12-04-2014 10:07 PM
53 123
tools
  1. b23h's Avatar
    I am very impressed by the idea of Wi-Fi Geofencing. I expect the typical use of it would be to have Wi-Fi off as a default, but when you got close to a location that you set, it turns the Wi-Fi back on. I have found that works. The problem is that when you leave that location, it doesn't turn itself off again. That makes what could be a set up and forget about it feature, into a feature where you still need to mess with turning the Wi-Fi back off.

    So Microsoft has made a great feature that I can easily imagine using all the time, and turned it into something that is far less useful. I certainly hope that they will fix the function so that it turns itself back off when you leave the location.

    Second, I hope they set Wi-Fi Geofencing up as a separate feature under Wi-Fi with a toggle switch and a setting button for defining the locations where it is to be used, plus some explanation and a warning that location services need to be on at all times for it to work.
    anon(8657436), GizmoEV and ptrkhh like this.
    04-16-2014 04:23 PM
  2. anon(8657436)'s Avatar
    Go to uservoice and submit this idea.
    b23h and ven07 like this.
    04-18-2014 08:53 PM
  3. b23h's Avatar
    Go to uservoice and submit this idea.
    That's a good idea. I've actually put it up in Microsoft's forums, but putting it up on uservoice is a good suggestion....
    ven07 and anon(8657436) like this.
    04-18-2014 09:21 PM
  4. b23h's Avatar
    I also want to incorporate an idea (and give him credit) by oryan_dunn here at WPC. What he brought up is that there may be some favorite locations in which there is no purpose in turning on the Wi-Fi. His example was that there was no Wi-Fi at his job. However as Cortana no doubt wants to know where his job is, it is listed as a favorite. So a list of toggles of Wi-Fi on or off for the individual locations listed as favorites is a good idea.
    04-18-2014 09:37 PM
  5. anon(8657436)'s Avatar
    Really brilliant. A novel idea. Same for me, my college's lab wifi has most of the sites blocked and i would love to exclude it from automatically connecting.
    b23h, Y2HBK and ven07 like this.
    04-18-2014 09:49 PM
  6. b23h's Avatar
    04-18-2014 09:57 PM
  7. b23h's Avatar
    Really brilliant. A novel idea. Same for me, my college's lab wifi has most of the sites blocked and i would love to exclude it from automatically connecting.
    Yes, having the Wi-Fi turn off automatically when you leave a favorite location and being able to set favorite locations, yet specify that you do not need Wi-Fi at some locations, would really complete the feature for me and make it a very handy and worthwhile feature. It is a nice feature now, but without it turning off when you leave the set location, that becomes a significant deficit.
    04-18-2014 11:13 PM
  8. ilektrolo's Avatar
    For Cortana and locations part.i think right now she searches for your location every few minutes.i think it would be more wise and battery efficient to monitor accelerometer sensor. If you have your phone on your desk location services will never work, then when you pick up your phone geofencing and location services will work as it is right now.
    b23h likes this.
    04-19-2014 02:29 AM
  9. anon(8657436)'s Avatar
    Yup. Cortana literally EATS up my location services. But it would be better by allowing a custom timing for setting location check. Like every hour or 2 hours maybe.
    ven07 and b23h like this.
    04-19-2014 05:08 AM
  10. b23h's Avatar
    Yup. Cortana literally EATS up my location services. But it would be better by allowing a custom timing for setting location check. Like every hour or 2 hours maybe.
    That's an interesting idea. I can imagine some situations where that would be pretty handy. Again as a set it and forget it feature it would allow you to potentially set periods of time through the day and week where you could specify the timing or whether or not location settings are on or not. For example when I am at work or at home, my use of location services would be lower than on my commute to work or back. I am not sure how much I would use that feature in comparison to the Wi-Fi geofencing feature, but I certainly can imagine that it could be a nice feature.

    Behind all of this is a question that I really don't have the answer to. What is the battery use of locations services vs. Wi-Fi services? I assume Wi-Fi uses the battery more than Location services does.
    ven07 likes this.
    04-19-2014 04:16 PM
  11. b23h's Avatar
    For Cortana and locations part.i think right now she searches for your location every few minutes.i think it would be more wise and battery efficient to monitor accelerometer sensor. If you have your phone on your desk location services will never work, then when you pick up your phone geofencing and location services will work as it is right now.
    SWEET IDEA!!! I like it. I'm not sure that I would say that location services would never check if the accelerometer sensor does not show movement, however you certainly could cut the location polling way back. If it is true that the location polling is every few minutes that could help, perhaps significantly, with battery life. Nice job ilektrolo, that is a very interesting idea...

    EDIT: After giving it some thought it strikes me that for me in any case, tying location polling to the accelerometer would not function as desired at work. My phone is invariably on my hip in a holster at work, and while I did a fair amount of sitting, there was a lot of standing up and walking short distances. Typical office work. While I have little understanding of the exact function of the accelerometer, I can imagine that such moving around would quite likely trigger it and therefore in this scenario restart location polling. On the other hand it would work great at night when I am sleeping....
    Last edited by b23h; 04-19-2014 at 04:36 PM.
    ilektrolo and ven07 like this.
    04-19-2014 04:21 PM
  12. ilektrolo's Avatar
    Yes with this scenario it will not work as we wanted but definitely locations services will be triggered less times than it is right now but in any way there is room for improvements.
    b23h likes this.
    04-19-2014 07:19 PM
  13. b23h's Avatar
    I'm a little unsure as to how consistently this feature works for me. I tried it today while I was out doing laundry. I turned off the Wi-Fi. It is set to connect to my home Wi-Fi automatically, which is a hidden and secure (WPA 2) network.

    For now I have Wi-Fi Sense turned off.

    When I got home the Wi-Fi was on but it did not show a connection. I clicked on the Wi-Fi button in the Notification area which led it to connect. It really was not my intention to prompt the connection when I did that, I simply wanted to verify the connection status. Next time I will check via Settings/Wi-Fi.

    My concern is that I really am hoping that it will end up being an entirely "set it up and forget it" feature, and today's experience showed that the Wi-Fi automatically turned on appropriately but did not automatically connect. I will test it again tomorrow...
    04-21-2014 10:55 PM
  14. b23h's Avatar
    Today's experiment was a clear failure. I verified all the settings and went out for a walk. At maybe a quarter mile from the apartment I turned off the Wi-Fi. As I walked back to the apartment I watched to see if the Wi-Fi would turn on and connect. It had done so on earlier experiments turning on at the end of the driveway (it's a rural area, there's a considerable setback). This time it never turned on, even to the point of not turning on when I got to the apartment. I put it down to the GPS not polling during the time that I was "near" my favorite place within whatever boundry MS has decided "near" is.

    I realize that the reductio ad absurdum of this setting if done poorly, could mean that one could never turn off the Wi-Fi at home. That is if home is set up as a favorite location and all the criteria is set for geofencing and the Wi-Fi is off and then the GPS polls to discover that one is at Home, then BAM the Wi-Fi turns on. That would irritate quite a few people. So I assume that MS has set a boundary and when the Wi-Fi setting calls for it to turn on "near a favorite location", they are quite serious about near as opposed to "at".

    What if the location services does not poll during that time period that one is "near" (whatever they've decided is near) a favorite location? I was walking, that's not exactly high speed travel, and yet I do not believe that it polled while I was within that "near" boundary (or the feature is just plain buggy).
    04-22-2014 03:29 PM
  15. Lumiamike's Avatar
    WiFi geo fencing is something that would be my no1 choice for a future feature, I work in or on construction sites where WiFi simply does not exist
    b23h likes this.
    04-22-2014 04:51 PM
  16. b23h's Avatar
    WiFi geo fencing is something that would be my no1 choice for a future feature, I work in or on construction sites where WiFi simply does not exist
    I tend to think that overall it works right now. It may be a little problematic and you may want to verify that it is working, however most of the time it has worked. What is keeping it from being a true "set it and forget it" feature is that it doesn't turn itself off after leaving a favorite location and it would be best to have the ability to fine tune the settings for each favorite location. If you are running 8.1, I'd suggest give it a try. I really hope though that Microsoft fills out the feature so we really can set it and forget it....
    04-23-2014 05:26 PM
  17. b23h's Avatar
    Worked fine today, turned on and connected without issue. I also got notification from Cortana about a reminder that I had set. One of the big differences is that I got the notification near the apartment instead of at the apartment.

    So I am still curious as to how often the location services polls and if it didn't happen to poll when it did but did later when I was actually at home, would the network have turned on or not?

    I will still runs tests and post till I have a pretty firm idea of what is happening, but if anyone wants to post their experiences with the feature, I am interested in hearing it.

    EDIT: One factor is that I am walking when I do these tests. This actually give the locations services a fair amount of time to track my location. However I don't know if location services is simply a timed event or if it is also tied into the accelerometer. Let's say location services is simply a timed event and this turn on "near my favorite location" is a semi-small band and is designed to not go on when one is at the location as opposed to near it. In that scenario, then if I was driving I can imagine situations where the locations services does not happen to ping while I am in that "near location" band and therefore the feature does not trigger. I'd like to know what the answers are to these questions....
    04-23-2014 05:28 PM
  18. ilektrolo's Avatar
    I think it is a timed event no matter where you are, otherwise it wouldn't work in all situations. Also without internet connection GPS is not accurate and this could create some problems.
    04-24-2014 03:14 AM
  19. ilektrolo's Avatar
    Btw for driving... Maybe it is a little of topic but.... In some cars with build in GPS can provide you navigation even if you are underground or you don't have signal. This happens by simply tracking speedometer and wheel positions. It would be nice for Microsoft to cooperate with companies to have these features in your phone when you connect it via Bluetooth's car. Then you will have an ultimate GPS system and accurate location services :P also it will be a good advertisement and innovating movement!
    04-24-2014 03:25 AM
  20. b23h's Avatar
    I think it is a timed event no matter where you are, otherwise it wouldn't work in all situations. Also without internet connection GPS is not accurate and this could create some problems.
    I would hope that it is also tied into the accelerometer in order to increase the polling rate at higher speeds, otherwise your driving instructions could easily be off. At low speeds or walking, the polling rate can slow down. This sounds rational to me and I would expect that is how it is done, but I cannot guarantee that.

    Today's experiment went fine. It was another walk, and approximately a half mile away I turned off the Wi-Fi. As I walked back the Wi-Fi again successfully turned on and connected to my router. Perhaps tomorrow I will drive....
    04-24-2014 06:55 PM
  21. b23h's Avatar
    Drove today... it failed to turn on.

    Upon coming inside I checked and the Wi-Fi was still off. I should have left it off for a while to verify to see what happened, but I did not and turned it on immediately.
    04-25-2014 08:08 PM
  22. b23h's Avatar
    walked today, it worked.

    I'm going to stop daily posting of results and only post when I notice particular failures or have a lot more confidence of my results...

    of course if anyone has experiences they want to post, that would be great.
    04-26-2014 07:30 PM
  23. gernerttl's Avatar
    I also want to incorporate an idea (and give him credit) by oryan_dunn here at WPC. What he brought up is that there may be some favorite locations in which there is no purpose in turning on the Wi-Fi. His example was that there was no Wi-Fi at his job. However as Cortana no doubt wants to know where his job is, it is listed as a favorite. So a list of toggles of Wi-Fi on or off for the individual locations listed as favorites is a good idea.
    I was thinking maybe turning on at a favorite then check for WiFi, if no WiFi, then turn off. But I like your idea better.
    04-26-2014 08:37 PM
  24. gernerttl's Avatar
    walked today, it worked.

    I'm going to stop daily posting of results and only post when I notice particular failures or have a lot more confidence of my results...

    of course if anyone has experiences they want to post, that would be great.
    You bring up some valid points. I've got a Starbucks as one of my favorites, but whenever I go there, I notice that the WiFi doesn't turn on. I think next time I go there I will wait a while to check to see if it turns on. What frustrates me is that I open maps and refresh my location and it still doesn't turn on. I'm wondering if the WiFi turn on function does the auto refresh and ignores when the GPS does a refresh. The shortest time you can set the auto turn on is for one hour. The GPS refresh rate is near-real-time, otherwise it would not be usable for navigation for either walking or driving.
    b23h likes this.
    04-26-2014 08:48 PM
  25. b23h's Avatar
    You bring up some valid points. I've got a Starbucks as one of my favorites, but whenever I go there, I notice that the WiFi doesn't turn on. I think next time I go there I will wait a while to check to see if it turns on. What frustrates me is that I open maps and refresh my location and it still doesn't turn on. I'm wondering if the WiFi turn on function does the auto refresh and ignores when the GPS does a refresh. The shortest time you can set the auto turn on is for one hour. The GPS refresh rate is near-real-time, otherwise it would not be usable for navigation for either walking or driving.
    I'll be curious as to what your results end up being. Most of the time I am finding the feature works to turn on and connect Wi-Fi at my favorite locations, but a few times it has failed. I'm really curious as to why the failures?
    04-26-2014 09:02 PM
53 123

Similar Threads

  1. Just an idea
    By fredd in forum Cortana
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 04-17-2014, 01:32 PM
  2. 8.1 Backup is great!
    By lpforthewin in forum Windows Phone 8.1
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 04-17-2014, 10:51 AM
  3. Cortana: Geofencing: Actions
    By yourguitarhero in forum Cortana
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 04-16-2014, 04:37 PM
  4. Wi-Fi not working when phone is locked?
    By Mihir Kandoi in forum Windows Phone 8.1 Preview for Developers
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 04-16-2014, 05:13 AM
  5. geofence really works?
    By Ural Kavraal in forum Windows Phone 8.1 Preview for Developers
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 04-16-2014, 03:52 AM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD