04-15-2014 10:45 PM
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  1. manicottiK's Avatar
    After 3 years in the market place, it has only managed a paltry 3% market share.
    True, in the U.S. It is doing better in other countries, particularly in those where the cost of the handset isn't substantially masked by carrier subsidies.

    Android, love it or loath it has become the default choice for tablets and smart phones. It has in fact become bigger than Google itself in that they themselves have lost control of the OS and are trying to rein it in.
    I disagree with most of this, particularly in the U.S. where both iPhone and iPad still have large market shares; iPad also does well in many other countries. I don't think that Google has lost control of Android, but they have realized that poor visual quality, sputtering behavior, and other "little things" add up to a less than desirable user experience. They have been working for two years to substantially improve that experience.

    As for the future of Windows on phones & tablets...the market gap has widened so much that Windows Phone will never be able to catch up.
    It depends on how you define "catch up." With WP8 and Win8, Microsoft tried to draw the heavy line between phone and non-phone. It didn't work. Apple drew that line between computer and non-computer; Android essentially followed Apple with a phone+tablet API -- that line seems to be one that consumers and developers like. It now appears that Microsoft is trying to adjust the thickness and placement of that line so that phones and tablets are more alike in programming. The unique differentiator that such a strategy affords, particularly in combination with Windows 8, is the ability let users run those apps on the "full computer", for those who want to do so.

    I'm a WP fan and love the OS, but in all honesty what do you really think? Are you as optimistic as when you first bought into the platform?
    Yes, but "as optimistic" isn't the same as "optimistic."

    I expect that WP will continue to improve its market position globally, finally getting noticed in the U.S. in late 2014 to early 2015. I expect that iOS will continue a slow decrease in share, mostly at the low end as a result of Android and WP. Google and Microsoft have strategies that span the price range; Apple does not. Google has an experience that, at the low end, isn't so wonderful, while Microsoft is able to provide a pretty good experience even on less expensive devices. The ability to span economic markets ($60-600) to maximize user reach and to span devices (phone-tablet-computer) to maximize developers reach gives Microsoft an advantage that Apple and Google do not have. Now the question is to see if they can capitalize on it.

    I'll give MS credit for being willing to beat their heads against a wall for longer than most firms; That persistence is why folks joke that you never buy an MS product until it's at version 3.x because the first two attempts are weak. WP7 was 1.0; Mango/WP7.5 was 2.0; WP8 was sort of a 2.1 because it did a "reset" of the product. WP8.1 will be the effective 3.0. Let's hope...
    FeedTheShark likes this.
    02-14-2014 08:34 AM
  2. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    You lost me here... care to explain what that means exactly?
    What i am saying is....People refer to ANdroid as the new Windows and how it dominates mobile/tablets like Microsoft does with windows in desktop.
    And using that same logic, Windows as an OS is having some difficulty on the desktop front and I could see eventually Android facing the same sort of challenge that Microsoft is facing with windows.
    Nothing is forever and i certainly hope sooner than later, someone...be it apple or Microsoft or hell, even Blackberry lol knocks google back a bit. So is it late? Yes of course.
    02-14-2014 10:31 AM
  3. wiggum15's Avatar
    Too littel ? We will see...
    Too late ? Hell yes !
    02-14-2014 10:33 AM
  4. Premium1's Avatar
    I think WP will top out around 10-15% of the market share and MS is ok with that since they continue making more money off android than WP. Not to mention, unless BB goes away or IOS/android lose a lot of market share, there isn't really a ton of marketshare left to gain in many areas (others still are growing, but nowhere near what it was 2-3 years ago.
    02-14-2014 10:42 PM
  5. Premium1's Avatar
    What i am saying is....People refer to ANdroid as the new Windows and how it dominates mobile/tablets like Microsoft does with windows in desktop.
    And using that same logic, Windows as an OS is having some difficulty on the desktop front and I could see eventually Android facing the same sort of challenge that Microsoft is facing with windows.
    Nothing is forever and i certainly hope sooner than later, someone...be it apple or Microsoft or hell, even Blackberry lol knocks google back a bit. So is it late? Yes of course.
    You also have to take into account MS sat back and laughed when the iPhone first came out calling it a "toy" while google went back to the drawing board, so does it make any sense that google has succeeded while WP has not. Google rather than resting on their laurels, like MS with with WM back in the day and waiting for WP, while google and others adapted and it is working for them. I also think that with google being so entrenched in about every area, you are seeing android pop up on more and more things that could potentially help keep them relevant if the phone portion dies off.
    02-14-2014 10:44 PM
  6. thatotherdude24's Avatar
    Microsoft has nowhere to go but up with WP and it seems like they're putting their best foot forward, they really have no choice because the tech field is going so mobile.

    It's going to be hard to get existing users of iOS and Android to step outside of their box. But Microsoft's worst enemy is going to be the sales reps in stores. You'll only ever sell what sales reps want to sell. I've had it happen to me, went into Verizon for a WP and the rep said WP8 was useless and said Android was the best but when asked why all he could come up with was because.

    So to answer your question no it's not too little too late on Microsoft's part but unfortunately sales reps have more control over the future of Microsoft than Microsoft. This isn't just with WP8 but W8.1, the people who hate on it the most are the people who have never used it. I support people with the tech needs and some of the biggest W8 haters have never touched it. I worked with a guy who absolutely hated W8 so went and bought a Mac because they were so simple, for the first 2 months he hated that too. Not because it's a bad product but because he didn't know how to use it, once he learned how to use it he loved it.

    It blows my mind how people can say they hate something when though they've never used it. You can't hate something you've never used, you just simply don't know how to use it.

    Sent From My Woven Black and Yellow Moto X
    Technoloay and mpt15 like this.
    02-15-2014 12:54 AM
  7. Genghis7777's Avatar
    It blows my mind how people can say they hate something when though they've never used it. You can't hate something you've never used, you just simply don't know how to use it.

    Sent From My Woven Black and Yellow Moto X

    I think they call it mass hysteria.
    Trouble is, once the frenzy has reached a certain intensity it's difficult to wind it back down.


    Sent from my Lumia 520 using Tapatalk
    02-15-2014 02:03 AM
  8. Genghis7777's Avatar
    After 8.1, I would say wp will be on par with ios and android (if not in customisation) but with good marketing, the market share gain is going to be faster than ever before.

    in fact, there are a few features I'd like to see from WP brought across to Windows 8. The People Hub, for instance, seems partially implemented over there.



    Sent from my Lumia 520 using Tapatalk
    mpt15 likes this.
    02-15-2014 03:08 AM
  9. Genghis7777's Avatar
    With the ultimate merger of WinRT and WinPRT runtimes (I doubt whether they actually meant the RT and WP OS'), there is a huge potential for a shot in the arm with regards to better sync capabilities across all your MS powered devices, number of apps, overall system stability etc.

    I hope so, it'd be great to see a more comprehensive synch between Outlook, Windows Phone, and Outlook.com. At the moment syncing tasks isn't supported and I miss it.


    Sent from my Lumia 520 using Tapatalk
    02-15-2014 03:26 AM
  10. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    I hope so, it'd be great to see a more comprehensive synch between Outlook, Windows Phone, and Outlook.com. At the moment syncing tasks isn't supported and I miss it.




    Sent from my Lumia 520 using Tapatalk



    What version of Outlook do you have? I'm running 2013, and this task I created in Outlook syncs with my WP.






    Sent from my Nokia Lumia 920 using Tapatalk
    02-15-2014 04:05 AM
  11. Genghis7777's Avatar
    I think WP will top out around 10-15% of the market share and MS is ok with that since they continue making more money off android than WP. Not to mention, unless BB goes away or IOS/android lose a lot of market share, there isn't really a ton of marketshare left to gain in many areas (others still are growing, but nowhere near what it was 2-3 years ago.

    I don't think MS can be happy with 10-15% market share. Their original vision wad to have Windows on every desktop. Now that is threatened with a new generation of people experiencing technology for the first time on other platforms. MS has to make their strategy work.

    And given time and if MS keeps up the pace in refining WP and Windows, it will get there. The smartphone race is not a sprint, but more like a marathon.

    Two major platforms that previously held substantial market shares and highly regarded in their day have fallen by the wayside.

    Neither of the two leaders can afford to be complacent.

    They say the pilots that succeed in a dogfight are those that have the stamina to remain more relentless than their opponents.

    MS have shown that they have a 30 something year track record that demonstrates their tenacity. Back in the early days of Windows, MS had seemingly lost the battle for word-processor supremacy in Japan to another. Yet they rolled in a new team and additional resources and two years later took the crown and haven't been deposed since.

    With a MS executive appointed as the new CEO, he will have this ingrained in him. They need to stay the course and listen carefully to what the market says without compromising their design philosophy as this isn't what's broken.

    In this game, it's never too late unless there's no coin left in the tin. Microsoft is far, far from that.


    Sent from my Lumia 520 using Tapatalk
    02-15-2014 04:05 AM
  12. SuneelBskr's Avatar
    That's a firmware issue, nothing to do with WP8 OS.
    I don't think its a firmware issue, this is because of the crappy OS. My camera was very good with out any updates. Only when upgraded to Amber, it sucks. Seems the image processing algorithm was modified.
    02-17-2014 06:49 AM
  13. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    I don't think its a firmware issue, this is because of the crappy OS. My camera was very good with out any updates. Only when upgraded to Amber, it sucks. Seems the image processing algorithm was modified.
    The updates with Nokia are usually a combined GDR (MS) and firmware update. The camera imaging process is controlled by the firmware and Nokia software, not the OS. So blaming MS is incorrect. On top of that, we're off topic. There is a huge thread going on different forums complaining about the same thing. Maybe find that thread and see what's being said and if there are any fixes?

    You also try a hard reset or a re-install using the Nokia Updater Software to see if that fixes your issue. It's possible that your firmware didn't install correctly.
    02-17-2014 07:21 AM
  14. RockmanNeo's Avatar
    "A little to late" cries have been there since WP7 came out, yet we're still here.
    tardismatrix22 likes this.
    02-17-2014 04:31 PM
  15. boxa72's Avatar
    Too little too late? This will attract more users than ever to WP! It is not like iOS and Android are evolving so quickly now...in fact I think they are both a lit boring now...whihc is why i picked up a Lumia 925 and am looking forward to the 8.1 devices!
    I have a 925 as well and have been really happy performance wise and it is easily the best looking WP!!!
    02-17-2014 07:37 PM
  16. boxa72's Avatar
    I am looking forward to fix the camera issue! I bought a windows phone because of its camera! 920's camera results are yellowish and blurry! Fix the efin camera algorithm! That would be the most innovative update of 8.1!
    do you have Lumia Black? Coz that has significantly improved algorithms at least on my 925
    02-17-2014 07:40 PM
  17. Agent-P's Avatar
    After 8.1, I would say wp will be on par with ios and android (if not in customisation) but with good marketing, the market share gain is going to be faster than ever before.
    This is my train of thought. I've met people who really like the look of WP and would be willing to give it a try, but it's currently missing some very basic features which made WP a no-go for them. Once those are addressed in 8.1, I feel like people would be more willing to give it a chance if they aren't too deep into their current ecosystem. Prying someone away from an established ecosystem is nearly impossible. People are comfortable there and don't like change.
    02-17-2014 07:57 PM
  18. boxa72's Avatar
    I don't think its a firmware issue, this is because of the crappy OS. My camera was very good with out any updates. Only when upgraded to Amber, it sucks. Seems the image processing algorithm was modified.
    Lumia Black fixed all that!
    02-17-2014 08:04 PM
  19. awesmdiver's Avatar
    Nothing is a little to late, what is hot day is gone tomorrow in everything. iOS was hot, then Android and yes Windows Phone was late and continues to be late because of the changes to the underlying operating system and APIs. Microsoft is in it for the long run and they already knew and know this. 8.1 is the work and in my opinion the beginning of Windows Phone, not the end. Once Devs can write code for Windows, Windows Phone and XBOX they will start to come.It has taken 4 years to get here and yes, MS had to get in the market early even though they were not ready. Bottom line, what is hot today will be boring for the next generation and that is where the real change happens.
    02-17-2014 08:04 PM
  20. Joel S79's Avatar
    I don't think its a firmware issue, this is because of the crappy OS. My camera was very good with out any updates. Only when upgraded to Amber, it sucks. Seems the image processing algorithm was modified.
    Amber is a NOKIA Software/Firmware update, not an MS OS update. Are you here to contribute, or just troll?

    To the main point, no, it's not too late, and thinking so because of Google's size and Apple's mind share is horribly flawed. The tech industry is littered with the corpses of failed companies who were once at the tip of the iceberg but were knocked off by another company. People were making similar arguments when Android came out, how it would never surpass the iPhone, yet it did. You can't rule out WP.

    The thing MS has going for it over iOS and Android is it's unique. iOS and Android are both icons in a grid like OSes, the animations are similar, the feel of the OS is similar, etc. WP looks and feels completely different, and offers a refreshing choice. I switched from Android because aside from me getting irritated with Android's performance, I liked the look and feel of WP.

    At the end of the day, people like choices, and WP offers a unique one. 8.1 fixes a lot of the issues with WP8, including some gripes I had. Filling those holes will just get more people to switch. I don't believe WP will overtake Android, but it'll settle in as a viable 3rd option.

    Oh, and Nokia is carving out a niche with their camera tech.
    02-17-2014 08:06 PM
  21. Jas00555's Avatar
    I wanna say yes, but I just have a huge if and that's what happens with Android. Google is quickly losing control of Android and I'm pretty sure that one of these day, they're gonna go too far and lock it down too much and that'll turn off a lot of the fan base and only worsen the problem of AOSP vs. GMS. Google's Android is only at 50% of the market, so we just don't know. I personally don't think it is (but it may very well be, I can't predict the future so I can't know) but I'm sure it'll be fine. Microsoft has a HUGE user base. I think its like 1.75 billion PCs, so I just don't know if they can appeal to those people in time. Idk, I'm optimistic though.

    Edit: Before I forget, I also think that it depends on Apple too. Not that Apple will do anything wrong (they're a very smart company, I mean... 51 million iPhones?!) but that the carriers will be the problem. With the way that T-mobile is positioning itself with Uncarrier, we could see contracts fade away in the US. Only the most hardcore Apple fans will shell out $700 on a phone that'll be replaced in a year.
    02-17-2014 08:12 PM
  22. iRANNA's Avatar
    Paul your damn right about it.I am no fan of any os as of yet;but i use windows phone right now and have used the androids and iOS too.android is almost taking the place of an unified os and wp is still catching up with tiny features but very essential.so at least when the Microsoft is late they have to bring in better services and better features to keep up the market share.else as Sam says it is an unsurmountable lead for Microsoft.
    02-17-2014 08:17 PM
  23. Ninja x's Avatar
    They are late for sure, but in terms of timing only. Considering the well entrenched players, and the bad publicity of previous platforms Microsoft has made the right choices and is doing all it can to get its share. As a person, and in my family I don't see any need to move away from Windows Phone in near future so we will keep on buying Windows Phones.

    Regarding the market share, if few % of market share did not stop OSX or Linux desktops from shipping and having its own fan following it really does not matter if Windows Phone stays in 3rd place. It has done well in some markets and went above iOS, the US is a different beast. The mobile operators and certain tech bloggers are so anti-Microsoft that they are not able to see anything beyond Apple and Android.
    02-17-2014 08:23 PM
  24. shovelhead84's Avatar
    I would not even come close to counting WP out of the race. A very important aspect of WP is not being fully considered in the OP and is vital in the growth and capabilities on WP.
    The redirection of MS as a whole is placing WP as a piece in a much larger puzzle. WP and the upcoming changes are not only about a mobile platform. They will be bringing together more features of the new Microsoft ecosystem. We are stepping towards a unified Microsoft universe that will bridge our devices and experiences.

    I use Microsoft products for work productivity, home computing, pc gaming, console gaming, and now an improved home entertainment experience. These items do not work perfectly together, but they are closer to unification and on a broader scale than anything Apple and Google are doing. If MS is able to bring these aspects of our digital lives together in a useful and reliable way, then WP will be an inevitable choice for many consumers out there.

    Let's not forget how Android slithered out from under the "revolutionary" iPhone and a horde of devoted fans. Android provided an alternative to the structured IOS and allowed people to use resources outside of the iTunes fortress. Now, it is a snotty out-of-control brat screaming at the movie theater while the parents act like nothing is going on.

    Windows phone recently slithered out from under a rock and learned to walk.
    02-17-2014 08:27 PM
  25. Leaf81's Avatar
    Given the choice of iOS, Android, and Windows Phone, I would chose Windows Phone every day. Right now, I use an HTC One. My carrier doesn't yet support Windows Phone, and has only recently gotten iPhones and the latest android devices (Galaxy S4, Moto X, HTC One), but as my contract nears its end, Windows Phone is looking good enough for me to want to switch carriers. I only got into tech about a year a go, and from everything I've learned, I think that Microsoft has the best ecosystem. With all of its amazing products, from Windows to Windows Phone to XBOX, I think that it was the best decision. Microsoft just needs to make deals with every carrier out there and get Windows Phones within everyone's reach. Then they need to push advertising and show Windows Phone as what it is, a great smartphone platform that works brilliantly with all of the other Microsoft products in your life.
    02-17-2014 08:30 PM
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