05-18-2012 08:49 PM
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  1. eric12341's Avatar
    Heh, every time I listen to a baseball game there's an add for MLB At Bat and it's always "Download MLB At Bat for the latest scores on your Iphone, Ipad, Android, Blackberry or Windows Mobile device"
    I heard that once on TV here during a sox game,oh well at least more than iPhone,iPad and Android were mentioned.
    05-15-2012 07:38 PM
  2. bpgui's Avatar
    Yay! You can credit me for part of that. I ditched BlackBerry for Windows Phone.

    Sent from my Lumia 900 using Board Express
    As did I, but I don't believe WP has passed BB just yet.
    05-15-2012 09:30 PM
  3. AngryNil's Avatar
    There's no chance whatsoever RIM lost 10% of its marketshare in a month. These numbers are cracked out.
    My favourite troll is back again!

    Definition of 'Market Share'

    The percentage of an industry or market's total sales that is earned by a particular company over a specified time period. Market share is calculated by taking the company's sales over the period and dividing it by the total sales of the industry over the same period. This metric is used to give a general idea of the size of a company to its market and its competitors.

    Read more: Market Share Definition | Investopedia
    Market share is a terribly shady metric. Most sources don't even use the above definition, they simply survey a bunch of people about what device they are currently using and call it a day.
    sentimentGX4 and eric12341 like this.
    05-16-2012 02:01 AM
  4. sentimentGX4's Avatar
    Market share is a terribly shady metric. Most sources don't even use the above definition, they simply survey a bunch of people about what device they are currently using and call it a day.
    Thanks for the informative post!

    While I had known the definition of "market share" prior, I didn't realize that the comScore survey was making improper use of the term "market share" by relying on user surveys instead of surveying new handsets sold. Reviewing the links, and reading the bottom, I see that now.

    Stated otherwise, Windows Phone now sells more devices in the US than Blackberry; but Blackberry still has more users total based on usage from former customers. The former is the accurate usage of "market share" and not the latter, so it is correct to say that Windows Phone has surpassed Blackberry in "market share".

    EDIT: Kantar survey affirmed by Engadget.
    http://www.engadget.com/2012/05/16/k...anks-to-nokia/
    eric12341 likes this.
    05-16-2012 02:35 AM
  5. HeyCori's Avatar
    05-16-2012 08:27 AM
  6. Dave Blake's Avatar
    You could have posted our article sooner

    http://www.windowscentral.com/window...tar-worldpanel
    snowmutt likes this.
    05-16-2012 08:47 AM
  7. HeyCori's Avatar
    You could have posted our article sooner

    http://www.windowscentral.com/window...tar-worldpanel
    I's sorry :(
    05-16-2012 08:48 AM
  8. Mr Bigs's Avatar
    First whats WM? Next if you have feedback lets hear it. The OP asked for positive comments. If you don't have a positive comment or a point to make beyond this is BS please move on to another thread.
    First of all you can't post up no negative replies and then make a blatantly false statement so it is what it is. Look up the facts yourself its readily available.

    Sent from my 4G HTC Rezound using Tapatalk 2

    edit: WM was an error obviously.

    Sent from my Nokia Lumia 900 using Board Express
    Last edited by Se1fcr3ation; 05-16-2012 at 09:14 AM.
    05-16-2012 08:59 AM
  9. selfcreation's Avatar
    Heh, every time I listen to a baseball game there's an add for MLB At Bat and it's always "Download MLB At Bat for the latest scores on your Iphone, Ipad, Android, Blackberry or Windows Mobile device"
    its possible the app still Exist for WM ( Windows Mobile ) witch was around till 2 years ago. and some people still use it...


    First of all you can't post up no negative replies and then make a blatantly false statement so it is what it is. Look up the facts yourself its readily available.

    Sent from my 4G HTC Rezound using Tapatalk 2
    how was it Blatantly False? from march 14th(iish) we passed RIM by 0.02% according to kantar Worldpanel.

    and if its to hard for you to RESPECT the OP's Choice in not leaving useless comments like this one:
    Trust me it's B.S WM hasn't caught up to BB especially with their OS10 coming.
    then ill simply re-quote My boss:
    Next if you have feedback lets hear it. The OP asked for positive comments. If you don't have a positive comment or a point to make beyond this is BS please move on to another thread.
    Last edited by Se1fcr3ation; 05-16-2012 at 09:24 AM.
    05-16-2012 09:14 AM
  10. tekhna's Avatar
    Market share is a terribly shady metric. Most sources don't even use the above definition, they simply survey a bunch of people about what device they are currently using and call it a day.
    Yes, and no. Because those numbers are not readily available or not always broken down, they depend on surveys. So yes, you are technically correct--but the information you are claiming is market share is basically unavailable, or if it is available, long after the fact. So they rely on proxies like surveys, which isn't "calling it a day" it's actually much more accurate, usually.
    Hence the fight over the census for the last 20 years--survey and extrapolation is MUCH more accurate than enumeration, and yet the constitution calls for enumeration, so every 10 years we embark on an expensive and inaccurate survey of the country.
    05-16-2012 09:53 AM
  11. tekhna's Avatar
    Thanks for the informative post!

    While I had known the definition of "market share" prior, I didn't realize that the comScore survey was making improper use of the term "market share" by relying on user surveys instead of surveying new handsets sold. Reviewing the links, and reading the bottom, I see that now.

    Stated otherwise, Windows Phone now sells more devices in the US than Blackberry; but Blackberry still has more users total based on usage from former customers. The former is the accurate usage of "market share" and not the latter, so it is correct to say that Windows Phone has surpassed Blackberry in "market share".

    EDIT: Kantar survey affirmed by Engadget.
    Kantar: Windows Phone clawing back share thanks to Nokia, but Android still rules the roost -- Engadget
    It just depends on how you define the sales period. If you're limited solely month to month, maybe, but that's not a very helpful.

    It's also worth pointing out there are multiple definitions of market share, and irlju just chose the one that helps make his polemical point.

    Market share - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    ""Market share is the percentage of a market (defined in terms of either units or revenue) accounted for by a specific entity." In a survey of nearly 200 senior marketing managers, 67 percent responded that they found the "dollar market share" metric very useful, while 61% found "unit market share" very useful."

    The pretty common sense meaning--
    http://www.investorwords.com/2989/market_share.html

    The percentage of the total sales of a given type of product or service that are attributable to a given company.
    05-16-2012 09:57 AM
  12. socialcarpet's Avatar
    I've always taken market share, as it applies to smartphones or computers to be based on the total number of units out there in use. Not a dollar amount, not a number of sales in a month or a quarter.

    So out of all the smartphones currently in use in the United States, what percentage are Windows Phone, what percentage are BlackBerry, iOS and Android.

    I think applying any other definition to marketshare in this case could be confusing. It's useful to track sales and spot trends over time and so forth, but those metrics should be separate from just raw "marketshare" IMO.
    05-16-2012 10:34 AM
  13. bpgui's Avatar
    I've always taken market share, as it applies to smartphones or computers to be based on the total number of units out there in use. Not a dollar amount, not a number of sales in a month or a quarter.
    That is how I've always thought of it.
    05-16-2012 10:54 AM
  14. eric12341's Avatar
    It just depends on how you define the sales period. If you're limited solely month to month, maybe, but that's not a very helpful.

    It's also worth pointing out there are multiple definitions of market share, and irlju just chose the one that helps make his polemical point.

    Market share - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    ""Market share is the percentage of a market (defined in terms of either units or revenue) accounted for by a specific entity." In a survey of nearly 200 senior marketing managers, 67 percent responded that they found the "dollar market share" metric very useful, while 61% found "unit market share" very useful."

    The pretty common sense meaning--
    What is market share? definition and meaning

    The percentage of the total sales of a given type of product or service that are attributable to a given company.
    Wikipedia? Seriously? How do we know that you didn't change it to say what you want? Can't disagree with findings.
    05-16-2012 12:36 PM
  15. naplesbill's Avatar
    Honestly people, it should be blatantly obvious what the article meant by market share. The whole point of tracking current sales is to project the future. If WP continues to outpace bb then it is rather apparent why this measure of market share is so important. One is growing, the other still bleeding.

    Sent from my PI86100 using Board Express
    eric12341 likes this.
    05-16-2012 01:34 PM
  16. tekhna's Avatar
    Wikipedia? Seriously? How do we know that you didn't change it to say what you want? Can't disagree with findings.
    ...do I need to explain to you how Wikipedia works? You can check the change log.
    There's a generally accepted definition of market share, and one poster thought he'd try to sway the conversation his way by providing a misleading definition of market share. It's really that simple.
    And yes, you can disagree with the findings. Lots of people have been disagreeing.
    05-16-2012 01:51 PM
  17. snowmutt's Avatar
    Click to view quoted image


    The Bears are going to be terrible this year.
    Dude, you are so my hero....
    HeyCori likes this.
    05-16-2012 05:07 PM
  18. eric12341's Avatar
    ...do I need to explain to you how Wikipedia works? You can check the change log.
    There's a generally accepted definition of market share, and one poster thought he'd try to sway the conversation his way by providing a misleading definition of market share. It's really that simple.
    And yes, you can disagree with the findings. Lots of people have been disagreeing.

    Then if you don't agree with the findings then it's obvious that you don't want WP to succeed and shouldn't be posting in this thread or on this site.
    05-16-2012 10:22 PM
  19. bpgui's Avatar
    Then if you don't agree with the findings then it's obvious that you don't want WP to succeed and shouldn't be posting in this thread or on this site.
    That's a bit of a stretch. Wanting WP to succeed doesn't require blindly agreeing with any positive report. That's fanboyism.
    05-16-2012 10:32 PM
  20. Dave Blake's Avatar
    That's a bit of a stretch. Wanting WP to succeed doesn't require blindly agreeing with any positive report. That's fanboyism.
    I guess I would say the opposite. Not believing the facts and findings of major studies. Continuing to argue with things that are proved now I would call that fanboyism. Your word not mine.
    05-17-2012 06:02 AM
  21. bpgui's Avatar
    I guess I would say the opposite. Not believing the facts and findings of major studies. Continuing to argue with things that are proved now I would call that fanboyism. Your word not mine.
    Yes, I made up that word. That's the great thing about the English language, anyone can make up a word and its meaning is usually easily determined. :)

    I think we'll have to disagree on this. Major studies can be and often are wrong. (For example take the health benefit of eggs, each year or so there is a major study saying they are bad for you followed by one saying they are good for you). Wanting WP (or anything else for that matter) to succeed doesn't require blind acceptance of any positive news and rejection of any negative news.
    05-17-2012 06:12 AM
  22. AngryNil's Avatar
    ...do I need to explain to you how Wikipedia works? You can check the change log.
    I hope you haven't done research papers for anything above primary-level education.

    There's a generally accepted definition of market share, and one poster thought he'd try to sway the conversation his way by providing a misleading definition of market share. It's really that simple.
    The generally accepted definition of market share in this industry is unit share over a period of time. Every single of the links below measure a form of percentage share for a set period. All these sources are widely quoted by technology publications.

    Nielsen
    NPD
    Gartner
    comScore

    But do continue on your FUD campaign, I can't wait for the next baseless assertion!
    eric12341 likes this.
    05-17-2012 06:25 AM
  23. bpgui's Avatar
    What's FUD?
    05-17-2012 06:46 AM
  24. smapor's Avatar
    not hard guys.

    consumer wise-blackberry is weak

    Business wise-my company has provided more iPhones 8 to 1. The only reason why that 1 exists because it has a keyboard.


    Windows 8 is going to destroy RIM leftover market share. Single ecosystem for your work....vs a slower company who does not have the cash flow that MS has...

    Regardless of this article, the cellular vendors and other experts know when a ship is sinking.
    05-17-2012 06:57 AM
  25. tekhna's Avatar
    I hope you haven't done research papers for anything above primary-level education.
    Dissertation prospectus under review right now by my committee, blow me a kiss for good luck!



    The generally accepted definition of market share in this industry is unit share over a period of time. Every single of the links below measure a form of percentage share for a set period. All these sources are widely quoted by technology publications.

    Nielsen
    NPD
    Gartner
    comScore

    But do continue on your FUD campaign, I can't wait for the next baseless assertion!
    I said that was a definition too--read my above post where I said you're technically correct. Measuring something sure wouldn't mean much without a period.
    "AT&T has 100% market share" (in 1958). So obviously period matters. No one ever denied that.
    But there is a common-sense definition that assumes the temporal present AND past (i.e the period is ONGOING) that is different from the investopedia definition, and necessarily so because of devices purchased outside the month of April.

    I have no doubt whatsoever in my mind that WP7 outsold RIM in April. No question, they did. So WP7's "market share" for April would be higher than RIM's, using that definition.
    I also would be very surprised if they had overtaken RIM in "market share" in the sense of proportion of all smartphones in use in the US (which assumes an ongoing period).

    Make sense?
    Last edited by tekhna; 05-17-2012 at 08:33 AM.
    05-17-2012 08:27 AM
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