ( sorta useless if you know the how to use your phone properly. cause you have all the same function as mass storage )
    - save pics from bing search


    every thing else ( unless i missed one or 2 little things ) is just personal preference or people wasting air.
    you can save pucs from bing search... 2 ways... first actually go to bing.com on the browser, not by clicking the seach button. or if you like to use the search button, when you search an image , click on the hyperlink below image and that will bring up the url. in which case you can long press and save to phone.
    04-26-2012 10:07 AM
  5. tekhna's Avatar
    Your right. I'm off. Carry on.
    It's cool, I've been accused of being an Android troll too, by virtue of offering constructive criticism of WP7, but this thread is actually interesting and useful!
    Nakazul likes this.
    04-26-2012 10:08 AM
  6. avenged24's Avatar
    The biggest problem in my area seems to be people having their mind set on an iphone before they even walk into the store. I was at my local Telus store the other day and asked the sales rep how they were doing with the Lumia 800, he said it was selling as well as expected but when someone walks in wanting an iphone, there's no talking them out of it.
    04-26-2012 10:20 AM
  7. selfcreation's Avatar


    OR



    this is EXACTLY what these threads remind me of.....i just wish they made one for WP... wait , i got time to waste.. LOL!~
    04-26-2012 10:24 AM
  8. jbjtkbw007's Avatar
    When I was in wireless sales, rule #1 is if someone walks in asking about an iPhone, sell it to them. They're already jaded, on the other hand, if someone just wants an upgrade/new act, this is the opportunity. I tell you, this is where the money is made and reps pushed Android. On VZW, you make no money selling an iPhone. When you are 100% commission, this matters. You push the midrange Android phone because that's where the money is. High end Android phones are ok margins, but the mid tier was a sweet spot.

    Now....i left because I couldn't do that. I'm too honest and I was more about educating the customer. Tell them the good and bad about a device. Let them choose. Here, we are finally seeing a worthy option to be that third platform ( cause it sure ain't BB anymore) so this is where differentiation is needed. I'd love to be an AT&T rep right now. I'd be WP7 phones all day. Know the product, the rest is easy, unless its your typical iPhone snob. You know who you are.
    04-26-2012 10:53 AM
  9. selfcreation's Avatar
    When I was in wireless sales, rule #1 is if someone walks in asking about an iPhone, sell it to them. They're already jaded, on the other hand, if someone just wants an upgrade/new act, this is the opportunity. I tell you, this is where the money is made and reps pushed Android. On VZW, you make no money selling an iPhone. When you are 100% commission, this matters. You push the midrange Android phone because that's where the money is. High end Android phones are ok margins, but the mid tier was a sweet spot.

    Now....i left because I couldn't do that. I'm too honest and I was more about educating the customer. Tell them the good and bad about a device. Let them choose. Here, we are finally seeing a worthy option to be that third platform ( cause it sure ain't BB anymore) so this is where differentiation is needed. I'd love to be an AT&T rep right now. I'd be WP7 phones all day. Know the product, the rest is easy, unless its your typical iPhone snob. You know who you are.
    i use to be in the same boat , id did 2 years in a store ( for BELL ) and when people came in looking for Iphones i always re-directed them to WM or Android ... Iphone is just a glorified app launcher... and honestly i would sale SOOO MANY WM phones .. actually probably the only one selling them lol.

    but its dangerous to push people away from the phone they want. but if you have strong points witch WP has .. then you can do it.

    honestly its easy to push any phones... clients are ignorant... here at BELL we got the Iphone 1 year after every one else... i was actually pushing a SAMSUNG INSTINCT ( its not even a Smartphone lol ) and i was telling client it was the competitor to Iphone and they just eat it up!!

    like selling ice to an Eskimo .. or a extended warranty on a life warranty unit.. LOL.

    its ALL about how you position it.. and honestly I blame sale reps for 90% of WP sales... so if its not doing good blame them.
    04-26-2012 11:39 AM
  10. jbjtkbw007's Avatar
    Where we come into play on the forums is to provide the researcher with information they can use to help prevent some of that. What takes away are the threads that perpetuate the iPhone/Android can so this and WP7 can't. That negativity (yes NEGATIVITY) is what's hurting on here. Go to those platforms if that's what you want. M$ isn't trying to copy them. They want to so things another way, and in many cases, a better way than the other guys. For people to believe that everything they need to so takes an app is the most ridiculous way to sell a product, but they've succeeded and done well at it. I firmly believe that you sell a product that does what you need it to do with minimal app support (make calls, surf the net, update social networks, share photos, etc), then you have a better way of reaching people. I think M$ is on that track. That's why I'm here.
    selfcreation likes this.
    04-26-2012 11:50 AM
  11. Mitlov's Avatar
    I'm seriously not trolling. I know many people are satisfied with their phones, but personally speaking; I'm bored stiff with the device (3 weeks in.)
    You've had the device three weeks. Two weeks ago, you created a user account named "Back to Android." By my math, you created a user account with the name "back to Android" roughly a week after buying a Windows Phone. There's not a carrier in the country who wouldn't let you swap for an Android phone one week in.

    None of this smells right to me.
    socialcarpet likes this.
    04-26-2012 12:10 PM
  12. cp2_4eva's Avatar
    I don't understand why (well, actually I do) people are arguing on both sides of this coin. I wish the best for M$, but it really boils down to your needs and lifestyle. You know, get the phone that makes YOU happy. WP devices aren't REALLY meant to be a true computer in your hand. It's a mobile social companion of sorts. If this doesn't do it for you, then you move on and get that other phone that you wish could replace your laptop/desktop computer. People want phones to do so much, but when some phones get to do that much, then thats where you start to see the legs of the system give out and get all wobbly. Android offers ALOT, but there is only so much weight it can hold. It's a flawed fragmented system, but it keeps on selling. They could have all the reboots in the world and some people with still swear by it.

    Thing is, it's not really cheap to make a change in OS and phones. So people aren't risking their hard earned stacks on what they don't know...which is WP7. Give it some time and keep pushing the agenda and more people will follow. Some people aren't power users and just want something basic and nice looking. My mom is one of those. my dad on the other hand considers himself a poweruser....which he isn't. I get questions from him all the time about his android and stuff. Had to school him a few times. lol.

    WP7 as of now do the basic things pretty nicely for the most part. WP8 MIGHT be the beast that the outsiders might be looking for. The release of the under spec phones almost seems like a beta test itself to see how many people's attention they can get before getting to the real thing they want to release. Thats just my conspiracy theory though. lol.
    04-26-2012 12:33 PM
  13. based_graham's Avatar
    The biggest problem in my area seems to be people having their mind set on an iphone before they even walk into the store. I was at my local Telus store the other day and asked the sales rep how they were doing with the Lumia 800, he said it was selling as well as expected but when someone walks in wanting an iphone, there's no talking them out of it.
    I can easily talk somebody out of an iPhone it all depends on what ecosystem they are currently using.
    04-26-2012 01:20 PM
  14. tk-093's Avatar
    I can answer the question at hand.
    (1) Android and iOS were the big two when WP launched and it was always going to be a uphill struggle

    (2) AT&T was pimping the iPhone hard while Verizon was pimping Droid hard. Outside of us powers users who hang out in forums and know the good/bad/ugly of smartphones, the majority of smartphone buyers the last few years are, well, we will call them the general public. (I'll call them plebes from here on out.) The plebes don't know anything about smartphones other then what they get bombarded with on TV which has been iPhone or Droid. I've always been curious about if the iPhone went to ATT and Verizon at the same time, what would the Android landscape look like? Without Verizon pimping the **** out of the Droid line, would we all be stuck using iPhones or Blackberrys? :)

    Also getting the Trophy on VZW way late and not getting anything new is not good.

    (3) It was mentioned already, but because the iPod was pretty much THE mp3 player, everybody already had iTunes which made is so easy to sell folks the iPhone. The plebes know iTunes and don't want to learn anything new. Forcing Windows Phone to sync to Zune instead of using someting like Media Player which everybody already had, was a mistake even though I love the Zune software.

    (4) Apps, apps, apps. This is a big one for the plebes too. Words with Friends, Draw Something, Angry Birds Space... These are things the plebes see their friends playing and why would they buy a device that they can't play games with their friends? Having substitute games is no way the same.

    (5) I don't know what type of impact this has, but it does effect me. The Enterprise support for WP7 was rotten and with 7.5 it is only slightly better. Lack of device encryption eliminates it for any company that has that as a requirement, which is alot.
    Nakazul likes this.
    04-26-2012 02:15 PM
  15. socialcarpet's Avatar
    I will sum-up concisely why I dislike Windows phones:

    They are bland, boring and lack basic functionality.

    I'm seriously not trolling. I know many people are satisfied with their phones, but personally speaking; I'm bored stiff with the device (3 weeks in.)
    You joined a Windows Phone forum with the name "Back to Android" and you dislike Windows Phone.... but you're not trolling?
    tk-093, vantil, willied and 1 others like this.
    04-26-2012 02:16 PM
  16. BackToAndroid's Avatar
    You've had the device three weeks. Two weeks ago, you created a user account named "Back to Android." By my math, you created a user account with the name "back to Android" roughly a week after buying a Windows Phone. There's not a carrier in the country who wouldn't let you swap for an Android phone one week in.

    None of this smells right to me.
    I bought my phone "sim free" from a "Carphone Warehouse" store. It's unbranded and unlocked. Three weeks is approximate, I was responding in haste. I could have taken it back, but there's essentially nothing wrong with the phone and I don't like dishonesty.

    With hindsight, I should have chosen a less provocative username, but I was angry when I first signed-up, so there you have it.

    I'll freely admit that Android is imperfect, has idiosyncrasies and can be flaky, but it's the closest thing to having full pc functionality in my pocket.

    Touchscreen phones are above all, fun and novel gadgets. Playing around with these phones is part of the user experience, that's why the iphone won so many hearts; it's beautiful, fluid, responsive and stylish. Personally, I don't like IOS because of the walled-garden approach of Apple. I get no enjoyment from using my Lumia.

    The only positive thing about my phone is the GPS performance. It's way better than my old Android, but then, is that a virtue of the OS, or the hardware?

    I don't mean to disrupt threads with negativity, but the topic at hand is an important one and all opinions should be considered.
    Nakazul likes this.
    04-26-2012 02:25 PM
  17. blackhawksfan75's Avatar
    So here I am a customer with a Bold 9900 with company Y looking to switch and go with company X. I have pretty good knowledge of all the ecosystems on the market, iOS, Android, WP7, and BBOS. What kind of sales tactic would you use on a customer such as myself who is still undecided by which smartphone to get.

    I tell you what my main focus areas are, I have an iMac at home, enjoy some social networking, apps (mainly for entertainment, sports, and gaming), music, emails, and overall good quality phone.

    Now, I explain the downfalls of each device I owned. Apple iPhone 3/4, lots of apps no doubt, but can be very buggy. The dropped calls, the instability as I have to reset the phone on numerous occasions. I may have ended up with a lemon but my carrier wouldn't acknowledge that. The Android I had was an Xperia X10 I found it to be not very user friendly, the battery life was terrible and did not sync with iTunes very well always crashed on me. Blackberry BB9900, I absolutely love the QWERTY physical keyboard as well as the notification system, but my patience is wearing thin due to the uncertainty surrounding RIM and App developers dropping off like flies for other platforms.
    04-26-2012 02:38 PM
  18. Mitlov's Avatar
    So here I am a customer with a Bold 9900 with company Y looking to switch and go with company X. I have pretty good knowledge of all the ecosystems on the market, iOS, Android, WP7, and BBOS. What kind of sales tactic would you use on a customer such as myself who is still undecided by which smartphone to get.

    I tell you what my main focus areas are, I have an iMac at home, enjoy some social networking, apps (mainly for entertainment, sports, and gaming), music, emails, and overall good quality phone.

    Now, I explain the downfalls of each device I owned. Apple iPhone 3/4, lots of apps no doubt, but can be very buggy. The dropped calls, the instability as I have to reset the phone on numerous occasions. I may have ended up with a lemon but my carrier wouldn't acknowledge that. The Android I had was an Xperia X10 I found it to be not very user friendly, the battery life was terrible and did not sync with iTunes very well always crashed on me. Blackberry BB9900, I absolutely love the QWERTY physical keyboard as well as the notification system, but my patience is wearing thin due to the uncertainty surrounding RIM and App developers dropping off like flies for other platforms.
    I would point out that WP7.5 has:

    (1) very good integrated social networking; show how easy it is to upload a photo to facebook.

    (2) rock-solid stability and smoothness (ironically, it's more comparable to Apple OSX for desktops than the more-versatile-but-less-refined Windows desktop OS).

    (3) unlike RIM, which is small and declining, WP has the fastest-growing app store of anyone. It's small but growing momentum rapidly, not small but declining.
    04-26-2012 03:20 PM
  19. socialcarpet's Avatar
    With hindsight, I should have chosen a less provocative username, but I was angry when I first signed-up, so there you have it....I get no enjoyment from using my Lumia...I don't mean to disrupt threads with negativity...
    Again, I have to ask, why are you here?

    You're not looking to be convinced of the merits of Windows Phone. You want to go back to Android. You don't get any enjoyment from your Lumia.

    Did you actually believe that people on a Windows Phone enthusiast forum would want to hear what you have to say about how much Windows Phone sucks and how you can't wait to go back to Android?

    Or are you one of those complainers that thinks Microsoft is hanging on your every word on the forum and you are contributing "constructive criticism" that Microsoft will use to improve future phones?

    Either way, doesn't make much sense at all for you to post here unless all your intent is to troll.

    It's that simple.

    We can't change the things you don't like about your Lumia. You are allowed to return it even if it's not technically malfunctioning. You didn't do enough research into Windows Phone before you bought one. That's no one's fault but your own. Now you want to come here and crap all over a forum for people who like Windows Phone because you're not a savvy consumer?

    If you have nothing to contribute, and clearly you don't, why not go find an Android forum to post on and why on earth would you keep a phone you so clearly don't care for?

    Someone here might even be willing to buy your Lumia from you, if you don't want to return it for whatever reason. Have you considered that?

    Go buy an Android. Go join and Android forum and be happy and let us be happy too.
    04-26-2012 03:33 PM
  20. blackhawksfan75's Avatar
    I would point out that WP7.5 has:

    (1) very good integrated social networking; show how easy it is to upload a photo to facebook.

    (2) rock-solid stability and smoothness (ironically, it's more comparable to Apple OSX for desktops than the more-versatile-but-less-refined Windows desktop OS).

    (3) unlike RIM, which is small and declining, WP has the fastest-growing app store of anyone. It's small but growing momentum rapidly, not small but declining.
    Two more things: Does the camera have auto-focus? Because that is one of my biggest pet peeves with the Bold 9900 which makes it very difficult for up close photo shots. Secondly, how compatible is it with a mac computer? Is there a desktop client that I can download?
    04-26-2012 03:40 PM
  21. selfcreation's Avatar
    With hindsight, I should have chosen a less provocative username, but I was angry when I first signed-up, so there you have it....I get no enjoyment from using my Lumia...I don't mean to disrupt threads with negativity...

    Ok , so you got MAD at WP because it dint meet your personal preference ( honestly that's your own fault, you should have done research first...)

    second: even if the phone isnt defective you can bring it back its called: BUYERS REMORSE!!


    and third.... you got MAD so decided to come not only TROLL the forums with USELESS RENTs but also create a TROLLER USERNAME!??

    OOOK so.... your lucky your not getting banned.
    04-26-2012 03:45 PM
  22. hwalker84's Avatar
    It's a tough sell because its called a "WINDOWS" Phone. The Windows brand shouldn't be anywhere near this OS.

    I pulled out my White Lumia the other day and someone asked what it was. When I told him it ran Windows Phone 7 they responded by saying "Windows mobile is the worst piece of **** i've ever used" "I'd never touch that device and can't believe you would". The brand damage is done. I explained that it has nothing to do with the old windows mobile but that still didn't matter. This isn't the first time I've had this reaction with various people.

    From the start this should've been called Metro or something else creative.
    04-26-2012 03:52 PM
  23. sting7k's Avatar
    Yeah, I agree, I've heard all that, but it doesn't really worry me.

    To be honest, while I proudly display my device and even reccomend others to the platform, I can't really push it as hard as I'd like to.

    The main problem right now is that the platform is just immature. It is very stable, silky smooth, and has a ton of potential, but right now, it's just not caught up with iPhone and Droid as far as what's possible to do on these phones.

    The biggest issue by far is the lack of 3rd party apps. However, this, I'm not really worried about. People are buying these phones, and as the platform continues to grow, apps will be developed. Windows 8 will be a major turning point, because all of the sudden, Windows phones will have specs which are just as good if not better than their iPhone and Droid counterparts. Not to mention it will have the same silky smooth UI that blows Droid and iPhone out of the water. Nokia will make a superior phone to both Apple and whatever the myriad of Droid vendors can come out with. High res screens, multi core, baked in Skype integration, etc. is all on the way, and that will certainly attract a lot of people. It will just snowball from there as people realize that Droid may not be the best #2 after the iPhone.

    What I'm a little bit concerned about right now are the little details that are bothering me.

    For example:

    -Why can't we choose custom colors for our tiles? The only color I really like is the "blue". But I'd really like to have a gray. I can't comprehend why an option like this was left out, and why we're only left with about 7 colors to choose from, the majority of them ugly.
    -Why can't we resize our tiles? I'd honestly prefer them to be maybe 3/4 the size that they are now. Or maybe 3 to a row instead of 2 to a row.
    -Can't choose pictures that show up on the pictures tile. So no naked pictures of that chick I tagged last night because I'm afraid they'll show up on the pictures tile randomly.
    -Why can't we have the option to keep Wi-Fi connected when the phone is sleeping? Getting very sick of waiting 8 seconds for WiFi to reconnect when I wake up the phone.
    -Maps could use a huge update. No option to turn on satellite mode, have to zoom in real close.
    -Put a damn forward and back button on internet explorer. Dumbest idea to combine the phones back button with IE back button. Also, IE can have sluggish performance.
    -Multi tasking is just not what it should be. Can't close out different tabs without going into them. So if I want to close out of everything, I have to hit the back button 50 times? Clumsy. Also, it's not true multitasking. Every time I switch apps the things reloads.
    -What if I want to separate my FB contacts from my true contacts? Or have Facebook integration, but not add the contacts to my contact "list". I do think there should be a "phonebook" that's separate from "people". I mean, a lot of people have greater than 1000 friends, I have about 500, these are people I don't need to see when I am trying to find a phone number. I might call 30-40 people regularly. It would be awesome if I could have a phonebook with only those people in it, separate from the "people hub". I could only imagine how annoying it would be with over 1000 Facebook friends.
    -FB Integration. Could be VASTLY improved. It's nice now but not what it could/should be.
    -The list of apps is just not a good way to display them. Let us create our own folders and put apps in them.
    -Speaking of folders, let the phone act as a USB device that we can manage data on!

    These are just a FEW of the items I've come across. Like I said, I love the OS and I'm glad I'm using it in its infancy. Excited to see where it goes from here. But I'm definetely not worried about the future of this platform. It's just too good to have consumers continue to ignore it forever. The "Windows" stigma will dissapear, if I recall Apple used to have a pretty lousy stigma for a long, long time.
    You can turn on sat. view, on maps hit the three dots at the bottom right to bring up settings then tap "aerial view on".

    You also can filter facebook contacts out of your contacts list. Go to settings, people, filter contacts list and you can set to not display facebook in your contacts but still have it integrated.
    04-26-2012 04:04 PM
  24. Mitlov's Avatar
    Two more things: Does the camera have auto-focus? Because that is one of my biggest pet peeves with the Bold 9900 which makes it very difficult for up close photo shots. Secondly, how compatible is it with a mac computer? Is there a desktop client that I can download?
    (1) Yes. Unlike Android, all WP phones have a physical camera button. Like a point-and-shoot camera, you push down halfway to autofocus, all the way to take the shot.

    In full disclosure, the autofocus on my HTC 7 Pro (an older, cheap Windows Phone) is annoyingly slow and makes it a bit hard to get action shots. However, I think it's much faster and better on newer or higher-end Windows Phones.

    (2) Microsoft distributes the Windows Phone 7 Connector app for free on the Apple app store. I've personally never used it, since my main computer is a Vaio, but my understanding is that you can use it to download updates to your phone, transfer music from iTunes, etc.
    04-26-2012 04:24 PM
  25. based_graham's Avatar
    It's a tough sell because its called a "WINDOWS" Phone. The Windows brand shouldn't be anywhere near this OS.

    I pulled out my White Lumia the other day and someone asked what it was. When I told him it ran Windows Phone 7 they responded by saying "Windows mobile is the worst piece of **** i've ever used" "I'd never touch that device and can't believe you would". The brand damage is done. I explained that it has nothing to do with the old windows mobile but that still didn't matter. This isn't the first time I've had this reaction with various people.

    From the start this should've been called Metro or something else creative.
    No it should be Windows because that's Microsofts bread and butter. Every OS has a ****ty revision when ppl respond to oh Windows Mobile I quickly mention its not its totally different. I show them tiles hubs and the speed and ppl are quick to jump the bandwagon.
    04-26-2012 04:32 PM
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