Is Nokia causing fragmentation on Windows Phone with their exclusive apps? YES

[mkr10001]

You see my brother, Nokia was no where when I (we all) bought our HTCs, Samsungs and LGs. All was perfect then, till they came and claiming everything their own. I love the Lumia line, bought the Lumia 800 for my Girlfriend but just don't like the way they treating the rest of us. Planning on buying the Lumia 1000 with WP8 and the HTC HD8 (Rumored) lol... I just love this discussions

They aren't claiming everything their own. They are developing apps for themselves.....

 

[sentimentGX4]

Have you seen any ads for your device? No? Nokia are the ones doing the work to generate the buzz. How much sense does it make to generate press and mindshare for your competitors?

Now that I think of it, it is untrue that HTC never promoted Windows Phone. I definitely recall commercials for the HTC Surround and, maybe, the original Titan. You're making it sound like HTC gave WP 0 support and that is untrue.

 

[keyboardP]

Bit late to this debate, but some interesting points being raised. I'll copy/paste what I wrote on Reddit regarding the article.

Firstly, I'd prefer it if the apps were available across all WP devices and not just limited to Nokia. But I look at it like this. I'd rather see the Windows Phone platform grow and become a third horse in the race. That requires apps and developers to get on board. Samsung and HTC don't see WP to be a worthwhile endeavor yet so they didn't bother to do anything like this in the 1.5 years they had. Nokia, within their 6 months, has pushed WP more than the other OEMs combined.

Nokia is in a much worse financial position than the other OEMs and, in order to survive, they're going to have to increase revenue; that means differentiators (which is not fragmentation) such as exclusive titles. Samsung and HTC can recycle their Android phones and manufacturing processes easily and slap WP on to it - they have high-end devices sorted with their economies of scale. Nokia can't and they have to differentiate in other ways. I'd rather see Nokia in the marketplace pushing WP than having them bow out and have Samsung/HTC slightly push their WP phones when most of their focus is on Android. Ultimately, that will just end in the demise of WP as a platform and I'd rather not see that.

As for the app exclusivity, at least it's timed. Sure, some are extended (12 months) but that simply means that other app developers can compete by using that as an incentive to get people to download their app on their non-Lumia phones. By introducing more developers and apps to the WP platform, it means that there can be more apps within the ecosystem from the get go. Look at Rovio, for example, who now have a team dedicated to bringing Angry Birds to WP. Hopefully this means WP doesn't have to wait a few months after the iOS/Android versions. I know I'd prefer that with time-limited exclusivity than not having the app in the WP ecosystem at all.

 

[cj-m]

The more apps for WP7.5 and WP8 the better. I don't care if it is HTC/MS/Nokia/Developers/whoever...the more apps, the better the selection and variety, the better it is for all of us. It is a win/win.

 

[N8ter]

Well Samsung is starting their own Music store among other things so I expect they will have apps for their ecosystem on WP7 soon enough. They're already bringing ChatOn to WP7.

I'm eager to see how that works, especially if their services end up price-competitive with Zune Store, Lol.

All OEMs are doing it. The same way HTC and Nokia have their own Navigation Solutions, among other things.

 

[Squatting Hen]

I don't care about Nokia, HTC or Samsung created apps, they can have those as exclusives. The ones I do not think should be exclusive are the third party apps. It seems like a lot of these posts do not realize that is what this thread is about.

You should not have to buy a specific brand in order to have thrid party apps.

 

[keyboardP]

I don't care about Nokia, HTC or Samsung created apps, they can have those as exclusives. The ones I do not think should be exclusive are the third party apps. It seems like a lot of these posts do not realize that is what this thread is about.

You should not have to buy a specific brand in order to have thrid party apps.

The alternative may be having none of those third party apps on the ecosystem at all. I'd prefer having a time-limited version within the ecosystem, which will then become available to others (albeit with some having very long dates). It would also mean prospective buyers can see that the app is available for WP and purchase a Lumia, instead of an Android or iOS device. Alternate is to keep these third party developers away with a clause saying "all OEMs or nothing". MS isn't in a position to do that and WP isn't in a position to be arrogant with what apps it can receive.

These third party companies aren't new startups (ESPN, PayPal, Rovio etc...). They've been established before Windows Phone was released. They've had the opportunity to develop for WP for 1.5 years. The fact that Nokia are funding it just means that they'll develop for the ecosystem. The price? Temporary lack of apps for other OEMs. No one likes third party exclusivity, but I'd be willing to sacrifice the lack of a few apps in order to help the platform grow.

 

[lesd777]

sorry but its up to the other manufactures to step it up. I'm happy to see Nokia setting the bar.

 

[steve70]

I agree, snooze you loose. Anyone else could have stepped up. I know people who love their Nokia and their exclusive apps but miss "attentive phone" ect. To me it's give and take. Heck, I was on Sprint since '99 and only had 1 choice. I'm happy to see things growing and progressing forward. Every manufacturer or provider has their own exclusive apps. Why should Nokia be different?

 

[rockstarzzz]

I agree, snooze you loose. Anyone else could have stepped up. I know people who love their Nokia and their exclusive apps but miss "attentive phone" ect. To me it's give and take. Heck, I was on Sprint since '99 and only had 1 choice. I'm happy to see things growing and progressing forward. Every manufacturer or provider has their own exclusive apps. Why should Nokia be different?

+1

As much as I am on the verge of falling for Nokia completely, I somehow cannot sell and give up my Titan. That is purely because of HTC exclusives like attentive phone, pocket mode and sound enhancement! So it is fair for Nokia to try harder and lure me with 3rd party apps.

I personally think 5-6 top-notch third party time limited exclusive apps should not cause any fuss at all for the rest. If you are ready to give up on OS and bash Nokia for those 5-6 time limited apps, you never loved the other mega qualities and apps on the OS.

 

[smapor]

For WP you want this to happen. If Nokia can sell millions of their units, it will only boost your options for other OEM.

If we continue to see this(just an example)
300,000-HTC
200,000-Samsung
500,000-Nokia

It doesn't bode well for any OEM, because sales are spreadout among a small market.

If Nokia can start doing million+, those other OEMS will finally take it seriously.

If you love WP7, you want Nokia to succeed to drive competition.

 

[freestaterocker]

Now that I think of it, it is untrue that HTC never promoted Windows Phone. I definitely recall commercials for the HTC Surround and, maybe, the original Titan. You're making it sound like HTC gave WP 0 support and that is untrue.

But have you seen any special promotion for the current device? I've only seen the Jim Gaffigan commercials. They're good, but I didn't see them on TV. I had to hear about them and find them myself on YouTube.

 

[socialcarpet]

Yep, terrible idea. Lets put a stop to this and go back to the status quo of not having these apps released at all for WP and OEM's like HTC and Samsung releasing phones and not doing anything to promote them while they promote their android devices.

Lets ignore the fact that only a handful are actually exclusive to Nokia and only for a set time period. Lets convieniently forget that Nokia is also providing their mapping services, operator contacts and other benefits to MS and are not just being paid blindly by MS.

Yep, lets just wait for HTC and Samsung to jump in and fully support the platform and provide their exclusive services like Beats and Chaton. Lets just sit back and pray that WP somehow takes off like we've been doing since it was launched in October 2010 with no support from the launch OEM's. Yes, then its all going to work out for WP....

Exactly.

All this whining and predictions of doomsday scenarios over a few exclusive apps from Nokia is RIDICULOUS.

First of all:

People need to stop using the word "fragmentation" if they don't understand the definition as it pertains to a phone OS. Android has fragmentation. Fragmentation means there are multiple major versions of the OS being used at the same time, and even sold at the same time and no clear upgrade path. With Android you have devices with Android 2.2 Froyo, Android 2.3 Gingerbread AND a few with Android 4.0 ALL BEING SOLD CURRENTLY. You have people with 2.2 and 2.3 on their phones who may never be able to upgrade their OS, or may have to wait a year or more to do it.

THAT IS FRAGMENTATION.

A handful of app exclusives that have expiration dates is NOT FRAGMENTATION. Not even close.

Second:

People need to stop convenient glossing over the the facts.

FACT #1: There was zero indication of any of these apps EVER coming to Windows Phone prior to Nokia's investment in the development. Let's stop pretending that Rovio was chomping at the bit to make Angry Birds Space for Windows Phone and Nokia intercepted them at the last minute to snatch it out of the hands of HTC and Samsung users. That's a lie.

FACT #2: All of these apps (aside from the Nokia branded ones, like Nokia Drive etc) will be coming to all Windows Phones when the exclusives expire. WITHOUT NOKIA, you may never have gotten them. At minimum, you would have waited at least the length of the exclusive and probably long after before the developers even thought about making them. So YOU SHOULD BE THANKING NOKIA. You're welcome. :straight:

FACT #3: Overall Nokia has done more to help promote Windows Phone in the last 2 months than HTC, Samsung, LG and Dell have done in the last 2 YEARS. So please, spare us the argument that Nokia is "destroying" Windows Phone because you have to wait 6 months to get an app for your 2 year old HTC that you never would have gotten anyway if Nokia wasn't investing in it. YOUR OEM hasn't done CRAP for Windows Phone. Nokia is carrying all the weight. Complain to your OEM for not doing more.

FACT #4: Nokia is the ONLY OEM 100% committed to Windows Phone. The rest could care less. If Microsoft had not made this partnership with Nokia, I'm sorry but Windows Phone was going to die with the lackluster support of your precious HTC and Samsung releasing recycled Androids that sat in the back of the store with a layer of dust on them and zero promotion.

Be Positive: Microsoft and Nokia are pushing hard to encourage development, even covering the costs to get these apps made. You're already seeing a lot of new apps that wouldn't have appeared without this effort. If a few of them are exclusive for a while, well I'm sorry. Nokia PAID for them. Nokia has all it's chips in the Windows Phone basket, they are fighting for survival. Windows Phone is not a hobby for them like it is with the other OEM's and it's not Nokia's job to pay for apps to be developed to prop up Samsung and HTC. Samsung and HTC have billions in the bank. Let them pay for some exclusives. Anything that can be done to encourage development at this point is a good thing.

Nokia is aggressive because they HAVE to be. They are not in a position to concede even one inch to their competitors right now. If you want apps that Nokia PAID for, then you can wait, or you can buy a Nokia phone.

 

[socialcarpet]

Lets take the CNN app for example: Nokia said the CNN app will be exclusive to the lumias for just 90 days, If my memory serves me right, it was somewhere January. 90 days is just 3 months right? Why is it not available to the rest of us? Now Nokia has come out to say the app is exclusive till May 2013....I'm telling you guys we'll never get these apps..they'll keep on postponding days till you buy a Nokia and be free...which in some sense forcing us to make decisions, really hate that idea. Can we all hold Lumia devices? Is it possible? I mean this is not the iPhone world where i'm stuck with one type of device...we need variations so NOKIA SHOULD NOT FORCE US TO BUY THEIR LUMIAS. Not saying I don't like Nokia devices (own some) but It's not fair, and MS just sitting there like a log doing nothing coz Nokia is promoting them...thats f**k. The OS should be stable and same across all OEM platforms except apps developed by OEMs themselves.

Nokia will start introducing their OS's into our beloved WP OS and I tell you guys, very soon, VERY VERY SOON we'll have Nindows Phone (WP combined with Symbian and Nokia Belle) and my beloved Windows Phone OS will be OBSOLETE and F**KED AS ****...NO DOUBT....I THINK MICROSOFT WILL BE NOKIASOFT

Nonsense.

You need to step away from the keyboard. The stupid is getting so deep in this thread we are going to need a snow shovel to clear it out.

Even if your ridiculous paranoid conspiracy theory were correct, it would be a huge improvement over the doldrums Windows Phone has been stuck in for the last two years with Android-loving Samsung, HTC, LG and Dell driving the OS into the ground with sh*tty phones and zero promotion and zero advertising. ANYTHING is better than that. If HTC and Samsung walked away tomorrow, very little would be lost, because they have done almost NOTHING for Windows Phone but through the OS on leftover Android's from 2009.

I hope HTC and Samsung stay in, but if they don't, I couldn't care less if they are contributing. So far their track record SUCKS.

 

[socialcarpet]

LOL, some people just refuse to see the difference between, for ex. PayPay and Nokia Drive. No **** one is already exclusive, but the other is a highly used 3rd party app.

And to whoever said, "just buy a Nokia". Please go jump off a bridge.

Choose one:

A) Nokia pays to develop these apps and you have to wait 6-12 months to get it.
B) Nokia doesn't pay to develop the apps and you DON'T GET THEM AT ALL.

What part of that do you not understand?

 

[socialcarpet]

Sir, you do know that MS is paying Nokia millions. So I suggest you direct your anger towards MS for not having a level playing field.

If Samsung or HTC want to make Windows Phone their ONLY SMARTPHONE OS like Nokia did, I'm sure Microsoft would be happy to cut a similar deal with them.

If they want to continue to ride the green robots crotch and flick their crumbs and leftover Android junk to Windows Phone, then Microsoft will give them no special consideration. Why should they?

 

[kenzibit]

Nonsense.

You need to step away from the keyboard. The stupid is getting so deep in this thread we are going to need a snow shovel to clear it out.

Even if your ridiculous paranoid conspiracy theory were correct, it would be a huge improvement over the doldrums Windows Phone has been stuck in for the last two years with Android-loving Samsung, HTC, LG and Dell driving the OS into the ground with sh*tty phones and zero promotion and zero advertising. ANYTHING is better than that. If HTC and Samsung walked away tomorrow, very little would be lost, because they have done almost NOTHING for Windows Phone but through the OS on leftover Android's from 2009.

I hope HTC and Samsung stay in, but if they don't, I couldn't care less if they are contributing. So far their track record SUCKS.

Infact, just decided to park my car and reply to this STUPID comment from this INGRATE. You are the one that really needs to stay away from the keyboard coz you talk ****. Are you telling me HTC, Samsung and LG never contributed to WP? Did you see the various commercials when WP came? How can you be such an ingrate.

Secondly do you think this is an iphone world where we are cool with one type of device? Let me tell you, we need variants and we need all from HTC to Nokia to make this platform better. You just can't say we will be better of without HTC, LG and Samsumg, that's just a **** thing to say dude. You just blind and can't see what's happening to our OS now. Better go do your home work and stop talking like an idiot.

 

[canesfan625]

This thread makes about as much sense as Google and Mozilla wining over Windows RT and by the logic demonstrated here the point is moot because there wasn't ever not fragmentation.

 

[socialcarpet]

For WP you want this to happen. If Nokia can sell millions of their units, it will only boost your options for other OEM.

If we continue to see this(just an example)
300,000-HTC
200,000-Samsung
500,000-Nokia

It doesn't bode well for any OEM, because sales are spreadout among a small market.

If Nokia can start doing million+, those other OEMS will finally take it seriously.

If you love WP7, you want Nokia to succeed to drive competition.

Nokia has already sold over 2 million Lumia's in the first quarter of 2012.

 

[socialcarpet]

Infact, just decided to park my car and reply to this STUPID comment from this INGRATE. You are the one that really needs to stay away from the keyboard coz you talk ****. Are you telling me HTC, Samsung and LG never contributed to WP? Did you see the various commercials when WP came? How can you be such an ingrate.

Secondly do you think this is an iphone world where we are cool with one type of device? Let me tell you, we need variants and we need all from HTC to Nokia to make this platform better. You just can't say we will be better of without HTC, LG and Samsumg, that's just a **** thing to say dude. You just blind and can't see what's happening to our OS now. Better go do your home work and stop talking like an idiot.

Windows Phone was dead without Microsoft's investment in Nokia and Nokia's commitment to go 100% Windows Phone.

Everyone knows it. It's obvious. The rest of the world paid no attention to Windows Phone before then.

The little bit that HTC and Samsung and others did, made no difference. In two years the marketshare for Windows Phone hardly grew at all.

Watch what happens in the next year. It will all be because of Microsoft and Nokia.

I do hope the others rise to the occasion and decide to contribute more than old Android's retrofitted with Windows Phone OS. Maybe when they see Lumia sales figures they will think it's worth it to put in some effort. That would be great for everyone. :happy: