09-30-2014 12:28 PM
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  1. rockstarzzz's Avatar
    Leaving minor updates alone, these are the 4 big versions of the top 4 OS on any mobile phone.

    I don't like the Verge. Why? It generally loves Apple. Or used to. I follow news everywhere. Now with its final iOS 8 review out, I thought I would see who lags where.

    Just going by scores, the Verge has rated them as follows, 10 being the best:

    Android 4.4 - Score 8.8
    iOS 8 - Score 8.2
    WP8.1 - Score 8.0
    BB10 - Score 7.0

    Performance

    WP8.1 = iOS8

    Features
    WP8.1 = iOS8

    Design
    WP8.1 = Android 4.4

    Worth noting that WP8.1 is rated AS GOOD AS iOS8 for performance as well as features. This is very encouraging for WP because iOS8 runs on a premium hardware with only 1 OEM making phones. WP8.1 runs on multiple hardwares made by diverse range of OEMs.

    Another point to note - WP8.1 design is rated AS GOOD AS Android and far superior to iOS8 - that is again more than a win for WP considering it can walk same pace as the big dog and is better designed than a premium OS!

    The only place where it has been rated bad (still better than BB10 ;) ) is ecosystem. This shows how much lies on the Windows 9 launch. May I remind everyone that Windows 9 launch is expected in 2015, the year when most polls have predicted WP to cross 10% globally (back in 2010-2011 after launch). I think, it is time we believed "it is a marathon, not a sprint" as clearly in 2014, WP has matured to stand right next to iOS and Android - for design, features and performance.
    Last edited by rockstarzzz; 09-24-2014 at 05:07 AM.
    09-23-2014 12:50 PM
  2. salmanahmad's Avatar
    Considering some of the editors of the Verge are somewhat biased and also quick to dismiss Android, Windows Phone and Blackberry, it's awesome to see Android 4.4 placed above iOS 8.

    Thanks for the find.
    09-23-2014 01:11 PM
  3. Karthik Naik's Avatar
    Nice windows phone finally is getting recognised for its design etc what it needs now is more marketing etc in other countries
    09-23-2014 01:56 PM
  4. dgr_874's Avatar
    Agreed, WP 8.1 is a great OS. Its the small things that keep it from being great (Xbox music...)
    09-23-2014 01:57 PM
  5. unstoppablekem's Avatar
    Some of your (op) opinions are bias too. Everyone is bias. Just saying. ;)
    09-23-2014 02:05 PM
  6. jonnaver's Avatar
    I agree with the ratings but the problem with calling it a marathon not a sprint in regards to ecosystem is that marathons aren't any consolation in the here and now. If ecosystem is to be considered for a phone ownership you're better off holding off on this runner until the race has matured more and sticking with the currently leading runner
    snowmutt and rockstarzzz like this.
    09-23-2014 08:16 PM
  7. fatclue_98's Avatar
    I agree with the ratings but the problem with calling it a marathon not a sprint in regards to ecosystem is that marathons aren't any consolation in the here and now. If ecosystem is to be considered for a phone ownership you're better off holding off on this runner until the race has matured more and sticking with the currently leading runner
    If every WP user thought like you, this runner would be on 2 broken legs and his hands tied behind his back. There are other things to like besides apps.
    09-23-2014 08:37 PM
  8. jonnaver's Avatar
    If every WP user thought like you, this runner would be on 2 broken legs and his hands tied behind his back. There are other things to like besides apps.
    No need to take it to heart. Apps carry a higher amount of weight than anything else.
    snowmutt, ven07 and rockstarzzz like this.
    09-23-2014 09:12 PM
  9. trivor's Avatar
    The problem isn't the OS - most people agree that Windows Phone is a good operating system. The problem is how to get momentum to move from the 3-4% market share to the 10% market share that would get more apps on commercial companies (Travel, Banks, Finance, Games, etc) on the Windows Phone platform. Right now, for most people that would consider switching the initial cost is not just the cost of the phone but the cost of buying replacement apps, the difficulty of using the Google ecosystem (GMail, Google+, Hangouts/Google Voice) on Windows Phone since Google is actively going against Windows Phone by not producing apps for Windows Phone and making it difficult for developers to make apps for Windows phone. On Apple or Android Microsoft has outstanding support for it's services on those platforms and in fact supports the other OSes better than it supports its own (even MS has to go where the money is).
    09-23-2014 10:31 PM
  10. fatclue_98's Avatar
    No need to take it to heart. Apps carry a higher amount of weight than anything else.
    Among us maybe. You think there might be a reason that low-end devices outsell the mid to high end?
    snowmutt and rockstarzzz like this.
    09-23-2014 10:38 PM
  11. ScruffyT's Avatar
    I have to admit that I'm surprised that iOS and WP are that close. As much as I like WP I would've thought a few things would have pushed us a bit lower. I'm guessing the static homescreen is really starting to take its toll on some iOS users. Back when I was on TA (about 5 yrs ago) there were mumbles about wanting apple to add widgets or whatever, and it seems to be one of the more sought after features these days. Every time I look at my iPod, it actually bothers me how little info I can get at a glance or 1 scroll. And, with 8.1, more tiles, and transparency, iOS is just really far behind in this area IMHO.
    09-23-2014 10:50 PM
  12. rockstarzzz's Avatar
    Some of your (op) opinions are bias too. Everyone is bias. Just saying. ;)
    I am undoubtedly biased for WP because I have invested a heck lot in Microsoft. I have 2 Windows 8 PCs, 1 Surface RT, 1 Surface Pro 2, 1 Lumia 1320, 1 Lumia 925, 2 Lumia 720, 1 Lumia 1020, 2 Dell Windows 8 laptops, I pay for Xbox Live, I pay for Xbox Music x 3 passes, I use Office 2013, I use OneDrive with additional 100 GB paid for, I have Bing as my default search engine, I have MSN-preview as my home page, I use Skype as my messenger of choice with international subscription paid for, Outlook is my default mail client at home and work, OneNote is the only way I know how to take notes. I guess, I *need* to be biased ;)

    However, Verge is not meant to be biased for WP or Android. It has always been biased for iOS. So those ratings are flattering to say the least.
    09-24-2014 05:04 AM
  13. mark2410's Avatar
    as someone very new to wp ill chip in.

    ive used ios on an ipad for about a years but its problem was being so locked down. i couldnt browse the home network and change the default app to open files. this was a huge pain.

    i have mostly used android as it lets me change whatever the hell i want.

    so wp, well some bits im really liking. its so smooth and snappy and i like how it pulls in live tile info. its just nice to use but......it has limitations, limitations that just scream of trying to emulate ios. the problem is ios keeps moving toward the flexibility of android so wp8 is lagging waaay behind. the keyboard. i want to change the layout to dvorak but nope, cant. i want to bluetooth teather it to my main android phone with a good data plan, nope cant. i want to run a voip client, it can run but not in the background so its essentially useless for incoming calls. lastpass, it cant auto fill anything i have to jump back and forth copy pasting. i know why these things are the case but so the hell what. its my device, let me choose to accept these issues and do what the hell i want.

    then we get to the apps. maybe its because it uses bing to search for things but its all full of rubbish. granted its not terrible but given that half the apps i would want cant run how i want because of wp's limitations its an excersize in frustration.

    i got this wp8 to play with to see what wp is like and at this point i would imagine it is likely my last too.
    snowmutt and carlos12001 like this.
    09-24-2014 11:50 AM
  14. salmanahmad's Avatar
    I have to admit that I'm surprised that iOS and WP are that close. As much as I like WP I would've thought a few things would have pushed us a bit lower. I'm guessing the static homescreen is really starting to take its toll on some iOS users. Back when I was on TA (about 5 yrs ago) there were mumbles about wanting apple to add widgets or whatever, and it seems to be one of the more sought after features these days. Every time I look at my iPod, it actually bothers me how little info I can get at a glance or 1 scroll. And, with 8.1, more tiles, and transparency, iOS is just really far behind in this area IMHO.
    While I would agree that iOS is somewhat behind when it comes to the home screen, the lock screen notifications somewhat make up for it, Windows Phone has pretty terrible lock screen notifications.

    Both OSes need to improve on this.

    Just my opinion.
    Laura Knotek and snowmutt like this.
    09-24-2014 01:43 PM
  15. fatclue_98's Avatar
    While I would agree that iOS is somewhat behind when it comes to the home screen, the lock screen notifications somewhat make up for it, Windows Phone has pretty terrible lock screen notifications.

    Both OSes need to improve on this.

    Just my opinion.
    When I want your opinion, I'll just give it to you. Just kidding of course, iOS & WP suck at notifications for the simple fact that a glowing LED could tell you there's something, perhaps important, that needs your attention. I can't wrap my head around this glaring omission. Palm Treos used to have their LED under the paint so you couldn't even know they were there until they started to glow in red or green.
    snowmutt likes this.
    09-24-2014 02:41 PM
  16. RumoredNow's Avatar
    ...Apps carry a higher amount of weight than anything else...
    I think this is a fallacy. It was created by Apple. Google got involved in furthering it as they neared App parity with iOS. Tech media pundits hammer on this point and users keep saying it. That doesn't make it true or even a majority opinion. I hear few users (outside of these sorts of stilted forum discussions) boasting how many Apps they have on their phone and how many are available for install.

    It's a matter of perspective and also one of deception. Apps feed into UX, but not necessarily as the main component. Who stays with a mobile OS that makes them miserable just because it has so many Apps? Now... being heavily invested in an ecosystem makes a bigger difference. It becomes burdensome to move all your data, cloud backup, media and settings... Agreed. But actual App count in a store? How many Apps can you use in a day? In a week? In a month? How many Apps are downloaded and quickly forgotten? Or uninstalled because they really don't accomplish what the user wants? Or behave as desired?

    Use as many Apps as you can for a whole year... Go ahead. Start alphabetically. In a year you wouldn't use more than a fraction of the 1,375,751 Apps on Google Play*.

    "Apps carry a higher amount of weight than anything else," may work as a personal statement for some, but not as a generalization. @jonnaver - How many of your phone purchase decisions have honestly been driven by App count or need for one specialized App? I talk to people about phones all the time, I rarely hear about such a thing... Statistically, from my unscientific sample, it is way less than 10%.

    App quantity or need for one particular App has never defined what phone or tablet purchase I've made. Overall User eXperience (UX) has always been a deciding factor and let the App situation fall where it may...

    App quantity as a driving force for mobile device purchase makes little sense in the long term. "I hate this device, but man, I have like twenty seven file managers on this bad boy!" Really? Is that how consumers determine where they spend significant amounts of money? Tech is not cheap. Unless you are a tech journalist that gets handed devices for free all the time, App parity is probably not the number one priority on your shopping list. UX and enjoyability, reliability and hardware spec; these make more fiscal sense as determining factors. I for one don't want to plunk down hundreds of dollars on something I hate navigating around on and which holds little aesthetic value for me in terms of interface. You can throw as many free versions of Angry Birds as you want on top of a mess and it won't sway me one bit...

    For good measure, here's a recent breakdown; Smartphones: So Many Apps, So Much Time showing the average number of Apps installed on a phone and the narrow focus of what most App use accomplishes. Sort of puts a real world minimization on how important Apps actually are to most users.


    *Updated 24 Sept, 2014: Number of available Android applications - AppBrain
    Last edited by RumoredNow; 09-24-2014 at 03:02 PM. Reason: typo
    09-24-2014 02:55 PM
  17. RumoredNow's Avatar
    When I want your opinion, I'll just give it to you. Just kidding of course, iOS & WP suck at notifications for the simple fact that a glowing LED could tell you there's something, perhaps important, that needs your attention. I can't wrap my head around this glaring omission. Palm Treos used to have their LED under the paint so you couldn't even know they were there until they started to glow in red or green.
    ​I've had a blinky LED and much prefer Glance, thank you very much. I find nothing lacking in my notifications on WP at all...
    prasath1234 and poststamp like this.
    09-24-2014 02:56 PM
  18. colinkiama's Avatar
    as someone very new to wp ill chip in.

    ive used ios on an ipad for about a years but its problem was being so locked down. i couldnt browse the home network and change the default app to open files. this was a huge pain.

    i have mostly used android as it lets me change whatever the hell i want.

    so wp, well some bits im really liking. its so smooth and snappy and i like how it pulls in live tile info. its just nice to use but......it has limitations, limitations that just scream of trying to emulate ios. the problem is ios keeps moving toward the flexibility of android so wp8 is lagging waaay behind. the keyboard. i want to change the layout to dvorak but nope, cant. i want to bluetooth teather it to my main android phone with a good data plan, nope cant. i want to run a voip client, it can run but not in the background so its essentially useless for incoming calls. lastpass, it cant auto fill anything i have to jump back and forth copy pasting. i know why these things are the case but so the hell what. its my device, let me choose to accept these issues and do what the hell i want.

    then we get to the apps. maybe its because it uses bing to search for things but its all full of rubbish. granted its not terrible but given that half the apps i would want cant run how i want because of wp's limitations its an excersize in frustration.

    i got this wp8 to play with to see what wp is like and at this point i would imagine it is likely my last too.
    You can tether with Bluetooth in 8.1.1. You can use the Dev preview. Don't worry it's free. Also Windowsdoing phone is not an OS for doing anything you want. It's locked down like iOS just like you said,however just like windows on computers,it's adding add much features as they can while maintaining performance
    09-24-2014 03:09 PM
  19. fatclue_98's Avatar
    You can tether with Bluetooth in 8.1.1. You can use the Dev preview. Don't worry it's free. Also Windowsdoing phone is not an OS for doing anything you want. It's locked down like iOS just like you said,however just like windows on computers,it's adding add much features as they can while maintaining performance
    I think he means using his Android phone as the host, not the client. To that end, I don't know of any phone that works as a client regardless of platform.
    09-24-2014 07:36 PM
  20. ven07's Avatar
    I remember one older WP user once saying that apps just make us lazy lol I think he is right! While apps are fun to have and do make things easier, we should be careful not to give ourselves over too much.I mean, if the app isn't available for some reason, we should know how to work around that :) Putting so much faith in apps lets the next generation think that's all there is and beyond that app the world ends :/
    09-24-2014 08:59 PM
  21. lovenokia's Avatar
    Agreed, WP 8.1 is a great OS. Its the small things that keep it from being great (Xbox music...)
    So very true, there are so many small bugs that plagues the OS. Check out my giant rant down below.
    http://forums.windowscentral.com/win...ml#post2779912
    09-24-2014 11:40 PM
  22. jdhooghe's Avatar
    Now you just need Microsoft to believe in Windows Phone and actually fix the things which are needed and add the small things which people look for. WP is a fun and interesting OS and it could be a valid competitor IF Microsoft were to stop screwing around and fix things. If Microsoft shows actual commitment and fixes things maybe, just maybe, the platform would show the confidence needed for app makers to take a look.

    Do not start with the "we don't need apps" business either. It is the lack of apps and the lack of polish which keeps WP from being little more than a small amount of the market. Consumers want apps, they just don't want to sit and stare at the flipping tiles. They need to apps to make the smartphone smart. These results show promise even though the OP doesn't like the Verge because of bias but takes this seriously?

    Competition is always good for the consumer. Microsoft is a multi-million dollar company and yet for some reason, the OS is STILL immature after all these years.
    Karthik Naik likes this.
    09-25-2014 01:39 AM
  23. TechFreak1's Avatar
    Well If I was to show this post to a certain group of they will go oh WP is crap because it scored 0.2 less than IOS8 and they made a judgement error as Android shouldn't be 8.8 blooming lemmings lol.

    No amount of ranting & raving will change one thing, Microsoft is falling head of heels to be cross platform.

    also we are very grounded on this cross-platform world. One of the things that you’re find is Microsoft icons on any phone — irrespective of whether it’s a Windows Phone or not. That’s our core goal: Things like Office, things like Skype are broadly available. And Minecraft! On every 8-year-old’s phone, for sure.
    Satya Nadella on Microsoft's mobile strategy: Current market share isn't what matters - GeekWire

    The era of Windows only or Windows First have long gone and we all need to embrace that, move on and fill up Microsoft's inbox showing them that WP users want the platform to succeed, not to make Cortana cross platform and give us app update parity.

    As a fellow WP enthusiast and a marketing guy it makes me cringe at the direction they are heading in regards to WP (for most it is illogical), I know why they are doing it and it is only logical for them to do so as at end of the day the only thing that matters is profits & shareholder value. Which is why Microsoft like any other software giant will focus on the larger install base first and in this case it happens to be Android & IOS.

    Unfortunately Google gets a free pass for their anti competitive nature (Look up the EU rulings against Google and then compare it to what happened to Microsoft, I'm not saying some of it was not their own doing but it is not balanced at all).

    Windows phone users may not like it but that is the cold & heartless reality of business, any business that doesn't make any profit or has no income will not survive let alone thrive.
    Karthik Naik likes this.
    09-25-2014 03:26 AM
  24. D M C's Avatar
    I remember one older WP user once saying that apps just make us lazy lol I think he is right! While apps are fun to have and do make things easier, we should be careful not to give ourselves over too much.I mean, if the app isn't available for some reason, we should know how to work around that :) Putting so much faith in apps lets the next generation think that's all there is and beyond that app the world ends :/
    Haha
    It's not apps but technology which is making us lazy.

    You should stop using technology and see how it goes
    ven07 likes this.
    09-25-2014 04:28 AM
  25. rockstarzzz's Avatar
    I think even though we keep going on tangent every time such a thread is created, what needs to happen here is - someone has to come forward and pat Microsoft's back! Instead of highlighting what is still lagging - why can't we see that current scores in OP reflects how far WP has come. I am happy to Bing older scores for you but trust me on this - WP7 was where BB10 is on this list. We have come a long way and that wouldn't have happened if everything Microsoft is doing is just simply wrong! Yes, we would be on 8.4 instead of 8.0 if Microsoft did some stuff better, but then we should be content that we are on the right path and Microsoft is only a "follower OS" for another update and from there on, it will lead the innovation as it truly comes par with iOS's continuity etc. - with Threshold. That's what Android lacks and will never have.
    09-25-2014 06:00 AM
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